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Honda Civic vs Mazda3

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Comments

  • z71billz71bill Posts: 2,000
    I am not sure how you would be better off if you leased a lemon car VS buy it. If your leased lemon car will not start - or needs to go in for warranty work every month you still need to find a way to get to work.

    A lease can even be MORE difficult to get out from under (compared to a loan). By more difficult I mean more expensive - early termination fees/penalties - at a minimum - some leasing companies will just say no early terminations - all payments must be made. Plus lets not forget that MOST of the time a lease will cost more than a loan.

    Find a dealership that offers a free rental car if your car is in the shop FOR ANY REASON.

    The bottom line is - You pay your money - you take your chances -
  • waygrabowwaygrabow Posts: 211
    Does this indecision extend to other phases of your life? Some risk is inherent; it is part of the adventure. Most of the things you read here are anecdotal; take it for what it is worth. I really don't care if you buy the same car I like. If it gets too popular there will be no individuality in owning one, and prices will go up. I just know that after 31,000 miles, I have no regrets.
  • mongoose65mongoose65 Posts: 31
    Excellent points, Z. Leasing companies are notoriously IN-flexible!! Mazda has a deal with Enterprise and offers free rentals a well as free roadside assistance. I know they don't want to come up with money out of their own pocket so to me it is a small sign of faith in their own cars' reliabiltity. So far my 3 runs great, looks great and the mileage is doing as well as I expected.

    Some of the posts here are so outrageous. "Get better like VW?!?!" VW has gone so far down in recent years it makes people's head spin! Mexican made VW's have been problematic and it's well documented. In all fairness, so have Mazda 6's since Mexican production started. So have the Hondas since American production.

    To the original poster, everyone gets anxiety at buying a new car (unless you've got crazy money). Once again, the civic and mazda3 are both GREAT cars. Lemons happen, they are complicated machines. Get the one you like best and expect problems may occur. Beamers, Lexus' and Mercedes break down too. If you really want reliability above all else, get a 1965 Dodge Dart with a slant 6 engine and AM radio!
  • ncgullncgull Posts: 13
    Not when it comes to telling you where to get off. That's an easy decision.
  • ncgullncgull Posts: 13
    I don't have the money to put down for a lease. What is it -- $2k or something? HAH!

    Sorry I wore my heart on my sleeve to your hardballs...
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    let's not get personal here, please.
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    Excellent points, Backy.

    It is not unusual in a forum to hear competing views. If some feel strongly about an issue it may sound as if this were the opinion of all. But as we see here, there are others with different experiences. One opinion does not negate another.

    Before making a decision I try to find out as much as I can by reading forums, consulting published comparisons, talking to colleagues and doing my own "testing". After four years, I'm still happy with my decision.
  • cticti Posts: 134
    You don't have to put money down on a lease. A security deposit should be all you need. Typically the money down on a lease is so that the vehicle can be advertised for a certain amount per month.

    If you don't have 2K to put as a down payment on a lease, you probably shouldn't be buying (or leasing)a new car. Now, I'm not saying you HAVE to have a down payment - maybe the interest rate is ridiculously low - but you should at least have the money.

    The Civic and 3 are definitely the best compacts out there. I went with a 3 hatch over the Civic because it was fun to drive, had 5 doors, and came with more features that the Civic didn't offer. It's been 15 months and I still smile every time I get into it.

    I have a 2000 Kia Sephia that I haven't driven in a year. I took it to the repair shop to get fixed before I sell it. What a piece of junk - and that was AFTER it was fixed.
  • richmlrichml Posts: 156
    More posts at various Mazda forums.

    Yes - discussion of AC on the "other" forum is even more dominated by the same select group of posters with weak AC who post here. Seems like you're referencing your own posts.

    Have you thought of trading your 3 in for a vehicle that is in no way associated with Ford? I know z71bill said he was looking at Hondas awhile back.
  • ex_tdierex_tdier Posts: 275
    Seems like you're affiliated with Mazda indirectly or directly. Either that, or your're in denial. :lemon:
  • richmlrichml Posts: 156
    Not affiliated in the least - just a satisfied 3 owner who has received good support from service departments for the five Mazdas we've owned. FYI, we've also owned various GM and VW vehicles.

    I don't know what it's like in western Canada, but I've been to various locations in Quebec several times in the last couple of years, and the streets are swarming with 3s and Pro 5s. Mazda apparently has a much larger market share in Canada than in the states. I'd think it would be fairly easy to sell your 3 and then get a Honda or non-Ford North American vehicle.
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    I've been to various locations in Quebec several times in the last couple of years, and the streets are swarming with 3s and Pro 5s

    You're absolutely right. The same is true for neighbouring Ontario where many a Mazda roams the highways and biways. If I'm not mistaken, the Mazda3 and the Protege have been in the Canadian top 10 for quite a long time.

    p.s. the "zoom zoom" tag line gets translated in Quebec to "vroum vroum" :)
  • z71billz71bill Posts: 2,000
    richml - Glad you have had good LUCK with Mazda - but do you really believe - if you would have been one of the UNLUCKY people who bought a Mazda3 with a defective AC system that Mazda would have fixed your car?

