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How many of you would buy an ES again?

carteachcarteach Posts: 179
I have been thinking of buying a preowned LS '04-'06; but I've been reading the negative postings about the transmission. I'm not sure what % of Lexus owners are experiencing these problems since people who are unhappy with a large purchase usually go to this kind of forum as well as people like me who are doing research.

In any event, I'd like to get some feedback.

Thanks.
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Comments

  • Club Lexus shows about 23% of their members having transmission problems. The Lexus TSIB doesn't fix the problem of 3rd-4th gear rpm flaring and Lexus has been replacing transmissions or even buying back cars.

    You're correct to question the application of forum figures to the ES350 owner population at large. I suspect, like you, that those with problems make up a larger percentage of forum entries than in the general population because they're looking for solutions for their problems online.

    My ES350 now has 7,700 miles on it. I've had the navigation display replaced under warranty to fix the climate control voice recognition issue. That has been my only problem to date.

    I would definitely buy another ES350 and am glad I own one now. It's a great car for those who are looking for it's strengths (reliability, comfort, luxury, mpg) and don't mind it's weaknesses (boat-like handling, lame tires, nanny lockouts, looks like a Camry).
  • Absolutely! I own a 05 ES330 that still turns heads and gets comments about it's great styling. But beyond that I have been extremely happy with the car and have not had any issues with it at all.

    There are a few points for improvement if Lexus cares to do so.

    1. There is a lag in power when stepping on the gas harder than normal such as trying to accelerate out of a bad situation on a freeway. I reported this to the dealer service center and they said that this is a computer designed lag to prevent potential engine damage. I definitely do not like this feature.

    2. The cup holders are sub-standard and will not hold a normal size cup in place during deceleration. I have to hold my cup to prevent spilling it.

    3. There is black hole surrounding the cup holder. Anything dropped in front of the cup holder disappears beneath it falling back into the console and anything dropped next to it falls between the seats making it extremely hard to get back.
  • I would consider buying another one only IF I have at least four or five years of trouble free driving this one (2007 ES).
  • I've owned a Lexus for almost 3 years. Their customer service leaves much to be desired. My car has a problem with the Vehicle Skid Control (VSC) where it comes on while I'm driving down the fwy on clear dry road. When the VSC engages the computer takes control of the braking and acceleration. The override button doesn't work. Lexus refuses to acknowledge that there is a problem and refused to repair it even though its under warranty. I'm in the Lemon Law process since it's been at the dealer for the last 3 months, but Lexus hasn't made any attempt to repair this or retain me as a customer.
  • I own a 2004 ES 330. I have about 28,000 miles on it and have owned it since August of 2004 (I bought it new). I have had too many problems to list here, but I will list what I consider the worst costomer service issue. The dashboard vent on the passenger side did not seat properly. After about 500 miles of driving, the vent falls out. Every time the car has been to the dealer, I have requested that the problem be fixed. It took 9 times and 27 months before they finally fixed the problem. The dealer used double-sided tape to hold the vent in place. This is the warranty repair to my car. My Lexus dashboard is now being held together by tape. I question the overall quality of the vehicle if this is how it is repaired.
  • Lexus ES 350 and dealership is terribly OVERrated.
    David
  • cxccxc Posts: 122
    One 2002 ES300 is too many. Its reliability is poor and its quality is not good. In terms of technology, I feel that I got cheated out of $40K. The next car will be BMW 5 or MB E class.
  • My new 2007 ES350 is a big disappointment. With my transmission repairs and other issues that I am told can not be repaired.
  • No, I would never buy another Lexus again. I bought my second ES in July of last year. The transmission does not shift smoothly, which is a flaw in design, the black cars do not have clear coat on them and I am having paint issues, the cup holders will not hold drinks and are unusable. I would not have bought a black car if I had known they were not clear coated. The car is a year old and the paint looks horrible and actually it's the worst paint job of any car I have owned in my life. The service at the dealership has been below average for the price I paid for the car and actually I have left the dealership with more issues than I came in with. I am planning on trading the car in this summer and getting something else.
  • I'm on my 4th Lexus. I have a 2006 GS300 which has been in the shop 2 weeks and will probably be in for another week while they wait for a part from Japan!! Anyway, I took my 2007 ES350 (3,000 miles) to the dealer to have bad dashboard noises repaired. It took them one full week and the repair invoice stated: (and I quote, bad grammar as well)
    Dash R&R front windshield creaking noise coming from right side lower corner between windshield and body unable to reseal due to big gap replaced windshield, sublet to (auto body shop name) also creaking sound coming from across dashboard and body panel remove and reseal dashboard and reinstalled also reseal navigation and radio unit panel and upper A/C vent remove and reseal instrument panel lower dashboard panel (the sealer is now leaking out of the dash)
    I'm thoroughly disgusted. They had to sublet to a body shop?? Also, the auto interior/exterior setting resets to manual after turning off the ignition. They had me wait 1 hour while a technician tried to correct it with zero result.
  • Well looks like Lexus lost a potential customer - I was reseaching buying ES. Foooorget about it now.
  • saleemsaleem Posts: 114
    I've taken my 02 ES300 into the dealership on our extended warranty plenty of times, but they've always been very helpful problems were radio (replaced 4 times before working), parking idle sound, vent temperature incorrect, and some other stuff. what percentage of 02 ES's have transmission problems??

