Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Ford Mustang (2005) vs. 2005 Pontiac GTO

1171820222363

Comments

  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    Got to agree. just went to another car show this week in NY. 2 GTO's, one a 2004 and one a 2005 and about 30 2005 Mustangs. GTO's got more people looking at them based on how rare they are.
  • gottabgtogottabgto Posts: 95
    I was pleasantly surprised at the insurance rates too.
    And I'm in Ca. where the price of everything is inflated.
    The day I drove mine home (45 mile drive on a major highway), I must have had about 15 mustangs slow down and check it out (I was going the speed limit, breaking it in). So these folks claiming it does not attract attention - I beg to differ. And so far, I would honestly have to say that the majority of the attention I have received has come from mustang drivers.
    Interesting...
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    GTO is ugly and fugly? LOL? It's a fully loaded 400hp V8 musclecar for $33k. Sorry to say, but GTO is actually same price or cheaper then a V8 Mustang based on hp. 400hp for $33k or 300hp Msutang for $25k. Do the math!!!! . Since when does the Mustang GT win with no contest? It is slower then GTO, LOL! GM didn't have to redesign it. They took it from their Holden division and made it as a fully loaded V8 only edition. Unlike the Avis/std V6 edition rentacar Mustang that starts at $19k for the highschool faithfull. That said, both cars rock. I like seeing Mustang GT V8 at car shows . American muscle rules. It's better then Front drive 4 banger and V6 cars.
  • stang22stang22 Posts: 36
    YOU SAID," Yep, very easy to rent a 2005 Mustang tomorrow, go to Hertz where they will have 3 to 5 on every lot available for rental, esp. by me. I have seen them sitting there. GTO? Can't rent. Wonder why?" I SAY,Thats smart marketing,to have some for rentals,and THOSE MUSTANGS ARE 6 CLYINDER ONES,IF THEY WERE GT's,YOU WOULDN'T HAVE ANY!! As far as no gto's to rent,thats because of poor marketing,and gm said that their sooo ugly that we can't SELL them to the people,much less than trying to rent them,because nobody wants them either way!!! :lemon:
  • stang22stang22 Posts: 36
    YOU SAY " GTO is ugly and fugly? LOL? It's a fully loaded 400hp V8 musclecar for $33k. Sorry to say, but GTO is actually same price or cheaper then a V8 Mustang based on hp. 400hp for $33k or 300hp Msutang for $25k. Do the math!!!! . Since when does the Mustang GT win with no contest? It is slower then GTO, LOL! GM didn't have to redesign it. They took it from their Holden division and made it as a fully loaded V8 only edition. Unlike the Avis/std V6 edition rentacar Mustang that starts at $19k for the highschool faithfull. I SAY gto is soo bad a design,it needs to go back where it came from which is fuglyville!!! :P As far as the better deal of the 2,we already know that mustang gt wins again against your cavalier (import looking) gto,sales speak for itself! As far as pricing,again mustang gt wins again 25 grand versus 33 grand which = that YOU need to RE-do YOUR math,because mustang gt wins again,its best bang for the buck,and with an 8 grand difference in price,if its horsepower you want to talk about,to make it equal,for 8 more grand to equal your gto price,I could have enough horsepower to beat your gto,c6 vette,and zo6 vette, all in ONE day!!! LOOKS like Mustang GT wins Again,and again,and again,etc.etc. And if gm didn't have to redesign it(gto),why do they keep trying to re-change the look of it?!!! I'll tell you why,its fugly and the sales say so by the people!! And last but not least having a 6 cylinder mustang as a rental for the younger crowd as you say for a cheap price,is ANOTHER WIN by Mustang for smart marketing all the way around!!! Man,there is no contest gto loses every time!! This is no comparison,because Mustanggt keeps on winning,and winning!! But here's your crying towel :cry: :sick:
  • dave50dave50 Posts: 22
    The GTO has no real distinctive looks to make me reach for my checkbook. I think if they had stacked the headlights like the 65-67 or done a little retro styling they may not have been able to make enough of them. But who cares what I think anyway, I drive a 96 Buick roadmaster. I never thought I would take a Ford mustang over a Pontiac GTO. Hell must have froze over.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    Retro doesn't always equate to good sales. Look at the failed Tbird which is being cancelled for lack of sales. I'm not a fan of Retro, it equates to un-original styling. Let's copy 1967 Mustang because we can't come up with something original. I'm glad they didn't retro GTO. If I wanted retro I would buy the real deal. My opinion.
  • graphicguygraphicguy SW OhioPosts: 7,449
    IF (big IF) the General decides to give a reprieve of the death sentence to the GTO, I would hope they would use the design shown in MT last month. That would go a long way to reviving the mark. But, that design was based on the ZETA platform, which we all know is still born for North America.

