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Ford Excursion vs Chevy Suburban/GMC Yukon XL - The battle of the titans

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Comments

  • retractretract Posts: 13
    protravel, the 2500 burb/xl a closer comparison truck to the excursion that the 1500s. It still has the leaf springs to give some of the "harsh truck feel" you crave. One of the things that I didn’t like about the excursions I have driven was that the front end tended to have difficulty tracking on a washboard road surface. It would get out of sync with the little bumps, become floating and make turning a little interesting. This behavior is systematic of previous generations of trucks. BTW, when I had a 91 burb it would do the same on the front AND rear. Many of the things that give the truck feel are really undesirable characteristics that reduce performance and ground contact. These characteristics are the very targets that the designers focus on in making improvements and will no doubt be heralded as breakthroughs when they occur.

    MY whole point is that “truck feel” has and will continue to be designed out of trucks because “truck feel” is the opposite of performance.

    For example: The F150 line was ahead of the GM offerings up until the recent redesign now the 1500 burb/silverado/yukon/xl is one generation ahead of the F150 in this respect. The super duty line of trucks from Ford is in a class by itself as it is not a variant of the F150 line. The GM Truck 2500's are variants of the 1500's. My 2000 4x4 suburban with autoride stays put better than the current generations (as they are several years old now) of the super duty trucks (and F150’s) but I would suspect that the truckieness would diminish in the next generation of Fords as well.
    If I want a soft ride, I drive my wife's expedition 4x2.
  • sdjaamsdjaam Posts: 3
    Not that it amounts to a hill of beans, but i'll throw my 2 cents in any way. It's all comes down to personal preference on what you like. I know many chev owners who would not touch a ford, no matter how much better the product is...and vice versa with ford owners. I have to agree with Protravel about the chev dealers. I also started out looking at the sub's. I went to 5 in my area. not only was every one of them rude, but when I tried to explain my purpose of why I needed a 2500, and not a 1500 they blew me off with the statement "nobody drives the 2500" (Those are the exact words of 3 idiots from 3 different dealers). For you chev dealers looking at this, you need to talk to your people about the PR thing.....it still goes a long way in my book.
    The ford dealers bent over backwards working with me...even after I got the price way under what they were asking. I have to say that I was very impressed with them. I do a lot of towing and needed a heavy duty tow vehicle that can also hold a herd of kids. But as I said at the start....it doesn't amount to a hill of beans and I know that a lot of people will have just as many bad experiences with ford.......YOU JUST GOTTA LOVE THOSE DEALERS.
  • protravelprotravel Posts: 19
    Thanks sdjaam, I thought the Chevy dealers only hated me.

    retract if you really, really want a smooth ride on your Expedition, get a set of Eddlebrock shocks. I did for my 97 and you will NOT believe the difference in the ride. Some guys have installed the shocks the same day they brought home the Expedition. I called Eddlebrock and they will have a set for the Excursions in two months.

