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Acura TSX vs. Infiniti G35

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  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    From Acura's press release:

    A new TSX powertrain choice means performance luxury buyers can enjoy a 280 horsepower 3.5L V-6, with sophisticated VTEC® valvetrain control and a dual-stage induction system. For maximum performance and efficiency, the engine will be coupled to Acura's Sequential SportShift automatic transmission, with intelligent features such as Grade Logic Control and Shift Hold Control. If the driver desires, the Sequential SportShift transmission can also be operated manually, via steering-wheel mounted F1®-style paddle shifters.

    image
  • bodble2bodble2 Posts: 4,519
    I think that's a smart move on Acura's part. More choices is always a good thing. I wonder if SH-AWD will follow, perhaps as part of the mid-cycle refreshening?
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    Hmm... Let's see... According to Edmunds.com...

    '10 TSX V6 $34,850
    0-60: 6.4
    Quarter: 14.7@96
    5-speed auto

    '09 G37 $33,250
    0-60: 5.4
    Quarter: 13.7@102.8
    7-speed auto

    The numbers do not seem to favor the TSX
  • nj2pa2ncnj2pa2nc Posts: 813
    how much is a 2010 G37 since you are comparing it with a 2010 tsx.
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Posts: 749
    IMO, probably 500-700 more than the '09.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    The base G37 doesn't have a moonroof, heated seats, iPod integration, auto-dim rearview mirror, compass/homelink, or Bluetooth. All standard on the TSX.

    To get all that, you must order the G37 Journey with Premium Package. MSRP of $36,200 (2009 model).

    And you can't put a price on the smooth and refined Acura V6 engine - the Infiniti runs like a Peterbuilt by comparison. :P
  • nj2pa2ncnj2pa2nc Posts: 813
    that is more like it-
    Have never had luck with nissan products
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Posts: 749
    And you can't put a price on the smooth and refined Acura V6 engine - the Infiniti runs like a Peterbuilt by comparison.

    I wouldn't drive the TSX or TL unless they're 10K cheaper than the G.

    BTW, w/ premium package, you also get Bose, memory seat, heat seat, an power tilt & telescopic steering wheel...not sure if those are included with the base TSX.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    "not sure if those are included with the base TSX."

    That's because you haven't done much research and don't know what you're talking about.

    Both are fine cars in their own way. The G is a little quicker and hard-edged, the TSX is a little more refined and polished. Neither can be considered a luxury car or a sports car.
  • sjaievesjaieve Posts: 252
    OK, initially I wanted to say what I think, then I remembered seeing this on MT, see the readers comments for the TSX here (scroll to the bottom)

    http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0906_2010_acura_tsx_v_6/index.htm- l

    Then see the ones for the g37 here

    http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/sedans/112_0810_2008_infiniti_g37_sedan_test- /index.html

    Generally for every 1 person who liked the TSX, there was probably 10 who hated it. The reverse is true for the G37. As one who drives an 08 G35, moving to the G37 in 2010, I normally like a good fight, this is one I dont even mind losing. Couldnt care less.

    Enjoy the TSX. Can I appeal to those who like the g37 to just let this one go and save you strength for worthy contenders like the 328i or the Hyundai Genesis V6 sedan.

    I am out.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Professional automotive journalists almost always prefer the car that is sportier and more fun to drive. When push comes to shove, 330hp and RWD is always going to be more exciting to play with than 280hp and FWD.

    But nobody can say one car is "better" than the other. If you want a luxurious car that can spit a little fire when you want it to, then the G is a fine choice. There are, however, others who are willing to trade a little vim and vigor for some spit and polish.

    The TSX is not as quick or dynamic as the G37, but it is a jewel of a machine.
  • nj2pa2ncnj2pa2nc Posts: 813
    Thanks- I love my 06 Milano red/ebony 6MT/nav tsx, bought new 11/17/06. It has almost 85,000 problem free miles. Glad you love your G's as much.
  • ingvaringvar Posts: 205
    The base G37 doesn't have a moonroof, heated seats, iPod integration, auto-dim rearview mirror, compass/homelink, or Bluetooth. All standard on the TSX.

