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Is Cadillac's Image Dying and Does Anyone Care?



  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,068
    I doubt Lexus, and especially Infiniti, will find much success in Europe as Europeans are even more fiercely loyal to their own luxury makes.
  • mediapushermediapusher Posts: 305

    And my point is, when they get to the point where they can afford a Cadillac, trust me they won't buy a Cadillac, they'll buy a luxury Lexus or BMW.

    -- mediapusher
  • MrShift@EdmundsMrShift@Edmunds Posts: 43,635
    Cadillac has a long way to go in terms of market visibility. Even in the USA, aside from selected Cadillac-heavy cities, the Cadillac is a non-entity. It's not even a player in the San Francisco Bay Area for instance. It sometimes seems as rare as a Maserati on the streets.
  • grbeckgrbeck Posts: 2,361
    mariner7: A few years ago, Caddy tried to set up a dealer network in continental Europe. I don't think anything came out of it, because I haven't heard about it since.

    GM decided to sell Cadillacs through its established dealer networks in Europe - either Saab or Opel/Vauxhall, if I recall correctly.

    And I don't know if Infiniti and Lexus will necessarily succeed in Europe, as Europeans don't have the same regard for Japanese cars that North Americans do.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,679
    Well just maybe you are wrong. I have owned Honda, Toyota, Nissan and Lexus vehicles. They were all more trouble than the last 5 GM products I have owned. My wife switched from Mercedes to Lexus in 1990. She is ready to buy another MB or Cadillac. She does not like the direction Lexus has taken. It seems to me that all the folks buying the Japanese cars you have mentioned are interested in is how fast the car goes from 0-60. Would that not be the very rationale you have accused GM buyers of using.
  • punkr77punkr77 Posts: 183
    I think the biggest difference between the American cars and their foreign competition, and why people tend to like either one or the other, is in the way the cars feel. American cars feel big and heavy and handle that way too, the Japanese cars feel light and tight and handle that way. The German cars are kind of in between the two, with Mercedes leaning more towards the American and BMW leaning more towards the Japanese.

    I've driven Accords, Camry's, and Avalons and I've driven several of their American rivals and they all fall more or less along those lines. It's kind of like a mattress, some prefer firm and some prefer soft.

    I'm suprised that all the Japanese cars have been more trouble than the American cars. My experience has been the exact opposite. My 3 American cars were all much more troublesome thatn my 2 Japanes cars. My Mazda 929S and Honda Civic neither had any problems at all other than routine stuff (the Civic had all the factory parts other than belts, filters and tires at 100K). My parents both had similar experiences. Out of curiosity, how long do you keep you're cars?

    As far as car advertising goes, American makes have the worst Advertising. It's all tough guy macho crap. The Hummer comercials always make me gag. Interestingly, Toyota is starting to use that tactic with it's trucks (trying to appeal to traditional American buyers maybe). Car comercials in general seemed aimed at people with a 5th grade education (and maybe 3rd for truck buyers).
  • poncho167poncho167 Posts: 1,178
    I agree. It's hard to believe all these people supporting Japanese companies like they were our own. Right again with the BMW comment.
  • punkr77punkr77 Posts: 183
    Call me a traitor, but I don't look at GM and the rest of Detroit like they're one of "our own" any more. Just because their headquarters are here, doesn't make me feel better about buying from them when they're building more and more cars in Mexico, Canada, and Korea out of more and more parts made in Japan, China, etc. Doubly so after my ownership experiences with the last four Detroit cars I own(ed).

    GM's problems are of their own making. If, as many feel, GM is actually building better cars than Japan then people will buy them. That is unless you think the American consumer is a bunch of drooling morons, in which case we have bigger problems. It took a while for Japan to take away a huge share of the auto market, it will take a while for Detroit to get it back.

    GM hasn't convinced me yet that they have indeed caught up with Japan in terms of reliability, styling, and refinement.

    I feel much more guilty about shopping at Wal-Mart (which I do about once a year) thanks to their poorly paid employees and almost utter lack of US made products.
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,560
    Call me a traitor,

    Ok you're a traitor. :P

    There are three types of people in this world. Those who are good at math and those who are not.

