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BMW 335i 2007+

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Comments

  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Ummm, $5,000 for winter rubber and wheels? Where did that number come from?

    I just configured up a mounted set of 225/45 HR17 Michelin Primacy Alpin PA3 tires and 17x7" Sport Edition E2 wheels for $1,040 on the TireRack web site. FWIW, given the price of replacement OEM rubber, I've found that it is actually CHEAPER to run winter tires part of the year (assuming you opt for the Sport Package). After all, every mile driven on the winter set pushes back the time when you'll need to replace the factory tires.

    Case in point, with my 530i SP I managed to (just) go the full three years of my lease on the original tires because of the miles that I didn't put on the factory tires while the winter set was mounted. Given that replacement tires are nearly $900 per set (plus mounting and balancing, figure an even $1,000 for the replacement), one set of those was nearly the same price as the winter set of wheels and tires (which came out to $1,004, including shipping), so on the surface it was a wash, however, after I sent the 5er back I was able to sell the winter set for $400.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    And the $5000+ for the winter rubber & wheels

    We obviously took different math courses in school. As shipo pointed out, a decent set of winter rims are relatively inexpensive. And winter tires are less expensive and generally last longer than high performance summer tires. So alternating to winter tires should actually SAVE you money on tire replacement over the life of the car. Probably enough to pay for the cost of the winter rims, if you plan on keeping the car 100k miles. Not to mention that it would only take one nasty pothole under the snow ruining a low profile factory rim (or two) to put you way ahead.

    I've previously stated my preference for 2wd, for a number of reasons - dry performance/handling, weight, fuel efficiency, etc. But even if I lived in snow country (my former hometown gets 100+ inches annually) and opted for AWD, on a car like the 335ix, I'd still have a winter set of rims and tires. I've seen what happens to low profile aluminum rims in 5+ years of rough winters and it's not pretty.
  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    And the $5000+ for the winter rubber & wheels

    Sounds like a dealer package. For $50 more they kiss you and send flowers the next morning. I can't believe anyone would fall for that.

    And winter tires are less expensive and generally last longer than high performance summer tires. So alternating to winter tires should actually SAVE you money on tire replacement over the life of the car. Probably enough to pay for the cost of the winter rims, if you plan on keeping the car 100k miles.

    Plus, it takes me all of 45 minutes to change over all four wheels. Cake.

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,886
    I'm with you 100% that AWD is pretty much not necessary and that a RWD BMW equipped with a set of winter wheels will go just about anywhere in the inclement weather.

    The few of us enthusiasts out here can't change people's perceptions that they "need" AWD. I've tried to tell friends of mine or people I talk to that a dedicated set of winter tires is the way to go. They look at me like I just tried to explain advanced nuclear astrophysics to them.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    In bumper to bumper traffic on and off the clutch for almost 2 hours waiting to get into Otis AFB for the military air show (Sunday 8/26), the outside temperature read 95 or 96 degrees consistently. The oil temp barely touched 250 degrees. This was excellent news, so far.

    Stop and go traffic in high ambient temperatures isn't much of a test of the N54 engine's cooling system. It has an electric water pump and cooling fan, so coolant flow -as well as air flow through the radiator- are not compromised like they are with an engine driven pump and fan. Spending extended time at higher engine speeds with the turbos dumping additional heat into the system will determine the overall efficiency of the cooling system. I DO know that the 335i drop top(sans oil cooler) that I flogged in the Florida Keys heated up to near 300F fairly quickly. And this was a MT car, which didn't have the added burden of a slushbox dumping additional BTUs into the coolant.

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    The few of us enthusiasts out here can't change people's perceptions that they "need" AWD.

    The owner demographics are also changing- what I call the "wearer to driver" ratio. More and more often I will see a newer BMW(AWD or RWD, it makes no difference) approach a 45 mph "advisory speed" corner at 40 mph- only to brake and slow down even more to negotiate the curve. If you are going to drive like that you might as well buy a Camry or Malibu.

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,886
    I agree with you. but the wearers are a necessary evil if you will. They help pump money back to BMW so BMW can give us enthusiasts real BMWs to drive like the E46 ZHP, ///Motorsport Cars, E39 and E60 5ers with SPorts Packages & stick shifts.