    From your list I need only a heated seats. iPod is a joke and useless for me, I don't speak when I drive, no need for Bluetooth :) Moonroof is HUGE minus for me, because of less head space. I better pay $500 in order to get it removed:-)

    smooth and refined Acura V6 engine
    Nice joke. Please, try BMW I6 at list once, you will get an idea about smooth engine. Honda's high revs engines with torque steer far away from "smooth".
  • ingvaringvar Posts: 205
    To be frank, I am not loyal to any brand
    Same here. Had 2001 acura tl-s, replaces brake rotors and pads every 30K miles, trans 3 times, leaking sun roof, clock lamp replaced 6 times, rusted exaust. Drop that junk at 50Kmile and switched to Accord....wrapped brake rotors, leaking windshield... Now I'm driving horrible BMW ....with 0 issues. 58Kmiles and counting
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Posts: 749
    That's because you haven't done much research and don't know what you're talking about.

    You're right. I don't care about the TSX because of the weak engine. The last time I look at all of these cars closely was back in late 2007. I tested drive the TL and the G back in 2005 and I couldn't live with the TL even if I could find one cheaper.

    However, you're the person who brought up the lack features on the G. You try to add the premium package to the G to make it equal to the base TSX. So, I think it's fair that I want to know if those 3 features are included in the TSX as well.
  • nj2pa2ncnj2pa2nc Posts: 813
    previously owner a nissan maxima with MT- three transmissions, new engine, leaky sunroof, power windows stopped working, all covered under warranty, I am not loyal to any brand either: previously owned mercedes, volvo, mazda, mitsubishi, hyundai, honda, nissan, eagle, ford, chevy, and now acura (along with a hyundai and mitsubishi truck) My 06 tsx also has 0 issues, 85Kmiles and counting
  • sjaievesjaieve Posts: 252
    Refer to post 127 on this thread, I dont think anything has changed even with the additional horses. Acura's new engine with 250+ horses, not even sure how much exactly, takes the new TSX to 60 in less time than a the Rav 4 V6. Look @ the 305hp TL, slowest car with 300+ horses. The point I am trying to make is not about 0-60 times, but about delivery. Where are all the horses ending up with such uninspiring 0-60 times. The word that comes to mind is wastage, somewhere along the line there is some serious losses being made, something I cannot stand. No one makes more powerful 3.5l engines like Toyota (IS350) and Nissan (VQ engines and the CVT engines in the Maxima and Altima). I would have to add Honda (Honda Accord Coupe V6), but exlude Acura as under that name plate, they have certainly managed to mess up the good stuff available from the parent company. The Accord Coupe V6 is a sexy beast IMHO.

    Handling: Dont even need to go there, another phrase that comes to mind is
    Torque Steer.

    There seems to be a lot of talk about bluetooth, moonroof etc, bear in mind that the average buyer of a G spends 36k (MSRP) on this car. This is enough to get the premium package at least. Also note that the G can never be priced like the TSX, the guys at Nissan would be absolutetly NUTS to go that route. These are serious perfomance cars we are talking about, if you want the VQ engine you need at least 29k (the 350Z) and at that price you are getting the base model. You will notice that even an Evo starts at 32k (base), that is just the way cars in the G's league are priced, save for the Genesis Coupe. There is always an exception to the rule :)

    As I noted in post 127, unless you are truly trying to be myopic and not willing to look at big picture, you will also realize that the G drivers are those guys who looked at the 335i (lucky bastards driving those cars:)) but realized that the car is expensive yet the G is very close in performance to this car. So rather than spend 52k, on a fully loaded 335i. you can save +10k on the G. Many G drivers, I included do not even consider FWD cars.

    And before someone rants about interior room, bells and whistles, refinement, residual value, reliability I would seriously consider picking up a copy of Consumer Report and see who is placed 1st in the ELLPS category. Consumer report is hardly a performance oriented magazine, but looks more at ownership experience. Do you know which car has a 95% approval rating from its owners.