    Would I buy again? it's my parents car and it's good for them I'd buy somehting sportier (g35x, 328xi)
  • ichor0416ichor0416 Posts: 10
    I have an ES300 and it has the transmission lag. I have been in several near misses and near death situations because of it. I have driven the newest ES series and RX350 (when my ES300 was being repaired and I had the loaner car). They seem to not have the problem. Too late for me though. I will never buy another Lexus and encourage everyone I know to look elsewhere too. The company reacted to the complaints by ignoring them and denying that the problem even exists. We must all be crazy, huh?
  • es4jbes4jb Posts: 17
    If you're happy with your ES, this message is not for you. This message is meant for someone thinking about purchasing a used ES.

    I dumped my 05 Lexus ES 330 yesterday, traded it in on a gorgeous 07 Infiniti G35.

    The ES had 21000 miles on it. I have never in my life traded in any car with less than 60000 miles.

    I drove the car for 2 years and came to loathe the vehicle. I have never had a car I hated as much. Perhaps my expectations of what I would get out of a Lexus were overblown, but here is a partial list of what drove me crazy:

    1. The vehicle is grossly underpowered. Requires Premium gas to get any power.

    2. The "transmission hesitation" problem is REAL and annoying at best, dangerous at worst. Punching the accelerator is not something you do with this car. I gave up on using "D" (Drive) in normal city driving. I learned to use the "drive by wire" mode to "manually" operate the car in 3rd or 4th gear.

    3. The center console displays are black LCD. If there is direct sun from behind the displays are IMPOSSIBLE to read. If you wear polarized sunglasses the displays are IMPOSSIBLE to read.

    4. The Lexus "Premium Audio" system is mediocre. The volume levels are not consistent between AM and FM, so you have to turn the volume UP to hear AM stations and DOWN to get the same level for FM.

    5. Vehicle is billed as "satellite" radio-ready which is bunk. There is a button that reads "AM-SAT". That's it. If you want to add satellite radio it's a $1700 upgrade from Lexus. The upgrade must be installed by a Lexus dealer.

    6. The pop out cupholder is poorly positioned. It's too high so when you have a cup in the cupholder, it's difficult to use the gear shift. It's like they designed the car and someone said, "hey, we forgot the cup holder", so they put it there as an afterthought.

    7. The center console box has 2 sections. You flip the arm rest up to reach into the deep bin. There is a small bin beneath the arm rest, which is the "lid" of the deep bin. Whatever is in the small bin is going to be jostled whenever you lift the lid to reach into the deep bin.

    8. The front wheel drive seemed to oversteer at freeway speeds.

    It is certainly possible that the newer ES 350 model addresses some of these issues, I don't know.

    If you're thinking of picking up a used ES 330, think again.

