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Mainstream Large Sedans Comparison

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  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    Well...after the TSB for the Azera tranny, I got mine re-flashed and that problem went away. I haven't had any issues with the tranny at all. Even the 4-speed that was in my '02 Sonata was solid. Had it serviced at 50K miles and Goodyear put the wrong fluid in it. Started smelling this buring fluid smell, took it to the dealer and they told me that Goodyear put the regular auto tranny fluid in. So I got them to power flush the tranny and fill it with good ol' Hyundai tranny fluid and the burning smell went away and life was lovely once again.

    The 5-speed took some getting used to since it had shorter shift points than the 4-speed had, but now...I shift it manually more than I leave it in auto.
  • jimmy2xjimmy2x Posts: 124
    If it were my money, and I wanted a stately American sedan with premium features, I'd look at a Taurus/Sable long before Buick

    I would also if I did not think that they were ugly. Reminds me of the wife's old 80's Tempo.
  • jimmy2xjimmy2x Posts: 124
    Since the Avalon and Azera seem to have been our topics 'du jour' , both these cars have benn noted to suffer from some delayed shifting/slipping problems. I contend this an uinfortunate byproduct of these new high tech, DBW, multi speed, electronically controlled trannies. The 'price' of progress, if you will, that I don't like to pay, except when I fill my Avalon up and the trip computer says 27 mpg for that tank..

    Both the Avalon and Azera remain on my list. Only problems I see with the Avalon are the smallish trunk (might have a couple of bodies to transport ;) ), and from my understanding the NAV system is the pits. The Azera will get strong consideration also.
  • jaymagicjaymagic Posts: 309
    After all the talk about warranties, I am surprised no one has mentioned Hyundai's 5 year UNLIMITED MILEAGE roadside assistance program. For all those like me who average 20K or better a year, it is great to have the reassurance of this. I actually had to use it a couple of times with my former XG 350L. Once my wife had a flat and they came and changed the tire no charge and once it was me that, embarrassingly enough , ran out of gas.

    I value this almost as much as the long warranty.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    as I have said before - if it is a trunk you want along with some fold down rear seats the Taurus may be the vehicle of choice - talk about enough room for a coupla extra bodies!

    PS I have heard no reports of problems only improvements with the now 6 speed in the 08 Avalon. Maybe somebody at Toyota Hdqtrs. (California) instructed some of those tranny programming computer geeks to be a little less aggressive because FE is unchanged (new EPA) despite the extra speeds. When I go 'interview' the new Avalon to replace my 05 I'll be curious to see if I can get it to 'hesitate' in its gear selection. The Azera (which wasn't available in the spring of 05) will also be on my list, along with what is supposed to be a completely new Maxima for 09, and even the Taurus (although I too think it looked better as a '500')
  • deskmandeskman Posts: 485
    Azera is a quality car and priced right. take the 0% for 72 and the 500 hfc cash .offer them 500 over and you will get a great deal on a great car.I only have 1 azera in stock now (they sell as quick as they come in)so until i get a few more i have to charge msrp.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    If they can throw those things in there
    be careful what you wish for - else the Azera might end up being a victim of Murphy's Law - corollary 23 - which is:
    The more complicated anything is the more likely it is to break.
    You certainly wouldn't want to sabotage what has been the Azera's rather enviable reliability ratings - for the sake of some usually uncomfortable (and rather silly) air conditioned seats - would you? :)
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    Well...the Azera does get the nod when it comes to the trunk. Avalon takes a bow there but the upside is that you get rear seats that recline slightly.

    I don't know much about the Nav system in the Avalon, but you might wanna wait till the '08 Azeras hit to see if the Nav system they will be offering will be any better. From my understanding, it will be a CD based Nav unit.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    Well...so far Hyundai has been pretty good at making it happen. I mean...they offer little things like the Shiftronic (which they've had since '02 to perfect), the rear power window shade and the seats are already heated. Cooling them would only mean routing some ducting to the seats...that's about it. I don't think that would affect Azera's reliability. The one thing I would like to see, which would probably end up sabatoging the reliability would be an adjustable suspension. As nice an addition as it would be, I do concede it could ultimately be problematic.
  • jimmy2xjimmy2x Posts: 124
    Well...the Azera does get the nod when it comes to the trunk. Avalon takes a bow there but the upside is that you get rear seats that recline slightly.