    I am sorry, this is not the right car to pick for a comparison. Have you considered the Maxima, Altima v6, Honda Accord v6, Hyundai Genesis V6 (at least its a RWD), Evo, 328i, A4 2l 4 banger, Camry v6. I think before you can even start dreaming of taking on the G, you should seriously consider these worthy contenders for the TSX. I probably would pick the 328i or the Honda Accord before I can start thinking of the TSX
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Posts: 749
    ...talking being loyal to any brand...'m in the same boat...I (we) used to own Corolla, Camry, Solara, Avalon, 323i, Altima and they always had this or that problems. Out of those cars, the Avalon seems the worst of all. Currently, my '07 Altima and '08 G seems to be holding good...but may be b/c they're still relatively new.

    I didn't get any Hondas in the past b/c I don't like their designs at all. However, the current generation of Hondas are not bad. I might try the Accord to replace the Altima in the near future.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    "Bose, memory seat, heat seat, an power tilt & telescopic steering wheel...not sure if those are included with the base TSX."

    "However, you're the person who brought up the lack features on the G. You try to add the premium package to the G to make it equal to the base TSX."

    360w 7-speaker AM/FM/CD/MP3 audio with RDS, XM satellite radio, and iPod integration.
    Heated leather seats with 2 driver memory.
    Manual tilt & telescoping wheel.

    http://www.edmunds.com/new/2010/acura/tsx/101174005/standard.html
  • gooddeal2gooddeal2 Posts: 749
    Wow...very impress w/ the standard features...I'm surprise that we can find more info. on edmunds than the Acura website.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I don't think Acura has officially announced the specs yet.

    I still think the 4 cyl TSX with 6-speed MT is the better car (and it's only $29,000).
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    "To then turn around and wear blinkers to compare the G with the TSX, I doubt anything useful will come out of this. I will resign on this note."

    Resignation accepted. :P
  • sjaievesjaieve Posts: 252
    Oh, that was post number 127, and at the time I was referring to the old TSX, see my post today, post # 144 on the V6 TSX

    And just to add to the accolades of the Infiniti G series, JD Powers just released this today, highest ranked initial quality survey. Its an honor to stand next to a Lexus when it comes to quality cos those guys are merciless in that dept. The TSX is so out of its league with the G its not even funny. Believe me, I will be having fun with this thread. :shades:

    Entry premium car:

    -Highest ranked: Lexus IS

    -Runners-up: Cadillac CTS, Infiniti G-Series
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Nobody is saying the G37 isn't a great car. Your neighbors are are green with envy and young girls swoon whenever you drive by. OK?

    The question is - why is it so hard to understand that the TSX is also a terrific car?
  • sjaievesjaieve Posts: 252
    Oh, I was merely trying to point out that these cars, when compared, the G will come out on top from any angle you wish to take. Which is why I said you are choosing the wrong car to take on, the G is simply a beast and is probably one of the most underrated cars out there. You should check the press coming out of Dubai, Europe, Australia on this car. Granted it has not unsit the 335i from the throne but who could be second (Unfortunately the IS350 has handling issues, otherwise a close contender)

    Yes the TSX is a great car, and yes the G is not the greatest car in the segment at least from a performance perspective, but once you factor everything in, even here at Edmunds they placed it 1st over the 335i, IS350, CTS, C350. Try pitting a TSX against these cars, see what happens.
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    The G does not really need to compete head-to-head with the 335i, since its price is much closer to 328i territory. The G will run figure-8's around the 328i. Thats what sold me on the G, it's such a great car for the money. The value consideration is also why it won the comparison test you mentioned againt the fierce competition in that comparo.

    The CTS in that article was down-graded because of its relatively slow performance (0-60 in mid 6's), which, incidently, is around the same performance as the TSX V6.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    Well, you're comparing an apple and a pomegranate and trying to explain why the pomegranate is superior.

    From a personal perspective, I have driven both the G35 and G37 sedan and here are some of my thoughts:

    1. The G35/37 has a powerful drivetrain - no doubt about it. But to my surprise, the G doesn't pull like a freight train like I expected. Torque still feels a little soft at lower RPM's. The BMW twin turbo is far superior in power delivery. The G does a nice job of hiding it's size and weight (it's a big, heavy car), but it definitely isn't as nimble as the smaller TSX.

