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2013 and earlier Lexus RX 350 / RX 450h Lease Questions



  • @Car_man Looks this over and let me know what you think. Was I off anywhere or did I hit a good deal right on the head?

    @valenkav We also were shopping at Meade in Southfield. I went ahead and closed the deal on Saturday with them. I’m posting all the specifics of my deal to help my fellow car buyers. One of the issues I ran into when planning out my negotiation was that I could not get exact invoice info from Edmunds as some options were not listed. So here is the pricing on the car. The first price is MSRP, the second is Invoice:

    *denotes options that are not listed in Edmunds TMV Report
    RX 350 AWD Base $39,375
    Dealer Holdback: 787.50 (2% Base MSRP)

    Comfort Pkg.: $1,950 $1,560
    Cargo Spider Net: $49 $29*
    12-Spker Prem Audio Sys: $110 $88
    Navigation: $2,465 $2,085
    Intuitive Parking: $500 $400
    Premium Pkg: $2,400 $2,028
    Towing Prep Pkg: $238 $190
    Remote Start: $375 $225*
    Wood & Leather Steering: $330 $264
    Accy Pkg: $242 $148*
    Paint Protect: $429 $259*
    Cross Bars: $259 $168*
    ---Total Options: $9,347
    Delivery: $875

    Total MSRP: $49,597
    Total Invoice: $44,641

    Dealer initial sales price offer: $46,199.82
    Initial lease payment: $646.34 for 36/mth, 15k miles (.00150 mf, 57% residual)

    Edmunds TMV: $45,527 (roughly as not all options are included. Missing $1,354 MSRP, $829 Invoice *.)

    My counter offer: $45,533.82 (2% over invoice)
    Final lease payment: $638.02 for 36mth/19k miles (.00078 mf, 57% residual, .20 mile over 15k, includes 6% sales tax - $601.90)

    -Side Note: Payment would have been $625.66/mth for 36mths/15k. Adding the extra 4k miles a year raised the lease to $692.51/mth. We brought down the mf to .00078 (orig. mf for Dec. is .00150) using multiple MSD’s to arrive at the final lease rate of $646.34/mth. In order to adjust for mileage over 15k, multiple the additional miles by $.20 and subtract that from the residual value in your lease calculation. That will adjust your lease payment figures accordingly. So for us, the addition 12,000 miles over the term of the lease is costing us $2,400. That was subtract from the 57% residual value taking the residual down to $25,870.29.

    Dealer Profit off sale: $1,680.32 (hold back + $ over invoice. May be more if I missed including something.)

    Even though Car_man was not able to respond to my post prior to me pulling the trigger, I was able to pull out enough information by reading over the forum from back to Jan., to go in the door fully loaded to get a good deal. I also called Lansing and Ann Arbor dealers to bounce numbers of them to see if they would bite. I told Lansing I had a deal between $44,000 and $45,000 on a fully loaded RX350. The guy flat out told me he could not beat it. I called Ann Arbor and gave them the dealer initial offer price and the sales rep told me he could beat it by $1,000. A buddy of mine that use to sell cars in Lansing and Detroit previously told me that when he sold cars, he would take 2% deals all day. I usually shoot for invoice price first but since my mother-in-law was itching to buy and TMV was above invoice, I needed a no fuse situation.

    I had her call them on the phone the day of and told them we would purchase today at 2% over invoice. The sales rep tried explaining how good a deal she was already getting and put her on hold to talk with sales manager. She came back saying she was not sure but how soon could we come in. We told them 15 minutes. Went in the door at the dealer and whipped out my laptop like I had did the day before and gave them the 2% over invoice offer. She came back after talking with manager and asked if we could do 3%. Told her 2%. She came back again and asked if we could split the difference. Told her 2% and to hurry up or it was going to be 1% in 10 minutes. Manager came over and asked if he did 2% could we close the deal that day. Told him yes. He shook our hands and said he appreciated being upfront and to the point. Fine, 2% it is. Had them run a few mileage scenarios and double checked all their numbers using my Excel spreadsheet. We settled on 36/19k. They completed the paperwork and everything was in order. We worked with Karen (Sales Rep), Doug (Sales Mgr) and Laura (Business Mgr.). They were all great and treated us well. Overall the dealership did give me the impression that they are true to what the sales person was pitching, and that is that they care about their relationship with their customers and have good service when it comes to using their service department and the little things like free loaners, etc. I would recommend them to others.

