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What is "wrong" with these new subcompacts?

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I don't like center mounted gauges so you don't have to convince me...
  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,167
    While I prefer the styling of the xD over the fit, from the reviews I've read I'd choose the Fit. I've also read that the seating position of the xD's driver's seat is uncomfortable for some people.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    No, the xD's gauges are in the usual spot behind the steering wheel.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Posts: 5,675
    edited December 2010
    And as michaell noted, the gauges are just dumb, with the speedo and tach rotating counter-directionally to each other, and both in the same gauge face. I didn't bother to drive one.

    This is in the Scion xD? Rotating speedo and tach, different sides of the same gauge face on what...every different start-up of the car? What is that supposed to mean, anyway? :confuse:

    The speedometer and the tachometer always stay in the same guage-face but rotate around each other indiscriminately, as the Scion's dashboard computer sees fit for that particular time? This is turning sort of Japanese video-gamish, sort of like the 2011 Scion FR-S' dashboard, which includes a racetrack layout as sort of a gimmick. :)

    2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS

  • oregonboyoregonboy Posts: 1,653
    edited December 2010
    jeez, man... just google it:

    image

    It's a little weird, but you would probably get used to it in a couple of days.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    Chevrolet to add the Sonic name, drop Aveo on its next subcompact

    Chevrolet will drop Aveo and adopt a new name - Sonic - when its remodeled entry-level subcompact debuts next year.

    Chevrolet and General Motors Co, officials have been considering a name change for the subcompact sedan since October. GM North America President Mark Reuss said confusion over how to pronounce “Aveo” had sparked the desire for a change.

    “The Sonic represents a new beginning for Chevrolet in the small car segment and so we felt it was time to give it a new name,” Chris Perry, head of Chevrolet U.S. marketing, said in a statement today. “The new car is roomy, stylish and fun to drive, and Sonic is a youthful, energetic name that helps convey what this vehicle is about.”


    http://www.autoweek.com/article/20101210/CARNEWS/101219999

    Confusion over how to pronounce the name? Who are they kidding? Could it have ANYTHING to do with the fact that the Aveo was a STUNNINGLY cheap little crapbox from the former Daewoo in Korea?

    So it's another "fresh start" for a Chevy model. We will see what the next one looks like at the Detroit show.....it IS interesting to me personally that they plan to build it in the U.S. though. That will put it in a class of one among subcompacts. There are several Mexican-built subs though.

    And if it holds true up until production, the 500 from Fiat will become the second model in that class.

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • iluvmysephia1iluvmysephia1 Posts: 5,675
    edited December 2010
    thousand words. Or at least 25 or 30 words that really mean anything.

    image

    I've seen bigger reasons than this to turn a particular car model down, for sure, for sure. Seems like it might even be a desirable thing after 10 or 15 trips in the car, eh?

    2008 Mitsubishi Lancer GTS

  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 27,650
    I sort of like that... better than the tach being hidden in a smaller pod, off to the side...

    I like the Porsche way... A big stinking tach, right in the middle... with the speedometer off to the side..

    Speaking of center instruments.... the MINI has that big dog dish speedo in the center of the dash, but some option packages put the tach mounted on the steering column, in front of you, with a digital speedometer readout within the tach dial... I like that the best, I think...

    MODERATOR
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  • michaellnomichaellno Posts: 4,300
    Speaking of center instruments.... the MINI has that big dog dish speedo in the center of the dash, but some option packages put the tach mounted on the steering column, in front of you, with a digital speedometer readout within the tach dial... I like that the best, I think...

    Yep, my daughters' '10 MINI has that setup.

    I suppose you can get used to anything. I've been driving the '06 ION for about 9 months now and am used to the center mounted gauges.

    The problem with the xB, IMHO, is that they went to the 2.4L engine and increased the weight by almost 25% from the previous incarnation, which killed the fuel economy. But, I suspect Toyota was OK with that, as they found that older folks were buying the xB in droves, so more room and more power seemed inevitable.

    nippon - so, at the moment you're rating the Fit #1, Yaris #2, Mazda 2 #3 and the Fiesta #4, correct?
  • crkyolfrtcrkyolfrt Posts: 2,345
    "Confusion over how to pronounce the name? Who are they kidding? Could it have ANYTHING to do with the fact that the Aveo was a STUNNINGLY cheap little crapbox from the former Daewoo in Korea? "

    My thought exactly when i read that garbage. Ya know...it's statements like that that actually give me great pause when considering ANY GM product. (the Cruze being in my sights for its apparent extremely quiet interior and solid but compliant ride)

    I'm sure they consider it marketing (cover your butt) speak, but I consider it DISHONEST. Since those of us in 'the know' are aware of the level of cr&p they were shovelling when they said that, do they honestly expect us to believe anything else that comes out of their mouths or factories? I take that as an INSULT to my intelligence. So much so that I think I will go in and test drive the Cruze and thrash it to within inches of its life, and then go back and park it, never to darken their dishonest doors again.

    Don't these idiots realize that if they try to shovel carp to intelligent people they will retaliate with their wallets? Geez, it is not rocket science. If i were in charge I would FIRE both Mark Reuss AND Chris Perry....oh wait...the first idiot is NA's Pres of GM...so the dishonesty begins right at the top...need I elaborate more?

    Confidence in the new GM? I think NOT..
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    edited December 2010
    I'm happy to be wrong!

    Pic:

    image

    Much better than the xA, but I still don't like the speedo or tach.

