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Midsize Sedans Comparison Thread

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Comments

  • w9cww9cw Posts: 888
    thegraduate - I live in a university town, so to speak. This area has a quite high per capita income level, and the Honda, Toyota, M-B, and Volvo dealers have no trouble in moving cars. In fact, it seems like one out of ten cars I see anymore is a Toyota Prius. Typical, major university town - a lot of tree huggers and "green" people - not that it's bad mind you. Our metro area is around 125,00 population with one Honda dealer. BTW . . . this dealer was the very first authorized Honda automobile dealer east of the Mississippi.

    My closest Honda dealer beyond the local one is around 50 miles east. That may be an option.

    I get down to Huntsville quite often on business trips, and I think the largest Suzuki dealer I've ever seen is located there. I've seen more Suzukis in the Huntsville, AL area than any other city.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Well, if you want, I can give you the name and website of the dealer we use in Birmingham (110 miles or so south of Huntsville). Shoot me a message on the Civic or Accord Prices Paid forums; I'm there a lot this week with my dad's recent deal.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    ESC will only kick in when the yaw sensors detect that the vehicle is going offline from the intended steering direction.
    Exactly. This must be one helluva smart computer that it 'knows' what I intended, don't you think?
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Exactly. This must be one helluva smart computer that it 'knows' what I intended, don't you think?

    Yeah, that's actually how it works bud. It can tell if the car is following your intended plane and take steps to ensure that it does what you asked it to do.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    The tornado:

    From the Birmingham National Weather Service

    TORNADO 3 SW DEMOPOLIS 32.47N 87.87W
    11/30/2006 STRENGTH-F1 MARENGO CO. AL NWS STORM SURVEY

    PRELIMINARY PATH LENGTH 1.2 MILES AND 150 YARDS WIDE. THE
    TORNADO STARTED NEAR US HIGHWAY 80 AND MARIA AVENUE.
    SEVERAL LARGE TREES WERE BLOWN OVER ONTO HOMES PRODUCING
    SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE. SEVERAL MORE LARGE TREES WERE KNOCKED
    OVER AND DESTROYED A FEW MOBILE HOMES. ONE APARTMENT
    COMPLEX RECEIVED SIGNIFICANT ROOF DAMAGE. A FEW MOBILE
    HOMES WERE ROLLED OVER. NO WARNING WAS ISSUED AT THE TIME OF THE TOUCHDOWN.
    (Touched down at 9:30 PM)

    Nobody was killed or even hurt amazingly. Thanks for the prayers. Back to the cars!!!
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,629
    So you think that these biases and prejudices cause their drivers to intentionally apply the brakes in their braking tests to skew the results a certain way? Somehow I doubt it. I think it's more likely they have demonstrated in a practical way the benefits of ABS wrt stopping distance in both wet and dry conditions.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    It takes your direction from where you point the steering. If it senses through the yaw sensors that the backend is whipping around and forcing you away from the original direction you pointed then it kicks in to slow you from getting more out of control. But it only does so when for example you aimed N and now without any additional input from you the vehicle is heading ENE ( oversteer ). Similarly if you told the vehicle to go NE but the yaw sensor determine that the vehicle is continuing in a straight line due N ( understeer ) then too it kicks into force. These are the only two cases it's in use.
  • plektoplekto Posts: 3,708
    I suggest you someday try running aroung in a 4-Runner off-road in a freshly plowed field or gravel road. My friend did this and it was instantly apparent when the stability control kicked in.

    The was this *beepbeepbeep" sound and the rear end went right back into place instead of allowing the vehicle to do a drift-like maneuver on the gravel road - and kept it from oversteering when he was doing doughnuts at 30mph and changed directions/returned to normal driving.

    Yes, he's a bit nuts off-road, but he never ends up at the edge of the road against a berm or ditch anymore thanks to it. (imagine sliding to a stop against something and then getting yourself out in 4WD)

    You have to actually push it like that to understand how incredibly useful it is - more than ABS in fact.

