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Buying a Used 3-Series

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Comments

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,565
    I say shoot for between $4500 -$5000 off their asking price. They might hold on to it because of the low mileage, but you should get at least $2500 off their asking price.

    Don't be afraid of a higher mileage BMW. My Mom recently turned in an '08 328Xi with over 63,000 miles and it looked & drove like new. You might definitely want to look into the extended maintenance (6 yrs/100K) as there are quite a fewthings that need to be done right after (or not too long after) the car rolls over 50,000 miles (Front Brakes, Rear Brakes, Inspection II major $ervice.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    I don't know where you live, but if this is a non-BMW dealer, their price would still be high here in NJ. That car has a trade-in value right around $21k. I wouldn't be paying anything more than $24k for it, personally.

    CPO would be a different story.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    Is it CPO?

    The buyout was actually fairly accurate. Trade-in is near $24k. So $27k is a fair enough retail price. $29k is more like a CPO transaction.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • Thanks for your reply. May I ask how you determined these amounts? I was looking at what I know and what I assume. I know that the residual was $27K. The dealer acquires these car at substantial savings from BMW financial if the owner opts not to buy. My friend who worked for Black Book for several years provided me with current auction results on this model and indicated from her data that the dealer probably owns this car for roughly $22,500 and $23,000 as wholesale (premium for mileage). Using this and adding roughly $1,600 for Certification, that puts an investment by the dealer at roughly 24K and 24.6K. Asking price is $29,998, so a starting bid of $26.5 seems reasonable. I would like to know if you have any additional information that would provide me with a rational reason for asking this price. Thanks again.
  • gbrozen, thanks for your reply. Your email came in as I was submitting mine. It is a Certified car and is at a BMW dealership. Based on this information, I see that you think $29K is reasonable. That sounds high to me. I know that they get these cars for much less than residual, so I was using this as a starting point. Is $2-3K profit enough for these guys to sell?
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    edited January 2011
    $2-$3k profit is fair. But CPO'ing a BMW, as I understand it, costs the dealer a significant amount. So if you assume $2500 profit, plus $1500-$2500 CPO cost, then we're talking $4k-5k over trade-in as a fair buy price.

    Using my Galves number, which is what a dealer would pay for that car here in the northeast US, its about $24k trade. So that puts a fair retail number at somewhere around $28k-$29k.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • Can you check your Galves number for the Chicago area? I know that the dealer that I returned my 07 to spent $3300 on CPO, but $1500 of that was new tires. In this case the sales person suggested that they would most likely not put new tires on a 9,000 mile car. They are putting a new battery in and as far as I know, that's it other than the usual inspection and detail. Certainly understandable.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    Galves doesn't work that way. It is just one number. The reason I say its northeast is only because it is a tool used primarily in the northeast (so I've been told by salespeople in other regions).

    If it is any consolation, I've compared Galves to Mannheim numbers on hundreds of occassions, and they match up 99% of the time. So it is a safe bet that the numbers I'm giving you apply in your area, too.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • I see. I wasn't aware of this number until I saw it on this board. So what you are saying is my base line should be more like $24K and build from there? $24K plus Certification plus profit? Looks like about $28K.
  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    you got it.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,565
    arctic56

    I've kind of got a 6th sense for these kind of things. gbrozen is kind of the resident expert around here because he has a GALVES subscription. What he has to say actually holds water.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • Thanks for your input. What I don't understand is how the Galves number is derived. As an example, is it a percentage of the residual? Is it a combination of several factors? Is it a multiple of current Black Book auction results? I would like to understand this so that I can try to apply it to other BMW 328xi i am finding that I may consider.

    There are the following: asking price, residual price (if you happen to now it), Galves, wholesale price, bottom selling price, etc. Just trying to find the magic formula....
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 28,572
    I'm sure Galves gets their numbers from the wholesale auctions..

    Actually, all wholesale price guides do.... The value of the guides depends on the timeliness of their information...

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • Here is a question: Is the CPO premium worth it? I had convinced myself that it was worth buying from a dealer to get a CPO vehicle. Does it make more sense to buy a less expensive car and have it carefully evaluated? What do the experts think? Appreciate all of your expertise.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,829
    edited January 2011
    I think that unless you are talented mechanically and/or have lots of BMW club connections and a willingness to shop around, improvise and "get 'er done", you'd be well advised to always pack a lot of protection into your used BMW; however, this is just my two cents about it, and a *lot* depends on the integrity of the dealer. A CPO car can turn into a lemon, too. CPO is no guarantee of paradise.

    I myself wouldn't spend the extra money but I feel I have two advantages---one, I can fix some things myself and two, I have a great network of parts and indie repair shops to help me.

    If the question were about a 7 series, I'd have no hesitation to tell you to go CPO all the way no matter who you were.

    MODERATOR

  • qbrozenqbrozen Posts: 17,313
    As the host said, it is from auction values. Galves updates theirs on a weekly basis.

    '13 Stang GT; '86 Benz 300E; '98 Volvo S70; '12 Leaf; '14 Town&Country

  • nyccarguynyccarguy Stamford, CTPosts: 7,565
    Galves numbers are REAL.

    2001 Honda Prelude Type SH/ 2011 BMW 328xi / 2011 Honda Pilot EX-L w/ Navigation

  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,829
    I like Galves because they understand that so called 'retail pricing' is a very mushy database, so they don't use it. It's simply too difficult to get reliable retail price information, especially from dealers, whereas auction pricing can be gleaned in large numbers from sources that aren't interesting in manipulating their reports.