    I agree about the tracking on washboards, but I knew I would eliminate that with the Eddlebrocks.
  • dporthodportho Posts: 1
    I have a 1999 1500 Sub and it is way underpower to tow my heavy enclosed trailer. I'm shopping for a V10 2000 EX because of the torque and horsepower. I ran into an ads local newspaper of a 1993 Sub 2500 for sale. Does anyone know the engine specs for the 1993 2500 Sub, torque, HP and towing capacity?. I know it is a 7.4L but can't seem to find the specs for it. I looked at the 2000 sub 2500 but it looks like the EX V10 puts out more torque & HPs. Should I buy the EX ($40K+ financing) or buy the used sub ($16K pay in full)and deal with the used car problems later. One thing about Chevy dealer, I think they do have an attitude problem. My 99 sub was only 8 months and had a bad leaking of brake reservoir. I had routine services done by these people and they claimed that I overfill brake fluid (not by me!). I took the sub back twice, still have leaking from the cap. I got tired of it and tie the cap down with 2 plastic ties. The brake fluid made a mess & peels all the paint underneath the reservoir and engine compartment. I always like Chevy but I thought to give Ford a try.
  • sdjaamsdjaam Posts: 3
    The only thing about going used, is that u don't know what the previous owner did with the veh, or how well they took care of it. You can end up paying a lot of money for stuff that might other wise be under a warranty. If you look around you will be able to find an EX way under 40k, and then haggle em down from there. I have about 3000 mi on my EX (1300 of which is towing a very large TT) and have not had any of the probs that u hear others talking about (thumps, bumps, sway etc). As a matter of fact, I'm very pleased with it's performance...and it's bone stock. But as with everything, the lemons are out there reguardless of what u get.
  • norman11njnorman11nj Posts: 3
    For all you Excursion lovers out there, check out this link - It says it all !!!
    http://www.businessweek.com/bwdaily/dnflash/may2000/nf00518e.htm
  • jsaucerjsaucer Posts: 1
    I seem to be the exception in how Chevy dealers treated someone ready to buy a Burb. We needed a much bigger vehicle (for 3 kids an lots of stuff) and waited around to the 2000 burb to come out. I called a local dealer on the phone May 4th. He happened to have one on the lot that fit my wants/needs, sold it to me for $600 over invoice and delivered it to my home the next day (I never actualy went to the dealership). I just assumed that higher gas prices and higher inventory numbers on all SUVs were leading dealer to deal on all of these vehicles (burb, Exc and exps).
  • larry91larry91 Posts: 189
    I am the happy owner of a '99 Tahoe LT, fully loaded with an aftermarket sunroof. I am really Happy with this vehicle.The problem at GM, as I see it, is there quest to reduce costs and increase profits. Now there is nothing wrong with this concept so long as u can also maintain quality. For the 2000 model year the jury is still out we'll see.....
    I also have owned Ford cars not the Trucks and I am a Ford fan as well. I was always happy with every Ford product I owned. I am going to buy a 2001 Excursion with the Powerstroke diesel. I am a little concerned about the diesel tho, smell, noise, getting diesel fuel at the diesel pump with all the spills. If this gets on the soles of your shoes and u track it into your Pride and Joy and it starts stinking from diesel fuel, not a very pleasant thought. Also, diesels do take more TLC than a gas engine overall.I have read about the cavitation issue and the need for an additive in the coolant that must be checked regularly for strength, etc.. I would love to hear comments on these points convincing me I have nothing to fear but fear itself
  • ldrldr Posts: 9
    Larry91,
    You may want to go over to the "Excursion Owners Forum" and read my post concerning my Excursion with the Power Stroke Diesel. I am Mr. Fussy when it comes to cleanliness and my vehicles. If you buy fuel at the "truck stops" it can sometimes get a bit messy. I carry a pair of glove under the seat for my hands and you just have to watch where you step. I have yet (in 12,000 miles) caught a wiff of diesel fuel or fumes from inside the vehicle and the scheduled maintenance is not a big thing. Good luck. Travel safe.
  • larry91larry91 Posts: 189
    Thanks for your reply, i appreciate the information. I have one more question regarding Horsepower.
    I am not at all familiar with Diesels, but 235 Turbocharged horsepower for a nearly 8000 lb vehicle seems to me to be pretty "anemic". 2500 lb cars have engines that are more powerful than that and I would not call them fast. If u, or someone out there could explain i would appreciate it.. Thanks
  • ldrldr Posts: 9
    You have got to drive a PSD to believe it! Don't be all concerned with horsepower. Diesels are different, ie, they have a very high torque ratio to horsepower. There are all kinds of tricks you can do to them to get even more power out of them. You would be hard pressed to tell the difference between the PSD and a gas engine. They are a bit (what I call) clickity/clackaty around town (nothing that a good radio station or cd can't eliminate). They are extremely quiet on the highway. If they continue to offer the diesel I will continue to buy them, and I spend a great deal of time in my truck. Travel safe.
  • bowtiebillbowtiebill Posts: 17
    At least they are trying to fix the problems rather than covering them up as many automakers would.
  • agt_cooperagt_cooper Posts: 202
    As someone stated earlier, diesels are different! Don't assume that because a diesel is rated at only 235 HP that is can't move an 8000 vehicle effectively. It is torque that gets you moving and power that keeps you moving. Diesels produce an abundance of torque at very low rpm's, so they get you going quite well (especially considering the weight!)

    Take a look at engines in tractor-trailers and fire engines for further examples. I drive a fire engine with a GVW of about 36000 lbs. It has a Detroit Diesel 6 cylinder turbo diesel, rated at 350 horsepower and about 1,100 ft/lbs torque. It is capable of running at 72 mph, (limited by gear ratio) and it accelerates quite well for a vehicle of that size. As far a fuel economy, we get about 5 mpg!!! (should fire trucks get hit with a gas guzzler tax??)

