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Sedans: My Best Choice for Fuel Economy?

2

Comments

  • kneisl1kneisl1 Posts: 1,685
    >As for the ECHO this page (Edmunds review of the ECHO) pretty much turned me against it.<

    IGNORE what Edmunds has to say about the ECHO. They are the ONLY source I have read that has panned it. Every other writer has nothing but praise for it. There is nothing wrong with its handling. There is nothing wrong with it having 14 inch wheels. Ive had mine for over five years now and its still wonderfull to drive. No problems at all. NOT ONE. I get 40 mpg driving it six miles to work. (in the summer) Its amazing all the things it does so well. You would do better to read the comments of the ECHO owners. Almost no one has anything bad to say about it.
    It gives me the creeps to have someone post they have discounted the ECHO because of Edmunds article about it. That article is widely recognized as one of if not THE most infamous article written in the last 25 years about a car.
  • have you thought about the chevy aveo.I recently purchaced one and love it.Start brand new for a little over 9 grand.
  • then it is a no-brainer : Get a Prius!

    It won't be the lowest TCO (Total Cost of Ownership) but that is not the subject of this thread.

    I couldn't get a Prius because I never learned to drive an automatic :(

    A shifting man,

    MidCow
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    get an Echo - I have had mine a couple of weeks and 1000 miles now, and it is averaging 39 mpg around town, A/C often running with the defrost, mixed suburban driving. And with the price differential between it and a Prius, you could buy enough gas to drive a Hummer all the way around the world! :-P

    Yes, yes, the Echo is gone now, although there are used ones out there for the taking. Or you could wait about three months and get a Yaris, with the same powertrain and estimated by Toyota to make the same fuel economy. :-)

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • Nippononly,

    Echo LOL. I never considered a Echo, even the new restyled ones still look funky. There are all sorts of issues from handling, to display layout, etc ; there is a reason why Toyota is dropping the Echo. A good Toyota choice would be the 5-speed Corolla CE or the snazzy looking S model.
    Another choice would be the 5-speed Scion xA or xB.

    I liked the 2005 Honda Civic Hybrid and though about getting one. But i waited too long the 2006 HCH is CVT only. And perfomance pretty slow.

    The Hyundai Elantra 5-speed is a choice for some. Hyundai relability has significantly improved recently and it has a fairly low TCO.

    The 5-speed Honda Insight is the mileage leader and I seriously considered ordering on for $400 over invoice. And the Prius is the highest mileage sedan and has hatchback utility. My wife said the performance would not be enough for Houston traffic for the Insight, Prius or HCHand what about the 2006 Civic Si ? So now I have a Rallye Red Si on order for my commuter car.

    The title of this thread is very deceptive ?

    Is is sedan only ? (probably yes)
    Is it highest mileage only or should TCO be considered?
    (probably yes , even though it goes against title)

    You know you can get a basic Cobalt or Aveo or Rio really really cheap? But sometimes cheap begets cheap!

    Then there is new versus used? A good used Corolla or Civic might make the most sense.

    Cheers,

    MidCow

    Aspirations: manual shift, relability, fun (performance, handling), looks, features, TCO
  • moparbadmoparbad Posts: 3,842
    then it is a no-brainer : Get a Prius!

    Are Prius available for $8,000 or less?
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    I agree: Echo, LOL. :-)

    Having said that, they are not dropping this model, merely changing the name to match what it already is in the rest of the world - the Yaris. For the next-gen, due out in April, they are trading out the 2-door coupe for a 2-door hatch in the hopes it will sell better as hatchback sales have proliferated again since Y2K. There will still be a 4-door sedan, and it will still be pretty much the best choice you have in a gas-only car (here I am talking FE using EPA ratings).

    "There are all sorts of issues from handling, to display layout, etc ; there is a reason why Toyota is dropping the Echo"

    Handling is decent even with the older model I have with the skinny tires - beginning in '03 they made 15" rims optional with larger tires, which improved handling quite a bit I am sure, and yet maintained the EPA rating of the older cars. As for the dash layout, it will not change when the next-gen car arrives this year. Still center-mount IP.

    No, I don't think we are STRICTLY sedan here, as there are good 5-door hatchbacks out there too, performing roughly the same mission. But forget SUVs and minivans, that sort of thing.

    I THOUGHT it was highest fuel economy only - TCO is such an improbable guess most of the time. I assume we could consider new or used.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • Yes, but not new ones! You can buy a used prius for $8,000 if you want a Gen I with lots of miles.

    The title of the thread is the best mileage sedan, not the best mileage for the money sedan or lowest TCO sedan.

    YMMV,

    MidCow

    Now the best fun per dollar car is another story ;)
  • its hard to beleive u are getting 39 mpg in town with AC on come on be real even the hybrids dont do that
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    Well what do you want me to say? I have been measuring it, and now after several thousand miles the average is just about 39.5 mpg. I don't get down to the last hundredth or anything, just round to 0.5.