    To answer the question posed by the original posting, I would state emphatically that I would NEVER buy another Lexus.
  • navtownnavtown Posts: 3
    One of the best cars I have bought and used. I have my ES 350 for a month now and love it. I have had many different cars in the past and I just love my ES. I would caution readers from buying into internet forums too much because you never know what kind of people post here. Some may be prejudiced against a certain make for various reasons other than the cars itself. I highly encourage people to talk to a real person - friend or family - who may have used the car so that you get a true unbiased opinion. Happy motoring!!!
  • mdamesmdames Posts: 79
    I've owned my 2007 ES350 for 8 months and 5,500 miles. What a great car! The fit and finish and quality is outstanding. The ride is very quiet and smooth, and it has a lot of power. The technology is very advanced; Bluetooth, Nav, backup camera, park assist, etc.... I love this car. I know there have been a small percentage of vehicles with transmission problems, but the majority of these vehicles are wonderful. This is born out by the continued high sales numbers for this car. If you are considering this vehicle, go test drive it.
  • I bought a used 1998 ES 300 in April 2007 (a 9 year old car) with 120,000 miles on it. I have been driving it for 3 months now and have put 1000+ miles on it. I think it's the smoothest car I have ever driven. It just floats when cruising but gets taut and handles well when accelerating ... atleast this is what I felt. I wanted to get an old luxury car with the best in reliability which means Audi automatically is off the list. I choose Lexus over M.Benz/BMW only because of Toyota's solid reliability reputation and it's worked so far.

    Now, why I won't buy another Lexus? Well ... if this one starts creating trouble soon then it is obvious why I won't buy another one but if this doesn't then I am going to keep this car as long as it runs. Why buy a second Lexus when you can buy another luxury brand like a BMW/Benz? So that's why I won't be getting another Lexus that way either :-)
  • texicotexico Posts: 3
    NEVER again. all those extra $$$
    just for the (L) on the hood. they are way too proud of their over priced Camry & over priced parts. you can't get parts from the Toyota Dealer. everything in the car is designed to force you back to the Lexus dealer. same parts, just changed the bolt patterns enough so you can't use the cheaper Toyota same part. you have to use the more expensive Lexus same part. I found the "owners manual" to be the biggest joke of all.
    it has the index in the back of the book. look up anything. head light adjustments, bulb replacement... anything. they all say the same thing. "see your Lexus dealer"

    right down to the stereo. it has this oddly shaped stereo. not a square or rectangle. plus it's about five time the size of a replacement stereo.
    so again. your forced into fixing it or replacing it at the Lexus dealer with a Lexus stereo. and don't even try to call the Lexus dealer service department for advice on a problem. the one and only answer you will get is... "yeah sure, we can help you... bring it on in."
    you can't just tell me how to get the ashtray out of the dash?
    or where the headlight adjustment screw is?
    "nope, but you can bring it in and we'll look at it for you."

    I also have a '98 Honda Accord EX. easy to fix. engineering is excellent.
    drives just a nice if not better than my ES. much better on fuel.
    the ES sucks it down. both have a 3.0 V6

    unless you think your impressing someone with the (L)
    I would say it's a big waist of money.

    oh, P.S. I didn't buy mine because it was a Lexus. it was passed down to me. I would have never paid that much for a silly car that's going to drop in price as soon as I drive it off the lot. birds, door dings, kids sitting on it when you come out of the store. eh! I'd take a good ol' pick-up any day over one of these again. rich Womens car.
  • I have a 2000 ES300 and apart for scheduled oil changes I have not had to spend any money on the car.I live near Toronto and last year we drove to San Diego and back and did not have to add any oil and most days we cruised at about 80 MPH when possible.I have had this car from new and the only reason I want a new one is because of the safety features on newer cars.A great car and very economical on gas.I have read about the problems some owners are having with the ES350 so I have test driven Acura RLs,Volvo S80,and Infiniti M 35X but all are too noisy, and I am comparing newcars to my 8 year old car.I guess being a Lexus owner has one drawback ,it spoils you so you cant go to another brand.Both the Acura and the Infiniti salespeople admitted to me that prospective customers they have who are Lexus owners find their cars too noisy and have a harsher ride.I guess I will buy the ES350 and trust I am not one of the few with problems
  • Have had mine for year and half and frankly I'm not impressed. It is a nice car but nothing special. (The BMW 5 or 3 is impressive to drive but too unreliable and too expensive). The most outstanding thing about the Lexus is the mileage, which is impressive. I should say that my wife loves the 350.

    I rent cars often when traveling for business and based on my experience frankly I'd be happy with a Buick, Mercury or Honda.

    I would consider another Lexus only if the price was not much higher than other choices. Otherwise I probably won't buy another one.
  • Interesting question.
    As I have read these posts over the past couple of years,
    I consider myself a fortunate Lexus owner. I am aware of the transmission issue,
    as is my wife, we are both car savvy and we work with it. And the air conditioning
    system odor, keep the cab air filter changed and keep the system clean and free
    from mildew. This is not just a lexus problem. Check with a Ford owner. They make a special spray to run through the system to eliminate the musty smell.

