Honda Accord (2003-2007) Maintenance and Repair

bunkie1

I replaced the battery in my wife's '03 about this time last year. I bought an aftermarket one at either Advance AP or Autozone, I can't recall which. The fit was just as good as the OEM and it's functioned just as well as the OEM, but what can you really tell with a battery in just a year? My OEM battery lasted less than four years and so did yours, so that's certainly not an inducement to buy another one.

wcook1

The exact same thing happened to me this evening. How did you get it unlocked? It's below zero today and I thought the locks may be frozen. I just don't understand why it won't unlock with the key.
Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

mrbill1957

There is only a small handful of battery manufacturers. The OEM battery in my 04 Accord is made by Globe Union (Johnson Controls). They also make batteries for Interstate, Sears, and dozens and dozens of other retail stores.

Mrbill

accorder1

He said the sensor's are in the exhaust pipe. The #1 and 2 sensors are in the catalytic/exhaust manifold.

davidd3

I have owned many Hondas, but my 2006 Accord is the first which has maintenance as one of the items of the on-board computer display on the dashboard. At about 6,000 miles, I noticed that the place on my dashboard which generally displays odometer information (which I find useful) started to show oil life (15%) and the type of maintenace to be done when it counts down to zero. Ever since that day (it has been going on for several weeks now) oil life is displayed every time I start the car and I have to press the reset button to change it over to the odometer into. Is anyone else annoyed by this? Now I'm down to 5%. I'd like to change the oil when it is closer to zero, but I find the constant alerts so annoying that from next time I'll be tempted to change the oil early (i.e., soon after the first 15% oil life notice) just to avoid this annoying feature. Anyone else feel the same way?

chucko3

In the PS note he said the sensors are in the exhaust pipe.
But in the 1st paragraph, he said the sensor #1 is before
the cat.

thegraduate

No, because I do as the manual states and take my car at 15%, so the most I ever see it is maybe a day or two. When I checked my oil at 15%, it wasn't DARK dark, but it was the right time to get the oil changed by looking at it, so I didn't dare put it off. I wouldn't recommend trying to get every drop out of it. I'd change it with at least 10% to spare - you never know when something will come up causing you to have to skip getting maintenance done for a few days.

davidd3

Well, I'm a lessor, not an owner. I'd like to wait it out on oil changes as long as possible. But this dashboard maintenance alert thing drives me nuts and is making me inclined to do what you are doing (change the oil right away at 15%), though for a different reason (my sanity).

I'm not going outside to my cold car to double check the manual, but I do not recall it saying to have the oil changed at 15% as you said. My memory from my reading of the manual is that it will count down from 15% by 5s and that you should have the service performed before or when it gets to 0%.

thegraduate

If I had my Accord's manual handy, I'd read from it to see for myself. I want to say that it says something along the lines of "at 15% Oil Life, the indicator will come on at startup to remind you to get your vehicle serviced soon" or something like that. It probably doesn't say "do it at 15%" like I said before (without thinking), but you can understand why one would want to keep up with maintenance before it becomes overdue.

With parents in Oklahoma (me in Alabama) I like to keep my car ready for such a trip in the blink of an eye if I needed/wanted to...So for that, I get the car serviced between 20 and 15%. I understand wanting to keep yours stretched out as long as possible, but is pushing that little button absolutely ruining your day?

rekh

Please be aware that per Honda, when it reaches 5% service is due and at 0% service is overdue. Go to: https://www.ahm-ownerlink.com/login.asp?brand=honda
Then, 1) log in 2)click on"My vehicles" 3)then click on " Service/ Maintenance" 4)then click on "Maintenance Minder" 5)then you see a link: "Click here to learn more about Maintenance Minder", click on it. And watch the video.

accorder1

P.S. The #1 and #2 sensors are in the cat. The #3 and #4 are in the exhaust pipe.

davidd3

I appreciate your good reasons for taking care of maintenance on the early side of the spectrum, while.

Pushing that button was a minor annoyance at first. After several weeks of this, it has crossed the line. I don't want to go through it again. I'll sooner change my oil earlier than I otherwise would have.

davidd3

Thanks for the info. I will watch the video from home later.

Also, now that my car is showing 5%, I'll get my oil changed at my earliest convenience, probably on Saturday.

hondalova

Just out of curiosity, does the Maintenance Minder Alert actually sample the oil for viscosity and particulates, or is it like the oil life indicator in my wife's (thankfully now former) Chevy Venture - just an algorithm in the computer that guesstimates oil life on the basis of mileage, driver's driving style, speed, and usage information stored in the cars computer, without any direct physical link to the engine's lubrication systems?

