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Chevrolet Malibu vs. Toyota Camry vs. Honda Accord

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Comments

  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    You just said that Toyota is a inferior company. So I sure hope you didn't buy a Toyota SUV.
  • bvdj84bvdj84 Posts: 1,721
    I think your statement nailed the point exactly!! A company has the right to pick and choose the best parts for its products. The issue with GM, is that it seems to be picked sub par parts that do not last as long.

    Then again, the New Accord seems to be having brake wear issues and VCM issues. Perfect? No! Not at all! The Camry has cheap interior parts? Good choice for Toyota? No!

    GM to start picking better, quality part, than you could perhaps see a much better product that lasts longer. Holds better value!
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,371
    I disagree that GM picked subpar parts. I doubt that Honda says to a supplier that they want the subpar parts for their brakes on Accord. I doubt that Toyo says they want subpar parts for the electronic drive-by-wire system on their Camry and others that give them unintended acceleration.

    Catalytic converters may have a failure rate that is low and occasionally one fails early, much like automatic transmissions. But as most auto mechanics taking calls on radio auto repair shows here say, "Catalytic converters don't commit suicide, they usually are murdered."
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    I think the bottom line is EVERY car dealer I have ever drove by has a fairly large garage with a bunch of stalls and I bet they aren't all just doing oil changes. So no matter what car you buy there is always that chance that something will go wrong or there wouldn't be garages. G.M. can't be to bad as they have out sold Toyota and Honda every year but one.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    There are many factors that go into the decision to buy this or that part. Failure rate, cost, and the company behind the part. Sometimes, a company will knowingly use an inferior part, because of it's association with that company (Delphi), or because of lower costs. If you want to sell your car for less, you have to get the parts for less.
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    thats a bunch of BS that GM didn't use substandard parts; why the heck to you think that both GM and Chrysler had to declare bankruptcy and Ford did not; thats one of the many reasons why GM was in the crap hole that they are in, because they used cheap parts, etc to build their cars; its because GM and Chrysler lived in stupidity and denial for years that there was a problem with the quality, reliability, and resale value of their vehicles

    thats why every GM car I had that I had to take in and get major mechanical and engine parts replaced at 3-4 years old, the service people and advisers acted as if it was normal wear and tear on a car and IT'S NOT- it was utter denial of a problem

    Ford saw many years before GM and Chrysler did that their products were of poor quality and reliability and started making plans and objectives to turn their company around ahead of time, unlike GM and Chrysler, and thus they didn't need a bailout through bankruptcy

    Hopefully, though with GM they eventually will be able to make a turn around by shrinking their product lines and getting the message to build better quality and more reliable cars - only problem is it is going to take another 5-10 yrs to see if GM really is on the right track because they only just recently restructured in the last 2 years so its going to be a wait and see game if their products remain reliable and hold their value in 4-5 years from now! hopefully, they will! if the new Buick lacrosse and Cadillac products are an indication of their change then GM is heading in the right direction for sure!
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    and your expertise in this matter is? For a company that is so bad as you think and thinking is cheap and so is talk when you can't back it up, anyway then why is G.M. still selling more cars than Toyota. Toyota had a fluke and out did them just barely one year but even in bankruptcy they still out sold Toyota. I also find it funny their poorly made cars still keep showing up in the J.D. Powers and even CP has shockingly made good comments on some of their vehicles. You can talk the talk but you still can't back any of it up like why does G.M. out sell Toyota who is supposedly one of the best even though they have what recalled now over 6 million vehicles with frames rusting out on their trucks in which this is the 2nd time plus gas pedal problems. I'd think they would have learned their lessons the first time on frame rust but I'd take a bad convertor on a G.M. car anyday before I'd want a rusted out frame. At least I can still safely drive it. But no one will convince you otherwise because of some bad experiences with G.M. which I'm sure was all their fault and you did nothing to help cause any of those problems. :sick:
  • vanman1vanman1 Posts: 1,397
    "thats a bunch of BS that GM didn't use substandard parts; why the heck to you think that both GM and Chrysler had to declare bankruptcy and Ford did not; thats one of the many reasons why GM was in the crap hole that they are in, because they used cheap parts, etc to build their cars; its because GM and Chrysler lived in stupidity and denial for years that there was a problem with the quality, reliability, and resale value of their vehicles"
    ---------------------------------------------------