    Anyway, check out the diesel and decide for yourself.
  • larry91larry91 Posts: 189
    Would u own a diesel for your personal vehicle that u had to live with day in and day out?
    I test drove the Excursion with the diesel and didn't like it at all. It was too noisy and smelly and the Ex rode like a truck. Now, I know, it is a truck...but if Ford wants to sell these vehicles they are going to have make it more like a car. I could handle the diesel on a part time basis, but not full time. I will wait to reconsider buying until next year and hope Ford will make some changes. Now this is just my opinion, I like the looks and size of the Excursion I am just looking for a smoother riding and better handling vehicle.
    As for the noise issue, they do make quiet Diesels, I have heard Big Rigs that were quiet. Isuzu makes a quiet Diesel, why can't Navistar?
  • ldrldr Posts: 9
    Larry,
    This is just my opinion but I am getting so used to this diesel that I would never buy another gas if a diesel is offered. All my salesmen drive Suburbans and Tahoes (9). A bunch of us went out to dinner the other night in my Excursion (now the Black Sheep) and none could believe the performance and did not think the "noise" was objectionable. I've had 3 gas Suburbans and if this Excursion hadn't come along would have a Yukon XL now. Just got 21.16 MPG on this last trip to PA. I must have got a good one! Travel safe.
  • agt_cooperagt_cooper Posts: 202
    I personally wouldn't want a diesel truck unless I really had a need for a truck! If that was the case, I'd definitely consider the diesel.

    My transportation needs do not require the capabilities of a "real" truck, so I'll stick to comfortable, quiet, gasoline powered cars!
  • dwg1dwg1 Posts: 5
    Thanks protravel for the article very informative.
    Purchases boil down to personal choice, sometimes after careful investigation but still a choice. The Excursion looks good to me but my choice was a 00 burb. Eat other vehicles pure lunacy. Small cars driven by over enthuiastic people account for more eaten vehicles vs wolf packs of blood thirsty SUVs. Readers Digest had an article a month or so ago concerning this myth of predator SUVs. Most small vehicles fall victim to other small vehicles, large vehicles other than SUVs (Crown Vics, Buicks, ETC) large commercial vehicles. SUVs account for 5% or less of small vehicle comsumption. We just have a vocal minority that can find problems or create a cause over most anything on this earth. I respect their right to speak, all I ask is become informed before you bash something due to unbridled emotion. Maybe the FED will take some lessons from Ford and save some of our tax dollars.........NAH.
  • doug2001doug2001 Posts: 1
    It really depends on what you want to do with your vehicle. I have a Ford with the PSD. Power is unsurpassed. I tow a 15000 lb trailer and tend to forget that it is there. Love the truck. I however just ordered a 2001 Suburban 2500. I will occasionally tow with the suburban, but bought it for long trips. What I would love is a suburban with the new cummins 6 cyl diesel. That would be the best of both. GM just doesn't have a decent diesel.
  • I don't know how long ago you ordered your new burb but from what I've heard about the new Duramax diesel it's very impressive I don't have the exact HP or torque specs on hand but HP will be around 300 Hopefully they'll get a little fuel econmy as well. Personally I'm not much of a diesel fan. If you don't put at least 30-35K on each year I don't think it you can break even. I live in Western New York and will order a 2001 Burb soon. From what I've found out orders won't be accepted until the first or second week of July. I'm going to order the 8.1 litre this time, lots of HP and torque, 345 HP, and 5-speed allison automatic. The Duramax is backed up by the allison as well, and is supposed to be an Isuzu-GM joint venture. I do think the Cummins 24 valve is the best on the road right now as far as power and fuel economy. Let's hope Chevy can finally get a diesel out there that will impress us Chevy lovers. Travel safely.
  • jkpopsjkpops Posts: 1
    chvey had the buban longer than any 1 so ford needs to stop copying gm
  • cardoctorcardoctor Posts: 3
    own a 98 4wd sub.drove a 00sub car like ride good power.its smaller inside not as much leg room between 1st-2nd row of seats.no overhead console where do you put the garage door opener.00 excursion its big ,lots of leg room more standard
    features than gm doesnt ride like a car but its not any rougher than my sub .its a truck not a van or station wagon.since both trucks have good features and bad features. i think the excursion
    has the least bad features.
  • cardoctorcardoctor Posts: 3
    before you complain learn how to spell
  • boattowboattow Posts: 2
    I have seen mentioned a few times the availablilty of the 8.1 litre engine being available in the 2001 suburban. My local dealer(s) are of no value. Anyone out there know if this is a reality ????

    Thanks in advance.
  • css3css3 Posts: 6
    Oh where oh where was Chevy in the Daytona race last week.

