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Buying American Cars What Does It Mean?



  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,071
    Holy Smoke! Pretty soon they'll be preaching "What's Good for Toyota is Good for America!"
  • Gotta admit it, I may not agree with you a lot,lemko, but that last comment was funny :D
  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 21,589
    Toyota's been pretty good for me! I've made a 37% return so far on some of their stock I purchased! Plus it's paying a dividend now. Not the consistent 50 cents per quarter that GM does, but I got one payout of 73 cents per share back in July, and one of 58 cents per share in December.

    Seriously though, I don't think GM, Ford, or Chrysler are going away anytime soon.
  • anythngbutgmanythngbutgm Posts: 4,159
    ^ Exactly, and I don't think there are many on the boards who want that to happen. I don't.

    I don't believe for one second that GM deserves the title of #1 in the Automotive world. I don't care if Toyota steps up to the spot any more than I'd like to see Ford or Chrysler take the spot.

    GM has been milking its success for FAR too long. Even Hyundai deserves the title more than GM just by the efforts here in the US over the last decade and I'm not really a huge fan of them.
  • reddogsreddogs Posts: 353
    Well we always thought what was good for Walmart was good for America and they are buying almost exclusively Chinese goods, so we might as well go ahead and say "What's Good for Toyota is Good for America!"
  • rorrrorr Posts: 3,630
    "What's Good for Toyota is Good for America!"

    Would you agree that what is good for American workers is good for America?

    Why does 'domestic content' include parts/labor/materials from Canada? If the purchase of a Chevy Silverado supports Canadian workers/suppliers while the purchase of a Toyota Tundra supports AMERICAN workers/suppliers, which do you think is 'Good for America!'.....

    I think what you guys are REALLY trying to say is "What's Good for the Big 3 is good for the UAW. And what's Good for the UAW is Good for America".
  • jlawrence01jlawrence01 Posts: 1,828
    Compare the state of the economy in 1976 to today. Now compare GM's share of the market in 1976.

    And how many FEWER people are working in the steel industry? And the textile industry? And the automotive industry??

    On the other hand, Jimmy Carter is still out there and is eligible to run in 2008.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,071
    What's even worse is that there's fewer competitors in the retail industry. You have three giants selling the same junk. "Where did you get that? Wal-Mart? Target? K-Mart?" "Does it matter?"
  • PFFlyer@EdmundsPFFlyer@Edmunds Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,808
    Let's stick to the automotive side of things here please. I know side issues get brought up as examples, but we can't spin off into a discussion of Walmart here.


    Moderator - Hatchbacks & Hybrid Vehicles

  • andre1969andre1969 Posts: 21,589
    is that they used to have some funny import laws that taxed the hell out of stuff that we exported to them. Back in the old days, Pontiacs in Canada were basically rebadged Chevies. The Chevies were made in Canada, as were the Canadian Pontiacs. I believe Oldmobiles and Buicks were imported to Canada though.

    I think the rationale was that the Buicks and Oldsmobiles were prestigious enough that the hefty tarrifs could be absorbed into the price of the car, but it would make an imported Pontiac too expensive. Still, it must've been expensive to make some of those Canadian Pontiacs, because they still used Pontiac interiors, dashboards, and sheetmetal that was altered to fit the shorter Chevy wheelbase. And they ran Chevy engines and drivelines. So that import tarriff must've been expensive, for them to go about getting their Pontiacs in such a roundabout way. :confuse:

    I guess Canada stopped doing this eventually, though.
  • fljoslinfljoslin Posts: 237
    Way back (1965) there was a trade agreement signed between Canada and the US called the Autopact. It was basically a free trade agreement where you could make any car in either country and sell it in either country free of any tarrifs. My understanding is that the Autopact has bennifeted Canada much more than the US and allowed movement of Domestic manufacturing production to Canada from the US.

    Canada-US Automotive Products Agreement (Autopact), a conditional free-trade agreement signed by Canada and the US in January 1965 to create a single North American market for passenger cars, trucks, buses, tires and automotive parts. In Canada FREE TRADE does not apply to consumer sales; it applies solely to manufacturers who meet certain conditions. Under the agreement, motor-vehicle manufacturers are obliged to maintain the same ratio of production to sales in Canada as existed in the 1964 model year; to maintain Canadian value-added or Canadian content equal to the 1964 model year; and have been required (from 1965 onwards) to increase Canadian value-added by 60% of the growth in the value of passenger cars sold (50% for trucks and 40% for buses).

    Between 1965 and 1982 Canada had an overall automotive trade deficit of $12.1 billion with the US, with a surplus of about $28 billion in assembled vehicles and a deficit of about $40.5 billion in automotive parts. Canada had overall surpluses in 1970, 1971, 1972 and 1982. Since 1982 Canada has had a continuing surplus with the US. In 1982-86 exports were $135.5 billion and imports were $112.9 billion, for a 5-year surplus of $22.5 billion.