    The '90s Pontiac style of the GTO has been worn quite thin for all of Pontiac's models. You also have to wonder if Pontiac will want two V8 cars in the lineup with the GP getting a V8, too.

    I'm very interested in seeing what special editions Ford will give the "go ahead" to build. So far, much has been made of the GT500, which on paper, looks to be quite good. Bullitt? Mach? BOSS? While I couldn't be more pleased with my Mustang, I'd like to see if Ford can entice me with some of the special editions that are rumored.

    As the GT500 comes in at just under $40K, with all the success of the Mustang, I can see a $30K Bullitt being quite interesting.
  • sensaisensai Posts: 129
    Well since you could not figure out the point of the other post, $25k/300hp = 83.3 dollars per horsepower. $33k/400hp = 75 dollars per horsepower. So using that equation, the GTO is clearly a better buy. And really, it is even better than that since a comparable (and I use that term loosely) GT is more like $28k. So GTO wins again, and again, and again. And yes you can make the GT faster for a few thousand dollars. Unfortunately, you cannot improve the build quality to the GTOs level, make the back seat useable, upgrade the transmission to a 6 speed, improve the interior to be as nice as the GTO, and throw in a real IRS suspension for anywhere near that amount. So GTO wins again, and again, and again. Looks like the GTO keeps on winning and winning.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    ....."So far, much has been made of the GT500, which on paper, looks to be quite good. ...."

    Nice car but it's a $40k Ford Mustang. Too much $$ in my opinion. For the same or not much more $$ I would buy a Corvette. GT500 $39k, Vette $43k. Remember that the GT500 does gain 200 to 300 pounds of added weight while the Corvette Lost weight for new C6 design. Vette is nearly 400 lbs lighter then GT500. We'll have to see how it handles.
  • donkitadonkita Posts: 2
    I have spent the last few days browsing this discussion, and, for what it's worth, these are my observations and opinions.

    I was shopping for a late 60s fastback Mustang as a "hangar queen", but because of the attention brought on by the Nic Cage movie (I suspect), the prices for a decent car were outrageous. Then I saw the new retro-style Mustang was coming out, so I waited for it. I was put off by the rear axle issue, but loved the look.I went to the dealership to try it out, and was disgusted to see that this dealer had a 10k premium on the GT. Knowing things would level out eventually, I went ahead and checked it out. Besides the rear axle, the other thing that put me off was, when I set the seat up for my normal driving position, there was about 2 inches between the front of the back seat and the back of my seat; i.e.completely worthless for people. Of course, I didn't plan on driving it much, but I did want the option of carrying my family on occasion. Anyway, I still loved the car, but decided to wait a while. As I waited, I began to see more and more of them on the road (I drive 120 mile interstate round trip to work). The more I saw, the less interested I was.

    Even though I get all of the auto mags, somehow, I had completely overlooked the intro of the new GTO (as had most of the mags). I first became aware of it when reading the backlash of letters in response to the C&D comparo. I immediately liked the car and the idea, a low profile muscle car/sleeper. The more I looked into it, the more I liked it, and after driving one, I hunted down the one I wanted and put the money down (Impulse Blue, Blue int. M6). Paid $31k cash total, no haggle. I absolutely love it; a family car when I need it, a performance car when I want it.

    As to the posts so far, I am completely baffled at the insistence of some that more sales is a good thing. Obviously, it is a good thing for Ford, but I don't see how it can be good for the long term value to the customer. Based on the production numbers I have seen, in a very few years, we are going to have conservatively 500k to a million of these new "unique" Mustangs on the road. My guess is that less than five years from now, Mustang owners are going to look around and say, "Hey, why does everybody have the same car I do". Regardless of how many configurations the car can be ordered in, it is still visually the same car. Then the used car market is going to be flooded. The way I see it, Ford's rush to keep production in line with demand is not good for those who bought their Mustang early thinking they had something special. I suspect the same will be true for the Shelby and others, i.e. too accessible.

    Obviously, the slow sales of the GTO are not good for GM, but I think it is very good for those of us who chose to not follow the crowd. It will be interesting to see how things progress, but if the GTO is truly dead after 2006, there will likely be less than 20K LS2 GTOs on the road. At some point, I believe car fans and press are going to wake up and realize that they missed out on unique opportunity in automotive history.

