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The New Scion 2008 xD



  • ohplezzohplezz Posts: 74
    This has got nothing to do with the xD but everything to do with MPG. I wish VW would build a reliable car. Their TDI jetta will get 50 mpg. But a VW will brake down at least once a month. Honda has had a civic diesel out in europe for about two years now. The 2.2 CDI. I wish they would release it here. NOW. But I know, emission laws. The xD will get better mpg than what the new epa standards suggest. How good I don't know. I'm going to buy one later this year. I let you guys know then. :confuse:
  • eldainoeldaino Posts: 1,618
    Comparing a Rabbit to a Civic is apples to oranges \

    why is it apples to oranges? they compete in the same class!!

    You do realize i'm talking about the 2007 rabbit right?

    Wether your an engineer or not means nothing; 500lbs is A LOT. Ifi i stuck the 2.5 from my bunny into my old civic, i would be going much more quickly then i otherwise would.

    Do you really need to be an engineer to understand the concept of weights impact on a car with regards to engine size? Sure hp, torque, redlines, transmissions and gear ratios play a factor as well; but the 2 most important ones, hp and torque, are probably the two biggest determining factors after weight.

    Why do you think there is a general consensus that weight is sports car enemy #1?

    I drive my car with just me and my wife, and when we fill up the backseat, you do notice it. And we are talking what about 375 extra lbs? (depending on the people of course.) even without timing myself you can tell that the car struggles more to accelerate.

    to say that weight has no impact, even a slight one, on mpg OR acceleration, is totally absurd. It does and thats just how it is. You can post 10 pages of why in your experience you think it doesn't, but that wont change a thing.

    (i.e. look at edmunds comparo of the gti vs. si. here you have cars with similar hp, but one (the gti) with a lot more torque. But its also carrying about 280lbs more of weight, which translated into ONLY slightly faster acceleration. Pretty sure weight had SOMETHING to do with it there.)

    I like the xd. Cant wait for it to come out. :P
  • mcmanusmcmanus Posts: 121
    All I'm trying to communicate is that I know 500 lbs extra should make a difference in mileage, but I've not experienced it making a difference in the real world. Have you (under at least semi-controlled conditions)?

    I know weight affects acceleration and handling, I just haven't seen it affect mileage. Please don't put words in my mouth and please try to keep an open mind.

    Maybe I'm out of it, but most of the "hot" cars I see kids driving are pathetic little things like a Cobalt SS or an old 70s Novi (former Grandmother's car) with big wheels/tires.
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    I am thinking this way: when you got 4 people in a car (like my 6 yr old corolla), you'll need to step on the gas pedal deeper and longer to get the car going, compare to a single driver. That means a whole lot more fuel got sprayed through the injectors.

    OTOH the mileage won't change much if you stick the same number of people in a suburban.
  • crabbymancrabbyman Posts: 9
    500 lbs does make a difference. It will be less notable the bigger the vehicle. I.E. - 500 lbs. in a Hummer, you won't feel a difference. 500 lbs. in Civic, you will feel a difference. old Geo person made a HUGE difference in how it accelerated, gas milage, and cornering. This is even when the person in the passenger seat only weighed ~100 lbs.

    So its all dependant on many factors.
  • eldainoeldaino Posts: 1,618
    am thinking this way: when you got 4 people in a car (like my 6 yr old corolla), you'll need to step on the gas pedal deeper and longer to get the car going, compare to a single driver

    exaclty. Your car has to work harder in general when more weight is added, and yes my mileage did suffer as a result.

    Common sense.

    Still wondering why a civic and rabbit can be compared though. :confuse:
  • rovertonroverton Posts: 20
    Just picked it on on Friday and too a 324 mile trip for a mpg of 30.1.
    This baby rides smooooth and without wind noise. Another reason for liking this is when hitting bumps on the road it is smooth compared to other vechiles driven.
    The only complaints are:
    - No arm rest for the passenger
    - For the driver, the left arm has no where to rest logically as the bottom of the window is to high and the area where the button are is too low. Otherwise this is a great buy.
    -The backseat room is great.
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    but your metro can go faster on a highway going downhill with two people ;)

    I once had a sub 2000 lb car. I can go to about 70 mph before I felt the air rushing underneath starting to lift the car. With 4 people on board, at 85, the car is still riding solid.
  • eldainoeldaino Posts: 1,618
    do you have an xb or an xd? Because you posted this in the xb forum as well....

    or do you have both? ;)
  • ohplezzohplezz Posts: 74
    Sorry about posting in the xB forum. I have a kawasaki ninja :shades:
    But I'm thinking about getting the xD when it comes out.
  • aathertonaatherton Posts: 617
    "... but your metro can go faster on a highway going downhill with two people..."
    The acceleration due to gravity is independent of weight. A 5 pound weight and a 10 pound weight would fall at the same speed in a vacuum. So would a feather and a cannonball. And so would a bullet whether it is shot horizontally or dropped. We experience heavier things falling faster than light things only because of air resistance affects light things more.
    In the case of a Metro whose air resistance does not change, increasing the number of people inside the car's envelope does not increase the downhill speed. But putting the any people on the roof would decrease the downhill speed.
  • 719b719b Posts: 216
    everything you said is accurate, but that metro better have a good set of brakes if it's going down hill with a full load.
  • ohplezzohplezz Posts: 74

    First Drive: 2008 Scion xD

    I got a little worried when I learned the new Scion xD shares its platform with the subcompact Toyota Yaris, a car purely about point-to-point transportation that's not the least bit entertaining to drive. After a brief drive in Scion's four-door hatchback, which goes on sale in August, I can safely say the new xD has a much more engaging personality than the Yaris, and it should definitely be on your list if you're shopping for a small car.