If, as I suspect, it is like the Chevy's, than my recommendation is to do an oil change at the appropriate mileage and just reset and ignore the indicator. I've always believed in the 3 mos. or 3000 miles rule (although today's oils are much more durable than those of my father's heyday). It's the best maintenance one can do for a car - particularly these new VTEC motors that have tiny little oil ports in system that opens and closes the variable cam mechanism.

However, I drive my '04 Accord 100 miles roundtrip to work each day and my wife drives similar mileage herself in her '078 Odyssey. So we've pushed that out to around every 3 mos. or 4-4500 miles with both cars.

At the very least, even if the car is leased and you're cutting corners (and I hope I never buy a car that was leased by such a person) do it at the maximum recommended service interval printed in the manual (which, if I recall correctly, is 7500 miles). The dealer cannot surcharge you if you are complying with the intervals required in the contract and/or the owner's manual.

-FS

saleem

@ hondalova

I believe it goes off of the cumulative revolutions of the engine, rather than off the mileage. That way it will more accurately reflect driving style vice just mileage.

thegraduate

I believe it goes off of the cumulative revolutions of the engine, rather than off the mileage. That way it will more accurately reflect driving style vice just mileage.

To coin a phrase;

"What he said."

davidd3

I've never cut any corners on maintenance. I have always followed the onwer's manual. Who knows, I may one day end up exercising the purchase option on a car I have leased and give it to one of my kids.

I just do not like to do any maintenance until it is time. For instance, when we used to go by mileage intervals, I changed the oil at 3,750 mile intervals as per the Honda owner's manual. Now maintenance intervals have bocome more of a customized thing - the manitenance minder for oil change that came on for me at 6,000 miles for 15% oil life may come on for someone else at 4,000 miles or 8,000 miles dependinig how the car is used and what the sensors sense about your driving.

I feel that 15% is too soon for maintenance minder alert to takeover your odometer function every single time you start the car, unless of course you are on the verge of taking a road trip, in which case it would be useful to know.

From what I have heard and read, long gone (but not forgotten) are the days when it was necessary and/or desirable to change the oil more frequently, such as every 3,000 miles. Today's oils are more durable and today's engines run cleaner. It should be perfectly fine to follow your owner's manual or maintenance minder, as the case may be. I believe (but cannot now check to confirm) that in the case of Accords with maintenance minders, the owner's manual no longer states mileage intervals for maintenance items. Instead each owner is supposed to rely on the maintenance minder to know when to do something.

rekh

This is a very interesting topic started by davidd3. Thank you. I would like to mention some points for those who believe it's better to change oil sooner and not to follow Maintenance Minder(MM):

First according to Honda, it's just needed and it's absolutely enough to follow MM.(see post #2230). Dealer's schedule for service and maintenance is so long,complicated and expensive. Would you like to spend more money? Would you like to go to dealers so often? Would you like to do some unnecessary services for a reliable car like Honda?

Secondly, to keep your warranty or extended warranty valid you should have you car serviced. You can choose between MM, dealers' schedule or any thing else. But I believe MM is the simplest and the cheapest.

Thirdly, MM has three codes: 1) oil life in percentage 2) alphabetical codes (A-B) 3)numerical codes (1-2-3-4-5-6). Each of these shows a type of service which is due and should be done. (details can be found in Owner Manual). But the point is that you won't get alphabetical and numerical codes before oil life reaches to 15%. So if you change your oil sooner than 15% you won't get other code(s)and you can not follow MM to do other services on time.

I just will follow MM and won't waste my money and time.

ron_m

My father who is 80 years old purchased a base model 2006 Accord sedan a few months ago. Since then he tells me on a regular basis that he didn't notice how "rough" the car rides during the test drive circuit that the salesman had him take the car on the day he bought it. He's replaced the OEM tires with a set of Michelins in hopes of a more compliant ride. No improvement according to my father--even after dropping the air pressure in the tires down to 34 p.s.i. I keep telling him that this generation Accord has a stiffer, sportier suspension to help improve handling and that he can't expect it to ride as smooth as a 1983 Lincoln Town Car.