    This new Mustang craze seems like one more faddish trend, and I shy away from anything trendy. Although I quietly support all of the worthy causes I can, I do not have a plastic yellow bracelet, nor do I have magnetic yellow ribbons and flags on my vehicles. The Mustang is being marketed as a car for the masses, and I see the GTO as a car for those with more individual tastes.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    Even next years Flagship GT500 Shelby or whatever other names they are throwing on it will have a solid rear axle too. Can you imagine a car starting at $39k without a IRS? GT500 will weigh very close to what GTO does without an IRS. I can tell on the 2005 V6 Rentastang that it is not an IRS. On any none smooth roads, it's the Shaker, and no not the stereo. I could tell my 1986 442, same thing. Especially ruts in the road, etc. As you say, you get what you pay for and that is why Mustang is cheaper then GTO.

    Read somewhere that Ford is already making suspension Improvements for the 2006 Mustang, to reduce vibrations. Wonder why?
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Regardless of how many configurations the car can be ordered in, it is still visually the same car.

    Even more so with the GTO since it only comes basically one way. And the V6 and GT are quite different from one another, and the GT500 will be even further distinguished.

    This new Mustang craze seems like one more faddish trend, and I shy away from anything trendy.

    Forty two years later and this faddish trend is still rolling along. Surely it has to end eventually. America liked it then and America likes it now. Remember, the Mustang sold a million copies in its first couple of years of existence. What do you think you would have to pay to get one of those today in good, original condition?

    The GTO is more akin to a faddish trend as it will be going off life support after the '06 model year. But I'm sure GM thought the Mustang was a fad, too, when it first debuted. That's probably why they were two years late getting in the game. Even then they probably still considered the Mustang a fad, but look at the Mustang now. Where are the F-bodies? Horsepower for horsepower's sake is the fad. The F-bodies out muscled the Mustang for most of their existence, but they're still gone. The GTO far out muscles the Mustang, but it is being handed its hat and coat as well. Again, the Mustang will be the one left to turn off the lights after the party. Many have challenged; all have been defeated.

    The Mustang's is a classic tale of the tortoise and the hare if there ever was one. There have been countless fire-breathing, smoke snorting, muscle-bound beasts that could mop the floor w/ the Mustang over the years. But where are they now?

    It's all about appealing to the masses. That's why the Mustang has the largest aftermarket than any other car. You could literally build a factory spec Mustang from aftermarket parts, but anyway...

    The bottom line is that the Mustang is here to stay. The Mustang is a part of American culture; past, present, and future. ;)

    The GTO probably would have been a great success had GM not decided to desecrate a powerful name with such a mundane looking car.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Read somewhere that Ford is already making suspension Improvements for the 2006 Mustang, to reduce vibrations. Wonder why?

    I wonder why, too. That's the first I (and I'm sure every other Mustang owner) have heard of any vibration. :confuse: Do you have a link to that, or at least a credible reference?
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    ..."The GTO probably would have been a great success had GM not decided to desecrate a powerful name with such a mundane looking car....."

    2005 GTO is the MOST powerfull GTO ever made. Same can't be said for 2005 Mustang. Oh you mean like how Ford desecrated the Mustang name with the embarassing 1974 to 1978 Mustang on the Pinto chassis. 1974 didn't even offer a V8 engine. Most power was 140hp in those years, LOL! A real joke. Even the 1974 GTO at least had a 5.7L V8 with 200 or 250hp.

    GTO was NEVER meant to be a great sales success for GM here, limited production car. How times does this have to be said? It is a great sales success in Austrailia. Hate to break the news but the 1964 GTO was very mundane looking... Just a rebadged Tempest. Knowone complains about that.

    The idea of the original GTO was to stuff a big high performance V8 into a midsized family car. Same thing as now.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    ....."There have been countless fire-breathing, smoke snorting, muscle-bound beasts that could mop the floor w/ the Mustang over the years. But where are they now?......"

    The Corvette is still here, came out in 1953.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    ...."I wonder why, too. That's the first I (and I'm sure every other Mustang owner) have heard of any vibration. Do you have a link to that, or at least a credible reference?...."

    Ford actually has a TSB out for creaking, popping, vibration thud sounds from the 2005 Mustang suspension.

    Try the Mustang problems and solutions boards. Many complaints on there about vibrations problems. My 2005 V6 Rentastang had the same problem.
  • gottabgtogottabgto Posts: 95
    Well said - I agree completely.

    Just out of curosity, I counted the mustangs on the road this morning on my commute which is 25 miles along the coast and into San Francisco.
    16 mustangs.
    16 - in 25 miles.
    Hey, if you want to fit in - get a mustang and join the crowd.
  • donkitadonkita Posts: 2
    I think 442man made my point much better than I was able to. The point being, I think, that the Mustang is intended to be a sports car for the masses and the GTO is a specialty car for the few (as evidenced by production numbers). So, there probably is really no point in comparing the two, as they are different classes of vehicle.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Yes, the Corvette is still here. Where are the others that competed against the Mustang?

