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Land Rover Discovery and Discovery II

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Comments

  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I'm not in sales or marketing, so I can't give pricing. Even if I could it would just be MSRP, the retailers are independent businesses that sell the vehicles at what price they feel is justified by the market. I've never heard of a "Moab" package, it's probably something the retailer put together.
  • at1963at1963 Posts: 7
    Thanks for your help on the subject. I just noticed that on edmunds the true market value is just above invoice and it seems that some people are getting good deals on them. On the kit the dealer told me they did not install it perhaps at the incoming port. Again thanks for the response
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    Oops, I'd better read the marketing bulletins closer. The Moab package was a port installed package. Since most of our retailers in any given area are owned by the same person (North and South Houston are an example of this) you may not find the dealer to dealer competition that other makes have. Also a lot of our retailers are stand alone and don't generate the volumes necessary to sell at invoice or just above without a compensatory plan like the X-plan. X-plan is a Ford program that is for partner companies and organizations and Ford Employee friends and families. There are a couple of threads in the Smart Shopper Topic that explains X-plan.
  • hatton3hatton3 Posts: 13
    I have noticed a few recent comments on whether ACE is worth the extra money. Having owned a number of Discos in recent years the current Series 2 7 seater with ACE has the sweetest road manners by far (on the best 4X4 by far). Discos have always held the road well (believe me I've hustled them all through very tight corners on the very narrow roads that we specialise in here in the uk) but the early Series I models without anti-roll bars often felt like a yacht at sea. This wouldn't bother the wheel hugging driver too much (except an occassional bruised ear when it smacked off the side window)but passengers (particularly rear seat) and baggage often suffered badly. The later Series I had anti - roll bars as standard and this made a big difference (everything is relative) but there was still a lot of rocking and rolling. Without ACE the Series II is another big leap forward in road manners but, believe me, with ACE this vehicle will skip through tight switch back corners without any hint of drama. The tyres feel totally planted on the road and the passengers and baggage stays exactly where they are supposed to be. Now I know you guys in the US have lots of very wide very straight roads and if the majority of your drive time above 50 mph is on such I guess ACE could be an unneccessary and costly extra. However if you do frequent curvey roads with fast and tight corners I would definitely recommend spending the extra. You (AND YOUR PASSENGERS) will love it !
  • atk1963atk1963 Posts: 1
    Tin cup & brianvolvo
    today we were looking at a disco 2se7 that the dealer is calling a representatives car. we seemed to be getting it for a good price with some miles on it 2464. The question is that the key has cad(assume Canada) on it but I don't know if it is referring to the vehicle or just where the key was made. If a Canadian car any problems warranty wise? I noticed that is said it needed to be serviced soon and sounds as if it could use an oil change. Could you please check the IN number - SALTW12481A703674 We had fun driving it home and I feel like a kid with a new toy. Haven't signed anything yet except for credit check. Also not clear whether they are truly allying the -plan or not a bit of runaround. though the dealer did show me what the invoice price would be but did not get to keep it. Also he mentioned that we would be charged for the document fee, unless fomoco wanted to pay them directly, which my understanding is no doc. dealer,etc fees. how do we prove this, still have not y
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    The Keys on the Discovery have a CAN then a number. This is the equivalent to the FCC number that is on the same sticker. Since this is a transmitting device it has to meet Canadian and US standards for such devices, that is what the numbers are for. I'll check the VIN when I get back to work tomorrow.
    As far as X-plan, the retailer does not have to honor the plan. But if they do it will be 4% over the A-plan price (not invoice price) listed on the invoice. They cannot charge doc fees if they are selling this on the X-plan. Taxes and tags are your responsibility, but internal doc fees are not allowed. It is clearly stated on any X-plan literature. If he does not believe it, tell him to contact his marketing rep at LRNA (not me).
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    The vehicle you were looking at was a LRNA Company vehicle. No problems under warranty.
  • unsure3unsure3 Posts: 8
    Tin cup,

    I understand you're in the employ of RNA, which is why I'm directing this query directly at you. I hope you can help. Of course, anyone with relevant input is more than welcome to respond.

