Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!





Hyundai Sonata vs. Honda Accord vs. Toyota Camry vs. Ford Fusion

1646567697092

Comments

  • If you are going to finance your new car, Honda back in 2004 had a deal that when you buy the loan insurance you get a better %rate which lowered the overall payments. Not sure if they still do this, but a lower % on a five year loan can even out the initial costs between Honda and Hyundai. Hey, does anyone know how to switch off the "maintenance" light on a Honda Accord (2004). My fiance has the Accord and of course the dealer will not tell her how to shut it off like my Toyota dealer did.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,805
    When I traded in my wife's minivan with 206,000 for her SUV in 03, the one salesman said that he wouldn't give me anything for her van, and rightfully should charge me to take it off my hands.

    Since I tend to drive til the wheels fall off, then put them back on and drive some more I have the same problem. When that happens I either try to sell it as is in a third party sale or if its bad enough take it to the junk yard and get some cash for it. Either way if I am not getting anything for a trade in it comes off the table.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,805
    Not sure if they still do this, but a lower % on a five year loan can even out the initial costs between Honda and Hyundai.

    Don't think thats true, using the prices quoted for the two cars in the post you are replying to for the payments to equal out Honda has to offer 0% financing over Hyundais 13.5% financing. Don't think thats the case.

    Also it usually costs the same or more to do that. You savings in interest is offset by the loan insurance.

    The sign said "No shoes, no shirt, no service", it didn't say anything about no pants.

  • w9cww9cw Posts: 888
    Nope, on my 2006 Elantra the single hinge, spring, and door are all metal, but not ferrous metal. You can see the stamping and cutting remnants on portions of the hinge flange. And, when you gently tap the hinge with a screwdriver, you can tell that it's definetly metal. It's strange that they would use an alloy for a parts like the fuel door and hinge.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    How to switch off the Main't Req'd Light...?

    If you will check your owners manual, it gives that information in full detail, but, if I"m not mistaken, it involves holding in the trip meter reset knob THEN turning the key to the "ON" position and holding for several seconds. Hope this is right for you, and good luck!

    thegrad
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,972
    a cabriolet is a convertible. of course an 8 year old 'vert doesn't handle as securely as the same size new sedan or have as much rear seat leg room. :confuse:
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,221
    On a seperate note Consumers doesn't reccomend the 6 6 cyl sedan and 6 hatchback due to under average reliability. However Consumers reccomends the 6 4 cyl sedan(average reliability) and 6 wagon(above average reliability.)

    FWIW I take very little stock in what CR says and I don't want to start a CR war here, but that seems very odd. The Mazda6 sport wagon comes with the V6 only. But somehow it's more reliable than the sedan and hatch which are built on the same line with the same parts? Yeah, that makes sense. :confuse:

    FWIW I do have a 2004 Mazda6 V6 MTX, "S" if you will, and have had one problem with it in 10,000+ miles. I noticed some jerky hesitation last spring when trying to hold a constant speed while climbing the hills in this area. Turned out the throttle body went bad and they had to replace it. It was done within an hour or two during a routine oil change and was of no inconvenience to me. The car still started every day and drove fine for the most part. Brakes are definitely NOT an issue at all. It's a really great car and I think it's getting a bad rap for no reason and without any real proof.

    Using MT's logic my long-term update log would show no problems to date. ;)

    Hopefully the Fusion fares better because, if for no other reason, Ford needs it to.
  • driverdmdriverdm Posts: 505
    "The retained resale value of people who bought the Sonata when it was brand spanking new should NOT be a standard by which the Sonata resale value is measured. What about those people that did purchase a new Sonata for $15k? They could potentially have a very good resale value percentage."

