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BMW 3-Series Lease Questions

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  • skobolaskobola Member Posts: 207
    I intend to lease a 325i, Arctic + BMW Assist, which bring it to MSRP of $32,820 ($30,110 invoice). Unfortunately, I live in Miami and there are only 2 dealers, none of which seem to offer discounts that I have read in here, that is, selling the cars for $1,000-$1,500 over the invoice. Does anyone have any recommendations for the dealers in the area, and what should be the lease price for 36 mo/30k miles lease? BTW, I should not be paying for the security, as I have been leasing BMW's for quite some time, including my current 325. Thanks.
  • ckm1515ckm1515 Member Posts: 52
    I agree with you 100% about the marked up rate factor. I work in equipment leasing so I'm very aware of how rate factors work, the margins associated, etc. Going in, I was already armed with the rate info. That being said, I really like this dealership and their customer service is outstanding. I did do some comparison shopping and found that, while other dealers in my area would go with the base rate factor, their discount on the vehicle wasn't as great. Every goal in negotation is for both sides to come to an equitable solution. I felt like I got the best deal possible at the first dealership and the cust service convinced me that this is the right dealership for me. Thanks for your input.
  • feistylegalfeistylegal Member Posts: 18
    Car Man:

    I have been given this offer. First, is this a good deal or do I have room to negotiate the price of the car down further? What should the monthly payments be with a 36m/12k lease including tax? I really don't want my payments to be more than $570 a mth with tax. (Please include whatever interest rate you used to calculate the payments). Thanks in advanced for all of the advice and information!

    Specifications: 330i 2006
    Metallic Paint
    Black Leather/Aluminum Trim
    Manual Transmission
    Comfort Access
    Premium Package
    Satellite Prep
    Heated Front Seats
    Sport Package

    Invoice: $36,600
    MSRP: $42,575
    Internet Price = 40,989.20
    Dealer Doc Fee = 399.00
    Subtotal = 41,288.20
    7% tax (Atlanta) = 2,890.17
    Tag and Title = 38.00
    GA Lemon Law Fee = 3.00
    OTD: $44,219.37
  • petesamprspetesamprs Member Posts: 25
    Something is wrong w/ your numbers. The difference between invoice and MSRP is never this large for a car of this price.

    Invoice is usually approx 91-92% of MSRP, so either one of those #s is wrong for you.
  • oceanexprtoceanexprt Member Posts: 16
    hi car man,

    2005 325cic
    12k/year, 36 months
    msrp 47270
    neg price 42995
    505 plus tax
    1500 out the door.

    what do you think of this?

    thank you in advance.
  • feistylegalfeistylegal Member Posts: 18
    Okay, I see your point, maybe I was unclear in the way I listed the figures. I have checked Edmunds and BMWUSA. Here are the figures again. If there is still a miscalulation, please explain. Thanks!

    330i
    Invoice: $33,485.00
    MSRP: $36,600
    MSRP+ destination = $37,295.00(base)
    Price with all the options = $42,645.00
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    I think you are confusing "invoice" with "base price"

    $36,600 is the base price of the 330i without options..

    The "invoice" price is the confidential wholesale price that the dealer pays BMW for the car...

    But, no matter... the invoice price isn't used to calculate a lease payment..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • feistylegalfeistylegal Member Posts: 18
    You are right. Thanks for the clarification! BTW, what is the acquisition fee? And is $825 the standard fee? Thanks!
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    BMWFS (the bank) charges an acquisition fee with every lease.. Almost every leasing institution does this... The base fee is $625.. BMWFS allows the dealer to mark up the fee to $825 (and many of them do)... this extra money goes to the dealer (extra profit for them).

    If your dealer is marking up the acquisition fee, it is a probability that they are marking up the money factor, as well..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • feistylegalfeistylegal Member Posts: 18
    Well, on the quote that the dealer provided me it used a money factor of .00195 and a residual of 64% for 12k/36mths. However, the acquisition fee was $825.00. By lowering the acquisition fee will that make my payments decrease? The net cap cost reduction was 41,606.83 (cost of car:40,939.00)= $667. Is this about average?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    .00195 is the base rate.. so, that is very good... I'm a bad guesser...lol.

    Anything that is less, will lower your cost.. If you can get them to lower the acquisition fee by $200, you'll either have $200 less to pay upfront, or your payment will go down by $5-$6 per month...