    2. Clutch take-up was too high and sudden which made moving from a stand-still unnecessarily difficult (especially on uphill inclines). Combine the poor clutch with an overly sensitive throttle tip-in (thanks to drive-by-wire), and the G was even difficult to upshift during normal driving. Pedal placement was also not the best for heel-and-toe downshifting, which is moot in the G because the aforementioned clutch/throttle issues made me loath to try it more than a couple of times. I did like the shifter action - short and precise throws with just the right heft. It was more precise and better feeling than the BMW 3-series, but not as slick as the TSX.

    3. Interior ergonomics. Sorry, I hate the G37 cockpit. This one is much better than the 1st gen G35, but Infiniti is still behind Lexus, Audi, and Acura in designing a cockpit that's intimate, attractive, and functional. I know this is a personal call and everyone has a different opinion here, but to me, the layout and appearance of that recessed center display area is less organic and distracting - it ruins the otherwise smooth lines of the dashboard. The Infiniti's switchgear is also somewhat lacking in quality feel and precision of action as compared to other cars in this class. This is an area where Honda/Acura shines. Overall, the TSX cabin is light and airy, everything falls perfectly into place, and all the controls have a feel of quality and precision.

    4. Exterior looks. I like the looks of the G37 from some angles, but I think it's a little on the boring. I'm afraid it will look dated very quickly like the 1st generation G35 does.

    5. Chassis / driveline refinement is another area where the G37 has improved significantly since the first generation G35, but I think they tipped the pendulum a little too far the other way. Where the old car was noisy and harsh, but had razor sharp reflexes, the new car is a little soft and numb. It does have a good ride now however. BMW also went too soft and heavy with the current generation 3 series - as did Acura. I can only imagine what a soft, understeering pig the TSX will be with a big V6 over the front axle. The old 4cylinder TSX was very light on it's humble little feet with quick turn-in and great chassis response - I really liked the 1st generation TSX.

    Anyway, there you have it - my personal, completely biased opinion of these cars. Personally, I wouldn't choose either one. The G37 isn't fast enough to be thrilling, and it isn't luxurious enough to be coddling - kind of a Jack-of-all-trades, master-of-none if you ask me.

    For around $35,000, I'd rather own a Genesis on the luxury side or an Evo X on the sport side.
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    I think the TSX's center stack, much like the current generation Accord's, looks like a sea of tiny black buttons. It may be functional, but it does not look luxurious.

    I agree that the G looks a little plain, but is that really bad? It's hard to read any article, forum, etc. about the TL without many, many complaints about the ugly front end. The TSX's front end has a similar, if toned-down, appearance. Like the dash appearances this is subjective, maybe Acura's styling works for you. I sure have read a lot of complaints about it though and perhaps the plain styling of the Infiniti is not all that bad. The Acura's styling actually is starting to grow on me a little, but I still hesitate to spend 35 grand on a car and have family and friends tell me it's ugly.

    The G's throttle does take some getting used to, but after 2 or 3 weeks it was no longer a major issue.

    I think you hit the nail on the head about it being a jack of all trades and master of none, but again this may be looked at as a good thing. Sure the Evo will outperform it, ever sat in one? It has about as much luxury as a Chevy Chevette. The Genesis is a nice car for sure, but the G will out-accelerate it (even the V8 version by a small margin) and out-corner it.

    The G is a car that will run neck-and-neck with a Mustang GT and offer a fair amount of luxury for mid-30's in price. There just aren't too many other cars out there that can say that.
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I agree about the TSX looks. I actually think the 2nd generation TSX was a step down from the 1st generation car (I may be biased, I owned a 2004 TSX for 2 years).

    The old car was simple and elegant, while the new one is needlessly fussy and overstyled (yes, especially the beak).

    Here is the 2004 TSX which I still consider a benchmark for the class in interior ergonomics, comfort, design, and quality ...

    image

    You're right about the excellent qualities of the G and the niche it fills very well between sport and luxury. Truth be told, I've been playing a little Devil's advocate here simply because I don't understand all narrow-minded opinions of the juvenile 0-60 fanboys that worship it. It's really a very poor choice for someone who's looking for a "fast car." It's quick, but it's not fast.
  • ingvaringvar Posts: 205
    The question is - why is it so hard to understand that the TSX is also a terrific car?
    Have you had a chance to drive "terrific car?" What's about torque steer and FWD? Why 5 speed auto?
This discussion has been closed.