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What to expect from the next model year Prius

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Comments

  • orangelebaronorangelebaron Posts: 435
    I'll troll all I want.
    "due consideration"... excuse me?
    I'm not allowed to point out the shortcomings of the Prius?
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    ... here's a thread from an other site with some good and accurate info on the changeover from Gen 2 to Gen 3.

    http://priuschat.com/forums/2009-toyota-prius/47621-putting-speculation-rest-200- 9-carryover-2008-confirmed.html#post621530

    Expect the Gen 3 to arrive here summer 2009 as a 2010 model.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Well speaking of shortcomings...

    The EPA numbers are out for the Jetta Diesel ...
    .. it's 2nd rate as compared to the Prius and HCH,
    .. plus diesel is significantly more expensive than gas,
    .. plus the pricing is likely to be at or above the hybrid models
    .. plus it's a VW with all of VW's baggage to drag around.

    But it probably drives better ( :lemon: ), woo hoo.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,681
    I'm not allowed to point out the shortcomings of the Prius?

    I thought you were spot on. All common complaints from owners. Handling in the wind is a biggie for me. I see them crawling along at 45 MPH to keep them on the highway when the wind blows across Interstate 8 here in San Diego. They seem to be a good city runabout, though kind of expensive.
  • Not to mention the safety concerns of low-rolling resistance tires.

    I've recently seen 2 Prii lose control on straight, flat, 4-lane highways in the rain at the speed limit and walled it into a concrete barrier. No other cars seemed to mind the invisible forcefield that causes Prii to spontaneously hydroplane.

    I'd never stick my family in a car with low-rolling resistance tires. Wet, dry or cold. You can't put a price on safety.

    If you choose to drive alone in a Prius because money is more important than health and safety, so be it. But do your loved ones a favor and keep the Outback or buy a Jetta.

    Accident avoidance is improved with better handling and tires. 'Safe happens' in a Jetta, but not in a Prius from what I've seen.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,681
    Sounds to me like damage control... :shades:

    Don't worry. People that buy Prius are not worried about how the vehicle handles. I don't even see them being cross shopped by VW buyers. Look out if they ever bring the Rabbit TDI to the USA. Or the One series BMW diesel. Then the Prius will have some good competition at the pump. Until then you got a captive market, courtesy of the EPA and CARB.

    PS
    I forgot the Accord diesel that was just tested and got 53 MPG highway.
  • sharon22sharon22 Posts: 28
    Went on the Informed for Life site and they indicate the '05 Subaru Outback has an overall score of 92 and the '08 Prius an overall score of 79.1. The lower score indicates the vehicle would be safer in their estimation. Can you clarify why they are saying the Prius is safer than an Outback? I have an Outback, but am on the waiting list for a Prius.
  • Clearly because either they can't do math or because you are quoting the numbers wrong. Or they used some useless statistics.

    Because they clearly are not using the NHTSA 4-star frontal crash rating to say that the Prius is safer than the 5-star Subaru Outback. You know, Subaru, the only company in which every model has been an IIHS Top Safety Pick.

    And if you've bought that the Prius is safer than the Outback, I have some ocean property in Arizona I'll sell you at a discount. Does the Prius still have Drum Brakes in the rear?

    Slippery tires, midevil brakes, gets loose in crosswinds because of bad aerodynamics. And a lower safety rating from the reputable source, NHTSA.

    I was referring specifically to you for keeping the Outback. If you think fuel is more important than family, you go right ahead and pick up the Prius. Thanks for playing.
  • Yup I just checked that site and those number are arbitrary. But you were clearly too enamoured with the Prius to see that. Is this your website?

    The Prius gets 4-stars for the front, but they get the same points as the Outback's 5-stars.

    For side impact, the Prius' 4.5 stars gets less points than the Outback's 5-stars.

    What the heck? Shouldn't the Prius have scored higher (worse) in both cases?

    They scored the same 4-stars for rollover rating, but again the Prius gets fewer points. What the heck?

    Any more rubbish sites that 'prove' the Prius is safer? Because logic dictates otherwise.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    God doesn't anyone read the specs before posting... Low Rolling Resistance Tires... LMAO!!

    Golly Gee you're only 6-1/2 years out of date!!!!! You do realize that since the Gen2 came out there are no such thing as LRRT's on any of the OEMs. How can you make a post like that based on completely inaccurate data? Pretty soon it will be 2004 and you can bring yourself up to date.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,719
    "You do realize that since the Gen2 came out there are no such thing as LRRT's on any of the OEMs."

    I'm following this thread with interest. If the tires are not LLRT, then would it not be WORSE for the Prius, since there must be some other explanation why there have been reports of crosswind handling?

    The LLRT would be easily fixed... :confuse:
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    God again you're using an outdated source when discussing the crash tests.

    This time however you're 30+ years behind the times. The NHTSA tests are about to be changed at their own initiative because they themselves did a study last year and came to the conclusion that their own tests indicated .... NOTHING!!!

    They stated on the Safercar.gov website that they had last made adjustments to the tests in the 70s and 80s and their own tests were outdated. The statement that they made was that there was little correlation between their own tests and real world situation. Too many people were getting hurt/killed by supposedly 'safe' vehciles. They solicited comments from the public for ways to improve the 'predictability' of the tests. Essentially the rest of the world and the IIHS all do the tests one way while the NHTSA does it another way.