    Unfortunatley not everybody is a car nut like many of us here are.

    Funny you should mention posted advisory speeds. I've actually slowed down my straight highway driving over the last few months due to a few (how shall we say) "discrepencies" with local law enforcement officials. I ended up getting off with 2 verbal warnings. One I actaully was speeding (we have some obscenely low speed limits here in the NYC area), but got let go because my license is 100% clean. The other I was pulled over and profiled because of my car and the manor in which the exhust is modified (I was going 60 in the right lane at the time). But I still rocket around those curves and exit ramps. I take a 25 mph exit ramp (Going from a Northbound highway to an Eastbound highway) going at least 60 every day and a set of 20 mph Ess curves at 60 while staying in the lines without tapping the brakes. In fact my '01 Prelude Type SH with just over 85,000 miles on it still has the original pads and rotors.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    I agree with you. but the wearers are a necessary evil if you will. They help pump money back to BMW so BMW can give us enthusiasts real BMWs to drive like the E46 ZHP, ///Motorsport Cars, E39 and E60 5ers with SPorts Packages & stick shifts.

    I agree, it's a similar situation with Porsche and the Cayenne. Still, the high percentage of wearers can have a negative effect. Remember the E46 over-boosted power steering fiasco? And did you see the recent Roundel column which told how BMW NA was getting dinged on JD Powers surveys because of brake dust on the front wheels?

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,396
    I recently notice that the speed-check police signs they put up on some of the roads here in Central NJ show 5-6MPH less than my '06 330xi speedo. That'll keep me closer to the law now!

    I can do those ramps and Esses 10 mph faster with x-drive...easy....in all conditions! ;)

    JK!

    Regards,
    OW
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,630
    I have to confess that when I see a highly engineered car that is capable of amazing speeds and cornering, being driven like a golf cart on a winding path at a retirement home, it gives me chest pains. :cry:

    MODERATOR --Need help with anything? Click on my name!

  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    I have to confess that when I see a highly engineered car that is capable of amazing speeds and cornering, being driven like a golf cart on a winding path at a retirement home, it gives me chest pains.

    It's not like I expect them to take every corner in a four-wheel drift, but yes, watching them putter along like Aunt Maude in her Roadmaster is just bizarre... :confuse:

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    As many of y'all know I'm relegated to minivandom these days and I too find it highly annoying when I have to slow down (often well below the limit) and follow any car capable of spirited driving through the twisties. I mean come on folks you're driving a 335i SP and I'm driving a nine year old minivan with 150,000 miles on the clock and I have to crawl along because you're too afraid to explore even 2/10s of the limit of your car. :mad:

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • 06ltd06ltd Posts: 25
    I'm sorry. Actually I did understand. It just didn't translate to my keyboard. I changed my order for a 2008 335xi Coupe to a 335i Coupe.
  • roadburnerroadburner Posts: 6,763
    I mean come on folks you're driving a 335i SP and I'm driving a nine year old minivan with 150,000 miles on the clock and I have to crawl along because you're too afraid to explore even 2/10s of the limit of your car.

    The same thing happens to me when I'm driving my TJ Wrangler...
    Unbelievable.

    2009 328i / 2004 X3 2.5/ 1995 318ti Club Sport/ 1975 2002A/ 2007 Mazdaspeed 3/ 1999 Wrangler/ 1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica

  • dhanleydhanley Posts: 1,531
    Yep, i was on the train going home from work recently, and we passed a 997TT who was doing about 45 on the interstate in the right lane. He was on his cell phone. Traffic was doing about 70.

    Wanted to smack him.

    And take his car, of course.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I've heard turbo-charged cars are fragile and break down easily. Keep the speeds down, and temps will remain lower, thereby eliminating the need for a 2 minute cool down at your destination. ;)
  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,886
    Good Point again. The wearers are the ones who probably complained the E36 was too small, with heavy steering, and rough riding suspensions which brought us to the E46 and then to the bloated E90 we have today.