    I was provided with a weekend demo car by a local dealer - a 2001 series II Discovery SE7 ACE with about 23 miles on it. It was a joy to drive for about the first 30-40 minutes or so. Then as we (my fiancŽe and I) were coming off a feeder at around 25-30mph and 2000rpms, the car continued to accelerate despite my foot being off the accelerator. I tried braking (v. hard - pressed into the back of my seat), but only had limited success. I put the car in neutral - while it was still accelerating - and it continued to rev up to the reline (quickly) where it bounced back and forth for a couple of seconds before coming down the idle rev range. I was able to replicate the problem 6-7 times after this incident. It seems to start when the car hits a combination of 25-30mph and 2000rpm - it then starts to accelerate briskly.

    This all happened on Saturday evening. I got in the car on Sunday morning to see if things had somehow miraculously changed. They hadn't. This time I decided to try something else. When the car hit the 25-30mph/2000rpm range and started accelerating, I gently tapped the accelerator to see what would happen (when my car idles at accessive revs, this tends to reduce the revs). It immediately jumped to the reline, but this time didn't subside. I turned off the engine, and re started, whereupon it immediately jumped to the reline again. I tried this a couple more times, with the same results, and eventually called Land Rover for a tow truck which arrived within 40mins. The car's on the way back to dealer for a further diagnostic.

    Note: neither the throttle cables nor the accelerator pedals seem to be stuck - I opened the hood, and tried revving the car a couple of times in 'P', and they seem to work perfectly. It's as if the car's set on cruise control and trying to reach a ceratin speed. Cruise control was actually disengaged throughout the experience, except when I started playing with it to get the madness to stop - to no avail of course.

    Needless to say, this was a pretty mind-blowing experience. However, I'm still willing to give the car some thought, but I'd like to know the following:

    To your knowledge, have similar problems been reported in NA or elsewhere in the past? If so, what was the cause and the fix?

    I've asked the dealer to look into this on my behalf (as a potential customer and to address three specific requests:
    1. Correctly diagnose the cause (seems like its engine management related, but what do I know)
    2. Fix the problem, explaining how
    3. Explain why the 2001 series II I may be purchasing from the dealer won't have the same problem - i.e. list preventative measures.

    The dealer, who's been v. supportive throughout this entire experience, is obliging on all 3 counts.

    On an an interesting sidenote, my brother's about to embark on a 15000 mile trek in a old converted military Land rover from London to Chine (www.le2001.org). While is car dates back to the 1970s (I believe), it has experienced similar problems in first gear and reverse. The car revs to the redline for no apparentl reason. And this is a car with a minimum of electronics & with a manual transmission. Land Rover UK has very kindly sponsored his trek, though, and will undoubtedly be able to rectify the problem when the car is inspected/serviced free of charge as part of the sponsorship package. This is great, but it still begs the question of: "is this a common problem"?
  • hockeydochockeydoc Posts: 2
    Friday I took delivery of my new Disco II SE, Java Black/Bahama Beige, with ACE. Headed up to the Catskills on Sat and down to the beach on Sunday. I love this vehicle! We first were heading towards the '02 Ford Explorer Limited with the safety bells & whistles (kids) or a Volvo S60 to complement our V70XC. On a lark, we test drove the Exp and Disco back to back. The results were clear -- the Disco had the European handling I love on a serious SUV. Around town I get all the acceleration I need in Sport mode, and the 18" tires on the performance package with ACE give me a great feeling of security, along with an exceptional ride.
    I do have one question for you: there's a pronounced "purr" when creeping in High range lower gears(1-2) around 1000 rpms. Feels like it's under my butt moreso than in the engine. Doesn't bother me, just wondering if it was part of the LR experience or break-in, whatever. TIA
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    I'm not a technician, so I don't know what would be causing your problem. I do know that it is very uncommon, as the Technical people hadn't run into it before. As far as this having anything to do with a 70's era vehicle, that is impossible. Those vehicles had points ignition and carburetors, engine management systems hadn't been invented yet.
  • odiopusodiopus Posts: 47
    I went in to the dealer on Friday and the manager mentioned your name to me but it didn't ring a bell. I guess you read my post on the site.

    You can call Steve Muffley at 281.249.2000. Tell him Paul Garcia told you about him. He'll treat you right. The service is 100 times better than the Centre on Katy Road. I think they might still have two or three SE7s with PPK and RAC. (White Gold, Epsom Green, Oslo Blue).