    I think Mazda would have told you the exact same thing that they told me (and thousands of others) - sorry we will not do anything because - its operating as designed.

    Now use your imagination a little - would your "Mazda provides good service" tune change a little then? I think it would.

    It is true I am looking at a Honda Accord coupe - its for my wife - the Mazda3 has been taken over by my 17 year old daughter - which is the reason we bought it in the first place. When I was 17 my car did not even have AC (69 Chevelle SS 396) and it did not bother me one little bit - I expect that most 17 year olds would gladly accept a 2 year old Mazda3 (even one with a weak AC) as their first car. Sure beats walking.
  • richmlrichml Posts: 156
    bill - I'd be very unhappy if the AC wasn't fixed. I own an '05 MT 5-door. I don't know if I have the insert plate that Mazda came out with, I know I don't have the air filter. I think the broad expanse of untinted glass combined with the black interior has to affect AC efficiency.

    I note that Meade has abandoned participating in the forum. It annoys me that my near 25 years of Mazda ownership and service experience doesn't seem to count when someone with their first Mazda isn't happy with the air blowing from the vents. Some of the sweeping statements and assumptions are over the top.

    My first car was a '64 Chevelle, three speed on the column - inherited from my grandfather in '74 with only 9,000 miles on it! It was garage kept, I don't think anyone had ever sat (on the thick seat covers) in the back seat. People used to leave notes under the wipers asking to buy it. It also came without AC - didn't even have a side-view mirror or a radio.

    When I started dating my wife she owned a 4-cylinder AT Firebird - couldn't believe that such a vehicle existed. It was so underpowered that you had to turn the AC off when you were paying a toll, otherwise it would stall.

    My father has owned several Accords - he swears by them. They are nice cars, just not what I was looking for.
  • gbw1gbw1 Posts: 6
    Is the mazda3 engine made by mazda or by ford? I know they are intertwined corporations, yet I've heard the mazda3 engine is made by the mazda and the mazda6 engine is made by ford.
  • midnightcowboymidnightcowboy Posts: 1,978
    get a manual shift Corolla CE
  • autonomousautonomous Posts: 1,769
    the mazda3 engine is made by the mazda and the mazda6 engine is made by ford.
    Correct.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I sure hope you are kidding, if not, i'm really confused, because they are the same (2.3L, 160 hp I-4) engine!
  • d_hyperd_hyper Posts: 130
    C'mon..I-4 engine is the same Mazda engine.
    V6 is Ford's, greatly improved by Mazda adding VVT
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    I sure hope you are kidding, if not, i'm really confused, because they are the same (2.3L, 160 hp I-4) engine!

    No, they are not the same engine. They share most of the same components, the top half of the engine is exactly the same. They have different intake systems,(VIS), I believe, which is a Ford Design in the Mazda6. The Mazda6 also has 155 Ft. Lbs. of Torque as opposed to 150 in the Mazda3. There are a few more details as well. I'm not a tech, but I will find out.

    The MZR 2.3 built in Hofu Japan goes into the Mazda3, Mazda5, Mazdaspeed6 (turbo), CX-7 (turbo). The MZR 2.3 in the Mazda6 is built in Mexico. The MZR 2.3 in the Mazda6 is a Mazda design, but, engine production is over seen by Ford. Same goes for the 2.3 in the Tribute, B Series, Escape, Focus, Ranger,and Fusion. It's basically a quality control difference.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    The Mazda3 engine is all Japanese. Designed by the Japanese, built by the Japanese.
  • ex_tdierex_tdier Posts: 275
    I think it's safe to say that the Japanese designed and built engines will be more or less fine as far reliability goes. However, there is more to the car than just the engine: sensors, climate control, brakes, suspension, transmission, electrics, the body, and everything else in between. Many components are contracted or subcontracted out and this is where quality, quality control, and reliability come to play.

    And of course, let's not forget customer service. You have to decide who you wish to believe and which car you want. In the end, you're the one deciding and have to live with the decision.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Thank you, i had been misinformed back at a car show a couple years ago by a Mazda sales rep (back when I was really interested in a Mazda 6), so pardon my implied ignorance. I did not know those facts...

    Thanks for correcting me with everyone's (seemingly) infinite wisdom!
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    You're welcome.

    I know this is not a Mazda6 thread, but, the Mazda6 MZR 2.3 IS a Mazda engine, just not identical to the Mazda3 MZR 2.3
  • atsang1atsang1 Posts: 15
    I test drove both 3 and 6, the 2.3 engine felt more punchy and powerful, on the other hand, the 2.3 engine felt sluggish (both are automatic). I know 6 is a bit heavier, but the engine definitely doesn't have the liveliness feel of the 3's engine, at least with auto transmission.
  • mrblonde49mrblonde49 Posts: 626
    richml - Glad you have had good LUCK with Mazda - but do you really believe - if you would have been one of the UNLUCKY people who bought a Mazda3 with a defective AC system that Mazda would have fixed your car?