    "Substandard Parts" have virtually zero to do with GM/Chrysler bankruptcy. To say so is pure ignorance. Every company has part failures and design flaws, look at Toyota recalling millions and million of cars right now to replace gas pedals and many people think there is also a problem with the computer that controls the acceleration.
  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    Substandard may be too harsh a word, but many D3 cars seemed inferior a few years ago. The interiors just felt cheap and it seemed like you had more problems in the 50-60K mileage range than on some of the better imports. I think D3 had too much focus on cost cutting in both engineering and purchasing. I think some of the new models are getting much more comparable though, although it will take a few years to know for sure I guess. Chrysler/GM BK had a lot of factors, but undesirable and unreliable cars were part of the equation in my opinion.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    "......"Substandard Parts" have virtually zero to do with GM/Chrysler bankruptcy. "

    AND, the lack of substandard parts have even LESS to do with Ford not declaring bankruptcy. Smarty, did you realize that Ford is living on a $39 Billion LINE OF CREDIT???
  • I'll agree with some of the substandard parts statements. Having owned both a 1991 K1500 and a 1997 Blazer, things were breaking before each vehicle had either 70,000 miles or before they were six years old.

    Both vehicles had alternator failures as well as transmission issues. Every 6 months something was guaranteed to break, whether is was the cruise control, rear differential (costly), egr valve, maf sensor, and the list goes on. The K1500 cost me dearly out of pocket while the Blazer had an extended warranty, but I never got a loaner.

    Needless to say, the Blazer and K1500 went and I bought an Accord and 4Runner. The Accord has had three window switches replaced in 11 years and the 4Runner in six years has had two repairs, one major, and all those repairs were under warranty. Not a single issue since the warranty expired. I won't consider GM at this time, even though I have a buncha GM Card dollars. Otoh, two of my brothers are sold on GM as their most dependable vehicle. One brother has a 2007 Malibu that been problem free, and he commutes 800 miles weekly to work and back.

    Last but not least, no one year old cat converters should be failing. They're built the way they're engineered, so if they're failing then GM engineers are the cause. Rarely are failing parts not built to specs, and if they are, they're usually recalled.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    and the only reason G.M. had to file is because of what the banks/markets did to the credit and everything else in this country. They weren't the only ones in trouble. If you would have bother to read the papers or watch TV Toyota, Honda and most other auto companies lost many many billions too. And as I read it the government of Japan helped out some of their companies but being everyone seems to want to pick on G.M. it wasn't front page news. Only lately have the newspapers starting putting all the Toyota crap on the front page where it should have been for years. At least G.M. has never hid/lied to the American people on problems with their vehicles like Toyota has. How many top level execs got fired from Toyota a few years ago for the coverups of defects? Yes you may have had some problems with your G.M. vehicles but what makes you think their isn't problems with your [non-permissible content removed] vehicle. You don't know cause you can't depend on them being truthful with you.
  • cooterbfdcooterbfd Posts: 2,770
    Hey dude, I think you replied to the wrong post. I'm with you 100%
  • A few points, the 04 Malibu did not have a power steering pump, they are electric assist steering, (unless you bought a "classic" style 'Bu). Also the Cat converter is warrantied till 8 years/80K per federal emissions law and is a free replacement for any brand of vehicle. Did you even do ANY maintenance on these cars or just put in gas and drove, you don't seem too mechanically inclined at all..
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    it was a classic for your information and your comment is unwarranted when you don't know the information; I keep all maintenance records and have all the tires and oil stuff done regularly on my cars and make sure the usual stuff at the 15k, 30k, etc mile intervals is all done

    no matter how hard I maintained my vehicles and kept them clean (ie washed them like a religion) I still had to bring them in or have them towed to the dealerships when things went wrong (at 3 and 4 years old)

    have done the same maintenance work done on my Japanese vehicles, two of which are almost 6 years old now and neither have had to be brought in to the dealership or BE TOWED into the dealership for any kind of work other than normal maintenance items

    I need to say this because people like you and dmathews will make some point to say that I'm saying all Japanese cars don't have problems, and I'M NOT!!!
  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    and the only reason G.M. had to file is because of what the banks/markets did to the credit and everything else in this country

    That was a factor, but poor product, overextended dealerships, overpaid employees, lack of management vision, etc.all increased the demand for cash flow making them more susceptible than some other firms.