    I just think that there is a loa of incentives on the car and that the used car market for these cars will be very competitive. I think that resale will be very low. They put $3K on it when it was two months old. What is going to happen at model year end? Even if there is only $4.5 on the hood at that point, that will hit both the people that bought the car for sticker in the first two months, and the peopel who bought it for $3K off the following months. It basically has to stick at $3K off for the rest of the year. After seeing it for $3K off all over commercials and web sites, would you still be willing to buy at a lower rebate. And at that point, someone could sell you their used for almost exactly the same money they paid for it to begin with. If incentives go down to $1K, people who bought at $3K off and negotiated their invoice price (another $1K off of sticker), could say, "hey buy mine, it has about 5K mileage but I'll give you $3K off the sticker of a new one". THat can't happen in the auto industry. Hyundai has put themselves and the car in a very compromised position very early.
  • driverdmdriverdm Posts: 505
    I have heard about Hyundai raking in market share and huge sales increases but I haven't heard too much about profits. I don't know if their porfits have shot up like their sales due to all the incentives and rebates.

    I'll tell you this, if Hyundai can still turn a good profit on the Sonata at its already low price, minus $3K in rebates and produce the quality and fit and finish levels they are. Then Honda, Toyota, GM, Ford, should all file for bankruptcy together because it would be impossible for them to compete unless they relocate all plants to Korea. It would be like me and you having two lemonade stands and you pay $1 for your lemons and I pay 50 cents. If the quality of your leonade is only marginally better (ignoring sugar costs), if I charge 75 cents and you only a $1.05, the question has to come down to. Is your marginal quality advantage worth 30 cents on the dollar? If I discount my lemonade to 60 cents (still making double your profit margin), fold up your stand and go sell newspapers.
  • carguy58carguy58 Posts: 2,303
    "It's a really great car and I think it's getting a bad rap for no reason and without any real proof."

    I don't think its getting a bad rap. Mazda missed the boat on the interior room so thats sales of the 6 are at 70k units a year and not at 90-100K units a year is because the car is not as roomy as Altima and Accord.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    It's easy to see how Mazda can be overlooked when doing comparisons based on pure numbers.

    I compared top models of Mazda 6, Accord, Altima, and Camry(outgoing), and here are a few of the shortcoming I have found.

    Legroom F/R:

    Mazda (42.3/36.5)= 78.8 total
    Honda (42.6/36.8)= 79.4 total
    Nissan(43.9/36.4)= 80.3 total
    Toyota(41.6/37.8)= 79.4 total

    These numbers don't illustrate the fact that the car isn't as wide as the others, and therefore feels more cramped when sitting 2 or three abreast in the car. (Just opinion, though)
    Mazda smallest in width, length, horsepower (by 29-54 hp or) AND economy, lower crash test results, old (relative) styling (since 2002, nothing has changed) in quick changing market.

    Mazda's 6 is a great car with great handling, it just isn't what everyone looks for when shopping for a family car.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,221
    Mazda smallest in width, length, horsepower (by 29-54 hp or) AND economy, lower crash test results, old (relative) styling (since 2002, nothing has changed) in quick changing market.

    Some of this was addressed for this year though. Side curtains and ABS are now standard on all models except for the base I4. The interior and exterior have been refreshed, NAV is now available, and the engine has been massaged a bit.

    But I was really pointing the bad rap thing out in reference to CR. Their ratings don't make sense to me and probably turn some buyers away without good reason.

    On another note, why Ford didn't follow it's own lead and make side curtains and ABS standard on the Fusion is beyond me. I know some people don't want or like them but it seems they took the hint from the market in the Mazda but not in the Ford. Kind of strange.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Ford needs to have a low priced model to sell to fleets, perhaps, and the SAB aren't a priority to companies keeping tabs on a bottom line?

    Just a thought.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    Good comparison. You might also include Sonata; front leg room 43.7, rear 37.4 (total 81.1).

    Hip & shoulder room, front & rear, is also more spacious in the Sonata.
  • ontopontop Posts: 279
    You got it - Hyundai's finances are all smoke and mirrors. You'll never know about their profits, and even if they posted them, who would believe their self-generated, hard to substantiate assertions?

