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Is Cadillac's Image Dying and Does Anyone Care?

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  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,204
    ...not having a car payment. I just can't let the Cadillac's siren song lead me back that way. Hopefully, I can save up enough money just to buy my next car outright. Of course I don't yet NEED a car. My Seville STS is still very healthy.
  • rockyleerockylee Wyoming, MichiganPosts: 13,989
    Oh well maybe you can just wait for that
    600 hp. CTS-V ???? :shades:

    -Rocky
  • rayainswrayainsw Posts: 2,577
    "Sorry, I get media articles emailed to me w/o links. I put them in italics so you know it is not my thoughts. Forget who wrote the one above. "

    Source appears to be:

    TOWERING SUCCESS: Cadillac CTS rises above other sports sedans with its luxury and technical sophistication
    September 27, 2007

    BY MARK PHELAN

    FREE PRESS COLUMNIST

    The highest compliment I can pay the 2008 Cadillac CTS is that five minutes behind the wheel turned me into as big a jerk as when I test a new BMW.......
  • lemkolemko Posts: 15,204
    I'd probably end up killing myself in that machine, but I'll die with a big smile on my face.
  • rockyleerockylee Wyoming, MichiganPosts: 13,989
    That would probably make two of us. ;)

    -Rocky
  • bumpybumpy Posts: 4,435
    Cars like a CTS-V have so many nannies on them that as soon as you do something slightly dumb the computers apply the brakes and cut the power down to 50 hp, so the kid in the primer-coated B16 CRX can fly past you. :surprise: :cry:
  • rockyleerockylee Wyoming, MichiganPosts: 13,989
    They do have a "OFF" button for all those nannies. :blush:

    -rockylee
  • The off button doesn't really shut everything off in most of those vehicles but just changes the limits.

    Sometimes a certain sequence of presses to the button will shut of the stability and traction control sometimes now. Volvo did that on their "R" models. If you pressed the DTSC button a certain number of times in so many seconds it would completely shut off the system.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Without knowing the original source, the information is not worth much, and a lot of your quotes are very long. I consider the car magazines like Automobile, Road & Track and Car & Driver to be good sources. Newspaper reporters/critics/whatever are not as good, but some of them have been doing it for a while, and do have some experience.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    My SRX has an on/off button for the traction control. The owners manual says that if I hold that button down for more than 5 seconds, the stability control will shut down too. I have yet to activate either the traction system or stability control.
  • Probably hard to do in that kind of car in AWD on dry pavement.

    If I floor one of our rovers from a dead stop going into a turn I might activate the traction/stability control but probably not. The cars are just to heavy and with the AWD it is hard to break traction.

    I can't shut off stability or traction control in the rovers either because those systems tie into the Active Roll Mitigation and Roll Stability Control. Plus the stability control in those vehicles is adjustable depending on the road surface using terrain response and terrain sensing software.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    I really have not tried to spin the tires, and do not plan to on dry pavement. I have accelerated hard from a standstill. I am looking forward to getting some snow to drive in though.
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpcontainers/do/vdp/articleId=122751/pageNumber=1

    From the moment he returned from testing an early example of the 2008 Cadillac CTS at the Nürburgring's Nordschleife racetrack in Germany, our Dan Edmunds couldn't stop talking about his experience. "This thing is fun," he said. "The CTS lives up to everything you expect from a car developed at the Nürburgring." He was so enthusiastic, we wondered if he had spent too much time conducting field research into the Vorläufiges Deutsches Biergesetz (provisional German beer law) to properly judge the new CTS's attributes.

    The CTS's new interior treatment has a visual warmth, and interiors from BMW and Mercedes seem cold and austere in comparison, while a Lexus seems antiseptic. The Cadillac's all-new front seats are reasonably comfortable, but some of us begged for more thigh support.
    Standard for the World
    This is the best Cadillac in 40 years. Sure, the direct-injection V6 is only adequate, but it's a great start. Even with the firmest FE-3 suspension package, the CTS proves GM knows how to walk the line between a compliant ride and ultimate handling.

    The exterior styling may only be an evolution of the original CTS, but it's far more successful. It has a bolder stance and chic presence the previous car never did, even in CTS-V form. Meanwhile, the interior and mind-blowing infotainment system remind us of the time when Cadillac was called "The Standard of the World."

    There's a flip side to the affirmation. The curse is that now that we've seen and experienced the exceptional 2008 Cadillac CTS, there can be no more excuses for mediocre vehicles from GM.