    If you buy cars or make decisions on the NHTSA ratings you are putting yourself at risk.....at their own admission. But continue on in your darkness. It's great to be 30 yrs out of date.

    Here for example are the 'real' crash test ratings for these types of cars.

    http://www.iihs.org/ratings/summary.aspx?class=40
  • Golly Gee you're only 6-1/2 years out of date!!!!! You do realize that since the Gen2 came out there are no such thing as LRRT's on any of the OEMs. How can you make a post like that based on completely inaccurate data? Pretty soon it will be 2004 and you can bring yourself up to date.

    Really? Because I thought that the Yukon Hybrid was NEW for 2008.

    Like other hybrids, the Tahoe and Yukon are equipped with regenerative brakes that capture energy normally wasted during braking and use it to recharge the battery. A new air-conditioning unit requires less power and thus uses less fuel. And Tahoe Hybrid rides on lightweight aluminum wheels with tires that have low rolling resistance.

    Go ahead and LYAO as you shoot yourself in the foot.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    The OEM tires used on the Prius are Goodyear Integrity which are the same tires used on the Corolla and Civic and millions of other small cars with 15" wheels.

    Now the wind buffeting is a minor issue but it is noticable because of the design of the high profile and relatively narrow wheelbase. It's not a huge issue but it's there nonetheless. It's one of the reasons I believe that the new Gen 3 next summer will a little lower, wider and longer.
  • You don't make any sense.

    If you claim NHTSA is out of date, but that IIHS does it differently, yet both agree that Subaru tops the list for all models.

    Lets see this Safecar.gov quote that all CURRENT government ratings are useless. Why are YOU quoting data from the 70's and 80's and saying I'm 30-years behind? They said no such thing in their 2005-2009 Plan,

    Through the combined efforts of NHTSA, Congress, states, local law enforcement, public safety groups and industry, the nation has made major strides in reducing fatalities and injuries in motor vehicle crashes.

    An effective way to help consumers enhance the market for safety is to provide them with more comparative vehicle safety information, including crash test ratings and available safety features. Increasingly, consumers are demanding such information and are basing their purchasing decisions on it.


    So what exactly are you basing your safety assumptions on? The Informed for Life site claimed to use both NHTSA and IIHS government ratings, but in the end, they clearly just picked their own numbers.

    Are you defending drum brakes as the epitomy of safety? Do all Toyotas come with standard 4-wheel ABS yet? I know in 2005 only the fronts were standard, with others moving to 4-wheel disk/ 4-wheel antilock long before them.

    The only company I know that is behind the times on safety is Toyota. Even if they fixed the problem, they leave a foul taste in my mouth.

    Clearly it is useless to argue against the propaganda minister in his own forum. It is clear that you have a predisposition to argue in favor of the Prius in spite of all available evidence.
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,719
    "The only company I know that is behind the times on safety is Toyota. I'm sorry if I don't forget as easily as you that Toyota is willing to sacrifice people to sell cars. Just to remind everyone;

    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/toyota_prius_tires.html

    Even if they fixed the problem, they leave a foul taste in my mouth. "

    Just to be fair, that article deals with the GEN 1 Prius, not the current model.
  • It should also be noted that low 'rolling resistance' is also achieved to this day with narrower tires on the Prius than are used on the Corrola and Matrix. Despite being heavier than cars of its size, its tires are more in line with what is used on the Yaris. A car that gives up 400lbs to the Prius.

    So technically, they are 'lower rolling resistance' because of surface area. Just not tread compound. For those that don't know; traction, breaking, and accident avoidance in general is improved as tread area is increased (so long as the tread is good). At the same time, fuel usage goes down.

    They are still sacrificing safety in the name of the almighty dollar MPG. The Prius drivetrain is not as impressive as you might think, considering all the other sacrifices they have to make to get over 40 MPG.

    kthx. bye
  • bksmith1bksmith1 Posts: 1
    Why would you compare vehicles' safety ratings in two different classes to begin with?
  • Why would you compare vehicles' safety ratings in two different classes to begin with?

    Why would you compare MPG of vehicles of different types? That's where the Outback/Prius conversation started.

    Then I was responding to a 'mathematical' comparison of the Outback vs. Prius safety, which like you say is bogus to begin with, but on top of that the math was bogus.

    Then there's those that want you to believe that the government is trying to kill us all with faulty safety data. That the worst thing you could do is trust the NHTSA ratings. Its a conspiracy! I doubt that very much.

    I think of the Prius as among the least likely vehicles out there to be able to AVOID an accident, let alone survive it. Its as stable as a pig on iceskates, with arthritis in the back feet.

    Fortunately, the best mileage occurs in the city, where high speed crashes are less likely. And both major Prius wrecks I saw this year were on a 65mph highway.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Basic reading for comprehension might help..

    In your quote it talked about the Yukon / Tahoe hybrids. It said nothing about the Prius. That was your own biased interpretation, incorrect BTW.

    It said '...like other hybrids the Tahoe and Yukon are equipped with regenerative brakes that capture energy normally wasted during braking ....' PERIOD, new subject,

    IT says nothing about the Prius and LRRT's.
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