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • oceanexprtoceanexprt Member Posts: 16
    hi gurus,

    2005 325cic
    12k/year, 36 months
    msrp 47270
    neg price 42995
    505 plus tax
    1500 out the door.

    what do you think of this?

    thank you in advance.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    As incredibly cheap as this seems... it appears that they are marking up the money factor, and possibly the acquisition fee...

    I get the same payment using a cap cost of $43,820 (selling price + $825 acquisition fee) and a money factor of .0014. Assuming that your $1500 includes 1st payment and security deposit.

    If the acquisition fee was $625 and the base money factor used was .001, residual of 62%... then the payment would be $471/mo.+ tax..

    Either number is incredibly cheap to lease a 3-series convertible, though.. That selling price is very good, even taking into account the $1500 dealer cash on the convertibles this month..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • oceanexprtoceanexprt Member Posts: 16
    hi kyfdx,
    thank you so much for all that wonderful info.
    what exactly is the dealers cost after their factory rebate and stuff like that?
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    About $5500 under MSRP including the dealer cash...

    You can build and price the car on Edmunds.com, and it will give you the invoice price... then subtract the $1500 from that...

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • bmwcccbmwccc Member Posts: 234
    I wanted to run a few figures past you and see if my math is correct. I have never leased before so I want to be fully armed before I go into negotiations.

    2006 330i $33,485
    Metallic Paint $430
    Sport Package $1,455
    Premium Package $2,000
    Cold Weather Package $910
    Steptronic $1,210

    Profit over Invoice $1,000

    Total Cost = $40,490

    36 mo. / 15k year lease
    .00195 MF Rate
    .62% Residual
    $0 dollars down ( except appropriate fees )
    Approx. 501.59 per mo. plus $41.39 tax = %542.98 per mo.

    KYFDX, my other question is what should I expect for fees and what would I be expected to pay up front?

    Acquisition fee?
    Security Deposit?
    Title & Registration?
    Liscense?
    Doc. fee?
    1st payment?

    Also, is shipping included in upfront fees or built into lease computation?

    Is Gap insurance usually included or is something I purchase extra?

    I am in an area with 8 BMW dealerships within 75 -100 miles. Competition is present so I am anticipating getting the $1,000 over invoice. However, will I be able to get the Nov. BMWFS MF Base Rate at .00195?

    Thanks in advance for all your help! If I missed something that you think is important to know please feel free to let me know.

    Thanks
    bmwccc :)
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    MSRP? Can't calculate a lease without it... Also, you don't have the destination charge in there.. That is part of the MSRP and the invoice..

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  • bmwcccbmwccc Member Posts: 234
    Sorry, MSRP is $43,845 and one of my questions was about the destination charge. Do I need to pay for that in the lease calculation or up front with the other fees.

    Let me know if you need any other info.

    Thanks again for your help!
    bmwccc
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    The destination charge is part of the MSRP and the invoice.. You need to include it in the MSRP to calculate the residual.. Is $43,845 the MSRP including destination?

    It really isn't a "fee"... But, if you are calculating a selling price, by adding up the invoice and then adding a profit, you have to add it in there, as well.. as it is also part of the invoice price. In other words, make it part of your selling price.. It should never show up as a separate charge, after that..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • bmwcccbmwccc Member Posts: 234
    Okay KYFDX, with that being said the MSRP will be $44,540 (which includes the destination).

    Thanks for your patience!
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    Actually... your $43,845 MSRP includes the destination charge..

    $43,845 MSRP
    $41,185 (invoice + $1000.. destination was missing here)
    $41,185 Cap cost
    3yr/45K lease
    62% residual
    .00195 money factor
    Payment = $523/mo.+ tax.
    Due at signing: 1st pymt, security deposit, $625 acquisition fee, license/registration fees.

    I think our figures differ, because you didn't add the destination fee into your invoice price..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • skyccordskyccord Member Posts: 2
    Hey everyone,
    I want to know what you guys think about this lease deal.

    2006 BMW 330I
    MSRP: $44,570.80
    Negotiated to: $42,100
    36 months/12K year

    Metallic Paint
    Leather
    Cold Weather Package
    Premium Package
    Sport Package
    Navigation
    6 Speed Manual

    $564.72/month after taxes
    $2106.45/due at signing
    -1st Month
    -Security Deposit
    -Acquistion Fee
    -MV Fees

    $28,524.80/Residual

    Anything I'm missing?
  • bmwcccbmwccc Member Posts: 234
    Thanks, by adding in the destination I get the exact same figures as you.

