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Honda Civic vs Toyota Corolla vs Mazda3

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Comments

  • w9cww9cw Posts: 888
    autonomous wrote: "The 3 is a great little car Among the names Mazda used for its compact cars besides 3 was 323 and GLC; when asked what GLC meant, the response was "great little car".

    I bought a new 1978 Mazda GLC in September 1977. I believe it was the first model year for the GLC. It was a very nice car, and given the size of the Civic at that time, Mazda actually marketed the GLC against the Accord. I drove it for 3 years, put over 75,000 miles on it without the hint of trouble. The only real problem I had was the dealer. They were basically clueless, and I ended up performing most of the maintenance on the car - which was nil except for normal routine preventive maintenance.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Posts: 4,421
    All this discussion about the Civic's fantastic gas mileage got my curiosity up, and I went over and looked at the "Civic: Real-World MPG Numbers" discussion. What I read there -- especially the last half-dozen or so posts which are from owners of 2004 and 2005 Civics -- made me start wondering if it was really fair to grant the Civic an 8-mpg lead over the Mazda3 on the highway. It appears, in the real world, that maybe 4 or 5 mpg would be a fairer comparison based on the way people drive their cars.

    Meade
  • Meade, did you compare these real world figures to the 3s real world figures or EPA numbers?

    I like the 3, my only concern is the gas mileage, which, even on the i, is no better than my 4 cyl Accord. For some reason, Mazda of late has been lagging on gas mileage, I wonder why. Earlier they used to be righ up there with Honda/Toyota.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Posts: 4,421
    Meade, did you compare these real world figures to the 3s real world figures or EPA numbers?

    Yep. Sho' did. It appears that the actual owners of Mazda3's are getting 32-33 on the highway with a few exceptions ... even admitting they drive the cars pretty hard. Actual owners of 2004 and 2005 Civics are saying they get "34-35 mpg" or "high 30s" for the most part.

    For some reason, Mazda of late has been lagging on gas mileage, I wonder why.

    Could it be that Mazda has gone with a larger engine (2.3-liter in the Mazda3s, 2.0-liter in the Mazda3i) and Honda has stayed with a 1.8-liter engine? And look at the difference in horsepower. That's gotta come from somewhere!

    Meade
  • "I'm waiting to see how long it takes the other guys to bring out their copies of the Mazda5. They'll come -- just watch. "
    Oh so ou think Mazda was the innovator for this type of vehicle? There were vehicles of this type in Japan from Japan's Big3 even before mazda release it there in January . Theyre the last to have this type of vehicle.
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    Q: For some reason, Mazda of late has been lagging on gas mileage, I wonder why.
    A: Could it be that Mazda has gone with a larger engine (2.3-liter in the Mazda3s, 2.0-liter in the Mazda3i) and Honda has stayed with a 1.8-liter engine? And look at the difference in horsepower. That's gotta come from somewhere!


    The other conspicuous reason is the increased weight of the Mazda3 when compared to its predecessor, the Protege. Several hundred pounds in fact. I'll have to check the Civic and Corolla but I wouldn't be surprised if they're getting heavier, also. This is an area of which the auto designers need to be more mindful; fuel prices are one reason but general sportiness including agility, braking, etc. suffer with the addition of superfluous weight. Imagine the upcoming MazdaSpeed3 shaving off instead of adding on several hundred pounds - that would be an astonishing achievement. Do I think it'll happen? No. Sorry to say, the direction for most cars seems to be going the other way. Judging from some of the incredible concept cars, I doubt this is due to technical/material problems; it's a question of consumer demand. If we demanded that instead of adding 10% to the hp our next car shed 10% of it's weight, the cars would be there and they wouldn't be wimpier but rather more powerful. After all, that's what happened in the seventies during the oil crisis when the bloated domestic behemoths were being trounced by those raptor-like imports. Here's hoping the raptors rule again.
  • Most people I know who drive Civics get close or even more than EPA. If you go back far enough in teh forums, you will see owners getting higher MPGs

    As for engine size, yeah sure size does matter, but if you look at competting engines, they are getting better figures. For example, the Accord 2.4 gets more than the 3s 2.3, as well as the 6s four cyl. Going to V6s, both the Accord as well as the Camry's V6s get better than the 6s V6 ( I am not sure about the Altima's V6 even that one may be getting better than the 6). All of the above engines, except the Camry V6 also have higher HP ratings than Mazda
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 13,556
    gearing plays a big part IMO. The Accord is geared much higher than the 6/3 (and probably the Fusion), at least in the 5 speed sticks that I was looking at. The Accord is much more relaxed at highway speeds, and that translates into improved MPG. In theory, the Mazda will accelerate quicker without downshifting.