    Otherwise, my 2003 has 50k miles on it and runs very well. Great mileage, quiet on
    the highway, we travel to the country regularly. Have done the front brakes for the first time earlier this year. Replaced the tires just last month. I am a big fan of synthetic lubricants and that is one of the first things I did after buying the car was change all the oils to Amsoil synthetic. No other gremlins so far.
    And yes, the display on the radio and climate control is pathetic in the daylight.
    Would I buy another Lexus. Yes, an Ls 430 or a 460L
    It's about time that someone made a big sedan car again. Even though the 460
    is really not that big.
    Volkswagen Phaeton anyone?
  • x021627x021627 Posts: 148
    Funny that i agree with nearly all of your comments. today the car was in for the 32k service, which is major. I was told I need brakes on both front and rear with about 1mm on front pads and 2 mm on back pads. Cost $750 on a call with only 32K miles. Ridiculous. I was also told that I'm going to need to buy at least 2 tires by the next service (another 5k miles). This will be the 4th & 5th tire I have bought for this car at $195 each. I loathe this car as well and am happy that my lease is over shortly. :mad:
  • acat1234acat1234 Posts: 5
    My 2007 ES 350 has 27,00 miles on it. This is my first foreign car purchase and thought I would get the "best" and not have to worry. Boy - was I wrong!! I should disclose that my previous cars were Olds Auroras (1995 and 2001) which had their own mechanical issues but the normal maintenance items were economical. Also, both cars ran and handled great! In fact, I would have bought another Aurora except Olds was no more.

    Back to the ES 350. The much hyped Japanese technology is so much bull!!
    - Interior temperature controls are virtually worthless. I have more luck with my 2005 Olds van with manual controls. My Auroras were much better at maintaining interior temp.
    - Audio system is a joke for a car this expensive. The GM Bose system just blows Lexus away!!
    - Rain sensitive wipers are virtually useless. Even on the least sensitive setting they continue working, smearing the windshield. I have turned them off. Again, my Aurora's rain sensitive wipers were excellent.
    - Throttle lag is annoying (Just to be fair, the Aurora had a similar problem)
    - The factory tires (michelins) are deplorable! Worn out at 20,000 miles!! Changed to Yokohama with 60,000 mile warranty and have a much better handling car!!
    - The handling is like the old American land cruisers (1970 Olds, Fords, etc.) Again the Aurora was much better!
    - The Lexus sounds like a diesel when you start it up and for the first 2 minutes. Told by the dealer it is caused by the exterior fuel pump!! I don't care why - you would think that the supposedly great Japanese automotive engineers could have figured that out!!
    - The interior material is so cheap that Lexus should be ashamed to market this as a premium auto. The plastic trim between the seats and the doors ( for the light grey interiors) is simply grey paint over black plastic. The paint rubs off very easily exposing the black plastic - very ugly.
    - The exterior paint is comparable to the better US cars - certainly not better!!
    - The car looks identical to the Camry (I saw that when I bought the car but did not count on how irritating it would become!!)
    - The navigation system is good except it cannot be used while driving!! This is the only system I know of with this limitation!! I understand that it is not safe for the driver to use it while driving but you would think that the brilliant Japanese engineers would have installed a sensor in the passenger seat to allow th passenger to use it!!
    - The cost to update the Nav system is $265!! Laughable since I can buy a new Garmin for not much more!!
    - Front end alignment can only be performed by the dealer for around $200 if you have the swiveling headlights.
    - All the dealer services are waaaaayyyy over priced!!

    The good things:
    - Ride is very good
    - Cabin is very quiet while driving
    - Gas mileage is good
    - Engine/transmission has been flawless (except for throttle lag)
    - Even though it looks like a Camry, I do like the body style
    - So far, the dealers I have taken the car to have been very good.
    - The HID headlights are great.

    Personal vital stats: Age - 62, male, other cars currently owned is the 2005 Olds Van and a black/black 2001 Corvette.

