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Honda Civic vs Toyota Corolla vs Mazda3

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  • i lkie the new honda civic si :)
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Never said it did not. However, the Mazda6 is not part of this discussion.

    Nor is the Camry, Avalon, Accord, etc....

    Let's all move on and leave the CamCord and 6 in the Midsize Sedans Discussion Board, shall we?
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    Nor is the Camry, Avalon, Accord, etc ... Let's all move on

    Exactly!
  • Didn't Motortrend compare all these cars a year and a half ago?? Hands down the Corolla XRS destroyed the others in Acceleration, Handling, Stoping, and MPG's. They gave the vote to the Mazda 3 though because of the optional Nav system and HID lighting.

    They straight said the Corolla was fun to drive but it's not for Lazy Drivers!!!! and Most American's are Very lazy drivers, and believe me there's a lot of shifting going on in the XRS, nothing sounds better than dropping it from 6th to 3rd gear on the Fwy
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Doesn't sound like the argument is dead with an excited post like that one! :)
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    Actually, this argument IS dead.

    The '07 Corolla is not offered as an XRS model. Toyota killed it in '06.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Well, the new Corolla should be debuting any day now, which will liven things back up I would think.
  • not likely going to liven anything up....Dual VVT-i and it only gained 4hp over the current engine
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    This segment isn't all about power, ya know!
    Most buyers of $16k-$19k cars aren't racers or speed demons. They want a compromise of capable handling, comfortable ride, safe power/braking, safety features, and interior luxury, with economy as a bonus. I meant the new Corolla should liven up the conversation, not necessarily a driver's pulse.
  • I know what you mean....but how much money did they invest into a new engine design....THAT WEIGHS MORE than the 1ZZ-FE and doesn't exactly out perform. I just hope the engine is tuned for more mid-range response.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I hope so too. With Dual VVT-i it should be better as far as torque across the rev-range is concerned. Also, I wonder if its fuel economy improved even more?
  • eldainoeldaino Posts: 1,618
    Well a year and a half ago i guess its understandable that a xrs would beat a civic. But whats the point in bringing that up now? I read a review from 1994 about a ford contour vs. a civic hx and the contour won. Think that going to swing any opinions on the cars now?

    The new civic would hold up fairly well against a corolla xrs. The si would 'destroy' it. :P
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    Didn't Motortrend compare all these cars a year and a half ago?? Hands down the Corolla XRS destroyed the others in Acceleration, Handling, Stopping, and MPG's

    Well, the XRS is no longer made, and the Mazda3 in that comparo was an automatic, not manual like the others. The XRS also had a solid rear axle, I do not know how it handled better. I have never seen anything anywhere else that a Corolla handled better then a Civic or Mazda3.
  • ezpilzeezpilze Posts: 29
    I don't understand why everyone is bringing in the XRS and SI into this; at this rate, we might as well include the speed3 huh? So to make this simple, I'm just going to compare the base models w/ no options (those you can add yourself hence 'options' ^^)

    Engine wise, the mazda3 has my vote, its the biggest and hence has the best torque to it, but it does have lower mpg (I don't care what ads say theres no way a larger pistoned combustion engine can have lower mpg than a smaller one). Too bad under hard revving the engine sorta just simmers down, while the civic revs nicely and evenly. The corolla just makes alot of noise; I had 3 other sit in the car w/ me for all 3 cars and the corolla did the worst at accelerating. (all were manual) Even when holding the low gears the car would not go, even the civic and mazda3 went along nicely. FYI: the corolla has 4 doors, but those are really just for looks, the car really does struggle when you put 4 people in it. This is probably why most ppl complain about not getting the advertised mileage on their corollas b/c they are constantly pushing the engine just to keep up w/ traffic.