    Read it and weep boys...Ford 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th.
  • scongroscongro Posts: 80
    Hey everyone! Buy the Excursion!!! At the Pepsi 400, the Fords had the top 5 spots., and I can see Suburban sales going down like a prom date. Chevy needs to improve its racing program, or the Excursion will be king!
  • Jeff, Don't plan on alot of help from your GM salespeople most of them don't know whats new each year. I'm a real Chevy truck freak and love all the rare options available that the salesman don't even know about. As for your question the 2001 3/4 ton Suburban will be offered with the 6.0 liter, 8.1 liter or the Duramax diesel I think 6.6 liter. I live in Western New York and my cousins son does subcontracting work for GM on the fuel injection systems as far as improvements go for better fuel economy and so on. He has actually laid eyes on a 2001 Suburban with the 8.1 engine, SQUIRT!!, he's a big block nut as well, and found out that the 8.1 is the 454 stroked and bored so reliability should be awesome. All 454's are built in the Tonawanda engine plant but I haven't found out for sure if the 8.1 engines will only be built there as well. Every GM dealer has an option book about 4 inches thick that is much more detailed than the computer. I have a half dozen very close friends involved in the sales end of things and this allocation deal stinks, the way it works is every new model year every dealer gets to place their stock orders one of each model for inventory purposes, before they get order entered (at the factory) they can be changed to the exact specs that you want and the order is changed from stock to retail sold. When you have hot vehicles, limited production, the dealers basically sell to the highest bidder (they wont admit it) but thats why the truck never shows up. After inital order entry the dealers can't place an order until they have allocation. They get new allocation every Tuesday that tells them what they can order so if you want a crewcab shortbox who knows what Tuesday, what month, the dealer can place the order? NOBODY!! So the dealer takes your deposit so he doesn't lose the deal hoping allocation will come up on the vehicle soon. Let the fibs begin. Gee we haven't heard anything yet, yea right it hasn't even been ordered yet but they won't tell you that. Supposedly they are revamping the allocation system but I haven't heard anything for sure yet. Enough complaining, I hope this helps some of you guys.
  • css3css3 Posts: 6
    Sure does help....me buy a FORD
  • boattowboattow Posts: 2
    Thanks thanks thanks for the info on the 2001 Suburban. I really would rather buy a Suburban over an Excursion (the Sub. will fit in my garage) for big towing. I tow a 38 foot cigarette boat from Ill to Florida (currently using a '96 Sub2500 and would like a NEW truck-the current vehicle works GREAT, it is just getting up in miles >65Kmi.) and the extra torque on the low end of the v-10 over the 6.0 litre seemed desirable. However, with the sub. engine upgrade possibility to 8.1 .....well, I will press the dealer and fingers cross. Any advice on a dealer or ???? to actually GET the vehicle rather than a bunch of B.S. ???

    Again,
    Thanks.
  • From my experiences the smaller dealers have always treated me much better than the big ones. The dealer I got my 99 burb from had been trying to get allocation for a burb every year for 9 years. The larger the dealer, the more volume of vehicles, the larger their allocation, but if you don't have one sold you get no allocation. When the dealer sold mine to me he got allocation for a second one, and so far I think he has sold six this year. In the next two weeks all the dealers will be able to place their initial order entries for the 2001 trucks, my advise to you is find a small dealer that you feel you can trust and have his initial order entry include your new burb. Once he shows one sold he'll be able to get another and thats the only way the small dealers can increase their allocation, so everybody wins. The reason you have to trust the dealer is so he won't sell it out from under you and because when you buy at the time of order entry the dealer won't be able to give you a price because the pricing doesn't usually get to the dealer until the last week in August or the first week in September. I think the smaller dealers value repeat business more so they will treat you better. Try to buy it for so much over invoice, most dealers will show you the invoice, and without knowing the exact price it's one of those deals where you gotta trust them and they gotta trust you. The only other downfall to ordering on order entry is if they come out with any new options different from the previous year you won't know about them until it's too late. Even if you think you end up paying a little too much for it I think it will be a very in demand truck for quite a while, so you'll get your monies worth! I know for a fact they will be hard to get, so don't wait to long. I'm talking specifically about a 2500 with the 8.1 which is the only way you can get the 8.1. I've always been a big fan of the rear doors on the old body style but when I order my new one (in two weeks or less) it will have the liftgate on it. I really like that design change but I was hoping they would have went to the dutch doors instead. Not many other options have changed except for fog lights, which I will also have. If you want to talk about it more Jeff E-mail me and I'll give you my phone number, hope this helps Suburbansrule
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