    I can see where the rear recliners could be of benefit to many people, but my kids are grown and on their own. The new car will be intended for use on trips after retirement at the end of next year. The company car ('04 Taurus) will thankfully go away and we will keep my wife's Camry for beating around town. She and I have been fortunate enough to see a lot of the world (Retired USN) and have lived on all three coasts - but most of what lies in between remains a relative mystery to be explored.

    I don't know much about the Nav system in the Avalon, but you might wanna wait till the '08 Azeras hit to see if the Nav system they will be offering will be any better. From my understanding, it will be a CD based Nav unit.

    All I know is what I read in a great many comments in the Avalon forum. It would be nice if they went back to a simpler touch screen (like Honda and Buick).
  • jimmy2xjimmy2x Posts: 124
    as I have said before - if it is a trunk you want along with some fold down rear seats the Taurus may be the vehicle of choice - talk about enough room for a coupla extra bodies!

    You may well be right if I can get over the exterior styling (or lack of).
  • This is indeed the last year for the 3800 ( I'm in the Flint, MI area where the engine is made ). BTW, the Northstar is getting a bit long in the tooth, too - just a basic DOHC V8: no VVT, direct injection, etc.
    I can't recall hearing anything about the future of the Lucerne/Cadillac DTS platform, but it's days have to be limited, too.
  • Since when has the Azera been plagued with any delayed shifting/slipping problems?
    Sorry, Mike, I have to disagree on this one. I have previously noted the delay in downshifting in my Azera, to which you advised that I should use the autoshift. If I want to shift manually, I'll drive my other car.
    An auto trans is supposed to work automatically. BTW, I have owned lots of GM cars with the old 4-speed trans and they all downshifted when I wanted/needed them to.
  • I mean, finally getting in-dash nav and improved suspension, but...lacking adaptive cruise, smart key/push-button starting, HID headlights and cooling seats. (The Azera is not yet competitive with the Azera).

    When I looked at the Avalon, I seem to recall that cooled seats were close to $2K extra. I remember thinking that was a bit much to keep the wife's tail end cool. (I didn't tell her that.)

    If offered on the Azera, probably would opt out of air condtioned seats due to additional cost.
  • floridabob1floridabob1 Posts: 1,190
    RE: 3955
    Mike
    Tell me about the HP snafu and Hyundai lengthening the powertrain warranty to 12 year 120,000 miles.
    I have the 10/100 extended warranty.
  • Do ya'll really think the ride and cabin noise of the Azera is the same quality of the Avalon? We drove the Azera, and it was not nearly as quiet or comosed. Just my thoughts.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    floridabob,

    I think the HP snafu relates to the 2002 Sonata with the 2.7L engine. The 2.7 was new that year (replaced a 2.5) and listed HP at 181. This was an overstatement. (My '05 2.7 engine is rated at 170.)

    Because Hyundai overstated the HP, they extended the warranty as a form of compensation to the owners.

    Personally I don't care what the HP rating is, just how the car performs when I drive it.
  • dborthdborth Posts: 474
    re. 3979 Because Hyundai overstated the HP, they extended the warranty as a form of compensation to the owners.

    Plus, in the case of my wife's '02 Santa Fe, a debit card of as I recall $25-30.00. Shortly thereafter, their Fountain Valley CEO resigned and went to work for Mitsu.

    I now take Hyundai's present HP claims with the grain of salt.
  • Hi,
    I am interested in a pre-owned car. Is anyone out there willing to help me to check the car's history via database such as carfax? Please kindly let me know if you can so that I can send you the VIN#. My email: john_ju_2000@yahoo.com.
    Thanks a lot.
    John
  • I now take Hyundai's present HP claims with the grain of salt.
    You can take the claims as you like, but in tests by Car and Driver of the Avalon, Maxima, and Azera, the 1/4 mile results speak for themselves:
    Avalon, 280HP ( since downrated to 268? ) 14.6@99, LBS/HP.... 13.37
    Maxima, 265HP.... 14.9@96, LBS/HP..... 13.29
    Azera, 263HP....... 14.8@96, LBS/HP..... 14.00
    I'd say if any of the above ratings are overrated, it would be the Maxima, which weighs over 100 pounds less than the Azera, but has identical trap speed.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    For a very modest price you can get it yourself directly from CARFAX: http://www.carfax.com/index.cfm

    That would be the best thing to do.
  • tonycdtonycd Posts: 223
    I haven't driven the Avalon. I'll answer as a courtesy, since nobody else has yet.