    I guess this isn't the consumer's problem right now. The cars are decent and the prices are dirt cheap. Somehow you'd think something will have to give. Iran could somehow buddy-up with North Korea and attack Seoul......
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I agree, but I just used the cars Mazda suggested a comparison with. I think we see (based on your post) why Mazda didn't want to be compared with the Full Size Sonata! :)
  • You got it - Hyundai's finances are all smoke and mirrors. You'll never know about their profits, and even if they posted them, who would believe their self-generated, hard to substantiate assertions?

    I guess this isn't the consumer's problem right now. The cars are decent and the prices are dirt cheap. Somehow you'd think something will have to give.


    Exactly. It very soon becomes a consumer's problem if Hyundai of NA decides to file chapter 11.

    But I believe it's pretty unlikely and they are probably trying to do what Lexus did starting in 1990. Which is launch excellent products while severely undercutting prices of the competition, win customers with the quality of products and service and then raise prices while retaining superior quality.

    Really a great scheme, but central to its success is the quality of the product, which Hyundai doesn't have at the moment.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,784
    That's right, those 20k Sonatas sold last month were to buyers duped into thinking the Sonata is a strong entry in the mid-sized car market. The duped include all the car mags that talk positively about the quality of current Hyundais like the Sonata, CR (which recommends some Hyundai models), and JD Power (which has ranked the Sonata above Accord and Camry in Initial Quality twice in the past 3 years). ;)

    Somehow I think GM or Ford will file for Chapter 11 before HMA does.
  • alan_salan_s Posts: 357
    Hyundai is a huge company with many different interests other than manufacturing cars.
    They may not be making huge profits on the Sonata now because:
    a) They know they can't command a Camry/Accord price YET, and
    b) they are most importantly buying market share.

    Low profits today are an investment for future profits when they have built market share and brand-name recognition. The Japanese effectively did this over twenty years ago. What this means to the consumer now is a good quality product at a bargain-basement price.
    With the release of the new Camry, though, I think a lot of top brass at Hyundai, Ford, GM, Honda and Nissan are having nightmares right now. It looks like it may blow everything else into the weeds...
  • jojoejojoe Posts: 81
    Yup I agree and the Sonata will be landing right on top of those bland ugly Camry's which were stuck in the mud beneath!
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,221
    Ford needs to have a low priced model to sell to fleets, perhaps, and the SAB aren't a priority to companies keeping tabs on a bottom line?

    Just a thought.


    Makes sense. However if they do follow the lead of Mazda, as in the 6, the base I4 would not come standard with SACs. That would be perfect for fleets and Joe consumer alike.

    I guess realistically it really doesn't matter to me. I'd like to see ABS and SACs standard on everything but either way I'm going to pay for them when I buy. My 6 does not have SACs because it was hard enough finding a V6 with an MTX let alone one with SAC's back in early 2004. I bit the bullet and took what I could get for my S-Plan. The Ford salesman I deal with already committed to allowing me to Factory order my Mustang at the end of this year and still get X-Plan pricing because I was concerned that those are still really hard to find with an MTX, and nearly impossible to find with SABs. You can bet the ABS and SAB boxes will be checked on that order sheet. Together, and with traction control added in, those "necessary" options will cost me about $600. Well worth it IMO.
  • Wouldn't be too sure about that. Yes Hyuhdai has alot of other interests as they are a very powerful company but not the least among them is their vehicle line.

    They are are making great strides with the Sonata, Elantra and other new vehicles. This is just their first salvo, stand by for their counter and followon attacks attacks already in prgress!!!
  • I think 300 - 500 below invoice before rebates is the best you could do. They are desparate to sell but much more than that would cause too big a loss for them. But heck you can try!!!
  • Don't buy a Ford.
  • Boring looking? I think the 2006 Sonata is one of the sharpest cars out and a great improvement over the 2005 (which may not necessarily be saying much). I have a dark cinnamon model got the windows tinted dark and have had several people (unsolicited) tell me how great it looks. One guy was in a Volvo V70 admiring my car. I think they look like the Audi A6. A buddy of mine likes the looks better than his Accord.