    Thanks again!

    p.s. now i need to figure out the 24 mo. lease so i can pick up the non turbo 335i in Nov. of 2007. Can't wait another year until it comes out in Oct. 2006 plus it prob. will sell only at MSRP. After a year on the market, any bugs will be worked out of the engine and the price will be more negotiable.

    bmwccc
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    The first thing that jumps out at me? How do you get an MSRP that ends in $0.80?

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  • skyccordskyccord Member Posts: 2
    Hhaha think I slipped. Quite intriging I agree.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    Using the base money factor, I get $515/mo. plus tax... If your tax = $50/mo., then everything looks good..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • luv2runluv2run Member Posts: 11
    Please let me know if this sounds like a good deal:

    325i, sport, prem., auto.
    msrp = 37445, sale price =35400, ($750 over invoice)
    They won't budge on acq. fee of $825, I know it should be $625. But they are giving me the base money factor of .0025.
    I'm only paying acquisition fee, security dep.($550), and first month payment at signing.

    Payment with 8.25% tax included=$517

    Does anyone anticipate better lease rates in December?
  • gwillgwill Member Posts: 5
    I went to a dealership in the DC area looking to lease either a 325i of ci. I don't know anything about leasing, but I told the salesperson my budget and what I was looking for and he gave me the numbers on three different cars. Can anyone tell me whether these are good deals. From looking at the previos posts I'm starting to wonder.
    These prices include tax.

    2006 325i Sedan
    Blk/Blk
    0 down 36 mo./12K
    MSRP: $30,900
    Premium Pkg: $2,900
    Sport Pkg: $1,600
    Auto: $1,275
    Heated Front Seats: $500
    Xenon Lights: $800
    Sat. Radio: $595
    Logic 7 Sound: $1,700
    Destination: $695
    Total: $40,465 Payments:$699

    2006 325Ci
    MSRP: $32,300
    PP: $2,000
    Auto: $1,275
    Xeno: $800
    Dest: $695
    Total: $37,070 Payments: $608

    2006 325i
    MSRP: $30,900
    Cold Weather: $1,000
    PP: $2,900
    Auto: $1,275
    Sat. Prep. $75
    Dest: $695
    Total: 36,845 Payments: $619.16
  • oceanexprtoceanexprt Member Posts: 16
    hi kyfdx,
    thank you very much for all your help.

    here is what i picked up this weekend.

    2005 325cic
    $47270 msrp
    $1500 down includes (first, security of $550, license, and a very small cap reduction)
    36 months, 12k/year
    $481 and change plus tax.

    i couldn't have done it without you.

    best regards,
    oceanexprt
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    That is a fantastic deal... I've found a similarly equipped 330Cic.. I'm trying to strike the same sort of deal, but I'm not getting any warm fuzzy feelings about it...

    I'm glad to see it work out for someone, though!!

    Congratulations,
    kyfdx
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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    luv2run.. You don't say the term or mileage on your lease...

    At 3yr/45K, I come up with $525/mo., including tax... About $505/mo. for 3yr/36K..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • luv2runluv2run Member Posts: 11
    luv2run.. You don't say the term or mileage on your lease...

    Oops, sorry...it is 3yr/36k.

    The tax is actually 8.75%, which accounts for the $12/mo difference, right? Thanks, for your help!!! I really saved a lot with all the advice I received on this forum!!!!
  • jra1jra1 Member Posts: 1
    Was offered the following car for $520/month; 27 month lease; .0025 money factor; 71% residual; $2,500 down; $550 security deposit; Sales tax at 6%; title fees $187; $40 doc fee; $500 dealer fee

    2005 BMW 330Ci $44,600
    Optional Equipment $5,450
    Metallic Paint $475
    Auto $1,275
    18' Wheels $1,000
    Xenon $800
    Sport Package $800
    BMW Assist $750
    Park Distance Control $350
    Destination $695

    What I need help with is convincing myself that the marketing support is being passed along and this is a pretty good deal.