    Now, traction control - that's a whole other story. I disable it every time I can. It definately kicks in in bad weather when you don't want it to. This is what 90% of people seem to think of when they hear "Stability control" though.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,622
    It's called a yaw sensor and that's precisely what it does. It determines if the car is understeering (you're turning the wheel but the vehicle is going straight) or oversteering (the back end is sliding out. Only then does ESC activate. You're confusing it with simple traction control. You might want to do some research before trashing a feature you apparently know nothing about.
  • mm99mm99 Posts: 25
    Are there really any cars in which the ESC cannot be turned off? The two ESC-equipped cars that I drove, Sonata and Altima, both have a dedicated button for it. So those who are not convinced by this govt. conspiracy have the freedom to exercise their beliefs.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    This is the video. It may be manufacturer slanted toward Subaru, but it is interesting. Taken from the one of Subie board links. It's 11 minutes but interesting footage.

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-4999142340359932162
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    Now I know what happened to the diesel engineers at Oldsmobile, they are designing dashes for Honda and Toyota. :P
  • mfletou1mfletou1 Posts: 508
    Or, you join the the 24,000+ others (ytd) who have purchased a Camry Hybrid. The VDIM system is standard. A quick perusal of Fitzgerald's inventory indicates that virtually every SE and XLE has stability control.

    Camry Hybrid + SE + XLE > Fusion.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    V6-only unless you get a hybrid.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    Some just don't get it. The reductions by Ford are long overdue. Thier market share has fallen, so must their capacity. I know in the long run this will make Ford a leaner and meaner car company. It will allow Ford to get thier product to market faster. Quality/fit/finish will rise also. Its all a part of the changing market.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    Nice try with the spin, but a 100 year automobile company that is shrinking in an environment where the global market is exploding and the potential for huge sales numbers down the road is huge - is BAD NEWS!

    This is a major league cluster when the rest of the world is going all out to capture the millions of new car buyers coming down the pipe. China, India, Latin America, Brazil, in addition to North America are all BOOMING!

    Hyundai, VW, Honda, Toyota, BMW - all jamming.

    Ford, Mitsubishi, Volvo, Jaguar, Isuzu - not.

    Once again, wrong! Ford is doing fine in Europe and China. The ONLY market Ford lost $$ is North America. guess you don't read that GM is the LEADER in China.. Stop spreading incorrect information.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    How up above Edmunds lists actual owners of vehicles and their reviews. How the Camry with 223 reviews scores the lowest!!?? If this is such a fantastic vehicle then why isn't it at least in the 9.5 category?? with actual people that bought the car. Same could be said for the Accord.. 35 reviews and a 9.3? These two cars are supposed to be the best of the best, no other car manuafacturer can or will ever build a car as good as these two right? Then why are the actual owners not giving all 10's???
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    Now I know what happened to the diesel engineers at Oldsmobile, they are designing dashes for Honda and Toyota.

    Actually they are all retired. That was a long time ago.
  • plektoplekto Posts: 3,708
    Well, of course the XC90 is hard dressed. It's the size of a 4-Runner and doesn't belong.(though the hill climb was interesting). I wonder how the new Suzuki crossover would do in 4 wheel only mode?

    They also should have tested the new RAV-4. It's extremely capable off-road.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Are you back to the statistical relevancy of these reviews above? Didn't we already show you how they can be manipulated by anyone? This is the third time I believe that someone suddenly discovers the reviews and says 'Ah Ha..'

    the reviews are not random and there aren't enough of them to give any statistical relevancy. I personally could create 1000 different persona's, give any vehicle on the list perfect scores - or zero's - and skew the results to make them say whatever I wanted them to say.

    Here is the bottom line in any free market.. 'Money talks [ everything else ] walks'. The public speaks with it's wallet. Noone is holding a gun to the head of 750,000 separate individuals forcing them at gunpoint to go to Honda/Toyota.

    Also why is it that it bothers you so much that so many people exercise their right of free will and choose to spend their money as they wish. It's not like they are taking sales away from the Fu-lans. These two are allegedly at full production capacity in Mexico so even if they were the two best vehicles ever made, the CamCord buyers would have to go somewhere to get a vehicle. There are no more Fu-lans to buy.

    All midsized vehicles are doing very very well in this current market.
    CamCords
    Fu-lans
    SonOptima's
    Mali-6's
This discussion has been closed.