This brings me to my question. What aftermarket suspension products could my father go with to soften up the ride of his 2006 Accord sedan? He seems to like everything about the car but the ride. Any of you guys know of a replacement strut, or other suspension modification, that may just do the trick for my father? By the way, my mother is really tired of hearing him gripe about how "rough" their '06 Accord rides. I'd like to try and help them both solve the problem with their latest ride. Any help would certainly be appreciated.

Ron M.

ol07

@rekh

Good point. However, don't the MM codes correspond to the maintenance schedule seen in the owner's manual of older vehicles? I haven't read the MM section of my manual since I got the car, but it seems like I vaguely remember the MM codes relating very closely to the highway maintenance schedule of my last car. Then again, maybe not.

I just hit 5% at 5800 miles. I plan to drive to 0% because I am a lazy poor college student. Plus, if the MM wasn't all that useful, why would Honda, of all manufacturers, include it?

elroy5

Good grief fellas. It's all the exhaust, and naturally #1 comes before #2.

elroy5

I am of the opinion that all car manufacturers are extending the maintenance intervals more than they should. This lowers the maintenance costs, and conversely lowers the car's "true cost to own" which more a more people seem to be looking at these days. The oil is my car's life blood, and I will change it every 3,000 miles, no matter how long they claim I can safely wait. Of course, I change it myself, so it's not that costly or a big deal (one hour at the most on a weekend). Just my opinion on the subject. You do as you like.

chucko3

I thought the specs called for 32psi for the
front and 30psi for the rear.
Try lower the front to 30 psi.

saleem

lol stubborn ignorance beats any engineering...

to be honest, its good to change your oil every 3K miles, and only costs you $10, so go for it. But the manual isn't propaganda, if it says the maintenance minder can manage it, then I believe it.

toggle_77

I don't know about your first two problems, but the rough transmission is a problem on my 2006 V-6 Accord.

I asked the dealer once and they said it was normal. I'm going to take it in again in a few weeks for an oil change and tire rotation and I'll demand they look at it.

By the way, it is much more noticeable when the gas is near 1/2 tank or below...do you have the same problem?

tallman1

The oil changing controversy crops up here and other threads all the time. I read them all with interest and based on everything I've read (here and elsewhere), I've changed my habits from every 3000 miles to following the MM on my new Accord. I've changed it slightly before 15% so far... but not much before.

This one is VERY personal so others get to make their own decisions.

rekh

As I have mentioned in my posts, I didn't mean to emphasis or focus JUST on ENGINE OIL change intervals. What I tried to say is that: To keep your car in a good condition and to keep your warranty and extended warranty valid you have to do a type of services. The question is that which schedule would you like to follow? (such as MM or dealer's schedule or....). If you have reached to this point that MM is the one you want ( as I believe it), you need to get codes from MM, and to get codes you shouldn't change your engine oil before 15%, otherwise you won't get other codes to know when you should have other services (such as transmission oil change) done.

Of course people can change their engine oil sooner or later. It's their personal choice and I respect it. But even they should be aware that they need some sort of services. They can follow other schedules for services or even a personal one. Good luck

elroy5

I get the feeling some of you think I change my oil much too often (3,000 miles). So I looked it up in the owner's manual. I have an 03 model, and there is no MM system. The scheduled maintenance is done the old fashioned way (miles or time, which ever comes first). The time/distance for oil and filter change is 3,750 miles (V6 engine). For those of you who have the V6 and the MM system, at what mileage does your MM typically say 15% oil life?

davidd3

For those of you who have the V6 and the MM system, at what mileage does your MM typically say 15% oil life?

I can't say what's typical, but my 15% came at around 6,000 miles on the original oil. Now I'm at 5% and 6,600 miles. Will have the oil change done tomorrow. Nearly double the traditional 3,750 miles intervals for Hondas.

I am not sure which model year Honda changed over to the MM system. My 2004 Odyssey did not have it. My 2006 Accord has it, as does my 2007 Pilot. BMW has a better way (in my opinon). You press a button if and when you want to check how many miles you have left to go for various types of maintenance. With Honda, once you get to 15%, you have to press a button every time you start the car to make the maintenance information go away (and until you get down to 15%, you cannot get any information at all about your progress, not even by pressing a button). Otherwise, you can't see your odometer. This has caused confusion for Mrs. D and daughter D. They start the car. Maintenance is not overdue, yet there's a wrench showing up on the dashboard and something is a amiss with the odometer making it appear that there may be some sort of oil crisis. "Something is wrong with the car," they told me. I then had to explain to them about this new MM system. They also find it to be annoying.