    Any thoughts?
  • sreevsreev Member Posts: 11
    I am leasing for the first time in my life so please excuse my ignorance. I am wondering if someone can comment whether this is a decent deal:
    2006 325xi, metallic paint, premium package, xenon, manual
    MSRP: $37670 incl. destination
    Agreed price: $36000
    $7000 trade-in or cash option to cover down payment, first month payment, taxes, DMV fees. No security deposit
    Monthly payment: $411.25
    36 months/15k per year

    I am happy with the agreed price unless there are better deals out there. But how can I find out if the lease calculation is good or not?
  • victord1victord1 Member Posts: 94
    another deja vue.

    I'm looking at an '06 330i with MSRP $45,270 and invoice of $41,485. I'm offering $43k flat. If they take the bait, what would my lease be for 3yrs/36000miles with no money down? I live in VA (DC area), and I think the tax is 4-4.5%.
  • jmd2jmd2 Member Posts: 1
    I'm new to the forum but I don't think this question has been asked before. If I do a pull ahead lease and lease a new 330i, what is the impact on the deal from the dealer's standpoint? Also, the residual on my 2001 330i is low at $16700 (after a 54 month lease). Am I right in thinking that if I turn in the car rather than buying it and flipping it myself for several thousand dollars that the dealer is making money on me there and should be willing to come closer to invoice and still do well?

    Thanks.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    You really should look at leasing this car for 36 months.. I'm not familiar with the 27 month lease program, but the 36 month lease has a base money factor of just .00075...

    You don't give your mileage allowance, but I would guess you should be able to lease this car for the same payment for 36 months, without making the $2500 downpayment..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    First.. putting down $7000 on a lease is not a good idea.. If the car is totaled or stolen early in the lease, that downpayment disappears and you've had a very expensive short-term lease..

    That said, your deal is hard to analyze without knowing the breakdown of the $7000.. How much is for tax, fees, etc... and how much is the downpayment...

    To arrive at your lease payment, I had to assume that $3500 of the $7000 was down payment... This leaves 1st payment ($411), acquistion fee ($625), DMV fees ($300?).. and tax.. If the tax on your lease is around $2200 total, then it looks like your lease terms are okay..

    I'd want it to look like this:

    $37670 MSRP
    $36000 Selling price
    $36625 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee)
    3yr/45K lease
    Residual 61%
    Money factor .0025
    Payment = $528/mo.+ tax
    Due at signing (1st payment, security deposit, DMV fees).. about $1500 total.. I'd put the tax into the monthly payment, as well..

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    '06 330i
    3yr/36K lease

    $45270 MSRP
    $43000 Selling price
    $43625 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee)
    64% Residual
    .00195 Money factor

    Payment = $549/mo.+ tax
    Due at signing = 1st payment, security deposit, title/license fees (approx. $1500)

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • sreevsreev Member Posts: 11
    kyfdx,
    Thank you very much for your reply and your insight. I don't remember the exact breakdown but I just requested it from my dealer. I remember the tax was about $1400. $7000 was trade-in for my old car but when I asked if I could sell the car on my own, then the dealer added "Trade OR $7000" to the order form. From your calcs, it would be cheaper not to put any money down other than $1500 for fees, etc. I will post the actual numbers after I hear from the dealer. Thanks again for your insight.
  • sreevsreev Member Posts: 11
    kyfdx,
    Here are the numbers
    $37670 MSRP
    $36000 Selling price
    61% residual
    3yr/45k lease

    Breakdown of $7000:
    $625 acq. free
    $1191.35 sales tax
    $346.50 reg/plates
    $198 documentary fee
    $411.25 first payment
    $4227.90 down payment
    No security deposit

    It looks like the money factor is lot higher than 0.0025. I would appreciate your opinion. I gave a $500 non-refundable custom order deposit. Do you think I will be able to negotiate now that I have more knowledge? On the phone, the dealer said he will be flexible if I change my mind about buy vs lease, different down payment, etc.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    I think you have it exactly right.. They are most likely bumping up the money factor by the full amount allowed (.0004).. In addition, by not making a security deposit, there is a waiver bump of .00015, bringing the total money factor to .00305, instead of .0025.... $198 document fee is just another way to add on to the price of the car as well...

    Given these numbers.. this is what I would want.

    $37670 MSRP
    $36000 Selling price
    $37813 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee +tax)
    61% residual
    .0025 money factor
    Payment = $564/mo. including tax
    Due at signing: 1st payment ($564), security deposit ($600), reg/plates ($347)... Total upfront = $1511.. (no document fee...lol)

    Have them cut you a check for $5489 ($7000 trade minus $1511 upfront), and you drive out with just 35 payments of $564/mo. left..