    Nobody is disputing that this GTO is the most powerful GTO ever. And nobody is disputing that this GT isn't the most powerful Mustang ever. What's your point? You guys, and apparently GM, too, just don't get it. Horsepower isn't everything, as proven by Fords inability to keep up with the demand for its "clearly inferior" Mustangs. And before you go on the "Well, they just can't afford..." STOP. The way I've been reading it, you can get a brand new '04 GTO for less than and an '05 GTO for very near the same as an '05 GT, but people are still opting for the GT. Wonder why? :confuse:

    Also, let's not forget that the GTO was always a hotted up version of a bland car. It was just an option package. What American made/sold car is this GTO based on? Nothing. And as bland as it is, I'd hate to even imagine how boring the car it would be based on would have to be. Bleh. A new malibu, maybe?

    And what do you mean the GTO was never meant to be a great sales success? :surprise: That is the whole point of manufacturers making sales projections. ;) The GTO has yet to meet a sales projection, even the lowered one. I wonder if GM said, "Let's bring a stop gap car in and make a sales goal of 18,000 units. Of course, we don't expect to actually sell that many, but we'll set the target for 18,000 anyway." Yeah, right. The GTO was never meant to be a mass market vehicle, but it sure as heck was meant to be a huge sales success, no matter how few they wanted to sell. They just can't meet the numbers, not even with insane incentives.

    With the Mustang, on the other hand, you'll be hard pressed to find a GT for less than MSRP for now; new or used.

    I remember watching an introduction of the new GTO to a GTO owners club on SPEED channel. Those guys were about as cold to it as they could be. You could see the disappointment in their eyes. The GM guy actually looked embarrassed when he got out of it. :cry:
  • sensaisensai Posts: 129
    I remember watching an introduction of the new GTO to a GTO owners club on SPEED channel. Those guys were about as cold to it as they could be. You could see the disappointment in their eyes. The GM guy actually looked embarrassed when he got out of it.

    Hmm, so you get in a car that has way better build quality and one of the nicest interiors out there, and then you drive it and it completely spanks your old car and most new cars out there, but you end up looking embarrassed when you get out of it? Please. Everyone that actually drives a GTO loves it after. The haters are still the ones that insists on reading magazine reviews and not actually touching the car.
  • gottabgtogottabgto Posts: 95
    Exactly.

    Try driving a car with 400 horses - one thing is most definitely ain't is boring.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    I see you didn't understand what you quoted. The GM guy was a GM executive or high level manager that drove the GTO into some warehouse or whatever it was that the classic GTO owners were meeting. There was a bunch smoke and flashing lights and when the car came in, the GTO club guys' expressions were like, "So what?" The GM exec was embarrassed because he could tell that the guys didn't care for it. One of them even mentioned on camera that he didn't care for it.

    Mind you, this was a GM sponsored club meet.

    And you should have quoted, or at least read, my entire post. I plainly stated that you guys just don't get it, in that HP isn't everything. It is mainly just about bragging rights. Maybe when you get a little older, you will. Besides, a GTO isn't exactly going to be "running away" from a GT in a street race. She's kinda portly, ya know. I define running away as 10+ car lengths.

    Point blank, the GTO strikes ZERO emotion in anybody, including the owners. You guys have more emotion about the Mustang than you do your own car. And your comment about everyone loving the GTO after driving it can just as easily be applied to the Mustang. Ask pretty much anybody who has actually driven the new Mustang and they will say it's great. Of course GTO owners won't, I'm sure, even if they did like it.

    GTO owner: I don't like that Mustang because it has that old, antiquated solid rear axle. And the engine is WEAK.

    Other guy: But they did a lot of work on it. It actually outperforms the outgoing Cobra with it's IRS. Hey, let me check out what you got under your hood.

    GTO owner: Nah, don't worry about that. It's powerful. Let's just talk about the Mustang's solid rear axle.

    Other guy: But wait. Isn't your engine the same basic Chevy small block V8 with pushrod technology that they've been using for 50 years?

    GTO owner: Don't you worry about that! It's powerful. Now back to the Mustang's solid rear axle.

    Other guy: I don't want to talk about that anymore. It's getting old already.

    GTO owner: Well let's talk about how they just copied an old design and didn't use any originality with this Mustang.

