Subaru Forester (up to 2005)

ateixeira

They are both boxy, and size is similar.

By the end of its life I think those were making 180hp. But they also were heavier, and not very fuel efficient.

One measure of engine efficiency is specific output, the Subaru makes 165/2.5 = 66 hp/liter. The Jeep made just 180/4 = 45 hp/liter.

Turbos can break 100 hp/liter, the GT does and the WRX even beats that. 66 is good for a normally aspirated engine.

-juice

subearu

The key here is torque. The I6 made a healthy amount of torque.

The later '90's Jeep I6 was making 190hp and 235lb-ft torque. Even in '87, it was 177hp and 224lb-ft torque.

That I6 was made right here in my town. Plenty of Cherokee's on the road here.

I would get 21 or 22mpg on the highway in my 2wd Comanche. My dad has an '87 Cherokee Laredo 4wd that he uses as a winter beater. I think he gets 18mpg.

-Brian

stever

New Subaru Forester, Saab "B9 Tribeca" to Debut at New York Auto Show (Inside Line)

Steve, Host

p0926

I had a 92 Cherokee Sport 4WD that could get low 20 mpgs on the hwy. The I6 was indeed a nice torquey engine. I tried to buy another Cherokee right before they stopped making them back in 2000 but couldn't find one equipped with a 5-MT. That's what led me to the Forester, I too found it "roughly" comparable in terms of size (interior volume) and capability.

As to which has the better engine... even though the Forester's 2.5 H4 has considerably less HP and torque, it also has less mass to move so I didn't really notice much difference in terms of acceleration. Of course the Jeep's 4.0 I6 was a lot more capable when it came to towing but then the Forester got considerably better gas mileage.

-Frank

subearu

Standard towing was 2000lbs, maximum towing on 'em was 5000lbs.

-Brian

tazereli

Does the boxer engine sit longitudinally or transversly in Suabru's?

Reagrds,
Kyle

ateixeira

Saab had better price it right, and from the get-go, or it'll be ignored like the 9-2x is. 2000 annual sales, forecast was for just 8000 and they didn't come close!

My dad had a Cherokee but it was so unreliable we'd rather forget it. He has an Outback now.

-juice

c_hunter

Longitudinal --

tdphatak

Hello. I just bought a new Forester LL Bean. I went to check the tire pressure 3 weeks after buying the car noticed that the pressure was 33 psi in ALL the tires (Yokohama tires that came with the car). However, in the inside of the driver's door, it says that the front tires should be 29 psi and the rear should be 28 psi. I hadn't altered the pressure since I bought the car which means the dealer I bought it from had the tire pressure set to 33 psi. Why is that? Should I keep it at 33 or reduce it to the numbers on the inside of the driver's door?
Thanks!

ejj

I read a comment that the new 06 Forester was really a "freshening" and they were going to introduce an "all new redesign" for 07. This doesn't seem like the best use of money on the Subaru end of things. Is this simply speculation? The pic on the front page looks like more than a re-skin, but who knows?

p0926

New cars are routinely shipped from the factory with more air in the tires to reduce the chances of flat spotting (which can occur when a car sits for an extended period of time). The dealer is suppose to air down the tires as part of the predilvery inspection but often forget.

Going with the manufacturer's recommended tire pressure will yield the best ride while leaving them at around 33 will provide a slightly stiffer ride but will also result in improved tire wear and somewhat better mpg.

-Frank

ateixeira

33psi is fine IMHO. Some people have reported 40+ at delivery.

Forester is on a 5 year cycle, the 3rd year is a refresh. Note these are *model* years:

1998 - new model
2001 - face-lift
2003 - new model
2006 - face-lift
2008 - new model

So the 2007 may be the calendar year for the new model intro, but it might be a model year 2008.