    I like it when 60 is top dead center on the speedo, since that's where you often are.

    The tach is entirely too small, call it a half tach, or even a 1/3rd tach.
  • oregonboyoregonboy Posts: 1,653
    edited December 2010
    I find the tach slightly annoying, in that the tach needle and the arc of the markings do not share a common center. How hard could that be to get right? :confuse:

    edit: Actually to REALLY do it right, the tach and speedo would have to share a common center, and that could be tricky.

    Still... not a deal-breaker if I was otherwise interested.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    edited December 2010
    nippon - so, at the moment you're rating the Fit #1, Yaris #2, Mazda 2 #3 and the Fiesta #4, correct?

    Well, evaluating each car individually on its own merits without price as a factor, I would say the order is
    1 Fit
    2 Mazda2
    3 Fiesta
    4 Yaris

    Fiesta would be in the first or second spot for anyone who values either (1) high-quality interior materials and design or (2) a smooth quiet ride over superior handling and being the "driver's car".

    But with price as a factor, Yaris might move up a spot or two. All my earlier comments were taking price into account, and that is specific to this moment: Toyota has an extra $1500 cash back incentive running for 2010 Yarises, of which there are plenty left all around, and dealers are desperate to sell them so they will go $500 below invoice. Yaris with power package at $12K or $12,5 is $2000 below what you could get a comparable Mazda2 for, and a full $3000 below what you could get the comparable Fiesta or Fit (base trim) for. That's a notable difference.

    My dilemma came about because Yaris tricks you a bit - in reality it doesn't really have a trim level to compete with the Fit Sport, Fiesta SES, and Mazda2 Touring. Those are the trim levels I am more interested in, because all of them have tire/wheel/chassis changes from the base trims which improve handling. Yaris does not have such a trim, so its handling is more comparable to the base trims of those models. But when its fully loaded (by Toyota standards, LOL!), it is tempting to believe it has received significant improvements which allow it to compete more with those fully loaded competitors, when in fact the "sport" package for the Yaris is typical Toyota: just a bunch of bolt-on plastic to make it "look sporty".

    Bottom line: Yaris is currently the cheap alternative du jour. A year from now a new Yaris model will have arrived, which should compete much better based on early looks at the new model in the Japanese home market. Unless you are shopping mostly on price, you should ignore Yaris for now, IMHO.

    juice: I will call the xD's a 1/3 tach. ;-)

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Here's a PDF with inventory supply in days as of Dec. 1:

    http://www.autonews.com/assets/PDF/CA71856129.PDF

    1 Fit - 69 days supply
    2 Mazda2 - 275 days (!)
    3 Fiesta - 142 days
    4 Yaris - not listed seperately

    This is good news for you, my friend.

    Check out the Mazda2 - massive oversupply and it's been growing.

    Reading between the lines, this could mean rebates are coming soon. Ideal is about 60 days, so both Ford and Mazda simply ordered too many cars.
  • tifightertifighter WAPosts: 1,367
    Great link, Juice.

    Boy, would I hate to be a Mitsubishi dealer... :sick:
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Look at Saab, also. 2 sales per dealer, for a whole month.

    Are you kidding me? That's one sale every 15 days.

    I'd just close all the time and make it "By Appointment Only". You would only work two days a month!
  • plektoplekto Posts: 3,733
    edited December 2010
    I found that driving a car with nearly the same weight and HP as the Yaris I had to flog the crap out of it every day in 3rd and 4th gear to get up hills and keep from being run over by massive SUVs that would come up on my bumper and get 5ft away as they made obscene gestures at me while laying on their horn. MPG never got above 25 combined as a result, though, yes, it would get well over 30 on the rare long distance drive to San Fransisco.

    Welcome to Los Angeles, I guess. I suppose if you lived in Springfield, Il., you'd be fine with such a pathetic little engine and flimsy construction, but most of the U.S. is just not the place for a Yaris.

    Conversely, my Volvo 240 got 25mpg combined without struggling and was fast enough to keep up with traffic. Sometimes you simply shouldn't get the highest MPG tin can just for the sake of buying a cheap car.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I guess LA is different than DC. DC hates cars, basically. Some NGOs stage protests at stop lights here to ... well, to stop drivers from driving. LOL

    My Garmin is capable of measuring average speed, I should use it for a week of commuting only and see the result - I bet it's well under 25mph.

    Around here I was fine with a 48hp Chevy Sprint in college. A 167hp Miata feels like a muscle car.
  • nippononlynippononly SF Bay AreaPosts: 12,687
    LOL! It is good for me that my experience is so completely night-and-day different from yours, or I never would have kept the Echo (and the various Civics and a CRX before it) all these years.....

    ....and yes, I do drive it around LA when I am there to visit my folks. It spends the rest of its time in the San Francisco area and occasionally in San Diego. ;-)

    2013 Civic SI, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (stick)

  • plektoplekto Posts: 3,733
    Oh wow I feel for you. That piece of junk was only slightly better than a VW Bug. MY "horror story" though was a 1981 Buick Century with that nasty throttle-body injection that never worked right. Basically computer controlled fuel supply to the carbs. If that sounds like a recipe for disaster, it was.

    0-60 was a hopeless 18-20 seconds without power-shifting or abusing the thing to death.(not that that would have helped any, either - maybe save 1-2 seconds)

    Replacing it with a Volvo 164E was fantastic. 50+ more HP and almost twice as fast in every way. 1/4 mile was 19 seconds - it would drag race a quarter mile faster than that Buick could get to 60mph :P
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