    Bottom Line: Will not buy another Lexus, probably trade this one in much sooner than normal. Will seriously consider the new Cadillac CTS for my next car.
  • I have never had any " unreasonable" problems with my '02 ES300. I bought it with about 90K on it and it has 130K now. It has been reliable, comfortable, quiet and has received nice comments from those departing the vehicle. Along with normal service I had to replace the mid coupling in the exhaust system, which is after the catalitic converter, because I ran over a heavily crusted ice mound instead of driving over the other side of the road: the back side of a mountain!!! Without a very savvy mechanic that little stunt would have cost me over 3K through a Lexus dealer. Thankfully that part was the only identical piece in the exhaust which was used in the camry that year. So Mr. Mechanic cut out the puntured piece and braised / welded the new piece in place in the system. Total cost $300.00. This is my first Lexus, before it I drove Caddy or Chrysler. Given its price range I'm very satisfied with Lexus. However, if I'm to buy another "L" it will need more horses in the barn and more " Bose" for the tunes. If I wanted to pick it apart I could but again for the $ it's a nice ride. :shades:
  • The first Lexus I owned was a 95 ES300. I drove this car for 10 years and it was a very good mechanically sound car. Toward the winter of it's life with me I had to replace the AC system, hood struts and starter. Other service items were batteries, tires, brakes but nothing unexpected for driving a vehicle for 10 years. I replaced it with an 2005 ES330 and it has been an excellent vehicle although since being retired have not put many miles on it. I have owned GM products, Ford and BMW and I can tell you that Lexus makes a better car. There service is top of the line and if you wait on a repair in their waiting room it is like your living room at home. They treat their customers with the up most courtesy and they always wash and clean your car after every service. I have recently just bought a 2008 RX350 so now I am a 2 car Lexus owner.
  • rsdlrsdl Posts: 2
    I have been in the Mercedes forum today researching E Series and I see a lot of people claiming they will never buy another one and will buy a Lexus instead. I come over here and see people complaining about Lexus and saying they'll go with MB E Series next time. It's a small world, indeed. :D
  • My first ES was (2 yrs old)when I purchased it. I drove it for almost 8 years and was problem free baring an expensive maintenance issue that is fairly standard for its age. I do take care of my vehicles and the paint finish and body looked very good at near 10 years old.

    I then leased another problem free 2002 ES that I liked very much. I was so glad to get rid of those ridiculous lease payments. No paint scratches and looked great after 3 years.

    Then I leased a loaded Grand Prix GTP beauty with a turbo charged engine. Totally problem free baring rear speakers that needed to be replaced under warranty. I really wanted to keep that vehicle but buy out terms were out of line with its value. I would have been happy to buy another but they are being phased out and the replacement was not available when I needed a car.

    I thought I had good luck with 2 previous models that I would have the same experience. I got my new ES this Feb. It is a very handsome car, with other than standard wheels and just enough pin stripping to accent the color and body. As of right now I will not buy another, and it is only 3 months old! It does not have near the bells and whistles that my GP had but costs more.

    The paint is inferior. It scratches/chips easly showing white lines or spots. This disturbs me. I was commenting about scratches and chips within 2 weeks of ownership.

    I do not like the the push button start and can't wait to get rid of that. It is so annoying. I spend more time looking for the fob or getting annoyed when I get out of the car with the keys in the car and I can't get in the trunk or passenger side. If the key fob is not just the right distance to the sensor again out of luck.

    The radio is inferior to my GP. It is also not set up for satellite radio which I really enjoyed in my GP. They said I could add the capability if I wanted to spend $500.

    It does not have fold down back seats, which I didn't realize I would miss as much as I do.

    No remote start. I was told it couldn't be added because it messes with the security or eletronics of the car.

    Cup holders need improvement too.

    2 cigarette lighters but neither are hot so my phone will not charge while the car is off.

    Another inconvenience is the memory seats. I typically drive my car, however, if my 6'5" husband tries to get in, he has to squeeze in to start the car for the memory button to recognize him. You cannot open the door, push the appropriate button and have the seat move.

    I am a little concerned about the transmission after reading comments. I have noticed some rough shifting a few times. Fortunately not often so far.

    The light grey carpet is really light, pretty, but a bugger to keep clean.

    What I do like: it is silky smooth to drive even if it doesn't have the get up and go that the GP had. It is peppy, but I was much more confident with the power the other vehicle had. When I had to move quickly out of a situation, I was gone!
    It handles well in the snow and slippery conditions. Seats are comfortable and back seat passengers are comfortable too. I am still trying to adjust the mirrors appropriately. So far I am concerned about a pretty big blind spot, but hopefully that will work out with adjustments. It feels like a solid car.