    The 2 principal purposes of the Autopact were to lower Canadian production costs through more efficient production of fewer lines of motor vehicles and parts, and to lower consumer prices. However, critics note that the industry has remained essentially foreign controlled and that Canadian subsidiaries are less autonomous than they once were. In addition, they note that the industry spends little on research and development in Canada. Automotive industry employment totalled 70 600 in 1965, reached about 125 000 in 1978 before falling to about 99 000 in 1982. Since then employment has recovered to about 140 000.

    Under the Free Trade agreement negotiated with the US in 1987, Canadian safeguards would remain, with North American auto producers losing their right to import parts and vehicles duty-free from other countries unless the safeguards were met. Japanese and other offshore automakers would not be able to join the Autopact. The Canada-US pact can be terminated at any time by 12 months written notice by either government
  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    It isn't meant to be arrogant. It's just a fact. :mad: I feel sorry for people living in China, I really do. The people get abused by american corporations. When I have video of chinese children chained to a sewing machine it makes this "human rights american" sick and sad. It's called Slavery in this country and shouldn't be tolerated any where on this earth. I'm sorry it came across that way and I hope I cleared up what I was trying to say. ;)

    Best of luck and I hope someday you can help China change.


  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,071
    Worse than you think. If a Chinese worker loses a hand in one of those machines from which the safeguards were removed to speed up production, he is awarded the princely sum of $40 and is unable to work again. He returns to his rural village as a pathetic beggar.
  • day9day9 Posts: 57
    I don't know where you got those news. I don't deny that those could be true. But always looking for sad stories is not good for you. If you want to look for dark side, they are every where. Turn on your TV and watch news and you will know. From what I know, things are not as bad as you described. Let's don't make talking cars political.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 16,895

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '08 Town&Country

  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    What's good for the UAW is good for America. Doesn't the UAW and other unions SUPPORT workers rights, fair wages, fair health insurance so your precious tax dollars don't go to another uninsured, retirements, etc etc. The UAW like all unions support Buy American Made first. What they mean is yes they would rather have you buy Canadian over a product made in mexico. The president of Mexico should "rot" !!!!!! He makes me sick because if he truely cared about his people, then he would do everything in his power to help his people. Nope he wants us to have open borders and illegal immigration instead of trying to overhaul everything that's wrong with Mexico. Mexico has been polluted by american corporations in some areas and had it's people taken advantage of. :cry: :mad:
    Mexico is one of the most beautiful country's in the world and has some of the largest natural resources yet to be extracted. WHY ????????????????

    Yes the Canadians Auto Workers are part of the UAW. I have said over and over again that Canada might as well be the 51st state. We are very close. kinda like sisters. ;) Canada is a developed FREE country that supports human rights, freedom of speach, the right to vote, child labor laws, etc etc. The UAW is going to support those rights and in Canada you can't cross the picket line ;) I'd rather buy a (CAW) GM vehicle assembled in Canada than a Toyota built in Kentucky. Why ? The money still goes to GM which is a domestic american comapany. Also that Canadian built GM vehicle also has more American Content than the Toyota. I however will say this. If the Asains ever get the american content upwards of 85-90% I won't complain too much. They are at 65% for the Acura TL.
    (I unfortunatly use to own one) The Honda Accord some say is 70% ???? 15% more to go and it will be American enough for me to not complain to much. Now if the plants someday become union then I will support them even more. Why ? I truely care about my fellow american and want he/she to earn a fair wage, benefits, retirement, which should be entitled to all people living in our great country. Not just for the select few with golden parachutes.

  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    Do you think someday we will ever get to see a automobile that is 100% American made ??????
    I'd would be happy enough if it was 80% American and 20% Canadian=100% North American Made.

    I got a question ol' timers !!!!!! What was the last 100% American made car ?????? I would like to really know the answer. ;)

  • bifbif Posts: 7
    If I go to a Wal-mart and buy a foreign made tee shirt, there is a good chance it was made by a child working under unconscionable conditions (14 hour days, no breaks, no going to the bathroom, work faster or get beaten, then get marched to a "dormitory" with the other captives). Besides that, the people at the Wal-mart look miserable and don't get health insurance except for what they get from the state. I would rather pay more someplace else and be able to sleep at night.

    On the other hand, if I buy a car that was made in Europe or Japan, the people who made it are better off (including things like health insurance, pension and disposable income) then the people who make cars in the US. So why shouldn't I buy the foreign made car?
  • reddogsreddogs Posts: 353
    Because pretty soon Bif, you and many other American workers are going to have jobs working working under unconscionable conditions (14 hour days, no breaks, no going to the bathroom, work faster or get pay deducted, then get marched to a "factory housing" with the other Anglos)in order to compete and you can say goodby to all the things you were used to (including things like health insurance, pension and disposable income). If you dont think its happening check the employees in all the airlines going bankrupt along with the business that Walmart is banrupting with its Chinese-made low price goods.....
  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    What country are you from ? I've seen the flag before but am not remembering. :surprise: duh me :)

    reddogs, I can see WHY he made that suggestion. I however gotta strongly agree with you. :shades:

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