    One of the Yaris' biggest problem areas is its weak, 106-hp four-cylinder engine. The xD uses a larger 1.8-liter four-cylinder that makes 128 hp, giving the car sufficient power to accelerate briskly in suburban driving. A five-speed manual and four-speed automatic transmission are offered, with the manual returning EPA-estimated gas mileage of 27/33 mpg and the automatic delivering 26/32 mpg (using the more severe EPA testing procedures that go into effect beginning with 2008 models).

    The xD's suspension has a knack for damping bumps in the road while still providing a sporty driving experience. It steers with a light, sporty touch, but the steering wheel could really use a telescope adjustment to better accommodate different-sized drivers. The fabric seats were comfortable during my short drive, and over-shoulder views aren't compromised by the car's large D-pillars.

    The standard 60/40-split rear seat slides back and forth and also reclines, but both of the levers that control these movements are located on the top of each backrest. This makes for awkward adjustment when sitting in the seats; levers mounted near the hips would be easier to use.

    Overall, the xD is a nice package, with air conditioning, cruise control, side curtain airbags, a Pioneer CD stereo and remote keyless entry among its standard features. Pricing information has not yet been released, but it should start at significantly less than the $15,650 base price of the brand's new xB.

    I wish they were reviewing the 5 speed. Auto is boring and does not have the gearing/power for big city hways.
  • crabbymancrabbyman Posts: 9
    I can attest to that!

    Don't ask me why I did it but...I once had 5 people in that 3 cylinder Metro traveling about 35 miles. That car neither wanted to stop nor go forward too fast with all that weight in there!

    Never really thought of the amount (225+100+300+130+160) approximately 915 pounds of people. I think the max weight occupancy with cargo in the Metro was 300 or 400 pounds. I don't remember.

    Although, I would take one of this gen's Suzuki Swift's in a heartbeat!
  • nwngnwng Posts: 664
    hmmmm... thanks for the physics lesson. Here's another one: would it take more or less fuel for the said metro to go downhill at the same speed with different number of people on board?

    And another one: air travels under the metro at a pretty good clip during this downhill highway run. More air travels under the car with one person than with 4 guys which lowers the vehicle's height.(if you stick 4 adults into any compact car, it will lower the ride height at least an inch). Will that decrease the air resistance(less air goes under the car thus less air resistance) and it allows the car to go faster at the same engine speed?

    curious mind inquires
  • aathertonaatherton Posts: 617
    "... would it take more or less fuel for the said metro to go downhill at the same speed with different number of people on board?"

    The number of people in the car does not change the air resistance and so does not affect fuel going downhill. Unless the engine is used to accelerate the car downhill, in which case more people will take more gas to accelerate.

    "... if you stick 4 adults... less air goes under the car thus less air resistance... allows the car to go faster at the same engine speed?"

    The height of the car off the ground does not affect air resistance unless the car becomes so low that it can push the air aside and have no airflow under the bottom. Adding people won't do it. This takes a very low suspension plus some ground effects panels.
  • Kirstie@EdmundsKirstie@Edmunds Posts: 10,676
    Interesting physics discussion, but...
    anyone have thoughts that are directly relevant to the xD? :)

    Need help navigating? - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • eldainoeldaino Posts: 1,618
    Their TDI jetta will get 50 mpg. But a VW will brake down at least once a month

    you sound so certain! 'at LEAST once a month'....

    mine has yet to do it! but again its a newer vee dub.

    when will the xd's be hitting dealers? anyone know?
  • ecotrklvrecotrklvr Posts: 519
    You're right - but only if you ignore rolling friction. An object's weight doesn't affect how fast it falls in a vacuum. And more to the point, with the same air resistance, weight won't change its downhill speed, either. But the force pulling the object down a ramp is directly proportional to its mass - more mass, more force. More force to counteract wind resistance AND the thing you're ignoring - the rolling friction.

    When I go biking with my 180 pound friend Matt, and we get to the top of a hill and coast down together, my extra mass shoots me downhill a LOT faster. He has a MUCH more expensive bike with better wheel bearings, so don't assume that it's a friction difference. And he's much more aerodynamic than me, as well.

    At the top of the hill, I've got lots more potential energy than he does - that's what's being converted to kinetic energy as we roll.
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