    Thank you to all that participate on this site. Edmund’s and its forum members to date have helped my purchase a 2010 BMW 535ix, 2011 Nissan Altima 3.5 SR and a 2011 Lexus RX 350 AWD all fully loaded, and have received better than average deals each time. The following are the steps that I recommend to anyone who wants to maximize their dollar and not pay too much for a car:

    1) Read the website Beat the Car Salesman Car Buyer’s School. The site is totally free and has all the information you need:

    2) Figure out what the dealer holdback is for your model car: This will help you understand how low a dealer is willing to go.

    3) Use the manufacture website to build the car that you want. Build it several times playing with the different options until you figure out the options that meet the price you want.

    4) Then use Edmunds TMV Pricing system to get the invoice numbers on the exact same car you built.

    5) Read back the last 3 months of at least the following two Edmunds forums for the model car you are researching: Prices Paid - Buying & Leasing Experiences and Lease Questions.

    6) If doing a lease, create your own lease calculator Excel spreadsheet using the formula here: . If purchasing and not leasing, create a loan calculator Excel spreadsheet to help you figure out your loans and payments.

    7) Go to the dealerships and do your test drives to help you narrow down what you are looking to buy. Document the car and options that you want. Get the dealer stock # if they have the car you are interested in. Let the sales person give you their initial offer and leave. Don’t talk any numbers with them at all. Go back home and look up the car with the options and get the TMV for the actual car you settled on. Also run the lease or loan calculator on the actual car you settled on at the sales price they offered. Then run the same numbers for invoice price and again for the Edmunds TMV price. Decide on a price that you are not willing to pay any higher than. (I would recommend 2% or TMV, whichever is lower.) Compare your initial offers also to help determine which dealer is mos
  • most reasonable.

    8) Determine if there are any incentives going on for the car you want. If so, remember that you use those on top of your offer. So if your offer is going to be $40,000 and there is a $2,000 rebate, your offer the dealer $40,000 and then remind them that they apply the rebate after the 40k, so you actually are paying $38,000. Dealers often will try and use the rebate for themselves by selling the car for 42k and then giving you 2k off to get the price to 40k.

    9) You are in the strongest position when you show up at the dealership with the checkbook ready to buy! Once you have all your finances in order and are ready to buy, go to the dealer you decided to work with (Best times to go is a few days before the end of the month or the weekend before the end of the month). Make them an offer at invoice. They will most likely act like you are trying to rob them but stay firm. If the car is in high demand, you may have to come up on your offer a little. But don’t go over your limit and only up your offer a little at a time (ie. $100). If the car is in low demand, you have a stronger position so stay firm. If they are not budging for numbers over your limit, remind them that you have other options on the table with other dealers but you are giving them the first right of refusal. I also remind them I am ready to buy right now. That is usually enough to get them to see things my way. If they continue to play hardball, get up, thank them for their time and leave. They usually stop you before you get to the door.

    10) KNOW YOUR MATH. Double check the final numbers you settle on with the dealer. Run them through your calculators right there on the spot. If something seems off, then they may be adding something on the backend. If it does not make sense, ask questions. If you get the sense of some shady business, than it probably is, so leave and take your business else were. TAKE YOUR TIME AND READ ALL YOUR PAPERWORK line by line. Ask questions about anything you don’t understand. Make sure you have GAP insurance or your insurance policy covers the “fully financed amount”. I recommend not purchasing any of the extra’s they want to sell you while you’re in the finance office. If you want an extended warranty, I would go with the manufactures warranty program but I would buy it only at dealer cost and only if the warranty will expire before the end of the lease. You usually can get an extended warranty at any time before the initial warranty is up or at least before the end of the first year of the initial warranty period. You also can find dealers on the web that will sell them at cost because they still make money on them. Lastly if you are uncomfortable about anything at any time, ask questions. Remember once you sign, you are on the hook for the deal for the next couple of years.

    I hope all find this helpful.

    @valenkav If you need to get below $650mth on a lease, try to get the car at invoice. If I would have paid invoice on this RX, payment on a 36/15 would have been $597.96 after tax. I don’t think they will do it as these station wagons are in demand so they may not budget. But then again it is the end of the month, so you never know. I highly doubt you would get a 2011 for under invoice right now and there are no 2010’s in Michigan.
  • Overall excellent write-up logic_3 !

    - One thing, are you sure holdback is calculated on base MSRP, or is it calculated on total MSRP (less dest charge) ? Dealers might be making a few more bucks here.

    - Also Lexus/Toyota charges dealers for regional advertising, so all those 'december to remember' commercials you see on TV do have a cost, I believe my TDA (Toyota Dealers Advertising) fee for my 2010 RX was $500 - again a true cost to dealers.

    - If you cannot find your car's total retail/invoice cost on Edmunds, I cross check with KBB, they tend to have all the available options listed, altho Edmunds' TMV is far more reliable than KBB's market price.