Thinking ahead to the equivalent of what used to be the first major maintenance interval (30,000 miles), I wonder what will happen with the MM system. If oil changes that used to be done every 3,750 miles are now being done every 6,600 miles, will the first major service be called for at say 50,000 miles instead of 30,000 miles (or is that unchanged).

Here's another thought, getting back to my orginal point which started this discussion. Suppose that MM would call for the first major service to be done at 30,000 miles. When the MM shows 15%, the car will only have 25,500 - - leaving 4,500 miles of driving to be annoyed by the MM every single time you start the car, unless and until you have the maintenance done.

Over the weekend I plan to read the pertinent part of my owner's manual again to better understand this new MM system. I also plan to watch the Honda video that someone recommended earlier this week.

elroy5

At what % does Honda reccommened you actually do the oil change? 0%, or something higher. How does the MM know if you are driving in severe conditions, or normal conditions? Doesn't seem like an exact science, to say the least. I don't think I would like the MM, if my car had it.

davidd3

Those are some of the things I want to read up on. If I do find time this weekend, I'll report back with my findings.

I suppose that MM is considered to be an advancement over the traditional maintenance schedules with only two sizes to fit all (something like change your oil every 3,750 miles for severe condition and change your oil every 7,500 miles for normal conditions). I do not yet know what MM monitors, but I gather that MM is a customized system that comes up with somewhat different maintenance timing for each car by somehow taking into account how the car is used. The customization aspect is a neat feature. The MM taking over your dashboard at 15% is an annoying feature.

rekh

Please see post 2230 and watch the video.

Some quotes from that video:
"The system keeps track of maintenance intervals automatically and let's you know when it's time to come in for service"

"The system performs this oil life calculation based on engine operating conditions. If the engine runs at higher temperature and RPM or at lower temperature during short trips the oil life will deplete faster than during more normal conditions."

"When the oil life reaches 15% service is due SOON ......... When the oil life reaches 5% service is due NOW and when it reaches 0% service is overdue"

Hope these can help.

richards38

I have an '04 Accord EX-L and it does ride harder than a Toyota Camry which is probably what your father should have purchased if he wanted a soft-riding car.

When my Accord was new, it did ride quite hard, but the tires were over-inflated and either the suspension softened or I became accustomed to the ride because it doesn't seem to ride too hard at all now.
I keep the tires at about 33 pounds--just slightly above the recommended pressure.

So, I suggest setting the COLD pressure to 32 lbs front, and 30 lbs rear per the manual, and give the car a chance to break in.

fated

rekh and all, I agree with what you said about following the MM for oil change as well as other maintenance. But for me, since time, rather than mileage, will be the binding constraint, I don't know how useful the MM will be. I have owned my car (06 accord XL 4cyl, bought new) for a little more than six months now and I only have 800 miles on it. The oil life shows up at 60%. When I took the car to the dealer last week for an oil change thinking that I should do one every six months at least, the service representative told me to wait. He said I could come back when it hits the one year mark if the MM still is above 15%.

So for me, when it's been a year, I would do an oil change, but then the MM might still not have hit 15%, which means none of the maintenance codes will show either. Do I then have to follow some other kind of schedule? If so, where is it available?

Thanks!

rekh

An interesting question and exceptional situation.

To be honest I don't have a complete or an accurate answer. But I can say:
1)Read the owner manual, maintenance chapter, It explains the codes, you will find some hints that can help you such as: change your brake fluid every 3 years regardless of mileage, change transmission oil first at... miles then....,
2) Try to find an older model owner manual. Usually you can find a type of schedule there.
3)Go to your dealer and ask them to give you a print of their schedule. They will give you one or two sheets that explain what services you should do at different mileages.

Now try to compare, mix and figure out a schedule for you yourself.

This is what I know. May be others can help.

blane

elroy5,

In post #2248 you wrote:

"So I looked it up in the owner's manual. I have an 03 model, and there is no MM system. The scheduled maintenance is done the old fashioned way (miles or time, which ever comes first). The time/distance for oil and filter change is 3,750 miles (V6 engine)."

That's strange. The Owner's Manual for my 2004 Accord (identical car and engine - one year later) says to change my V6's oil and filter "every 7,500 miles or every 1 year, whichever is sooner".