    There hasn't been much A/C use except for the defrost which I run every morning on the way to work and most times it rains, which has been on and off. I don't think the compressor runs as much on defrost cycle as it does when you are cooling the car down.

    I should add that 39 is exactly what I would expect to get in around-town driving in a car rated 34/41, based on 20 years of driving experience and many different cars of various EPA ratings. Or at least, I would EXPECT 38 and HOPE for 39-40! :-)

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • tundradudetundradude Posts: 588
    My dad has a 05 S with an auto, and it gets a consistent 39.

    My old 85 with a manual and 70hp got 42.

    So to almost have double the hp and get similar mileage is cool.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    your dad is doing well, what with the Corolla rated 30/38.

    They say the new Camry hybrid will have a 41.5 mpg combined rating. Of course, being a hybrid, I don't suppose anyone will get that figure. But if it could pull a solid 35 mpg week in and week out, that would be close to 20% better than the 4-cyl gas, and only 10% less than some of these smaller cars like Echo and Corolla. In such a big car, that would be impressive. Too big a car for me though! ;-)

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • tundradudetundradude Posts: 588
    I test drove one yesterday while my xB was getting an oil change. Its alot more sportier and it really rides good, but compared to my xB its Huge. However, you should see my xB and my Tundra beside each other in the garage. Someday, I wouldn't mine having one to replace the 95 someday in the future. I am going to see how far I can drive the 95 Corolla.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    a comparo in MT of the Accord and Camry Hybrids, and in theirs they managed 34 mpg in the Camry, which leads me to believe the average driver could easily get 37, 38 mpg (considering how auto mag guys go everywhere with the pedal floored). Which is great, especially considering it has the same power and acceleration as the current (now former) 3.0 V-6. Theirs was $26K, about $4K less than the Accord Hybrid too.

    It's quite impressive. Someone somewhere here posted that there are future plans for a Corolla hybrid, which I had not heard. If that turns out to be true, I figure it would have Prius mileage (47 or so) at a price of $18-20K. That would be a deal.

    I also noticed that both the Honda hybrids and both the Toyotas now have a 10 year/150K-mile warranty on the battery pack. In five years, I think hybrids will hit the mainstream, as I can't see any of the other up-and-coming technologies being ready for the big-time in that short a timespan.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • clarkkentclarkkent Posts: 154
    then it is a no-brainer : Get a Prius!

    Are Prius available for $8,000 or less?

    NO, the $8000 is for the add on price and the battery pack you will need in 7 years.

    The Prius is for those who what to "feel" like they are saving the earth! Good luck, because you won't be saving any money with any hybrid car.

    I see just above this post someone saying there is now a 10 year warranty on the battery pack. I bet at 7 years it will still cost you 70% of original cost!
    CK
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    the battery pack is covered 100% through the 150K mark. This is not a prorated warranty. For those who keep their cars longer than 150K miles, battery pack replacement costs will be a consideration.

    Hybrids are good for those who need more space or features than those available in the small gas-sipper cars at the bottom of the market. If all you care about is getting 40 mpg or more, buy a B-segment car and call it a day.

    Prius is a pretty nice car at $22K.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • The Echo is an amazing little car with fantastic gas mileage. However, since they are no longer making them they are more difficult to come by. As far as a manual transmission most people do not even know how to shift because sales people sell more automatics than manuals shift cars. They always tell you that on a trade in you can get more on an automatic. I just traded in my manual shift Echo for an automatic Corolla and it isn't the same. Much more fun to shift!
  • I just traded in an '03 Echo (5 speed) which I loved for an '06 Corolla (automatic) and I can tell you the mileage isn't there for the Corolla at all. (Had to trade in because of knee problems - couldn't shift any more) With the Echo I got about 35 mpg in the City. With the Corolla I am getting 21 mpg. BIG Difference and I am very disappointed. For that I could have gotten a bigger car! I am very disappointed in the Corolla.
  • kneisl1kneisl1 Posts: 1,685
    I think something is wrong with your Corolla and I would have the dealer look at it if you havnt already.
  • stdbobstdbob Posts: 14
    I have an 02 Echo (bought it new) 5 speed manual. It just turned 105,000 miles. Doesn't burn a drop of oil between 3K changes and as of this week is still getting 40mpg. AC/PS/PB 2 door.
    I replaced the brakes at 95K(very easy), tires at 60K, and today I had to have a front axle bearing replaced. That's all I've needed. Typically run it about 75mph and commute 120 miles a day. Can't beat the mileage. If I ever wear this one out, I'll be looking for another one. :)
    I hope the new Yaris is going to be as good.
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