    By most accounts, the Avalon's suspension is better sorted than the Azera's. It may be more biased toward ride comfort at the expense of responsive handling (except the Avalon Touring model), but the Azera reputedly does not handle small pavement imperfections as well.

    As for noise, most objective testing seems to show the Azera has lower absolute noise levels than the Avalon, although this does not speak to the subjective quality of the sound that is heard. The Azera's sounds certainly have not drawn any generalized complants, however.

    Hope this helps.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    You seem to continually complain about your Azera, without complaining out about your specific car, and ask if the model will be continued; and now you are complaining about an another Hyundai you own.

    If you weren't satisfied with your '02 Santa Fe, why did you buy an Azera?

    It's my observation that Hyundai tends to intoduce new models years on a 12 month cycle, not the traditional October 1 cycle. Present generation Sonatas hit the street around May or June of '05, as an "06." Each year since, this is about the time they introduce the "new" model year. Same thing for when the current Santa Fe or Elantra were brought out. The '06 Azera first hit the market (depending on locality) around December of '05 or January of '06. Same with the '07 Azera, (check other Azera topics to confirm this).

    So, if a new model or new generation of that model is introduced in X month, we should expect that the new model year will be introduced 12 months later.
  • dborthdborth Posts: 474
    re 3985: You seem to continually complain about your Azera, without complaining out about your specific car, and ask if the model will be continued; and now you are complaining about an another Hyundai you own.

    If you weren't satisfied with your '02 Santa Fe, why did you buy an Azera?


    My '07 Azera has a noisy rear suspension, period. I leased my '07 Azera in October '06, so in my market the '08 is now a 14-month "cycle". I don't buy other posts that the '08's are "still at the Port", or otherwise in storage. 750 + US dealers have only sold 20,351 units in 11 months resulting in a monthly average of 2-1/2 Azera's per month per dealer. Hyundai knows their US monthly rate of sale, so where is the "glut of remaining '07 inventory" that is delaying the distribution of the '08?

    Regarding my '02 Santa Fe, that post had nothing to do with product satisfaction. Read it again, I added it to a post regarding HP misrepresentation by Hyundai in certain '02 models.

    I enjoy both Huyndai's in my garage and I have no serious complaints with either. My concerns are with Hyundai's third world marketing efforts and uninformed dealer service departments.
  • CD Based? hmmm in that case it will have no info on POI. even handheld NAV are flash card/ hard drive based now. Some cars still use DVD (not CD) based Systems.
  • allmet33allmet33 Posts: 3,557
    I'm sorry, I did mean DVD based. That's what I get for burning CD's while typing a post...had CD's on the brain. No...it will be a DVD based nav unit. Maybe for '09 they go to a GPS based unit and the head unit will have a 40 gig hard drive built in.

    Hey Alexstore, you see the YouTube clipe with the '99 Max going up against an Azera w/the 3.3 V-6?
  • Well NEW SAE requires new tests and as a result for SAE certified engine Maxima is now rated @ 255 and Avalon @ 268. Maxima also weighs almost 200 lb less than Azera and still beats Azera in lb/hp ratings. 2005 Max- 3432 LB, 05 Avalon touring 3545 and 2006 Azera 3629 LB
    Maxima = 13.45 lb/hp
    Azera= 13.8 lb/HP
    Avalon=13.23 lb/hp
  • floridabob1floridabob1 Posts: 1,190
    re: 3979
    Does the extention of the powertrain warranty to 12/120000 carry over to the Azera?
    If so, how does one confirm it with Hyundai US?
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    I think the extension only applied to model year 2002 vehicles with the 2.7L engine. Hyundai did restate the HP to be 170.
  • 99 max 190 hp vs 242 hp Azera? You better find one with 04+ max vs 3.8 Azera
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