Honda OwnersLink also says "The "normal" schedule is fine for most drivers, even if they occasionally drive in severe conditions.".

davidd3

I am reporting back after re-reading the Maintenance Minder chapter of the owner's manual. Here are my findings and observations:

Based on the engine operating conditions and accumulated engine revolutions, the onboard computer calculates the remaining engine life and displays it as a percentage.

Contrary to what I said in my previous post, it is possible to see the current engine oil life at any time, by pushing and releasing the odometer reset knob until engine oil life is displayed.

When the display shows 15% oil life, actual calculated oil life is anywhere between 11% to 15%. Similarly, when it shows 10%, it's anywhere between 6% and 10%. And when it shows 5%, it's anywhere between 1% and 5%. Above 15%, oil life is displayed by increments of 10% (i.e., when it shows 50%, oil life is anywhere between 41% and 50%). One might ask why the display is not more precise. I do not have the answer.

When the remaining oil life is 15% to 6%, you will see the oil life indicator every time you start the car (and it stays there unless you press the odometer knob to change it back to the odometer). When remaining oil life is 5% to 1%, the message changes from "oil life" to "service oil life." When the remaining oil life is 0%, the oil life indicator will be blinking and you should have the indicated maintenance items performend ASAP. If you do not have the maintenance performed within 10 miles after 0% is first displayed, negative mileage will be displayed (in lieu of a percentage)and you should have the service done immediately. While the owner's manual does not quite spell it out in this way, my take is that service should be performed at your earliest convenience after oil life first shows 5%.

Here's something to be careful of. The MM must be reset after maintenance is done. If you have the required service done but do not reset the display (or you reset the display without doing the service), the MM system will not show the proper maintenance intervals thereafter. This can lead to serious mechanical problems because you will no longer have an accurate record of when maintenance is needed. This reset issue should be more of a concern if your car is serviced by yourself or an independent shop, rather than a Honda dealer (who should be well aware of it). The owner's manual tells you how to do it if you want to (or need to) do it for yourself.

Hope this helps.

blane

ron_m,

Have you considered giving your father a soft cushion to place between himself and his vehicle's seat? The memory foam type may be your solution until he gets acclimated to the Accord's superior ride and handling.

elroy5

I've always gone by severe conditions (short distances and high humidity). I also change my transmission fluid every 15,000 miles. I guess I'm over protective of parts I can't see, or change easily. My oil looks pretty dirty (dark brown) at 3,000 miles. It would probably be black as coal by 7,500 miles.

davidd3

Had my oil changed today for the first time, after 7 months and 6,600 miles, not long after the Maintenance Minder starting showing 5% oil life. I'm providing this info just to give people a sense of when the timing comes for the first oil change under the MM system.

Had it done by an independent service station and they reset the MM for me (they knew about it). They don't like the MM system either, but for a different reason than my reason for not liking it. They don't like it because people who do their maintenance in accordance with MM (as I believe most people would) are going much longer between oil changes, which is bad for business. They love the people who still do oil changes every 3,000 miles no matter what.

Still mightily surprised and impressed with this car. I was just looking for a good lease deal on a reliable 4-door sedan. Leftover 2006 Accord was the best deal going at my moment of need. I figured I was getting a ho-hum mainstream family car. But it turns out that this car (I have the V6) has more of a sports sedan feel. Power, handling and ride are all very good. I enjoy driving it, much more than I thought I would.

blane

elroy5,

I did a quick Google search for "motor oil color" and thought you might be interested in the following from the top of the list:

Oil Change Intervals

Few subjects generate as much debate on Usenet as the proper oil change interval. Since few people bother with oil analysis the debate centers on time and mileage.

Follow the Money
Unfortunately, there are market forces that have a vested interest in convincing vehicle owners to change their oil more often than necessary. The legal prey of these market forces have become convinced that they are purchasing "cheap insurance" or "peace of mind" by changing their oil more often than necessary. Complicating things is the fact that doing oil changes is one of the few do-it-yourself maintenance tasks that is still within the ability of the backyard mechanic to perform.

Recreational Oil Changing
The term "recreational oil changer" was coined to define people that change their oil far more than necessary because they actually enjoy doing it. It's easy to understand the psychology behind the recreational oil changing. It's the visceral feel of the tools, the victory when that old oil filter breaks free, the hot dirty oil pouring out, the joy of oiling of the gasket on the new filter, that new copper or fiber gasket on the drain plug, the clean clear oil going in, and the sense of accomplishment when you start the car, the oil light comes on for a moment, then goes out. For $8-10 in oil and parts, it's pretty cheap entertainment, but if people would be content to do it only when it provides some benefit to the vehicle it would be better.