    IMHO it is a good looking vehicle inside and out.
  • tarkiotarkio Posts: 4
    After researching for a year I recently bought a black/black 08 ES with UL package. This car is perfect in every way (for me).

    Quiet as a vault inside, smooth but firm ride (not like a boat), great performance, and incredible quality control. Not a single rattle, transmission is great, and none of the problems that some people say they have had.

    The way the Bluetooth integrates with the nav system and ML sound system is very cool, and my iPod sounds great through the line out to Aux input.

    The ventilated seats are incredibly comfortable for me (6'2") and the upgraded leather is beautiful.

    One of my favorite features is the key fob and push button start. This is the way cars should have always been. At night, the puddle lights come on as you approach the car, and you simply grab the handle and open the door. This is great when carrying a bag or 2 of groceries to the car. No fumbling around for the keys or remote, which is a great security feature for my wife when parked in dark lots at night. And the system won't let you lock the fob in the car.

    Cup holders are solid and big enough for larger cups/bottles if needed, and they are positioned right were your hand falls in front of the center arm rest/console. Nice design Lexus!

    I like to keep the info display on "Average MPG." I reset it when I leave for work and try to beat my MPG record every day. My commute includes residential and turnpike driving, and my current best is 31.2 MPG in morning rush. This is a great teaching tool for getting the most out of a gallon of gas.

    The memory seats are a real convenience with 2 drivers in the family. You can have the key fob memorize your setting position, press the button as you approach the car, and your setting is ready for you when you get in.

    Things I didn't even know until I bought the car: when the fresh air/recirculate button is in auto mode, the incoming outside air is constantly analyzed, and if there are exhaust fumes or other gases it automatically switches to recirculated air. There are several levels of sensitivity for the automatic windshield wipers. The headlights automatically "self-level" to accommodate different passenger weight loads. Holding the trunk release button down opens all of the windows. I park on the top level of a parking garage. This is great as I can vent the hot air from across the lot, thereby eliminating that hot air hitting me in the face when I get in the car parked in the sun.

    I can go on about the great nav system, ML sound system, etc. but you get the idea. This is the best new car experience I've ever had, and I would be glad to do it again!
  • panbabupanbabu Posts: 1
    Since the beginning of the deal from the dealer I was cheated on every step. Contacting Lexus directly was a big mistake as they did little to help and wipe there hands of by saying “we can’t do any thing because they are independent dealers and Lexus will not interfere or service any vehicle directly”. If you can…… just avoid looking for any car from ‘North West Lexus’, Brampton. (I’ve also heard that they are the worst dealers of GTA……… well, too late for me!)
    I am fed up with this dealer, I am fed up with Lexus and I am fed up with this car (ES330).
  • caazcaaz Posts: 203
    Interesting comments. I'm sure you can find the same comments with any brand of automobile. You'll Always have the 2 or 3% that are disatisfied. And they probably are legitimate complaints. I just sold my 03 camry 4 cyl. been thinkijng about an ES. Which obviously is similar since its from the same platform. I loved the camry. Got as high as 40.058 mpg on one of my runs from SO Calif to Phoenix. cruise control @ 65 steady. I drive 65,000 miles a year for work. Plus personal miles. So i like a quiet car and the camry is, or was. I think all cars can endure, as long as the driver knows how to take care of them. i'm surprised about some of the comments in here reguarding the disatisfaction on some of these cars with so few miles. I think i'll dive in and purchase one reguardless of the 2 or 3 % who arent so happy. I trust Car&Driver....Road&Track....Consumer Guide etc.. they all seem to think for the most part, the Lexus is one of the best cars on the road. I think i'll agree with thier opnions. I looked for a nice used Es this week. On Autotrader. Found an 05 ES 330. I think i'll pass on it since the mileage was........... 225,000 YES, you read it correctly....on 3 yr old car. Lol But that tells me something. After having called the seller. He never had any problems with it. 225,000 trouble free miles. Its still listed within 50 miles of zipcode 92620. Check it out. Black exterior, 225,000 miles, $9,700.00 asking price. 7-29-08. So i know purchasing one with 90k miles doesnt mean a whole lot since they are capable of 200k plus..

    Later

    Caaz
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