    I didn't actually see the sticker price on the Disco because they had to bring it in from Dallas, but I believe it should be somewhere around $42,800.00. The X-Plan is for Ford family and friends and I qualified for the purchasing plan through my employer since they have a partnership with Ford. If you ever go into the Centre, you'll notice they have Compaq computers. Land Rover is currently offering 4.9% financing with 5% down. Hope this helps.

    Odiopus
  • odiopusodiopus Posts: 47
    The North Houston and South Houston Centres are owned by different companies. The North is owned by Park Place and the South is owned by Momentum or Advantage. The South Centre has a bad reputation and most of the Centres around outside of Houston don't like dealing with them because of past experiences.

    Odiopus
  • at1963at1963 Posts: 7
    Tin cup, Thanks:-) for the info, Well we looked over the papers and the financial manager said he could not remove it. It is only 50 dollars and I wasn't sure whether to argue over that amount or not. I did tell him that I would be getting the pin number on wed or Thursday. But he did not reply or say anything. We will most likely be getting the car since it sees to be a good deal SE7 ARC, Climate pkg, 35200, 2500 miles on it. I just wanted to be sure since sometimes one wonders if the deal is too good to be true. Odious, Scott at the North store he was so nice, but since I had spoke to this guy at the katy store, kind of felt obliged to give him a chance to work with us. But i must say that just in speaking with the different individuals at the north store, you may be right about what you said. So for servicing does it matter where you but the service aggreemnet, do you have to to that store only? We found out that we do quality for the 4.9% so that is sooo cool. So in a couple of days we should know more.....
    Again thanks to both of you for the advice and help!
    Yeah i am going to contact Scott tomorrow and thank him for his wonderful explaination of the x-plan on paper.
  • samzurc1samzurc1 Posts: 19
    We are looking into buying a 99 Disco II SE-7 for 24,000 with 30400 miles. The owner will change the tires(uneven wear) and all brake pads if we buy it. Still under factory warranty. Good deal or what? The car is in excellent condition even has an A stainless steel brushguard and an harmon Kardon 12 speaker stereo system. By the way he is leaving for Europe on Sundayand he still owes 24,000 plus on the car to BMW financing. He told us to just send the check to BMW and he will do the same. Any red flags here. Comments and suggestion will be well appreciated. More power to everyone. Thank you.
    Additional Questions....
    1. Do I have Land Rover dealership check it out or have independent LR check it. $120 difference between the two.

    2. What will I expect from this vehicle. This board is really making me feel queasy about getting this vehicle.

    3. My wife likes it very much. Is it true that if I just take this LR to its scheduled maintenance, NO PROBLEMO till at least 250,000 miles.

    4. What's the pros and cons between buying a RX300 or MDX versus the 99 DiscoII SE-7.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    When you get your PIN number, ask the operator about doc fees. Tell them that the dealer won't take it off. Doc fees are a no-no that could cost the retailer the money that Ford pays them for the X-Plan deal (which is what makes the A or X plan sales profitable for the dealer). It may be only $50.00, but it is $50.00 that the dealer is not entitled to under the program.
  • tincup47tincup47 Posts: 1,508
    If you decide to have an independant check it out, make sure they have the right equipt. The Land Rover computerized diagnostic equipt. is not available to independant shops, and although there are alternatives available they may not be able to check everything ours does. The dealer can also check the complete warranty history, and if the person you're buying from had it maintained at a dealer they can get that too.
    Any vehicle can have problems regardless of maintenance performed. There are no guarantees that any vehicle will last 250,000 miles with no problems.
    As to pro's and con's, that is something that is so different for every individual it is hard to say. For someone considering off-road use, there is no question, the Discovery is going to out perform the RX300 or MDX. They will be better on road, if carlike ride and handling are more important. All SUV's have to make compromises between on-road and off-road prowess, it is almost impossible to build a vehicle that excels at both. Ultimately, you need to drive them all and decide what is most important to you, no one else can make that determination.
  • waskowasko Posts: 103
    Samzurc1:


    A quick check of www.lrx.com shows that the DII that you're looking at seems to be consistent with other vehicles in that price range. Also, a scan of http://carpoint.msn.com/kbb/ seems to also show that the price is right.


    Just pass the last 7 #'s of the VIN # on to Tincup and he can do a quick check of the vehicle's service history to see if anything is out of the ordinary. Tincup - thanks again for providing us with this valuable service!


