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Performance Oriented Factory Tuner Automobiles



  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    I read that somewhere on the net. Now I'm seeing the 450 and 500 hp number throwin' around again. :confuse:

  • wbwynnwbwynn Posts: 246
    These are the benchmarks until the RS6 is released.
  • rockyleerockylee Posts: 14,011
    The 2009' CTS-V will probably be this segments benchmark as far as sedans go. ;)

  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19
    Not much out of Lexus except a tentative Release date of Late March early April 2008 .........

    Got some pictures .......

    I will post any information as it comes available....... ;)
  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19
    So Lexus has given us a bone and told us to look out for the IS-F at the Dealerships ( Northern Virginia, Lexus Eastcoast) on or about 14 January 2008 ( give or take 7 Days)!!!! Along with this great news they also told us there will be 6 exterior color to choose from, 3 interior colors, and a Basic, Middle and Ultra Option Package available. They also told us that we don't know if we'll get all the colors, or interior colors, or Option Package's in this area ............ more to come on this later. They also told us to get our orders in order as fast as possible since the first Year production will be a Limited number and the "first come first served" allocation process will be in effect. So if you have your order in great!!!! If you don't then you might want to think about it quickly.

    Oh yea and lastly the boy's from Lexus said it would be around $60 to $64K +TTP to take one of these home.......

    Stay tuned and I'll post whatever information I can when I recieve it.

  • michael2003michael2003 Posts: 144
    Is the IS-F available as an AWD?
  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19
    The best sources at Lexus say "NO" :mad: ....... it's simply a question of Performance!!!! At 400+ HP an AWD platform would be counter productive, In simpler terms it can't handle the Horses..... we'de have to tune down the Horses and that would be counter productive to the Performance aspects of the IS-F.......... :cry:

    Sorry, the 2008 IS 250 will still be offered as a AWD Model.
  • allargonallargon Posts: 75
    Tell that to Lamborghini, Porsche and Audi. They seem to put a great deal of horses into AWD just fine.
  • michael2003michael2003 Posts: 144
    Sounds like a false excuse. AWD would not require reducing HP, but it would allow for increased HP. However it would somewhat increase weight and reduce gas mileage. Seems like it's really nothing more than a choice.
  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19
    OK Michael Before we start throwing " false excuses" as the answer to the comment let's take a Look at the cars in question. Audi R8, wonderful vehicle and AWD! imagine that Also a "Mid Engine Mount"!!!! Talk about apples and oranges The structual specifications for a Mid Engine Mounted vehicles allow for the rigidity and support need in a AWD vehicle with the accent on Performance..... :confuse: OK the Lambo ........ Damn ....... another Mid Engine Mounted Vehicle. OK then onto the Porsche ...... 911?, Boxer?, Cayman ?, all have the engine in the front, all Performance vehicles ........ Oh Gosh .... NO AWD!!! Wait a minute there is the Porsche Cayenne, that's AWD ..... But it's an SUV!

    So now it looks as if your choice is: do you want a "Mid Mounted Engine" and AWD or do you go for the true Performance vehicle and stick with the rear wheel drive. Anybody care to discuss Apples to Apples????

    Just my $0.02........ ;)
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    Uh...few corrections

    1. 911 is rear engine mount
    2. Boxster & Cayman are mid engine mount
    3. Porsche does offer an AWD 911 version. Targa(?)
  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19
    Again, My point exactly ... Mid-Engine Mount, REAR-Engine Mount both are significatly structured differently to allow for the AWD possibility! Yes or No? :confuse:
  • louisweilouiswei Posts: 3,717
    I don't see how more difficult that a front-engine-mount car to allow AWD than a rear-engine-mount one. But anyway, the point should be that the IS-F DOES NOT need to be AWD, period. Why? I'll give you several whys...

    1. M3 isn't AWD
    2. C63 AMG won't be AWD
    3. The only reason why the RS4 is AWD is because Audi is specialized in AWD and they don't have a dedicated RWD platform.
  • michael2003michael2003 Posts: 144
    My reason for saying that an AWD system would require reducing HP is a 'False Excuse' is that putting AWD would actually allow much greater HP since a 2WD system has limits on how much traction can actually get to the road, so the statement just doesn't seem to make any sense. Please note that I'm also only talking about street legal vehicles used for transportation.