    OK, General Motors, you've proved it once. Now the biggest challenge will be to do it again and again. That's how reputations are made.
  • Everyone get's caught up on these acceleration numbers...300HP for the street is overkill. In the suburbs where I live it is next to impossible to use all of the power of a CTS or a BMW without risk of an accident or ticket or both. It's sad but that's the way it is. And the demographic that can afford to buy these cars typically can't afford to lose their license or worse. It is fun to have the power but using it all is another story. We should not all run out and buy 4 cylinder hybrids but this needs to kept in perspective.
  • bumpybumpy Posts: 4,435
    300HP for the street is overkill

    Not in a 2-ton car, unfortunately. :sick:
  • rockyleerockylee Wyoming, MichiganPosts: 13,989
    Well it does do 0-60 in the 5.7-5.8 range with a stick. I "thought" I read somewhere that somebody got a 5.4 0-60 time with a stick. Edmunds, did it in 6.5 with a automatic which is by far the slowest time I've read. :confuse:

    Perhaps they had a couple tons of cement bags in the trunk so the number wouldn't approach the foreign cars they bias. :cry:

    -Rocky
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    While I agree that there is no need for a car to accelerate to 60 in less than 8 seconds, there is also no need to use full throttle from a standstill either. What I have seen for the DI 3.6 is 0-60 in about 6 seconds with the automatic and RWD (source: Cadillac advertising). The AWD is slower. My supercharged 95 Riviera had too much torque from a standstill on icy pavement. I have not found this a problem with my FWD Seville with a northstar V8.
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    It doesn't matter if it's 5.4, 5.7, 5.8 or even 6.5 seconds, the matter is that the car weighs about 4100 lbs. That will just hurt the overall performance of the car no matter how powerful a engine you put in there. When going through a corner you'll feel like you are running with an extra big [non-permissible content removed] attached to your body. I would much rather take a 200HP car that weighs 2700 lbs than this beast.

    Man, and I thought my 3500 lbs car with 300+HP is heavy...

    Nevertheless, the interior is awesome though.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    With AWD it is 4100, RWD is 3900. However, this is more than a 3-series should weigh. But it is bigger than a 3-series too.
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    Even with 3900 lbs it is way overweight. The 535i is around 3500 lbs and that's 400 lbs less than the RWD CTS!!

    If I am not mistaken, the 5-series is also bigger.
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    Even with 3900 lbs it is way overweight. The 535i is around 3500 lbs and that's 400 lbs less than the RWD CTS!!
    535 with the 3.5 Liter/auto is 3700#. 300 hp
    335 with the 3.5 Liter/auto is 3605#.

    The comparable 3.6L/auto is 3872#. 300 hp

    Size wize:BMW5.........CTS..........BMW3
    Length...191.1.........191.6........178.2
    width....72.7..........72.5.........71.5
    height...57.8..........58...........55.9

    So the CTS is as large outside as a 5 series with a 172# differential. For the $20k cost difference GM gives up some lightweight alumium materials perhaps.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 34,305
    Does anyone really cross shop a 5er with a CTS? Really?
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    Problem w/ high output V6's is that they have to revved wayyy up to provide the power.
    Easier to do w/ a stick.
  • volvomaxvolvomax Posts: 5,274
    While I agree that there is no need for a car to accelerate to 60 in less than 8 seconds, there is also no need to use full throttle from a standstill either.

    a Cadillac is not a NEED car either.
    It is a WANT car, and want cars are the ones with the speed and the toys.
    That is why people want them.

    That is why I like the new Caddy commerical,about the car turing you on.
    People who buy want cars want those car to elicit a response,they want to be "turned on" by their car.
    Otherwise, they'd drive a Camry.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    Ummmmm - the inline BMW 6 is 3.000 liters, not 3.5 or 3.35 or....
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    Does anyone really cross shop a 5er with a CTS? Really?

    Probably few. But the comment was the CTS weighs so much more than a 3er but it is actually the size of a 5.
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    Ummmmm - the inline BMW 6 is 3.000 liters, not 3.5 or 3.35 or....

    OK, both at 300 hp. The L6 is more efficient.

    Why is it called a 535 series or 528?
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    528i uses a de-tuned version of the 3.0 I6, same goes for the 525i.

    535i has a twin-turbo version of the 3.0 I6, thus the nomenclature.
  • 62vetteefp62vetteefp Posts: 6,048
    528i uses a de-tuned version of the 3.0 I6, same goes for the 525i.

    535i has a twin-turbo version of the 3.0 I6, thus the nomenclature


    Sorry, I do not get it. What does the 28 mean? 35 mean? I know they are different versions of the 3 liter.
  • sls002sls002 Posts: 2,788
    The first number is the series, as you know. The next two numbers indicate the engine, but also are a trim level I think. Going back a few years, the 325 and 525 models had a 2.5 liter inline six. The more upscale 328 and 528 had 2.8 liter inline sixs. The 2.8 liter engine was bumped up to 3 liters, so then these became 330 and 530 models. When the 3 liter engine for the 330 and 530 models got variable valve lift, the 325 and 525 models got a version of the older 3 liter engine without the more costly variable valve lift (I think). With the addition of turbos, the x30 models move up to x35 models.

    Perhaps it is worth noting that Mercedes model names include a number to refer to the engine, but one should not conclude that the engine's size is used. The current AMG models with 63 in them really have a 6.2 liter engine.

    Cadillac's three letter names do not make a whole lot of sense either; CTS (Catera touring sedan), STS (Seville touring sedan), SRX (Seville utility vehicle :surprise: ), DTS (DeVille luxury sedan - not a sports sedan for sure).
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