    - There is also a term called 'pack' which is a financial incentive given back to dealers when they sell a car off the lot (similar to holdback). I believe if a dealer moves a car within 90 days, the pack covers their carrying costs for that car. So if a car sits on the lot longer than 90 days, it costs the dealers more. A dealer should be highly motivated to move a specific car before it reaches 90 days (if you can determine the build date - Lexus puts this on the sticker on the driverside door jamb)

    - And to add to logic_3's timing, dealers get incentives/bonuses to reach quarterly & yearly quotas - so a great time to buy is right before the end of a quarter or calendar year. I find that Lexus dealers will make fantastic deals on Dec 30 or 31, since their annual sales volume determines their allotments for the coming year.

    Again, great write-up logic_3/
  • Hi,
    Thank you for sharing your leasing experience in Michigan and excellent job you have done in calculation of payments. I am looking for pkg incl. CP,PM,NV,PA,WU,EK,TO (MSRP $48,243). Invoice is confusing. Based on Invoice is $43,823, incl.$700 regional ad fee.Dealer Cost is $43,036. If I use last number, 2% over is $43,896.72 or $43,900 after round up.
    My monthly will looks like $589.35 using Resid.61% & MF .0021 for 36/10k lse.
    What about Dec. to Rem. incentive? Meady of Lakeside mentioned $1,200.
    Ann Arbor of Lexus dealer mentioned high $400 to low $500 as my monthly.
    You suggested 2%, 1% over Invoice, even Invoice. How practicle is it? Will dealers except Invoice when RX is in demand? Take care. Val.
  • Thanks socaljd, glad I learned a few things over the last couple of car purcahses I made.

    To answer your question on holdback, per Edmunds (, Lexus hold back is 2% base MSRP.

    Thanks for the insight regarding additional dealer cost. I was unaware of that. I try not to get too caught up in what the dealer is making on a deal (cause they have to eat and keep the lights on too), but I do like to know so I can get a feel of what the other side of the table is thinking. Knowing their cost or profit gives you a bit of a guide as to how much they really can budge on a price. Thanks for the info on 'pack'. I did not know about that. I will definitely keep an eye out for that on my next purchase.
  • Val, I ran the numbers you gave and came up with the same $589 payment. I don't know the initials of all the packages you mention, so I am not sure exactly what the car you are looking at has. But if you can't figure out exactly what the invoice price is, here is another trick I picked up. Just take 10% off total MSRP on the window sticker. You will have the invoice price, give or take $100. So here is a few scenarios for you using the following numbers:

    MF= .0021, Residual= 61%
    MSRP $48,243
    Purchase Price 1: $43,418.72 (Invoice Price Guess of MRSP-10%)
    Purchase Price 2: $44,287.09 (2% over Invoice Guess)

    P1 gets you a mthly payment after tax of $574.10
    P2 gets you a mthly payment after tax of $601.60

    @ MF .0015 (This is the Dec. to remember rate for Tier 1 credit)
    P1 gets you $527.77
    P2 gets you $554.72

    So yes Val, I suggest as little as invoice to offer! ;-) Don’t be scared to play hardball. And don’t be afraid that they will say no, because they will. In fact, they will say no several times. The sales person, the sales manager, etc. will tell you stories of how they can’t pay the bills at that price, how their kids are going to go hungry at that price, how there is no way on Earth they could sell the car for that price, etc. STAND FIRM I SAY! So what the car is in demand, you are in a strong position. In fact, if you wait until Dec. 31st to go in to buy, you will be in the perfect position. As socaljd just said, not only is it the end of the quarter, but it’s the end of the year! If they have 20 RX’s on the lot, they want them to gone. I know you can get a deal at just 2% over invoice, I just proved it last weekend. But what I would like to see you do is get yours at invoice and you can do it given the timing.

    Are you sure on your money factor? Don’t forget as shown above, the Dec. MF is .00150 makes payments better. If your credit is Tier 1 but you’re getting a different MF, then they may be trying to add points to your lease. If you’re not Tier 1, Car_man may be able to let you know what the MF is for other tiers is. I would just confirm you have the correct MF from an independent source that is not a dealer.

    If you’re not the hardball type, then take a family member with you that is Or just take friend for support. But set your game plan before you go in and stick to it. If I were you, I would go in the weekend before the 31st and make an offer at invoice, telling them you are ready to buy that day. They will give you a counter offer, say no. They will ask you to split the difference, say no. When they come back the 3rd time, asking for more money, say thank you and tell them you are on your way to the other dealer that will do it but you stopped at their place first because their closer. Guaranteed they will stop you at the door or call your cell as you are driving away. If they don’t that’s ok, because they will call. I would make verbal offers over the phone to the dealers that are further away. One of them will call you back before the 31st.