    I think Mazda would have told you the exact same thing that they told me (and thousands of others) - sorry we will not do anything because - its operating as designed.

    Now use your imagination a little - would your "Mazda provides good service" tune change a little then? I think it would. "

    Why don't you use the same logic and put yourselves in the shoes of the vast majority of 3 owners that have had little or no issues at all? Would your tune change? Or do you only like sad songs? ;)
  • juniorswajuniorswa Posts: 3
    Just thought I'd throw in my $0.02. I completely understand what the nervous buyer is going through, because I felt the same way. I own a '99 Mazda that I bought USED in 2001. I was totally freaked about buying a Mazda because I had only owned Toyotas and Hondas up until that point, but I fell in love with the HANDLING of the Mazda during a test drive while looking for a new used car. Would the car hold up? How good was Mazda quality? What about the dealership service? To make matters worse, my Mom said that any car would be okay to buy, except Mazdas, because apparently her parents had a bad experience with rotary engines in the 70's!?! Well, I did what any good 25 year old would do, totally ignoring my Mom's advice and following my heart. I bought the Mazda and I still own it today. It is more reliable than the last car I owned for 8 years, a Toyota, and people still ask me if my car is brand new! The delaership is excellent, with free car washes and rental cars while your car is being serviced. Oil changes are $20, with free tire rotation, within 30 minutes or the service is free. Been to a Toyota dealer lately? They're horrid in comparison! My car has had no problems, runs like brand new, and is a joy for me to drive everyday! Mazda never really crossed my mind until the dealer I bought the car from practically forced me to drive the thing when I was hunting for a car in 2001. Mazda has been a better car for me by far than my last Toyota. Everybody has a different experience, and ALL manufacturers produce a few lemons, so there's no point in saying a certain manufacturer never makes mistakes. (Exhibit A: Numerous Toyota and Honda recalls lately.) Go with your gut and buy what you like. I would not hesitate ever again to buy a Mazda. It's been great for me!
  • z71billz71bill Posts: 2,000
    What a foolish way to look at the situation!

    Mazda will not fix the cars that have an obvious defect - how can you possible see that as a good thing? Wouldn't you feel better about buying a Mazda is EVERYONE with a weak AC had their car fixed?

    The expectation when someone buys a new car is - if it develops a problem the company that manufactured it will stand behind it and fix it. Anything less is a PROBLEM.

    Right?

    Even if only 10 people have AC systems that do not work Mazda should still fix them - Right?

    Or do you think that as long as only a small % of cars have a problem its ok to just ignore it?

    In your opinion how many cars need to be defective (1% 5% 10% 25%)before Mazda should fix the problem?
  • juniorswajuniorswa Posts: 3
    Here's a simple solution to the guy with the A/C problem. Take your car to the dealer and tell them that the A/C isn't keeping you cold enough. If he says that it is normal or working the way it is supposed to, then ask him to test drive a brand new Mazda3 with the A/C on. If the A/C in the new car on the test drive is the same, then that's just the way it operates. If the new car has much colder A/C, then there should no longer be any argument about whether or not the A/C in your car is working properly or not. The dealer could not possibly argue with you about it, and your car must be fixed under the warranty. Simple solution. If you want to hear about bad ownership experiences, try blown head gaskets, cylinder shut downs, and oil burning engines from the "legendary" Toyota that I owned. It was legendary alright. A legendary P.O.S.!!! Those are real issues. Such as your car not starting when you turn the key. My Toyota experience totally turned me off from ever owning another Toyota in my lifetime. The dealer/manufacturer did not stand by their product at all. Was it a fluke based on others experiences with Toyotas? Probably. But, just goes to show everybody makes a lemon every now and then.
  • richmlrichml Posts: 156
    Bill, at the risk of reviving your long-gone discussions with Meade, it seems to me that owners with issues are much more likely to post to the forum than people who don't have substantive problems. At least in your many posts, you've outlined the extensive trouble-shooting that you've done to solve the problem - much better than some who post "Mazda sucks" and insert the lemon icon. They've got a problem, Mazda sucks, and any happy owners are fools - right!
    I think you and the other two or three posters who dominate AC discussions on this and the "other" Mazda3 forum would be much better served by directing your comments to Mazda North America, and whatever the Canadian counterpart is. If you compiled the massive number of posts to the forums that you and the couple of other AC-challenged posters have made, and sent then with a cover letter to Mazda, they might see that they are reaping poor PR by not addressing the problems of a few owners who have recurring AC problems.
    All of the posts to this forum have pretty much exhausted the topic, with no resolution in sight. Why not send it all to Mazda and see if they respond? I think it is worth a try. Maybe some of the Mazda associated posters to the Mazda3 and CX-7 forums could give you the name of someone who might try to resolve the issue? Everybody would like to see your problems resolved.
    I've been in the heat of Texarkana all week with a rented Corolla - the AC could be better.
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