-juice

toasterpilot

In case you are wondering what to look forward to--those of you that just bought new Foresters--My '01 L has over 100K and went from Chicago to Pennsylvania a couple of weeks ago. Last weekend, I had to drive to Hot Springs, Arkansas and spent a lot of time on those twisty country back roads--about 1800 miles in a couple of days. Next week, it is headed for Asheville, NC and the coast.

It has been very comfortable and, most of all, reliable.

Sorry, no pics or gas milage figures, I was in a hurry.

Juice: I mentioned to crunchy squeak (or was it creaky scrunch or squeaky crunch?). At any rate, it is really more of a squeak and I only hear it when the car isn't warmed up. I'm wondering if it isn't the suspension making noise until the grease warms up. I'll have my mechanic check the leaf springs (and bearings) before the next trip.

With more than 3k in added mileage in a couple of weeks (at hot engine temps), would you change your oil again? I'm using 10/W/30 dinoil.

streetough

At 80,000 miles my 1999 Forester just blew - broken rod. The company said they never heard of such a thing happening. Have you gotten any other responses from people? My mechanic says he has definitely seen this before in the 1998 and 99 models.

Kirstie_H

Don't forget tonight's member-to-member chat - it's open mic night, so come and discuss whatever's on your mind.



http://www.edmunds.com/townhall/chat/townhallchat.html

6-7pm PT/9-10pm ET. Drop by for live chat with other members. Hope you can join us!

kirstie_h

ateixeira

Actually you have coil springs. Check that the springs are seated properly in their base, and that shock mounts are tight. Could even be a bad motor mount.

For pure highway miles like yours, I'd go with the longer service schedule, i.e. changes every 7500 miles.

streetough: broken piston rod? Holy cow! Definitely the first here on Edmunds, that's not rare, it's unheard of.

-juice

stever

Possibly the second time:

liz3, "Subaru Forester" #15858, 28 Dec 2004 4:19 pm

Think it's too late to ask Subaru to help fix it?

Steve, Host

streetough

I've now towed it to a Subaru dealer in Moravia, CA in the hope that Subaru will do something about this; it shouldn'a happened.
Wish me luck. Bye the way, if anyone knows of another forum, maybe I can try there to find others who have had this problem.
Carole (Streetough)

ateixeira

liz3 was not specific but I'd be willing to bet she had a blown head gasket. She said it was not a lack of oil, but the symptom for a head gasket failure is often lack of coolant rather than oil.

So I doubt that one was a rod.

Any how, call 800-SUBARU3 and ask them to open up a case file. Be extra friendly and see it they can at least help you in some way, maybe they can cover a portion of it at least.

By any chance were you fording water? I have seen instances where an SUV was crossing water and the intake sucked water with the air, the piston can't compress water so it threw a rod.

Pretty extreme case, though.

-juice

kens

Many people find that the recommended settings are geared towards comfort rather than handling and tire wear. When I had my 98 Forester, I typically kept the tire pressures at 34/32. I once set my tire pressures to the door jamb levels for kicks and was amazed at how loose the handling became.

Try a few different tire pressures to see what works for you. Definetly don't go below the recommended settings or get too close to the max pressure indicated on the tire sidewall. Also, keep the ratio 29/28.

Ken

msavad

i want to get a 05 forester in july. subaru says they will be showing off the 06's in the car show next week. do the new models come out in the summer? or is it based on the actual new year?

do you think i could get a deal in july? i want to get a red forester XS, standard options, with a bin.

thanks

---Mike Savad

stever

Hi Mike, welcome to Edmunds. There's a live Subaru Chat in a couple of hours; hope your schedule permits you to pop-in. We talk about all Subarus, most cars, food and lots of other stuff. Your XS question would fit right in there too.

The chat link is at the top and on the left.

Steve, Host

ejj

I would consider buying sooner--they have started offering huge discounts on 05's--$1750 back on the XS. If you wait until July, they may not have the vehicle you want. On the flip side, the deals may improve! Transmission choice may be important. And yes, the new car will be available in June or July.

ateixeira

I think the new models will show up early summer.

