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Where Is Ford taking the Lincoln Motor Company?



  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,666
    I don't disagree. But given the neglect at Lincoln it was more important to get the Zephyr out the door quickly to give the dealers something to sell (the LS died earlier than expected).

    The MKS philosophy is better (no shared sheetmetal) but they need to take that into the interior as well with standard Lincoln features like electric tilt/telescope steering wheel. Add Lincoln only drivetrains (like the 3.7L) and I think they've got it.

    And I do think they need a new RWD platform for their flagship, but I think it can coexist with the MKS and appeal to 2 different buyers.
  • And I do think they need a new RWD platform for their flagship, but I think it can coexist with the MKS and appeal to 2 different buyers.

    I agree. They should build a PREMIUM rear drive sedan to compete with the larger BMW and Mercedes models, as well as the Lexus LS and Infinity Q/M 45, Cadillac CTS. And make it truly premium and world-class. A strong V8, sophisticated suspension tuning and steering feel (BMW in the crosshairs here), and no parts bin engineering. Nobody wants to lay out 50 large for a car, and have Fusion switchgear and hard plastics. And offer it with a MANUAL TRANSMISSION! Even if only 10% of the buyers want it, that's still 10% that you might lose to someone who does offer it, and the critics will like it a whole lot more. Even if it's not a volume seller, it would be a "halo car" to give the brand a better image.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    MKS looks pretty good. Make that the Mercury by Ford 500 model, and sell it for $24K with the new V6 and $29K with a V8 and luxo junk added. As for a FWD turned AWD turned Lincoln for anything over $29K, I think not. Drop the Lincoln and Ford car names, go upscale Mercury by Ford. Lincoln dealers now have an upscale Mercury to sell. It's all Ford anyway- a reality check.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    Well you can FORGET it.

    You've just described the Lincoln LS almost to a tee and they just killed that so they could build Mazda and Volvo clones. Forget it, Lincoln is history as a performance oriented luxury brand. I'm finally convinced. Lincoln is the new Oldsmobile.
  • The LS didn't fail Ford, Ford failed the LS.

    It sold very well and was highly praised.
    But Ford did what Ford always does- They neglected it until it's sales withered away and they had an excuse to kill it.
    It's no different than what they almost did with the Mustang in the late 80's, and "successfully" did with the Minivan market, the Focus, the Ranger, the Town car and the Crown Vic.
    Taurus was selling 400k units a year not that long ago- now it's dead. It takes remarkable skill to pull that off!
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    Yes indeed, the new Lincoln is " not your fathers automobile." Recall that stupid Oldsmobile ad which insulted the your fathers choice in a car, which was actually the better car, and did not impress the sons and daughters one bit to buy an Olds. In looking back, I recall a wonderful Olds Cutlass 1972 model family car, with rear wheel drive. Now it was the 1980's with the FWD less than stellar engineered cars thrown together to compete with Japan makes, which they were claiming to be new, better, exciting, reliable, and blah,blah,blah. I beg to differ. I would take the '68 Olds 442 or the '72 Cutlass we owned over the so called modern junk by GM. I do believe these are the days of, " it's not your father's Lincoln " and that is the problem. Weren't those Mark cars hot looking? How about the old Lincolns with the suicide doors? And what happened to the classic look to the Town Car?

    As for the last run Olds, I do like the looks of the last Aurora Euro look last rendition And the original Aurora was perhaps unique enough to be in auto shows within a decade, or less. An interesting looking car.
    Actually, the Intrigue is a better looking car than lots of bland looks presented as Chevy cars.
  • m1miatam1miata Posts: 4,556
    I guess the LS would not be a bad choice in a used car. Have not researched the car all that much however. I recall some years were better than others for reliability -- which if I recall correctly may have been an issue for a couple years.

    It was not bad looking, yet lacked that stand-out look. I bet a design team could have made a new one, with more style presence within a years time and saved this car. Advertising, I always though was rather stupid. And it could have to do with dealerships not being viewed by consumers as knowing a thing about performance cars. Perhaps a new image for dealerships, and two cars with rear wheel drive would have helped. Something like a BMW3 and 5 . Or even the FWD Zepyher is OK for BMW3 competition (yet it FWD???) and then a 5 and 7 sized Lincoln to compete in RWD class. I am afraid this one car at a time does not make a whole.
  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    I love your post and you mae a great arguement. I honestly have to disagree with you on the "This isn't your fathers Lincoln" comment. Now with Olds, you are correct. The new Lincolns exceed anything that Lincoln, has rolled off it's assembly line. I like I said before liked my grandfathers 88' Continental. ;)