The 3000 Mile Myth
The 3000 mile oil change interval has been pounded into people's heads for decades. It had a scientific basis when engines used non-multi-weight, non-detergent oil. It no longer has any scientific basis, but it is still being promoted by certain entities, most notably the oil change industry in the United States. This myth is also sometimes known as the "Cheap Insurance Myth."

The 3000 Mile Fact
There are still vehicles that need 3K oil changes, but it's not because the oil goes bad after 3K miles. One example is the Saturn S series. These vehicles have a timing chain system that is very sensitive to clean oil because oil pressure is used as hydraulic fluid to ratchet up the timing chain tensioner. If varnish forms in the timing chain tensioner bore then this system can fail and the chain will become loose and eventually break. Dealers have gone as far as tearing out the normal service schedule (6000 miles) and leaving only the severe service schedule. If your engine is destroyed (under warranty) by a failed timing chain then the dealer will legitimately request evidence of oil changes. Unfortunately this problem usually won't manifest itself during the warranty period.

The Dark Oil Myth
Dark oil does not indicate the need for an oil change. The way modern detergent motor oil works is that minute particles of soot are suspended in the oil. These minute particles pose no danger to your engine, but they cause the oil to darken. A non-detergent oil would stay clearer than a detergent oil because all the soot would be left on the internal engine parts and would create sludge. If you never changed your oil, eventually the oil would no longer be able to suspend any more particles in the oil and sludge would form. Fortunately, by following the manufacturer's recommended oil change interval, you are changing your oil long before the oil has become saturated. Remember, a good oil should get dirty as it does it's work cleaning out the engine. The dispersant should stop all the gunk from depositing in the oil pan.

The only real way to determine whether oil is truly in need of changing is to have an oil analysis performed. Since most people don't want to bother with this, it's acceptable to err heavily on the safe side and simply follow the manufacturer's recommended change interval for severe service. There are still a few cars that specify 3K intervals for severe service, but not many. If you look at countries other than the U.S., the oil recommended change interval is much higher than even the normal interval specified by vehicle manufacturers in the U.S.

Severe Service versus Normal Service
Each manufacturer specifies what constitutes normal and severe service. Generally, severe service consists of operating the vehicle in a very muddy or dusty areas (because dust particles get through the air filter and contaminate the oil more quickly), operating the vehicle in a very hot areas (heat breaks down oil more quickly), using the vehicle only for short trips in cold weather (the moisture in the oil never gets vaporized), or using the vehicle for towing or when carrying a car-top carrier. You'll often see claims such as "everyone falls into the severe service category," but these claims are untrue (follow the money and see who's making these claims). If you primarily do freeway driving in moderate weather you do not fall into the severe service category. If you're in doubt, the best way to see if you fall into the severe service category is to have an oil analysis done at the mileage of the severe service interval. Many people just like to play it safe and follow the severe service schedule, which is fine, but there is no benefit in changing the oil sooner than the severe service schedule states.

saleem

One might ask why the display is not more precise. I do not have the answer.

It's a psychological thing. If you constantly saw your oil life dropping, 1% every 65 miles-- you'd get this impending doom' feeling and may feel more reluctant driving longer distances, because you can feel the remaining use of the engine/oil slipping away from you. so if it goes down in 10% increments, you prolly wont notice EXACTLY when it goes down, and you don't WORRY about it as often.

That said, I'm a mechanical/aerospace engineer, not a psychologist, so I have no clue. Plus, you see the mileage on the odometer always going up? I guess the countdown from 100% to 5% is a lot more stressful than seeing the odometer slooooowly make its way to 150,000 200,000 300,000 or whenever the damn engine will actually fail. they're pretty solid.

elroy5

Good stuff blane.
All of this information sounds very logical, and I am considering going up to 4,000 miles for my oil changes (slightly over the severe interval). It's hard to teach an old dog new tricks though, and dark brown oil bothers me :surprise: . I know if I paid someone else to change my oil, I would be more likely to change my ways
While I don't mind changing my own oil, I certainly don't get a thrill out of it (as your post suggests). It's just my obsession with clean oil, that makes me do it so often.