  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 17,694
    >American makes have the worst Advertising.

    I also think the advertising is off point for new marketing. You may be looking at trucks and SUVs and that's consistent with your comments. But I think there needs to be a new slant to the car commercials. And I've seen some change.

    This message has been approved.

  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,068
    I feel much more guilty about shopping at Wal-Mart (which I do about once a year) thanks to their poorly paid employees and almost utter lack of US made products.

    Add Circuit City to that list. They're laying off all their experienced employees in order to replace them with lower-paid new employees. Oh, those experienced folks CAN get their jobs back after 10 months at the same low rate as the newbies. Unbelievable!
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 17,694
    > Circuit City

    Thanks for the info. That will affect my purchasing. I likeliked their order online, pickup in 24 minutes plan. Have bought a few things there I could have bought at BB or Compusa.

    I assume Circuit City is applying the new lower rate workers to the CEO on down? grin.

    This message has been approved.

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,679
    I went Japanese early on. My first Toyota I bought in 1964 a Land Cruiser, lots of engine problems poor copy of a Chevy 6. My last was a 1994 Toyota PU, Problems from 11k miles on, poor warranty. 1978 Honda Accord, an awful car, 2 Datsun PU trucks, 1970 was great the 1976 was a piece of crap. A 1973 Subaru that should have never left Japan.

    I bought a new Chevy truck in 1988 and 4 more. They were all good up till now. I just do not care for the 2005 GMC, tinny build, sheet metal too thin. Wish I had my 1999 Suburban back. It was a GREAT vehicle. Used gas, but nothing is perfect.

    That is why I am considering a 2006 Escalade. My wife wants the GL Mercedes. If I could get the diesel I would go for it. Kind of small but we could manage.
  • mediapushermediapusher Posts: 305

    Is it any surprise that their Chevrolet Volt (Electric Concept Car) was all smoke and mirrors? I knew it the moment I saw the media blitz. It was just that - A MEDIA BLITZ so GM could try and improve it's fledgling reputation.

    GM is notorious for this kind of pipe dream silliness.
  • mediapushermediapusher Posts: 305

    Your mindset of loyalty doesn't seem to factor for people that have an education or learn from their mistakes.

    It seems to me that many people in the 1980's and 90's were ready to be loyal to GM, and they still got burned BIG TIME. So finally they said, "Enough is Enough" and never looked back.

    "Loyalty" only got many people financially exploited by General Motors in the not to distant past and currently.
    Where does this idea of loyalty come from anyway? It's SILLY. Why be loyal to a multi-national corporation who wants us to buy "American" when they won't even buy "American"?
  • snakeweaselsnakeweasel a Certified Edmunds Poster.Posts: 11,560
    This has noting to do with what I said. When have I ever said anything about buying American. All I stated was that there is an anti GM/Ford bias that has no real basis in reality.

    Again many people like yourself would bash anything GM made no matter how good it was and would claim that BMW or MB made better cars regardless of how crappy they were made.

    There are three types of people in this world. Those who are good at math and those who are not.

  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    Please stop this ranting!! Again we will lose this forum and it will become another read only!!!

    We have gone over this crap too many times.

    Lets talk about Cadillac and what it will take to regain some kind of leadership in the world and how they are doing. Not repeating and repeating the past.
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,068
    What year, make and model were these "USA nameplate" cars? What problems did you have?
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,068
    ...I see Cadillac is considering a V-12 powered sedan. I love the looks based on the Sixteen, but I'd stay away from trying a V-12 at this time. They sound impressive, but I've always heard V-12s were nightmares to maintain and repair in BMWs and Mercedes. Cadillac has a great engine in the Northstar, and I'd look for them to further develop it.
  • bumpybumpy Posts: 4,435
    The Benz and BMW V12s were money pits because they were rare and super complicated, not just because they had four extra cylinders. The current rumor has Cadillac doubling the existing 3.6HF V6 to make a V12, so repair and upkeep shouldn't be any worse than the HF. Other rumor has a long-overdue 5-liter "Ultra" DOHC V8 replacing the Northstar in a few years.
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