    Whether they will change the deal to favor you more, now that you've already ordered, I don't know... But, if you seem willing to walk away from your $500, they may come down some.. I'm certain they will allow you to not make the downpayment and take that out in cash instead.

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • sreevsreev Member Posts: 11
    Thank you, kyfdx! Your numbers are right on. Now I understand how these calculations are done. The dealer is using .00305 without the security deposit. I called the salesman over the phone and said it should have been .0025. He said he had the authority to change it to .0029 ($9 less per month) by collecting security deposit and anything else needed manager's approval. I asked for 0.0025 which would save me $1084 over the lease period or I would consider losing my $500 deposit. He is going to call me tomorrow after discussing with his boss.

    Thanks again for all your help. I learned a great deal about leasing today.
  • amstamst Member Posts: 8
    I currently am leasing a 2003 325xi with premium package, heated seats, wood dash and auto transmission. I didn't pay any cap red., but I did put 9 additional security deposits down at the time of lease. My current payment including 9% sales tax is 466/month. This is based on a 39 month program. I'm looking to get the same type of equipment in a 2006. Dealers are quoting me over $100 more per month. They say that the price of the car has increased by 2K, the discounts off the car have dimished (meaning their margins) and that BMW will now only allow 5 extra security deposits, and that they only reduce the money factor at a rate of about half of what they did back in 2003. They tell me that the 36 month offer is best available now. I'd like to know what is a reasonable price to pay for my 2006 325xi lease with no cap red. 36/39/42 month is fine for me.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    The dealers are correct in just about everything they told you.. except maybe the thing about their margins...

    The multiple security deposit program has indeed been cut back to a maximum of five, with the money-factor reduction of each one cut in half... Under your old program, you saved .0009 off of the money factor, while the new program has a maximum savings of .00025... That factor alone would cause a $30-$35 increase in the payment..

    Also, the new 325xi has only been out for a couple of months... there are no incentives and the lease program is nothing special..

    But, to give you an estimate on a monthly payment, you need to provide the MSRP of the car you are interested in, and what mileage allowance you require.

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • amstamst Member Posts: 8
    I'll be looking for 10K/yr in miles on a car that has an msrp of around 38,600.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Moderator Posts: 234,725
    '06 325xi
    3yr/30K lease
    $38,600 MSRP
    $37,000 Selling price (just a guess)
    $37,625 Cap cost (selling price + acq.fee)
    64% residual
    .0025 money factor
    payment = $515/mo. + tax..
    Due at signing = 1st payment, security deposit, reg./license fees..

    If you made 5 additional security deposits, it would lower the money factor to .00225 and lower the payment to $500/mo.+tax (not hardly worth the trouble).

    regards,
    kyfdx
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  • amstamst Member Posts: 8
    Before I turn in my 2003 325xi, can you tell me....am I able to lease this same vehicle again??? If so, what type of terms might apply? Is this something I would negotiate with BMW financial or a dealer?

    Thanks.

    Amst
  • ariz4meariz4me Member Posts: 1
    Hi, I'm new to leasing a BMW. I presently am financing a 2004 BMW convertible and want to trade it in for a new one. I talked to a dealer and he indicated that for what I wanted I would have to pay list price - no negotiation. The cost of the car is 46,834.00 without taxes, etc. From my car, once I pay it off, I would have about 9,000 left to put down, etc. I'm looking for a 3 year lease with about 17,000 miles per year. Can you provide me with some advice on what would be a good lease deal? I would like to go in with some numbers prior to speaking with the dealer. I live in the Philadelphia, PA area.

    Thanks,
  • victord1victord1 Member Posts: 94
    You've always been very helpful.

    I emailed a dealer (PassporBMW, MD) about a similar car with an MSRP of $44,345. They emailed me back with the selling price of $41,940 ($1300 above invoice), which is reasonable. However, it was $605.92/month tax included (3yrs/36,000miles lease), with only $719.12 due at pick-up.
    I have no clue how they came up with that figure. :confuse:

    The base money factor for '06 330i is 0.00195, right? And the residual for 12k/yr is 64%? If that is so, my calculation is ~$537/month, and due at delivery: lic/reg fees+security deposit+first month payment, all of which I'm sure would be more than $719.12.

    I requested for the detailed breakdown of their number. So far no answer. :(
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