  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,120
    True. My father's Oldsmobile was an awesome 1955 Ninety-Eight Starfire convertible and my Uncle Daniel had one of those awesome Continentals. I'll take a nice 1965 Continental over ANY current Lincoln.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 33,509
    I've seen a few new "Emm Kay" commercials over the past couple days. It's just not a good naming convention.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    It's such a GD shame too. Yesterday the heads of the "Big 3" (really isn't it Big 2 and a half?) were meeting with Pres Bush asking for help on health care (gee, I'll take some of that action) etc but they were definitely NOT asking for any bailouts - just ask them.
    Afterwards there was a brief round table of financial type talking heads on Fox news. Amoung the questions put forth by the moderator Cavuto was "Do you think in 5 or 10 years that one or more of these 3 American car companies will be gone?" EVERY ONE of the panelists said YES. In addition, some expressed the opinion that that would be good for America because Toyota would take over and they are bringing jobs TO the USA while the Big 3 are moving jobs OUT of the USA.
    I am truly ashamed of the people that have run the BIG 2.5 into the ground and that includes in a HUGE way the UAW. There is no more free lunch for these people yet they still hang around with their hands out. One of the Detroit stations followed some UAW "Workers" to a bar where they hung out for 4 hours WHILE THEY WERE PUNCHED IN. Think the Nissan workers in Smyrna get away with that?
    The BIG 2.5 say that they spend more money on health care than on steel in the average car and truck. Unreal.
    I have NO health care. I was offered Cobra when they kicked me out to bring in 2 engineers off the boat. Know how much that is for a family of 4? Try almost $1900 a month. Sure, I can afford that with no job.
    Emm Kay My Big Fat A
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,614
    now i kind of understand your venom. i am truly sorry for your situation. i have been somewhat in your shoes years ago.
    here is my perspective on some of the financial woes of the 'domestic' auto manufacturers; those health care benfits they gave workers long ago, along with medical advances, have helped them live much longer than anticipated. now they have to pay pensions longer and pay for higher cost medical expenses longer too.
    i'm not going to condemn a vehicle for that.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    What heyjewel new hero. I like his snarl and bark. This company needs to hear how low low low it has sunk...paying big bucks to b*neheads (this is a family-oriented forum so I am being cautious and careful with namecalling).
  • marsha7marsha7 Posts: 3,666
    All your points are well taken, folks often drive them like idiots...

    My only point was that, as I understand it, there seemed to be a predominance of Expy rollovers with Wilderness tires...whether Ford was wrong to underinflate by 6 psi, or the tires were simply bad, I do not know...

    Obviously, if much fewer rollovers of other brands exist, then driver error becomes the obvious reason...I understood that the Expy/Wilderness combo seemed to have more than just a simple statistical increase in occurrences...
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Central CTPosts: 9,614
    ford sold abut 400,000 explorers for around 10 years. does anyone actually know of anyone having a rollover incident that can be traced to the tires or whatever?
    i had firestones on my expedition and swapped them due to the recall. they looked perfect to me after being taken off the rims. i was happy to be able to put on a set of pirelli scorpions for free. :P
    i traded an explorer with 50k on it for the expedition. the firestones had plenty of tread left on them. just my experience.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,666
    There were blowouts, but the majority of the rollovers that occurred after the blowouts were driver error - jamming on the brakes e.g. And IIRC the blazer had as high if not higher rollover rate compared to the explorer per driven mile.

    Firestone admitted the tires were faulty. Case closed.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    The Wilderness tires were prone to tread separation. Had problems with them on both a Ranger and a Sport Trac.

    Now...where is Ford taking Lincoln? ;)
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    One note to add, I was involved in class action lawsuit a few years ago. Boy those lawyers were gonna 'make em pay' for all the horrible things done to us poor suckers. And guess what? We WON!!! I still have the check for my share. Gonna cash it on a rainy day. It is for $0.87 I am NOT making this up.
    OK, enuf of this. As long as all the lawyers got rich, all's well in the system of AMerican jurisprudence.
  • heyjewelheyjewel Posts: 1,046
    OK, so where is Ford taking Lincoln? Hoo-ah. I think we all know. But what's really interesting is where GM is taking Cadillac and now Chevrolet.
    If you haven't read this week's autoextremist, I urge you to do so. You'll find him having a little fun with what Horbury said last week, mentioning the newest hit in the auto world (the Jeep Wrangler 4 door) and even praising Ford's 'Bold Moves' ad campaing (well, he can't be right ALL the time can he?). But the big news is his small take on the 2008 CTS which he really likes and the BIGGEST news is that Chevrolet will have a real RWD Impala in 2009 and the AE guy thinks it will be a blockbuster hit. ANd who is that going to hurt? Fraid so.
    SO we will have come complete full circle by then. GM will have hopped on the successful Chrysler RWD bandwagon while Ford will be trying to sell it's FWD boring-mobiles. I am sorry, but it looks worse by the day.
  • gregg_vwgregg_vw Posts: 2,415
    But at least we can come here and to the left see the All-New 2006 Lincoln Zephyr (click to build and price). Make an impression!
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