    THis is actually one of my pet peeves. I think recent MT cars have been geared way to short. No way a fairly torquey 2.3-2.4l 4 cyl needs to be turning 3K plus at 70 mph. Syre, maybe a low torque/high RPM screamer 1.8l needs to be turning faster, but not a big displacement 4.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • mpg60mpg60 Posts: 71
    Meade,

    Thanks for the link to the information on the M3 - Good reading. All I can say is I am glad Mazda made something different for those of us who want different.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Posts: 4,421
    All I can say is I am glad Mazda made something different for those of us who want different.

    I couldn't agree more. You know, back in September 1991 I had compared the Corolla (a '78 was my first car), the Civic, the Sentra and a few others. I had settled on the Civic EX. But then, almost by chance, I thought (like a lot of people), "I wonder what Mazda sells in this price range?" I went over to a Mazda dealer and could not believe what I "discovered." I felt as if I'd just uncovered the "best-kept secret" in the small-car world! I never looked back. They let me drive a Protege LX home that night, and I came back the next day and bought it.

    Guys (and gal), I used to drive a Saab. I know Mazda isn't the end-all to the automotive world. But I'll tell you this -- I'll take another reliable, fun-to-drive, comfortable, family-friendly Mazda3 over another Saab at any price any day.

    Meade
  • mdaffronmdaffron Posts: 4,421
    Late '80s, right? Where were the AWD Corollas and Civics? AWD is a proven safety feature, right? I won't even ask about turbos, since I'm a guy and we know guy are only interested in zoom-zoom! :P

    Meade
  • And just for the record, the 2006 Civic has a timing chain, not a belt, so it will not be a maintainence item as it was on past Civics.
  • mdaffronmdaffron Posts: 4,421
    The 2006 Civic now offers a timing chain.

    But the Mazda3 had it in 2004.

    Mazda comes out with the innovation, its competition plays catchup -- that's what I'm talking about.

    Meade
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    some off-topic posts.

    We are talking about the Civic, the Corolla and the Mazda3 here. Regardless of some folks' efforts to involve a bunch of off-topic material, that's not going to fly.

    Please keep future posts to the subject if you'd like to see them remain on the board.

    Thanks.
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 13,556
    just curious, but does the Corolla compete here on anything but price, MPG and the toyota nameplate? Most of the discussion seems to centered on the Mazda and Honda. Having driven all 3, the Toyota is (IMHO) totally outclassed, in comfort and driving dynamics/comfort/excitement.

    I heard there is a new Camry due for 2007? Anyone know when the next Rola is due out?

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • As a matter of fact its not. Sales figures as of September shows that it is the best selling compact for 2005.
  • The Corolla had the timing chain starting from its 2003-present model. Who's the innovator now?
  • stickguystickguy Posts: 13,556
    the majority of sales are to people that couldn't care less about cars, and probably hate driving to start with.

    Most of the regulars at Edmunds are outliers on the car lovers scale I think.

    2013 Acura RDX (wife's), 2007 Volvo S40 (when daughter lets me see it), 2000 Acura TL (formerly son's, now mine again), and new Jetta SE (son's first new car on his own dime!)

  • majority of car buyers are not bias to a particular car. Look, we have the information and we all have access to all the information were giving them here so dont think theyre not smart buyers.
    Just because your driving it and you like it doest mean that I have to like it too. I have my own priorities and needs and basically thats what it says when you look at the sales figures.
  • ctalkctalk Posts: 646
    Sales figures do not tell which car is the best, then the Cavalier and Impala will be on the 'best car' list.

    The Corolla is an excellent choice, its hard to find anything bad about it (like the Camry)
This discussion has been closed.