I doubt incentives will go up any more than they already have, but more importantly your choices will begin to dwindle.

If you want a certain color and options, I would start shopping seriously now. If you are very flexible, then I do think prices will drop a little more in May/June. But so will selection.

Do you gamble? ;-)

-juice

crashton6

Are the rebates/incentives still in effect on the 05's? I may be buying my son a new 2.5RS Wagon & would sure like to save some $$$.

Thanks.

Chuck

ateixeira

Subaru typically renews rebates as long as needed. I doubt they'll vanish. Selection might, however.

-juice

msavad

i've heard a range of comments about the speakers in this car. the XS has the upgraded speakers - which to me tells me nothing. i'd like to get the tweeters and sub-woofer. it might be cheaper if they install it from invoice - however i'm not sure if it's worth it.

should i go with my original plan and get the car - having a seperate place install my better speakers and alarm?

natually i'll listen before i get anything new, but i'd like to hear other people's views. since i use music to concentrate.

thanks

---Mike Savad

c_hunter

Listen to the stock stereo for a while before making the decision.

My wife's 03 XS had the factory sub, upgraded speakers, and tweeters. It actually sounded pretty good. The bass was impressive.

Aftermarket speakers will sound better, but you will lose some "volume" since the factory head unit does not have a whole lot of power. Good aftermarket speakers will require a lot more driving power than the stock speakers, and the radio will run out of oomph at higher settings.

So definitely get a feel for the stock setup before making decisions.

Craig

pnassmac

My driver side fender is developing chips and was aware Forester used to sell plastic fender covers for the previous model but not the current forester.

Checking out the German and UK Forester sites and noticed their accessory choices are greater.The German and UK sites carry them but the US does not. Anyone know someone in the state who can get these accessories?

ateixeira

See if SubieGal from Carter Subaru can get them, I know they import some stuff. Do a Google search and you should find her.

-juice

p0926

Like Craig said, the factory sub, upgraded speakers, and tweeters is perfectly satisfactory for many people. But if you're a purist, you'll want something better.

-Frank

rhody_marco

My '05 X AT just passed 3,000 miles. Got 24.8 MPG at my last fullup after travelling 50% highway, 35% paved (for the most part) country roads and 15% city.

Got my windshield replaced at the dealer after a stone hit and cracked it. That, plus oil-change #2, and tax cost us 317 bucks - ouch.

Got 8 inches of wet snow last week. A Ford F-150 4X4 crew-cab slid sideways into the rear of another vehicle at a stoplight. Guess you could call it a reverse t-bone.

While waiting to get around the accident, a member of the local constabulary walked to our car. She told us that ten accidents had been reported in town, and suggested we turn around and go home.

The wagon held its own, though. I've yet to trigger the antilock brakes unintentionally. I once "tested" them on a snowy backroad, so I know they work.

Did some dirt-trail driving over the weekend. We live in a cabin bordering a environmental management area. The Sube had little trouble with rutted mud and snow-slush. The car did pull to either side sometimes. My lack of off-road chops (or a limited-slip differential) were factors here. As to prove the first point, reducing speed to 20 MPH made for better control.

A friend of mine rode shotgun over the weekend, as well. At first, he described the Forester's stiff ride as trucklike. So I pulled a few high-speed turns. The tires didn't squeal, although my friend did. He changed his initial observation to "sporty". That's better.

My observations...

- Ride and handling are very good. High-speed steering is a bit light.

- There's a slight wistle from the roof rack between 35 and 45 MPH.

- Some have complained about long brake-pedal travel. What gets my attention, however, is the excellent brake control. That's probably why I haven't yet needed ABS.

- The top dashboard cubby door gets in the way. The cheap plastic door below the radio is even worse.

- I still don't like the gated shifter, or the lack of a shift-mounted indicator.

- Not crazy about the push-button recirculate button either. It doesn't allow you to mix fresh and recycled air like an old-school mechanical slide would.