    Adding an AWD system that only puts a small percentage of the traction to the front wheels still allows that much of a percentage of additional HP to be available towards getting traction.
  • twq83twq83 Posts: 19

    Adding HP is just a matter of adding a larger more efficent Engine! What your talking about with traction addition is Torque ( the force that get's the vehicle moving)and this requires Structural and Pitch and roll supports to ensure that the vehicle doesn't tear itself apart over the years. The more weight you add the less Torque you can produce...... hence the less PERFORMANCE the vehicle is allowed to exert on you and your driving experience. AWD adds stability and some Torque at the expense of performance. SEE??? ;)
  • The RS6 is front engined with 580 hp. Anyway the TSX and civic si makes more hp/liter than the IS-F which is supposedly a top performance car, never mind the M3 and RS4 which makes 100+ hp/L. IS-F is an embarrassment. 5L from the M5 makes 500hp, IS-F power is made by M3 with only 4 liters. Lexus should just keep on making nice fine luxury boats and leave the hi performance to others. I'd rather get a 335i which is only a tad slower but more comfy and cheaper to insure. Best yet i don't have to explain myself to my friends why a $20k civic engine has better output
  • skarieskarie Posts: 78
    IS-F is an embarrassment. 5L from the M5 makes 500hp, IS-F power is made by M3 with only 4 liters

    How is this an embarrassment, the lexus produces 370lbs of torque, the M3 does'nt even have 300.. the lexus also has a faster 0-60 time 4.2vs the M3 4.6..
  • You got it exactly right, best-to-worst: "In order, Lexus, Acura, Infiniti, BMW and Lincoln."

    The Lincoln was designed with a compass and a straightedge. Their over-the-hill designers can put their pencils away already. "No more graph paper for you." I would be insulted if Lincoln tried to sell me their interior as entry-level luxury. Just look at that get-up.

    The BMW's redesign took the car from the 80's to the 90's. The orange backlighting looks cheap, and the over-simplistic dash has no character. BMW's are beautiful on the outside, but they make me frown when I get inside, like a VW bag lady wrapped in a fur coat.

    The empty chrome space on the Infiniti dash, combined with the cutouts and small climate controls, are disproportionate, the same problem you'd have putting 14" wheels on one of these cars. They took some cues from the Infiniti M, but did not execute it as well. What's up with those vertical vents? Looking at the car on the showroom floor, the exterior of the Infiniti G is more power than luxury. If you want luxury, keep moving.

    The Acura is nice (I actually preferred the TSX interior to the TL, since I liked the wood trim strip arcing across the mid-dash). I almost bought the TSX. It's nice that their cars come loaded, with NAV as the only option, which works for me. The blue/white backlighting is beautiful. The TSX is the best bang-for-the-buck.

    The Lexus is the best of the lot. My IS250 AWD is on special order for the Mark Levinson audio option. The car will come with every bell and whistle except NAV, which isn't worth $3K, but I'll miss the touch-screen climate controls--pure eye candy. All other entry-level luxury cars (and many more expensive cars) seemed to be missing items I'd want in my car for the next 10 years: hands-free entry (no keys or fob button pushing), pushbutton start, multi-level heated and cooled seats, HID/adaptive lights, electrochromatic rear/side mirrors, real wood trim, AWD--you know, the little things that help boost my carbon score. Even the steering wheel automatically raises/lowers for easy access. Lexus does have the best leather seats, and I can't wait to get my hands around that leather-wrapped steering wheel -- pure happiness. I'm also getting a clear bra and tint, dealer-installed, everything for $35K plus 6% tax. My only quibble with their layout is that the speedometer should be on the right side where it belongs. The only car I'd replace it with in the next few years would be an IS convertible.

    Lexus has more luxury prestige (for me) than any of the cars in this group. From day one, Lexus earned their luxury reputation at a value price over the Euro luxury brands. I would be concerned about owning a MB past the initial warranty, and the trips to the shop for days/weeks would be unacceptable anyway. The price of adding every separate option to get all the bells and whistles puts their cheaper cars into the $50K+ range. I prefer Japanese reliability and price-points. I want trouble-free luxury.

    I never made it to Audi, Saab or Volvo--maybe next time, maybe not. Those guys have always been collected together (in my mind) as faceless, boring, fringe, "rumoured" automakers to anyone from the States. However, the A4 (or A6) I recently saw was sweet as it drove by. But I had already finished my search before seeing it. They probably need more dealerships and should have been making more-noticeable cars all along.
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    Welcome to CarSpace! :)
  • ajvdhajvdh Posts: 223
    Hmm. A center stack that looks just like the rental Camry I had last September, gaudy Tokyo-by-night instrument cluster, fake looking veneer around a "we stole this from Mercedes" shifter, and door panels that look like they were copied from the '95 M3 I used to own. Yeah, that reeks of "luxury prestige."
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