    Also, as a person who recently purchased a Land Rover inspection (on my OWN vehicle), I would highly recommend going the Rover dealer route. They have great insight into the little things and really pointed out a few things I could do to avoid problems moving forward. The one I had done on my '96 SE7 was a 50 point inspection.


    Also, on RX or MDX - those vehicles are worlds apart from a Rover. Rovers are more truck-like while the other two you mentioned are much more car-like in response and feel. In fact, I think they're both based on a car chasis. It really boils down to a few things - namely - will you ever use it offroad, and which feel/experience do you prefer?


    I for one prefer the feel of the Rover and found the others to be a bit too car-like. I've test driven the Mercedes, Acura, Lexus, Toyota LandCruiser, and Chevy Trailblazer (in addition to the DII).


    The only other vehicle that I've test-driven that made me do a double-take was the BMW X5. And it was for an entirely different set of reasons. In addition to my '96 Disco, I've also got a '97 Defender 90. I've been taking the D90 offroad and into the mountains and it has been doing an awesome job at satisfying my 'truck' urges. But I've also yearned for a car since I gave them up in 1994 with my Jeep Cherokee purchase (the start of my SUV career).


    The X5's sporty BMW handling, thoughtful german engineering, and more fuel efficient 6 cyl engine that does 15-20mpg (with many people getting 23+ highway) are extremely appealing to me. It also satisfies my desire for a car and an SUV - in one purchase.


    Those are the 2 vehicles I'm currently contemplating, but the DII has an inherent advantage (IMHO) in price (lower), financing (4.9% APR), X-plan (gotta love it), and appeal. So at the end of the day, barring any irrational (I'm already trying to talk myself out of the X5!) decisions, I'll be maintaining two Rovers in the stable over the next 30-45 days. In addition, my wife is seriously eyeing the Freelander, so we're a bit odd in our Rover tastes :) Keep that in mind when evaluating my post! :)


    Best of luck and let us know what you chose, either way.


    Regards, wasko

  • samzurc1samzurc1 Posts: 19
    I appreciate all your insights on my querry ...will give tin cup the vin #'s ... how about those brakes and tires scenario...any red flags here?...how much is it to change the pads at the dealer? thanks again. how about mpg on hwys and city.
  • waskowasko Posts: 103
    All:

    Just thought I'd share this with you. I've been posting on this forum for a couple of years now and can remember the quality issues with DI's, including mine. For the most part with a few exceptions, these have gone away in the DIIs.

    It's easy to not see the forest through the trees and to think that Rovers are the only vehicles plagued with build issues. Some readers have expressed uneasiness in buying DIIs based on the posts here.

    As I evaluate the BMW X5, I can't help but notice problems that MANY BMW owners are seeing:
    * two major recalls this year alone
    * radiator overheating - could lead to fire
    * stalling issues at slow speeds
    * tailgate button issues
    * random Check Engine Light
    * Open Tailgate light
    * key/seat memory issues
    * random locking door problems
    * squeaking tailgates
    * dashboard indicator lights constantly on
    * AC blowing cold in front, hot in back
    * heater blowing cold in front, hot in back
    * etc.

    As I've made mental notes on DII issues over the past year (with rkoesler's difficult DII being the exception), the DII problems seem to be much smaller, like:
    * rattling sunroofs
    * squeaky back seat
    * one transmission issue (warrantied)
    * the recent accelerating issue (loaner vehicle)
    * radio quiet with rear headphones (design?)
    * etc.

    So, let's tip our hats and our pints to the quality job that the folks at Solihull are doing. British engineering at it's finest - perhaps BMW's influence on LR was better than it was for BMW themselves :)

    Thanks - wasko
  • waskowasko Posts: 103
    Samzurc1:

    Brakes should religiously be checked every 10-15,000 miles - Rovers are notorious for eating brake pads. Depending on driving factors (stop and go city driving or lots of downhill), some folks will get ~10k off the pads, but most get 20+k off of them.

    As for the uneven tire wear, I can't comment on that. Could be something as simple as the tires being improperly balanced. Again, as I culled through 100's of previous posts in my own research recently (as I prepare for the DII purchase), I can't recall seeing uneven tire wear as a general issue.

    Also, I think mpg is 13-17 on the DIIs. Tincup or other '99 DII owners could comment for a fact but I think it's the same even for the '00s and '01s.

    Thanks - wasko
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