    At least G.M. has never hid/lied to the American people on problems with their vehicles like Toyota has

    Hmm, I recall having an undisclosed Chevette tranny in a V8 Monte Carlo that was not disclosed until they got caught. Then there was the plastic manifolds on the 3.8L V6 that only got stepped up to after threats of litigation and exposed publicity. Don't kid yourself, companies from everywhere will try to hide potentially high cost problems if they can get away from it.
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    thats not the reason GM had to file you fool; every car manufacture was hit hard and had terrible sales from the end of 2008 to the middle of 2009, even the Japanese automakers took huge hits in sales compared to years before the recession hit so using the credit market and economy for GM's bankruptcy and gov't bailout is just unture

    you know why GM and Chrysler had to file for bankruptcy, its because of their lies and half-truths to the American people for almost 30 years saying they products were well made and reliable cars when in fact they were not (THIS IS PRE-2008) GM and Chrysler top level managment didn't want to listen to the American people and focused on making huge gas guzzling SUV's that no one wanted when gas hit over $4 gallon and they just sat on their lots; the Japanese companies started planning fuel efficient vehicles many years ago and decreased their SUV and minivan productions at the time gas hit record high numbers and they never suffered the sales loss that GM and Chrysler did

    I never heard of Toyota, Honda, Nissan, or Mazda getting money from Japan when sales were tanked last year and in 2008 - you give me the link to the article that says that; I didn't here Ford, Toyota, Honda, etc whining like GM and Chrysler were for gov't money to keep them a float; and then to have their top execs each fly on their own personal jets while their companies were tanking to go to a meeting in DC to request tax-payer money was simply outrageous and just shows the disconnect between GM and Chrysler exec management and the American public- that kind of mentality is what got them into a bankruptcy situation not the economy- plus I don't know what cool-aid your drinking but Toyota beat GM for #1 in global sales for 2009 and 2008 so this idiotic idea that GM is selling more than Toyota still is a fantasy in your head!

    I think there was a reason why the top five vehicles traded into the cash for clunkers program were GM, Ford, and Chrysler vehicles while the most bought cash for clunker vehicles were Toyota's and Honda's - if that doesn't show what the country as a majority is saying with the car they prefer I don't know what does

    You can trash talk Toyota all you want to me and to everyone else about defects (which I admit was wrong for them to cover up), quality, problems, etc but there is a reason why the Camry has been the top leading mid-size sedan in the US for the last 10 years

    Oh and I know there are not problems with my [non-permissible content removed] vehicles, as you put them, because I'm coming up on 6 years with two of them and have never had to bring them in or have them towed into the dealership for anything like I did on my GM vehicles at the 6 year mark; all I have to do is normal maintenance on them and I have peace of mind!
  • vanman1vanman1 Posts: 1,397
    Toyota received aid from the Japanese government in the spring of 2009. Honda and Toyota have both received billions in development money to build hybrids.

    Anyone who thinks the Japanese do not help their auto industry have no clue.

    Further... Toyota is no better than the big three with recalls. They hide them well and seem to get a free pass from the press because of their past quality but they are a for profit corporation just like any other. Nothing more.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    I never said they didn't do stupid things, I said they did not lie. You know, deny it when presented with the facts until things became so overwelming they had no choice. Does sludge bring up any memories?
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    That's exactly my point you said GM never lied or hid things from the public and they most certainly did; listen I'm tired of this argument, your just as hypocritical in your remarks as you say I am so just forget about it, its not worth it; if your happy with your vehicle and I'm happy with mine that's all that matters

    For the last freakin time, I never have nor do I currently own a Toyota; I've heard some Toyota people talk about the sludge and others say its not true if you use the right oil, I have no idea because I DON'T HAVE A TOYOTA!
  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    I never said they didn't do stupid things, I said they did not lie