metalibrarian

There has been much good discussion on Honda's Maintenance Minder, but Honda leaves several questions unanswered in the manual and in the video--or have I missed something? What happens if you do give your dealer or your independent or your beer company more business by changing your oil more frequently than the MM suggests? Suppose you change it at 4,000-mile intervals instead of the 6,500 habit that mine seems to have fallen into? I presume you then reset the MM...okay...but does that louse up the whole system? Are you then going to get false information on when to change the tranny fluid? In other words are the MM information points compiled separately from each other? Is oil change A and B separately determined from 1 and 2 and 3, etc.? If you goof up once, i.e., change your oil too soon or too late, is the car's MM permanently out of kilter? Can the MM be rebooted, so to speak, to restart the whole information process correctly? What happens when you buy the car used instead of new and have no idea on how regularly the first guy did things? The chaps at my local dealer cannot answer these questions.

For those of you who may be confused at my including the beer company reference above, it is because one of the truly great pleasures of changing the oil yourself on a late Saturday afternoon is to sit down on a stool in your garage, stare at your car, sip a cold beer, and think, "I've just made the universe run a little better, a little cleaner..." Two cars, two beers. Admit it: if we factor in beer, most of us lose money on changing our own oil...

/

elroy5

What happens when you buy the car used instead of new and have no idea on how regularly the first guy did things?

Well this problem is inherent with any used car. Did he change the timing belt? Did he change the transmission fluid? Fuel filter?

rekh

Is oil change A and B separately determined from 1 and 2 and 3, etc.?

This is from Honda video (Post#2230):

"........ note the sub codes will only appear with main codes...."

Main code=A-B
Sub codes=1-2-3-4-5-6

Also please see post#2247

metalibrarian

rekh, I did read your #2247. You are one of the more knowledgeable commentators.

If it is the case that one should only reset the Maintenance Minder when the oil life reaches 15% or less, and that one will screw up the subcodes otherwise, then the MM is a kind of informational straitjacket. I suspect a lot of folks will end up ignoring it, especially conscientious guys like the readers of these notes who do change oil, fluid, coolant, plugs, filters, and so on, regularly. Result: false maintenance signals popping up as time goes on and the cars age. Now that is annoying. What strikes me is that dealer personnel seem as confused about these matters as everyone else.

I think the MM is a very good idea--it's just in a primitive stage right now. Watch and see how better it gets when it can store the vehicle's maintenance history and it can adapt to differing needs and schedules and to exceptions. There are many reasons for an out-of-schedule oil change, for example, besides being a maintenance freak. Suppose you are going to drive coast-to-coast, round trip, 6,000 miles? It's a good idea to start out wth a little preventive maintenance (oil, tires, hoses, etc.) How does MM account for that?

davidd3

These are excellent questions. If your Honda dealer does not have the answers, who does? It looks as though we are being used as guinea pigs for MM.

exshoman

All good stuff here.

As I was reading the post here, I think I hit upon what might be the solution to the "what to do if I change the oil more frequently than MM says" quandary. Think of MM as serving two purposes - when to change the oil, and when to do other stuff (trans fluid, tire rotation, etc). Unfortunately, the "other stuff" only shows up when the MM gets down to 15%.

So what to do if you change oil at say 4K miles, but still want to use MM for everything else? I think you can get this to work if you DON'T reset the MM after each oil change, but instead wait until it does in fact get down to 15%, then you can see if the MM is showing only an oil change or an oil change plus something else (the AB/12345 indicator). If it's a oil change only (ie. A), then just reset the MM (after all, you've already changed the oil). If it's oil change plus something else (B or A/B with a number), then have that service performed and reset MM then.

I think this way you can still perform the oil per your preference (the 3K mile fan base), but still use MM for the rest of the service, since Honda seems to be a bit obtuse for those folks that might want to see a more concrete milage indicator for other services written on paper.

Using this method, it's obviously up to you to keep track of the mileage for your oil changes, but that's what you're choosing to do.

I really don't know what the MM does with the other, non-oil related maintenance items if you reset the MM before 15% (say every 3K miles). But then again, it's sort of a moot point, as you'll never see the other items because you never let it down to 15% (can someone say "Catch-22")?

Does this make sense?

tallman1

The other option for some has been to look at the pre-2006 model year Accord service interval. Same engine but MM wasn't used then. I believe 2006 was the first hear of MM on the Accord.

It was posted here(or another thread) from Honda's Owners Link a few months ago.