    Interior the mazda3 looks nice and all, but it really is kinda tacky. The plastic parts seem cheaper when compared to the civic and corolla, but the sound for all three cars were pretty good. The seats for the mazda3 had a somewhat wannabe racey feel in that they grip your body, but comfortably, which is not something I'm used, 'racing' seats aren't supposed to be THAT comfy. Also the mazda3's seat adjustment used the turning knob thingies. I sat only in the driver's seat so interior room I can't say much, I'm not some 7 ft tall monster so I can't say much about interior head/leg room. The gauges for all the cars are sufficient, all I need to do is be able to see them, but if you want sporty the mazda3 and corollaS has decent gauges, while the civic has innovative/quirky gauges. The instrument panel is easy to use on all cars though I'm not sure if it was me, but the mazda3 had a bit too many buttons for my taste, while the civic looks weird w/ the empty panel where the GPS is supposed to be.

    In the handling dept. the mazda3 is very good for zipping around traffic, the steering is quick and responsive, though feedback is quite close to nill. On freeways this could get annoying, during my test drive it was kind of windy and I had to constantly readjust the steering against winds and road bumps. The civic and corolla feel less nimble, but on the freeway they make for easier drives. All cars handle about the same to me under normal driving conditions, but under hard cornering the mazda3's engine showed its draw back in having the heaviest engine of the 3 cars. But nobody is going to be driving any of these cars hard... right? You can go try it on your own I personally preferred civic in this dept.

    Price wise the cars were off by $1000 or so, and that didn't bug me horribly. Honda and Toyota's reliability are pretty solid in my book, but I've had a couple of bad experiences w/ mazdas in the past, although you do get a bit more w/ the mazda3 for the price, but that just tells me something about quality in the car.

    Looks is a personal preference hence I will stay off the subject. W/ these cars what I tend to see are people either liking it, or hating it.
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    A few questions for you:

    What do you currently drive?

    How important is fuel economy in your choice?

    How long did you spend test driving each car?

    Did you use a similar "track"?

    had a couple of bad experiences w/ mazdas
    Which Mazdas had issues?

    you do get a bit more w/ the mazda3 for the price, but that just tells me something about quality in the car.
    Do you mean that the quality is related to the price (i.e. higher price equals higher quality)?
  • ezpilzeezpilze Posts: 29
    I currently drive an 02 BMW. I test drove the cars for my brother who the dealer wouldn't let drive because he didn't have insurance yet, so I have no bias towards any of the cars.

    My brother was going to college so of course I kept fuel economy in mind, I even noted that the mazda3 despite having better torque would yield lower mpg's. MPG really does depend on the driver, the corolla boasts higher mpg ratings than the civic, but if you were to drive the corolla so that it would keep up w/ the civic under normal driving conditions, then the numbers would be about the same. I don't go by the number provided online or what not, I go by my own judgment based how the cars run, so I can't really give you numbers.

    Each car was driven for about 20 mins, some my friends own so I get to see how they're doing as well after 3k miles. All the dealers were in the same area so I took the same course both freeway and city for all 3. I did hill, flat, curves, straight, turn radius, freeway back and forth.

    Mazda MPV minivan, light weight truck, and forgot my friends car mx-3 or something like that, its been a while since I've seen him. The Protege I didn't even have to take a look at and it went through a mass recall from what I hear (source is from 3 friends that each own one either directly or through family).

    The interior trim of the mazda3 gives you the whole metallic-y trim, console comes w/ more features, but the plastic covering it wasn't too great. The seats were firmer in the mazda3, but the material didn't seem as great as the corolla or civic. So you get more stuff for the buck, but quality wise its not really that much more.

    Hope I answered all your questions sufficiently.
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    Interesting.

    Sounds like you give the test cars a good ride that should show off some of their strengths and weaknesses. Some drivers dismiss cars without test driving them.

    The 323/Protege/Mazda3 is probably Mazda's most popular and long running vehicle line. I've never heard of a recall since 2002 for the Protege/Mazda3. Consumer Reports continues to rate its reliability as top notch.
  • I recently bought a Corolla and at first i was getting 33 MPG (all city driving - no highway!) and now i am getting closer to 28 MPG. Not so cool..... i bought the Corolla instead of the Civic because of gas mileage. Other thoughts on this gas mystery / aggravation?