    Lastly, I don’t think I mentioned this in my long post, but I am avidly against putting money down (cap cost reduction). Don’t do it. Take advantaged of multiple security deposits(learned about this when doing a BMW lease). With Lexus, you can do 9 total. They will reduce your money factor down by .00008 each. Plus you get the money back at the end of the lease.
  • Thank you again, logic_3!
    Do I need to tell you how much I already learned from your math and tricks?
    If I use some of them I'll save something. My situation is: RX with opts
    looks Comf.$1,950/$1,560 (msrp/inv), Prem.$2,400/$2,028,Nav.$2,465/$2,085,
    WU $330/$264, PA $500/$400, EK $110/$88, TO $238/$190 &
    Accy.Pkg $242/$148. Final numbers: MSRP=$48,485, Invoice=$43,271.
    Using MF=.0015 (Dec.-to-Remb), which is close enough to $1,200 rebate as one dealer told me recently, and RV=61%, I have following monthly pmts.
    P1 offer $43,271 (inv) = $519.07 (tx incl);
    P2 $44,136 (2% over inv) = $545.91;
    P3 $43,703 (1% over inv) = $532.48;
    P4 $43,900 or $44,000 = $540.
    I feel a little bit more comfortable with P4 (but can start from P3).
    Take care, Val.
  • Just thought I would post a number for those searching for a price on the RX 450h..I just purchased one in SoCal the last day of Nov....Had to wait until that day to get dealer to sell it to me at the price I wanted....I went to 5 other dealerships and ended up with this one.

    2010 450H with Comfort and Premium packages, nav, and parking assist.
    Lease/Sell price was 43,500. Payment is $630 including tax, lic, and all fees...The only out of pocket was $300.00, for 3 years, 12k a year.

    Hope it helps someone and I hope I did well
  • What was the list price? Also, are you saying it was nothing down for that monthly payment? We are in the market for a second 450h, also in SoCal. Thanks!
  • 51k was the sticker....that is the typical 450h you find on the Lexus lots in LA SoCal...the next version up is the 55 with heads up display....I had to work hard to get it at that price and had to wait to the last day of the month. No one wanted to budge on that price till the last day. Hope it helps
  • Need an information regarding lease of 2011 RX350 AWD 36/10K, or 48/10K.
    Looking for MF,RV for loaded SUV (no TV). Thanks in advance.
  • vritsvrits Posts: 3

    Do you have the December 2010 residual and MF for a 2011 RX350 AWD lease for 36 months, 12k miles per year, with Dec to remember event.

    Thank you.
  • I'd be happy to help you out, i-SpY.

    Lexus Financial Services' December buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 24 month lease of a 2011 RX 350 AWD with 10,000 miles per year are .00170 and 67%, respectively for consumers who qualify for its top aka "Tier 1+" credit tier.

    The numbers for an otherwise identical 36 month lease are .00170 and 60%.

    The 24 month numbers for the '10 model are .00210 and 64%. Its 36 month numbers are .00210 and 57%.

    Yes, it does appear as though the lease programs for the AWD and FWD models are the same.

    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • Greetings lexusmonkey. Lexus Financial Services' December buy rate lease money factor and residual value for a 48 month lease of a 2011 RX 350 AWD with 12,000 miles per year are .00170 and 50%, respectively for consumers who qualify for its top aka "Tier 1+" credit tier.

    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • Hi vrits. I just posted this information two messages ago. Please check there. Thanks.

    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • vritsvrits Posts: 3
    Thanks Car_man, that shows only 10k.
    How will 12K miles a year affect MF and residual for December, please advise.
  • What is the residual on your lease? I am in SO CAL and in the market to lease a 2010 RX450H. Thanks in advance.
  • No problem, vrits. LFS' 10,000 mile per year residual values are 1% higher than its 12,000 mile per year residuals.

    Prices Paid: Buying & Leasing Experiences Forum
  • beachlady80beachlady80 Posts: 5
    edited December 2010
    Carman, Can I have the rates for the December to remember MF and residual for RX350 FWD 36 months with 15k and 48 with 15k. Thanks!!!
  • cartman13cartman13 Posts: 43
    edited December 2010
    Hi Car_man,

    I think you said the 2011 RX450h AWD had a MF of .0015 for this event earlier. is that right?

    I didn't see any residuals for it though. could you provide those if different than the RX350? 10k miles.

This discussion has been closed.