    Those JD power surveys are overrated IMO. If someone has a major complaint (My car wouldn't start 3 days after taking delivery, my tranny failed while I was overtaking an 18 wheeler at 75 mph, I hit the unlock button and my car caught on fire) then it should count against the car. People complain about brake dust, poor fuel economy, and rough riding suspensions on these surveys.

    2001 Prelude Type SH, 2011 Pilot EX-L 4WD, 2015 Subaru Legacy 2.5i Premium

  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,396
    I wonder what the difference the extra "bloat" has vs. driving dynamics between E90/92 and the lighter E46/36.

    I never droves those models but to me the E90 is fantastic. Were the earlier model that much more capable in the handling area? To me, the car feels a little heavy but coming out of large US cars, this car is NOT bloated IMO. More solid is the feeling I can best submit and top class in the suspension feedback.

    My only complaint is the RFT and no dip stick or a complete set of gauges. I did have a major problem with change out of the wiring harness due to malfunctioning air bag/seat belt sensor readings.

    BTW, JD Powers, Consumer Reports, C&D, etc are guides only, IMO. The market goes to what people buy. I believe BMW sales have increased partly due to more affluent buyers being available, partly because the younger, more affluent population gave up on US automotive and perceived/actual quality at MB/Jaguar had problems recently.

    Just my 2 cents. Bottom line, my view is from a different perspective.

    Regards,
    OW
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,562
    I test drove a new 2007 335 Sedan this week. Comments below.

    Questions first:

    Q1 - Comfort Access = $500 to NOT have to insert the key?
    And that's all?

    Q2 - Run flats.
    The example I drove happened to have an aftermarket 19” custom wheel \ tire “package” installed. This was the only Sport, Premium, Step available at that particular moment. Since I have not driven a 335 with the Sport package and either the ‘standard’ 17” wheel \ tire package, nor the optional 18s, I will limit my comments regarding ride quality.

    So, my question is: How do the ‘standard’ 17” and 18” runflat tires & wheels handle harsh conditions – for example, poorly patched or broken pavement, abrupt transitions such as concrete road seams, etc?

    [ Q2.1 - And who handles a tire issue – a tire dealer or a BMW dealer? ]

    Q3 – RPM at cruise.
    I have a somewhat irrational ( but very strongly held ) preference for the feeling of effortlessness I sense when I can cruise at high ( but at least semi-legal ) velocity at very low RPM.
    I had no opportunity during this brief test drive to spend any time at my typical open road cruising speeds – 70 to 80 MPH.
    My calculations indicate that with the Step, 70 MPH would require approx. 2300+ RPM and 80 would be almost 2700 RPM.
    [ My Corvette shows approx. 1550 RPM at 70. ]

    Question: Is this what you 335 Step. owners are seeing for RPM at cruise?

    Thanks in advance!!

    Brief background \ Context, before my comments:
    My current Daily Driver is a 2007 Corvette w/six speed automatic & paddles on the steering wheel – very similar ( visually ) to the BMW’s paddle shifters.

    My local dealer has been hounding me to drive a new 335 sedan – and had one equipped roughly as I would buy one, meaning Step, Sport, Premium, and a couple of other items. So, I drove it.

    I was impressed. As has been well documented, the 300\300 HP\TQ rating is clearly ( um ) not accurate. Even with my sales dweeb as ballast ( 180#s or so, I’d guess ) to deal with, the 335’s acceleration impressed me. Driving as I typically would, with the sunroof in the vent position, I found the minimal engine noise & subtle but melodic exhaust sound quite enjoyable.

    Coming from my Corvette, rated at 400\400 for HP\TQ and with a curb weight around 3300#s, and the 335 weighing closer to 3600 & saddled with a 5% handicap here ( the additional weight of my ‘Client Advisor’ in the right seat ) I was all the more impressed with the throttle response & quickness. This engine is a masterpiece. I had high expectations for this aspect of the car’s performance - and they were met.