    Q - how long do you need to own a new car to get your moneys worth? (Loaded Q - I know)
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    A couple of thoughts on your first question...

    Winter fuel is known for being a mixture which lowers mileage, sometimes by 5-10%. I've recently lost 2 MPG average in my Accord (well, since Nov.). Are you warming up the car extra than you did when you first bought it? Driving a little harder since break-in?

    To your second question, I'd say:

    When your car starts costing more to keep running than another new car payment would, I'd say yours is used up. Of course, it is up to you to decide when before this occurs you will sell/trade it in. My grandfather drove his brand new Civic Wagon (a 1987 model) until it had 255,000 miles, and the A/C died. He sold it for $1,000 and bought a 3-year old pickup with low miles. If anyone got his money's worth from a new car, it was him. :)
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    Q - how long do you need to own a new car to get your moneys worth? (Loaded Q - I know)

    If you purchased the car and own it, then you would try to keep it as long as possible to spread the cost of the car over a long period. The single largest cost of a new car is its depreciation (especially in its first year where many cars typically lose 15% to 20% of their value). For that reason alone, it does not make sense to me to sell a car before it is four or five years old. Another way of looking at it, the money you save not paying for a new car is earning interest in the bank. The car industry, of course, would prefer that we buy new cars as frequently as possible.

    To keep a car for this period (four years or more) is directly related to its long term reliability. That's one reason I think one could argue that Japanese cars are cheaper than American and European cars. And Corollas are great in that they hold their value especially well.
  • Ahhh the graduate.... always a good reply to my posts!

    Well actually the past two tanks i've tracked i have gotten 22mpg - I am pretty meticulous about tracking my mpg...or neurotic - you decide - however i know its accurate. Anyway, I am letting it warm up a bit more, about three mins but only when the car has sat for a while (i.e., in the morning). I know that the car is going to get worse gas mileage in the winter but now ten miles different - seems a bit ludicrous. I know SUVs (my friend's CRV) that is getting better mpg than my corolla.

    Driving harder - ya know i kind of drive like an old lady - hence my purchase of a corolla- so no i don't think so - the car only has 3,000 miles on it - i mean i guess i have to punch it sometimes in the city to avoid a crazy driver but all in all i think i am pretty standard over the past three months of owning the car.

    I ask about the time of ownership, because I am quite disappointed in my purchase and have been thinking about a trade in and I am wondering just how insane that is.... the mpg is just really aggravating me - save the world girl at heart!

    Last - do you think something is wrong with my car???

    do you think i can call the dealer on false advertising?

    My previous car was a '92 honda civic - loved it - wish i could have drove it into the ground - but someone else wanted it so they took it (you may remember this story from past posts).

    ok grad - any advise - i'm here....nursing my wounds from a Chicago Bears loss in the SuperBowl....
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Well actually the past two tanks i've tracked i have gotten 22mpg - I am pretty meticulous about tracking my mpg...or neurotic - you decide - however i know its accurate. Anyway, I am letting it warm up a bit more, about three mins but only when the car has sat for a while (i.e., in the morning). I know that the car is going to get worse gas mileage in the winter but now ten miles different - seems a bit ludicrous. I know SUVs (my friend's CRV) that is getting better mpg than my corolla.

    -Warming up the car will use a decent amount of fuel, but 22 MPG is pretty low, I'll definitely agree.

    -What kind of mileage did you get in the Civic in the same type of conditions? If it got in the low-mid 20s, then I'd say your vehicle is probably fine. Do you do a lot of stop and go city driving?

    -I would be tempted to let the dealer take a look at the car, but since you are at 3k miles, maybe ask about it at the oil change, and mention your concern. 22MPG is NOT normal for regular driving, but with a lot of idling, warming up, and stop and go, its pretty easy to get to. Remember, for every minute your car idles, you are getting 0 MPG.