    Other guy: Wait. Hasn't Porsche been using the same basic design for the 911 for 30 years? Nobody's complaining about that.

    GTO owner: Man, later for you!! I'm going to go burn rubber and do some 170MPH speed runs on the freeway in my awesome GTO!

    Other guy: Well, good luck with that.

    GTO owner: I don't need luck! My car is so run-of-the-mill looking, the cops won't even notice me. And that's just the way I like it! Nobody spends $30K plus on a sporty car to be noticed. Sporty cars are about being able to pull double duty as a family hauler and long distance cruiser, not aggressive looks and crisp handling. Back seat space is everything in this class of vehicle!

    Other guy: :confuse:

    :shades: :P
  • gottabgtogottabgto Posts: 95
    'And you should have quoted, or at least read, my entire post. I plainly stated that you guys just don't get it, in that HP isn't everything. It is mainly just about bragging rights. Maybe when you get a little older, you will. '

    Interesting you should say that as I've been thinking - there's no talking to these Mustang youngsters.
    And you are right - it is not all about HP.
    I love the interior of my GTO.
    I think the exterior is totally hot looking but in an understated, classy way.
    About the only thing I don't like is the operating slowness in moving the front seats forward and I can live with that.
    I think what you 'just don't get' is the concept of 'to each his own'. We like GTO's and I have not seen any of the GTO folks trashing the Mustang or the Mustang drivers. In fact, I think there have been a few efforts made to say - hey, the Mustang is a nice car & Mustang people are cool.
    You guys on the other hand, are all about personal attacks, trashing the car, etc.
    It's cool to debate the issue, but kept it respectful.
    You're arguments just might get heard that way.
  • dave50dave50 Posts: 22
    The guy who designed the Aztec must have been involved in the GTO body design. I love Pontiacs but how many times can they drop the ball? Chrysler has thrown the dice several times in the last ten years and I believe it payed off. Every car model has had some ugly years but they changed some sheet metal for the next year. Why can't Pontiac change the sheet metal a little like in the 60's and 70's? and keep us guessing? Yes It will be sad to see a zillion mustangs in the future. If they keep selling the Mustangs, why should they change a thing? Only competition will motivate Ford, not our rantings. SS chevelles, GTO's and 442 were common sights 30 years ago and nobody paid much attention to them either. Most of us were oblivious to their future demand and collectability. I don't think I would buy either of them to stuff in a barn somewhere. Just drive em.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    ......" guy who designed the Aztec must have been involved in the GTO body design. I love Pontiacs but how many times can they drop the ball?....."

    The Aztec and GTO look nothing alike. Where did Pontiac drop the ball? Holden created the body design for 2002 in Austrailia.

    ....."'s and 442 were common sights 30 years ago and nobody paid much attention to them either..."

    Not as common as the Mustangs 30 yrs ago, but yeah they were as noticeable as some might think, I agree
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    The car show I was at on Wednesday had 4 GTO's, A 1967, 1970, 2004 and 2005. There were about 30+ Mustangs there, including about 12 2005's. One of them was a V6 Mustang. I wouldn't be showing off a V6 Mustang. But to each their own. That car should only have the V8.
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    Tayl0rd writes............."Point blank, the GTO strikes ZERO emotion in anybody, including the owners. You guys have more emotion about the Mustang than you do your own car. And your comment about everyone loving the GTO after driving it can just as easily be applied to the Mustang. Ask pretty much anybody who has actually driven the new Mustang and they will say it's great. Of course GTO owners won't, I'm sure, even if they did like it........."

    Then why did JD Power chose the GTO over the Mustang as it's Best appealing Sporty Car? huh? Both Mustang and GTO owners were surveyed within 90 days of ownership! I guess the GTO owners had more satisfaction, according to JD pwr

    Speak for yourself, but GTO strikes emotion in me and I am an owner. I was of driving age when GTO's were new back in early 1970's, I love both the new and old ones.
  • benderofbowsbenderofbows Posts: 544
    Hey, I have said the GTO is a nice car and GTO people are cool!
  • 442man442man Posts: 210
    I like the exterior of my GTO as well. Different strokes for different folks I guess. I get along well with the Mustang guys at the car shows I go too. We have mutual respect for each others cars. No trash talking. We'll bust each other chops sometimes. The people that I have heard trash GTO or say comments at the car show usually are young kids that drive a used 140hp mid 1990's V6 Mustang or used older V6 Fbody. Gotta love it. In fact one of the Mustang guys heard what the kid said to me and yelled at him, have to have respect. I usually park with the 2005 Mustangs are newer ones at the show, they don't mind. There isn't many GTO's there.
This discussion has been closed.