    The Steptronic \ automatic was the other key aspect I was interested in evaluating in my test drive. The primary irritations I have with my Corvette ( and I am very happy with it, overall ) center on the behavior of the automatic transmission. Primarily an inconsistent pause \ lag between request for an upshift or downshift via the paddles and the beginning of the actual shift execution. The shifts themselves are reasonably quick. Secondarily, there is no throttle blip or ‘rev match’ on downshifts. ( Or at least a poor execution of this very good idea. And yes, I did know that before buying the Corvette. Sigh. )

    In my relatively brief test drive of a 335, the Step has an almost immediate & seemingly quite consistent response to both up & downshifts via the paddles. And there is a good execution of the ‘rev match’ on downshifts. Each of the shifts was quick - but smooth. Lived up to me ( high ) expectations.

    The BMW paddle shift operation for the Steptronic happens to be the reverse of what makes sense to me & what I have now driven for something like 45,000 miles, in various sports cars & sedans. Old dog here – who would have to un-learn & re-learn. Oh, well . . .

    I was also particularly impressed with the low RPM torque that the 335’s TT motor exhibits. I enjoy an exhilarating run to the red line ( when road conditions & traffic safely allow ) but in more typical driving, I also find low RPM torque & flexibility very useful & attractive as well. I did not note any turbo lag in my driving. The previous couple of 330’s I have driven were somewhat lacking in this area. The 335 has addressed this very well indeed.

    I never even attempt to approach any car’s handling \ cornering limits on public roads, and certainly did not stress this 335, but the handling certainly felt secure – the steering accurate & pleasantly weighted. The ride was generally very good ( see above re: wheels & tires ) with mostly well damped vertical motions & little side-to-side movement, though I was not on truly challenging surfaces for most of the drive.

    I had planned to drive a new Caddy CTS after finishing at the BMW dealer. But after driving the 335, I just did not see the point. It seemed clear that the 304 HP V6 in the Caddy ( TQ = 270-something ) pushing over 3800#s would never be able to impress me, at least when directly & immediately compared to the BMW. 14.6 at 97 ( manual trans. 2008 CTS, tested by C+D ) is not likely to feel nearly as quick as a ( mid-13 second @ 100+ ) 335.

    Just did not seem fair to the Caddy.

    Just my 0.02 gallons worth . . .
    - Ray
    Comprehensively impressed.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    I have a somewhat irrational ( but very strongly held ) preference for the feeling of effortlessness I sense when I can cruise at high ( but at least semi-legal ) velocity at very low RPM.

    I think you need to exorcise yourself of that "very strongly held" preference, at least if you are going to consider cars that are more precisely engineered for performance than GM.

    Your Corvette that lugs along at 1,550 rpms at 70 mph can only do so because Chevy's single minded approach to performance: add more cubic inches and torque. That Corvette can't possibly hit redline in 6th or even 5th gear. It is NOT a transmission or gearing ratio strategy that BMW, Porsche or even Honda engineers would ever consider worthy of imitation. Porsche gets similar or better acceleration out of 355hp/295 ft lbs of torque as Chevy does out of 400/400 in a lighter car. And the 911S, running at 2,700 rpm at 70 mph still turns out 27+ mpg on the highway. It's top speed of 182 comes precisely at 7,100 rpm (redline 7,200) in 6th gear. It's geared absolutely perfectly for maximum performance out of 3.8 liters. You can say you have a strongly held preference for 1,500 rpm at highway speeds, but it's simply done by GM to try to coax a decent EPA rating out of a oversized, underachieving 6.0 liter GM engine. And how did they refine it for 2008? They made it a 6.2 liter engine. Duh.

    So, if the 335i impresses you, I suspect at least part of that is due to BMW's affection for quality and precision. I've seen it written that the "right" RPM's for a precisely engieered high performance engine to be running at 70+ mph highway speeds is roughly 35% of redline, and that they should be able to approach 90-95% of redline in top gear. And sure enough, everything from the Ferrari 430, 911, M3, and even my former Honda S2000 are right in that ballpark. Maybe BMW's use of twin turbos on the 335i changes that formula, but one thing is for sure, the Corvette transmission is not remotely close to "precise". And if it weren't for all of its 6+ liters, it wouldn't be able to keep up with that 2.0 liter Honda.
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    Wow! :surprise: I can only imagine how you feel about the Viper. And all the Mercedes AMG cars would probably receive a severe lambasting from you. :sick:

    But you do know the Z06 revs out to (I think) 7200, don't you? And it tops out at redline. There are plenty of videos to attest to that on YouTube and Streetfire.
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,562
    "I think you need to exorcise yourself of that "very strongly held" preference, at least if you are going to consider cars that are more precisely engineered for performance than GM. "

    Thanks...
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    A1 - If you think that's bad, try paying $1,000 for the exact same thing in the 5-series! :mad:

    A2 - I drove a 335i w/ Sport that had the RFT and didn't see what the big deal was. The previous 330i SP had some noisy RFTs (drove that one, too), but the issue has been remedied.
    A2.1 - It should be the dealer, but most of the time they tell you to contact the tire manufacturer yourself.

    A3 - Keep in mind your Vette has a 6th gear as tall as a skyscraper and torque all over the place. It doesn't need to be wound up like a top like the "precision engineered" engines from other manufacturers (that are half the size or smaller and consume just as much fuel; precision engineering at its finest.)
  • cdnpinheadcdnpinhead Forest Lakes, AZPosts: 3,305
    ". . .major complaint (My car wouldn't start 3 days after taking delivery, my tranny failed while I was overtaking an 18 wheeler at 75 mph, I hit the unlock button and my car caught on fire) then it should count against the car. People complain about brake dust, poor fuel economy, and rough riding suspensions. . ."

    A-bloody-men!!

    Faults that render the car: 1) immobile, 2) really uncomfortable (window falls down & won't come up in Phoenix in the summer) or 3) not 100% functional in all areas at all times should definitely be weighted differently . . . but they're not.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 45,630
    I sure hope the person who attempts to rev out a new Corvette to redline in 6th gear knows what the hell they are doing behind the wheel! :shades: I think, if you remain alive, you'll blow that motor doing that.

    MODERATOR --Need help with anything? Click on my name!

  • circlewcirclew Posts: 8,396
    Habitat1, excellent post...and that's why Cadillac will never really have a precision-tuned offering any time in the next 20 years anywhere near 335-caliber!

    It's like you said over on the Porsche forum...'Vette = sledge hammer, Porsche = scalpel. I would add to that Caddy = rubber mallet!

    Regards,
    OW
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    But you do know the Z06 revs out to (I think) 7200, don't you? And it tops out at redline. There are plenty of videos to attest to that on YouTube and Streetfire.

    Try that again? Using 1,550 rpm for 70 mph, redline in 6th gear would be a mere 325 mph. :surprise: About 140 faster than it's actual top speed, which, if I'm not mistaken is redline in 4th gear. 5th and 6th gears in the Corvette are virtually useless except for eeking out an extra 1-2 mpg on the highway and lowering the decible level.

    As for lambasting the Viper, I don't honestly know what the gearing is. But it does appear to use the "super sized" sledgehammer approach to engineering as well.

    AMG cars get a limited free pass from me. They will never will be my cup of tea, but if you want 700 ft lbs of torque in your family sedan or 2.5 ton SL65, who am I to argue. What I did ascertain, however, is that even the SLK55 wasn't half the real sports car of my former Honda S2000. Automatic only, a slow shifting 5 speed slushbox and an extra 600+ lbs of dead weight made for a very underwhelming drive. Even the owner of my Acura/Mercedes dealership drives, of all things, a Porsche Cayman S.
  • habitat1habitat1 Posts: 4,282
    I would add to that Caddy = rubber mallet!

    Addition accepted. ;)
  • tayl0rdtayl0rd Posts: 1,938
    ... Using 1,550 rpm for 70 mph, redline in 6th gear would be a mere 325 mph. ... 5th and 6th gears in the Corvette are virtually useless except for eeking out an extra 1-2 mpg on the highway and lowering the decible level. ...

    Don't forget about Cd. And on an episode of Top Gear a couple of weeks ago on BBC America (YAAAAYYY! We finally got it!!), the tall guy whose name escapes me right now for some reason, went from a dead stop all the way to 170MPH in 5th gear in a Z06 and was still accelerating when he hit the brake point down the runway. I'd love to see a 335i or Porsche do that.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Don't know about the Porsche, however, the 335i is governed to a top speed in the 150 mph range.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
This discussion has been closed.