    -You can't call the dealer on false advertising, because the dealer, and even Toyota corporation, are not the ones who come up with the mileage estimates. That's the EPA.

    Let me know what your commute is like (how far, and how long it generally takes to go that many miles). I understand you don't drive aggressively (under 4k RPM most of the time, I'd guess?), but a lot of stopped time is what will kill mileage.

    That's all I can tell you for now, with the facts I've got.
  • Civic Mileage = 32 miles in the city and 38 on the highway - consistently. Same type of driving i do now with the corolla.

    Yes, i do mostly stop and go driving in the city. I really only have to drive 2.8 miles to work (no public transport), but it is all lights and many people on the road.

    commute = 2.8 miles to work, it takes me any where from 20-35 mins to get to work. Yikes that's scary....
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    commute = 2.8 miles to work, it takes me any where from 20-35 mins to get to work. Yikes that's scary....

    Ok, there's all I need to hear. You are averaging about 5 miles an hour - which is really REALLY bad for mileage. Remember, the CITY EPA estimate is averaging 20 MPH, or making 4x the forward progress that you are. With that kind of commute, I'm amazed that you got 32 MPG if this is in fact the same commute you had in your old Civic. I wouldn't expect 20 MPG in a 5 MPH average drive, so I'd say your Corolla is performing pretty well, considering.

    Have you taken your car out on the highway for a trip (over say, 250 miles highway at one time?) Do this, and see if your mileage hits mid-upper 30s or better. If it does, your car is likely just fine.

    Honestly, my personal opinion is that nothing wrong with your car, instead everything is wrong with your commute.
  • d_hyperd_hyper Posts: 130
    You can easily bike or ski to work.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    If she's dresses in a business suit and heels for work, or does anything less than casual, that could pose some difficulty!
  • Yes, I guess it is bad...

    I have taken the corolla on one long trip and i averaged 40 mpg - I was smiling!!!!

    I'm glad to hear your expert, graduate opinion things nothing is wrong with the corolla. Now if only summer could come sooner....

    Thanks!
  • I do in fact ride my bike to work in the summer time - quick change into the suit and heals when i get to the office. But the winter poses a whole new threat.... snow and freezing cold temps... not to mention I don't work in the best of neighborhoods so night time is not very safe for a woman on her own on a bike.

    Cheers!
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Yes, I guess it is bad...

    I have taken the corolla on one long trip and i averaged 40 mpg - I was smiling!!!!

    I'm glad to hear your expert, graduate opinion things nothing is wrong with the corolla. Now if only summer could come sooner....


    I'm definitely no expert, but I do have some knowledge about what will help and hinder mileage. Call it a moderately educated opinion. :)

    My ex-GF drives her Corolla pretty hard, and averaged 31 MPG with mix city/hwy driving. I drove her car two days worth while mine was in the body shop getting repaired, and I averaged 35 MPG in similar conditions to her 31 MPG (driving styles are important). Still, you'll get better mileage at 85 MPH than you will doing stop and go at 5 MPH.

    The fact that you got 40 MPG makes me pretty certain your Corolla is fine. Happy to have discussed this! ;)
  • steve333steve333 Posts: 200
    Unfortunately you have to drive the thing. I test drove a 2006 Corolla and it was the worst car I have ever driven. The Steering Wheel is at an odd angle, the engine sounded like an angry lawn mower and the engine had no torque, it just lurched until i got in on the Freeway.
    I fully expected a smooth nice handling car after reading press reviews and was shocked at how poorly it drove.
    I have a feeling that many people don't test drive other cars. They feel that Toyota's are reliable so thats what I'm going to buy.
    Luckily I test drove everything out there. The Mazda 3 was my first choice but I couldn't find any to buy (their ship sunk and lost a few thousand cars). I couldn't get over the new Civic's dash, so it came down to the Cobalt.
    I gotta say, this little sucker drives like a bigger car. Very good acceleration, quiet, excellent highway ride, and good handling.
This discussion has been closed.