    I dunno - the dealer assured me I had the proper tranny. It wasn't until I received federal court documents telling me I had a Chevette tranny in a large V8 engine and was entitled to extended warranty coverage that I found out the truth. GM didn't notify me, nor the dealer. I'm not looking to pound GM, nor defend Toyota, but hiding something to me is the same as lying. I learned long ago not to totally trust any company, domestic or foreign. As for Toyota, I think they were dumb and totally mishandled this UA problem initially. If they had been more forthright they would have avoided a lot of the fallout, just like when GM put Chevy engines in Oldsmobiles and ended up having to issue customer checks after states attorneys got involved. That was 'lying" in my opinion, GM got caught and it cost them. They tried to pass off a different engine than advertised.
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    Couldn't agree more with you, no matter what auto manufacture you deal with whether it is GM, Ford, Toyota, Hyundai, etc they all are out to make tons of money and screw over the customer at any opportunity

    A great example of this, I used to buy many years ago an extended warranty which of course the salesman said would cover anything once the factory warranty ended after 3 or 4 years; extended warranties are nothing but another way for the auto manufacture to hose more money out of the customer that you won't get back when you do have problems; consistently, once I was out of factory warranty the dealerships always came back when something was wrong and said, "oh that isn't covered under the extended warranty because its normal wear and tear"

    I had that excuse given to me time and time again by the service department and unless your a skilled mechanic, which most people are not, like myself, you have to take the dealership for their word and how do you know something wore out normally or if it failed prematurely - its all a bunch a BS the dealerships dish out to get more money out of you; suffice it to say I stopped buying extended warranties 20 years ago
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Could someone direct me to the real car comparison thread?
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    I'd love to compare the 2010 Accord, Camry, and Malibu, here is my ranking for various categories: realize these are highly subjective, have seen enough on the road and sat and driven each one so can make a pretty educated guess to rankings

    Exterior: Malibu > Camry > Accord
    Interior: Accord > Malibu > Camry
    Ride Quality: Camry > Malibu > Accord
    Seat Comfort: Camry > Malibu > Accord
    Resale Value: Accord > Camry > Malibu
    MPG: Malibu = Camry > Accord
    Technology Options: Accord > Camry > Malibu
    Turning Radius: Camry > Accord > Malibu
    Price: Camry > Malibu > Accord
    Trunk Room: Malibu > Camry > Accord
  • chuck1919chuck1919 Posts: 176
    Re: Price - You will get it back on the Accord at resale time...no doubt.
  • smarty666smarty666 Posts: 1,503
    agreed, the price cat I gave really is just the total cost (msrp) on the window sticker and doesn't really mean anything, the residual value cat I put the accord at the top for that reason since Acura and Honda have won the last two years in a row highest resale value
  • berriberri Posts: 4,234
    Re: Price - You will get it back on the Accord at resale time...no doubt

    Gotta be careful here - if Honda and Toyota keep cutting back on quality some of that premium is going to start going away down the road. Also, you've got to look at net out of pocket sale price versus trade in down the road when you calculate depreciation. Publications can't really do that when they calculate it because everyone pays a different price, so they have to use sticker. Incidently, just got an email from my dealer telling me Honda will double incentives for current Honda owners through the end of the month.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Gotta be careful here - if Honda and Toyota keep cutting back on quality some of that premium is going to start going away down the road.

    I don't see any cut back in quality. My 03 Accord has been just as good (better in many ways) as my 92 Accord was. I got $5,000 for the 12 year old 92, with 140k miles on it (private party). I see the 03 holding it's value just as well.

    Incidently, just got an email from my dealer telling me Honda will double incentives for current Honda owners through the end of the month.

    If you can get one for less than MSRP, that also helps the resale value. A win+win.
  • dmathews3dmathews3 Posts: 1,739
    If you can get one for less than MSRP, that also helps the resale value. A win+win.
    Only if you were lucky enough to buy yours with the big rebates. Those that didn't take a big hit when they sell it as incentives and cheap fleet sales are what kills the resale of a car, something G.M. has finally found out and has cut way back on.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    The Accord has lower fleet sales than just about any other midsize car. They always loose the sales title to Camry, but I think Toyota sells just enough to fleets, to stay ahead. Most Accord buyers are repeat buyers, and that says a lot about how satisfied the owners are.
This discussion has been closed.