    I dropped my wife's Honda Pilot off at the Honda dealership for servicing and parked my 2006 Hyundai Sonata right in front of the big service window (OK I did it on purpose). Recently waxed, tinted windows etc. I saw five or six salesmen huddles around obviously discussing it. I don't know what they were saying they looked worried and they certainly weren't laughing at it!! LOL!!

    You guys are stuck on Gargonzola and it is clearly Brie time baby! Honda and Toyota step aside!!! I love to see the giants fall!!
  • jimmy81jimmy81 Posts: 170
    The Elantra is an aweful looking vehicle. You have to not give a spit about looks if you buy one of those.

    The Sonata is a great car, but it too is unappealing. Wouldn't take much to turn it into a looker.
  • jojoejojoe Posts: 81
    Hmmmmmmmm...and do we all remember,beauty is in the eye of the beholder! I bet the girl of your dreams isn't the girl of mine or anyone elses and who cares! I personally like the looks of the Sonata ,I think it looks awesome.I personally don't like the look of the Accord,Camry or Fusion.Now saying that,I have my own views of what is nice looking,my likes and dislikes won't be that of the next person.Then I don't really care.I am not a follower as many folks are.I like something different and I am always willing to take a chance,if I see something I like.You know what I mean(SOMETHING I LIKE).I as many in here don't care if folks such as you don't like our choice of vehicle,but it does seem that you have a problem if we don't agree with yours.Well we really don't care about that either.You go ahead and be a devotee of your brand,we will of ours.What you choose doesn't make you any better or more special than us,even though you might think it does.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Hmmmmmmmm...and do we all remember,beauty is in the eye of the beholder! I bet the girl of your dreams isn't the girl of mine or anyone elses and who cares! I personally like the looks of the Sonata ,I think it looks awesome.I personally don't like the look of the Accord,Camry or Fusion.Now saying that,I have my own views of what is nice looking,my likes and dislikes won't be that of the next person.Then I don't really care.I am not a follower as many folks are.I like something different and I am always willing to take a chance,if I see something I like.You know what I mean(SOMETHING I LIKE).I as many in here don't care if folks such as you don't like our choice of vehicle,but it does seem that you have a problem if we don't agree with yours.Well we really don't care about that either.You go ahead and be a devotee of your brand,we will of ours.What you choose doesn't make you any better or more special than us,even though you might think it does.

    This is very true. I personally think that all four of the cars here are handsome, if not breathtaking. No midsize sedan should be polarizing in its style (if it wants to sell high volumes). I feel that the Fusion went out on a limb with some of its exterior details, and most of those paid off (the best looking Ford sedan in YEARS). Hyundai, Accord, and Camry are all fairly bland IMO. The Sonata took the 03 Accord's rear and stuck it on the Sonata (especially taillights). The Camry makes me sleepy to look at! The Accord has a much nicer looking rear with the 06 redesign, and adds a touch of class with the LED taillights (offered on the more upscale cars like Azera).

    While I'm talking tail lights, I was very dissappointed to see that Ford still hasn't made a seperate blinker from the brakelight/taillight. The one bulb shares all three functions. Just seems like a cheap out to me, and I personally feel that having a seperate brakelight and blinker is safer (Just my opinion, not necessarily yours).

    Have a good MLK day tomorrow!

    thegrad
  • I had an English teacher back in High School that used to mark us down on papers when we used the term "in my opinion". She said that it was redundant to use it because you are the one writing/saying it so it is obviously your opinion.
  • Joe you are right on. I hate going with the crowd. I saw the Sonata as different and that appealed to me. It also gets stolen alot less!
This discussion has been closed.