- AT shifts are a bit flakey, not unlike my 1995 Saturn SW2. Tends to hunt on hills, as well.

- This car is solid. Close the door and you are rewarded with a "thunk". My 89 Civic gave me the same feeling. It's like you're in a single, solid mass, not something made up of seperate parts.

- Still wish the gas mileage was better.

All-in-all...a good ride.

Peace,

Marco

bluesubie

I got my Euro Forester 17" wheels from http://www.cc-b.com/
They ran into some delivery problems and it took over two months, but I eventually got them. They piggy-backed my order on a WRX wheel group buy.

Another option is through a UK dealer like http://www.bell-colvill.co.uk/
I've corresponded with them via email and they were very prompt and courteous.

-Dennis

c_hunter

Marco, great report! You can take the rack crossbars off if the noise bothers you. I only put them on our cars when they are needed.

Craig

rhody_marco

...at first I thought the noise may have been a wind-leak or tranny whine. Once I figured out what it was, I was cool with it. It's hardly noticable.

Besides...the crossbars are cool :-)

Polo

p0926

Might try sliding the front cross-bar forward or aft slightly then. That often times eliminates the whistle.

-Frank

ezshift5

....enjoyed your very readable report.... Buried among these threads would be the word that somewhere between 3 - 5k, your highway MPG will improve...........ez

moe5

I just bought a Forester XS, but it didn't have the tweeters and subwoofer/amp installed, and the dealer was going to charge me an outrageous amount to install. (Several dealers actually encouraged me to get an aftermarket setup.) I've ordered the OEM tweeter and sub/amp, but am looking for installation instructions, particularly for the sub/amp. It's not clear how to remove the front dash panel around the 6cd changer.

Has anyone installed the subwoofer/amp and tweeter in the most recent models?

I'd like to pick up a service manual at some point too, if anyone recommends one please advise!

Thanks!

kev_xt_owner

Generally Subaru parts come with some instructions on how to install the part (primarily graphical). I bought a cabin air filter and the auto-dimming mirror and they both came with instructions.

You can also search online for installation guides as many Subaru Parts suppliers provide online versions of the guides as well. [Just search for Subaru Parts Guides]

p0926

I'm sure someone else who's actually done this will weigh in but I'm almost positive that all Foresters come prewired for OEM tweeters and subs so they should be pretty much plug and play.

-Frank

rsay777

The wire and connector under the drivers seat I assume is for the sub? I knew the tweeter space comes pre-wired. Bob L.

c_hunter

None of the Subarus are prewired for the sub. You have to install a harness that tees into the main radio harness behind the dash.

I've installed the sub in 3 different Subarus, but not a Forester. I am sure the instructions will explain how to get the radio out. Generally a very simple install when I have done it.

CRaig

moe5

Thanks to all.

Doesn't seem like the wiring would be too hard, if the part comes with instructions for removing the front panel (and a hopefully a harness). One dealer quoted me $225 just for installation of the sub (part not included) saying the seat had to be removed. (!)

p0926

Well I was half right at least :-)

Remove the seat? The previous gen Foresters had the sub under the front seat but the current ones have it back in the cargo area.

-Frank

mckeown

From the Factory, the XT, the sub is in the rear cargo. The Option from the dealer is under the passenger seat. I have installed this one, and YES it comes with instructions on how to remove the Fascia and install the wiring harness and route it to the underseat area,

njswamplands

jon_in_ct

2006 Forester Announcement
2006 Forester Preliminary Specs

dannyka

Wow. So many discussions! How do you all keep up? :-)

Thanks for the heads-up. More reading to do tonight...

--Dan

jon_in_ct

Subaru has put up some pictures of the 2006 Forester on its media web site. Click on a thumbnail for the high-res version.


2.5 XT Interior


2.5 XT


2.5 L.L.Bean Interior


2.5 L.L.Bean


2.5 L.L.Bean

once_for_all

why Subaru went DOHC on the NA 2.5? Must be something with the AVCS upgrade?

John