    In the appraisal business, we refer to some online retail price guides as "wish books", as in "I WISH my car were worth that much". :P

    MODERATOR

  • Found a used '02....have never owned a BMW before have owned several Mercedes over the years. This is a very nice and clean car with 158,000 miles on it. Very high but its a one owner car that was mainly driven on the interstate.

    What are the main things I need to look for as far as maintenance and repairs? Supposedly the control arms were replaced last week.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 44,829
    Man with that many miles it could be anything. Best thing is to go over the service records and try to determine what's never been looked at, and go there first---so belts, hoses, battery, exhaust/catalytic, exhaust hangers, water leaks (bad seals around windows and doors) control arm bushings front and back, all the fluids (ever changed?),wiper blades, brake rotors, that sort of thing. Also play with every switch and knob and find out what's not working (being German, there will be something that's dead).

    MODERATOR

  • i'm in the market for BMW 328i coupe or 335i coupe. i called the dealer about the promotion which they have it online.

    the salesman said that if i get 100k mile warranty, i have to get a loan @ BMW Finance which is around 6%+, they won't allow me to get my own loan since i get the promotion. That's suck and i told the salesman that i can get the loan @ PenFed.com for 3.25%. i told him the promotion is worthless and either way it's cost money to either finance or not. I think a promotion from BMW is a scam.

    promotion - $1500 credit or .9% for 24 months, 2.9% for 36-60 months or 6/100k miles warranty
  • fedlawmanfedlawman Posts: 3,118
    I don't know why you bothered to call the dealer.

    Right there on the website, it says "you must enter into a retail installment sale contract...using standard BMW FS rates."
  • lemmerlemmer Posts: 2,676
    Can you take out the loan and refinance it later? I've done that before to get a deal done.
  • kyfdxkyfdx Posts: 28,572
    Anecdotal evidence suggests you have to keep the loan for 6 months, before refinancing, to get the deal...

    Of course, you have interest rate risk during that time...

    MODERATOR
    Prices Paid, Lease Questions, SUVs

  • I found a 2008 238xi, Alpine white,22k miles, cold weather, premium (dakota leather), sport, paddle shifters. The dealer (prestige in ramsey, nj) is asking 29k. I love the car but i'm afraid this may cloud my judgement when it comes to the money part. :)

    Anybody have some thoughts?
  • For what it is worth. I recently bought a 2008 328xi, cold package, premium package, NAV, fold down back seat, leather, 36K miles, black sapphire met. on beige. Certified local car here in Chicago area. Dealer was asking 29K, I offered 26.5K and they came back at 28K and came up to 27K. They came back at 27.4K and held my ground at 27K. They took it. I think I could have done better if I hadn't had a trade that I ultimately pulled off the table. Based on previous information I was able to determine that the lease return residual was roughly 28K. I figure they bought the car from BMW finance for about 23K. I added the usual $1,500 for CPO and $2,000 profit and that is where I started. I could have pushed harder from the beginning, but two volley's each is about all I can deal with.
  • Hi folks,

    A forum newbie here so I ask for forgiveness in advance should I stumble.

    I was shoping for a Mini, or an A4. For grins (I would never want (or be able to afford, a BMW...) I stopped in and tried out a 2006 325i. I was shocked at the experience. Haunted, as I put it to a friend pushing the A4. Super comfortable driving experience. An actual driving experience that did not seem like it would be tireing. Quiet, nice punch, and then the cornering... wow. I had forgotten it could be fun to drive!

    I have located a CPO good till Dec 22), 2006 325i with premium package, automatic with 39,500 miles for an OTD price of $20k, Tags et al.

    What questions have I not asked that I should?
    They say only 2007 can qualify for BMW financing so I should go with my 6.3% bank financing.
    CarFax is clean for what that seems to be worth. Appears to have been leased 40 miles from where I found it (different dealership) then reregistered in CA for a year, then back to FL for the remainder of the run.
    Artic Silver with Tan interior.
    Looks very clean to me.

    Thoughts? Thanks so much.
  • ctfarmboyctfarmboy Posts: 11
    i've been looking at getting a CPO '08 328xi (prestige in Ramsey NJ) and i'm curious how you know that a dealer is buying a car with a residual of 28k for 23k. is this discount typical? they have a large stock and are receiving lease returns on a daily basis. if this is true, based on your calcs i should be shooting for a couple % under the residual.
  • rwolffrwolff Posts: 19
    I was recently talking to Prestige in Ramsey about some 3 series CPOs but never ventured up there. Something about the salesman I spoke to a few times that I just didn't like the approach. I know they have a lot of cars and some good deals but I couldn't answer you question about residual values, etc. I would just get all the specs on the car and do appraisals from edmunds, kbb and nada and see what the average is vs the dealer's price and go from there.
    I just purchased a 07 335xi w/ 15K miles, premium and cold weather weather packages, original maintenance until 11/2011 then CPO for two more years. Traded in my 2000 Audi A4 2.8 quattro and got the car for 23,400. I have my fingers crossed that the HPFP holds out or at least fails within the 10yr/120K mile warranty. BMW of Bloomfield. I would check them out. Very nice staff, no pressure tactics and upfront.
    I would appreciate anyone giving me a reference for a reputable independent mechanic who works on BMW's in the tri state area, northern NJ preferrably, Bergen county. Thanks.
  • fomentarfomentar Posts: 46
    I'm considering a 2008 335xi, 35K miles. 2 door coupe, cold weather pkg, sport pkg, premium pkg, Nav, sport steering whl w/paddles, steptronic automatic trans, dynamic cruise, ipod adapter, premium hi-fi. Dealer asking $34,999. Edmunds CPO is $36,478 and KBB is $37,510 I would appreciate thoughts on pricing and negotiating position. Thanks.
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