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Ford Escape Mazda Tribute Maintenance and Repair

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  • My 2001 Mazda Tribute has stalled 5 times. I had it to the dealership 3 times and the lastest TSB fix it to replace the PCM along with relay coolant fan, idle air valve, and reman control unit. They had to reprogram the PCM and it has been running better than before. I am hoping that this solves the problem.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    That is correct grahamjr. It clearly states in the latest TSB that some older PCM's can not be reprogrammed, therefore they must be replaced and then reprogrammed. They can't just replace it alone.

    What changes have you noticed? I'm curious to see if the idle RPM's have been raised in the new program.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    Please visit other chat rooms around the net. If you scroll back and count.. you will see many of these posts are duplicates from the same people over and over again...
    "All these problems" are spun way out of context.. Visit other chat rooms around the net. There are thousands upon thousands of satisified Tribut/Escape owners out here.. Like myself..
    I have 10,000 trouble free, reliable miles on my Escape and am enjoying the vehicle..
    Base your decision on your needs. I needed/wanted a V6 for the extra towing/hauling power. Its also nice to be able to pass/merge and dart quickly when needed in traffic.. Good luck
  • I have never posted here or anywhere else on any server about my Tribute. So this is not a duplicate post or an attempt to defame Mazda or Ford without cause.

    I own a 2001 Tribute with about 10,000 miles on it. Until last week I was delighted wth my car.
    Last week it stalled.
    I was going down hill at about 35 to 40 at the time. I could not stop. I hit my brakes as hard as I could. The car slowed a little.
    I could not stop the car, pull it over, or even slow it down much until I reached the bottom of the hill.
    I was lucky there was no traffic at the time.
    I was lucky the road was straight.
    If there had been anything in front of me I would have hit it.
    If the road had curved I would have gone off the road and possibly over a cliff. (I live in Colorado...so going over a cliff is not that unlikely)
    Don't tell me that stalling is a minor issue.
    I fought the car with all the strenght I had and I could not controll it.

    I feel I can no longer trust my Tribute.
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,110
    I am glad you emerged from your harrowing experience unscathed and I know I wouldn't be too happy about the ordeal either.

    Were you able to find out what the cause of the problem was?

    tidester
    Host
    SUVs; Aftermarket & Accessories
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    In noway was I trying to downplay your problem.
  • bri66bri66 Posts: 220
    I am amazed that for someone who has had no problems at all would visit a site with a topic posting for problems and then turn around and tell someone that posts a problem to go visit another site. You know I have heard of people like you, they have nothing to complain about so they complain about others that have problems. Scrolling back in prior posts in this topic you have a serious problem complaining about other members problems. You must be the life of a party.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 40,866
    Wintergreen9, it would be a good idea to visit the NHTSA site and fill out a complaint form if you haven't done so already. Here's the link.

    Steve
    Host
    SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • purpypurpy Posts: 4
    The only reason I posted to this site was because
    I had a stalling problem and had received some
    helpful information. I do like my Tribute but if
    Ford is not going to back up their product and leave you in Limbo, then there is a problem.
    IF your Ford/Mazda is running great then you're
    lucky but if you have a problem with it join the
    stalling club. It is no fun being there!!!!!!!
  • I took my 2001 Tribute down to the local Mazda dealer after it stalled. They said it might be a few days so they arranged a rental for me. Three days later they called and told me my Tribute was fixed and ready to be picked up. They told me that a faulty air control valve was to blame. They said it was a rare problem but one they knew how to fix.
    I was thrilled.
    The dealer had found the problem and fixed it.
    While I was returning my rental car I ran into a woman returning hers.
    She was the proud owner of a 2002 Tribute.
    It had stalled.
    What are the odds that two Tribute owners with the same rare stalling problem would be returning their rentals to the same place at the same time?
    (What is Mazda's definition of the word rare?)
    She and I had a long talk.
    The dealer told her when she bought her Tribute that the 2001 models had a stalling problem. He said it was fixed in the 2002 models.
    He was wrong.
    The same people just told me my 2001 Tribute was fixed and now safe to drive.
    Did they 'fix' my 2001 the same way they 'fixed' her 2002?
    Do they realty know if this or any other fix they come up with will work.....or are they just trying out their latest idea and then waiting to see what happens?

    I feel a little like a lab rat
  • crashproofcrashproof Posts: 19
    I've had my new 2002 Tribute since Oct 2001. There have only been very minor problems that have all been resolved promptly.

    No stalls thus far although I'm well aware that it is a common complaint. I live in flatland but for the times I've gone downhill (bridge, for example), I've never experienced stalling.
  • I took my Tribute to my local dealer to fix the stalling problem. They replaced an air control valve and did no other engine related work. (they did reprogram my key fob)

    After reading the TSB for the Escape I became concerned that my Tribute might need its PCM replaced or reprogramed.

    I called my dealer back and was told that the Ford TSB did not apply to Mazdas and that my vin date was not one that required the reprogramed PCM.
    I bought my Tribute in July 2001.
    Does anyone have a detailed copy of Mazda's offical fix or TSB for this problem?
    I hope the dealer is correct and my Mazda is now safe to drive...but I am concerned that they don't want to do any more work on my car until after I have had it for a full year. (our lemon law deadline)

    Please advise.
  • thrift607thrift607 Posts: 5
    could anyone tell me how to get info. on mazda's service bulletin # 01300R in regards to #3 engine mount vibration? it was posted on 8/00. i would like to know if problem still extist on 2002 models?
  • I do have the complete Mazda Tribute TSB for the stalling problem--but it's 8 pages long. I'm going to recreate a lot of it here, and you can let me know whether you need more. I'm not even sure they'd let me put that much material up on the mesage board. BTW: I live in WV where the mts. aren't nearly as big as CO, but roads are typically narrow, steep, and extremely curvy. I had a similar experience to yours (going about 35 down a steep mountain road and I had thankfully just hit a straight stretch w/no traffic). I was able to stop, though, so it was much less chilling that what you went through. I'm completely with you on this. When I started posting here (something I'd never done anywhere before), I was astounded and genuinely baffled at the (seemingly) many posters who agressively insisted that stalling was not a big problem, nor was it a safety issue. But I've since come to believe these people work for car companies, so I don't pay any attention to them. It's the only conclusion that makes sense to me because this is such an obvious and extreme hazard to me that I don't know why anyone would dispute it, or what they would have to gain by doing so. These folks notwithstanding, I've found a lot of good info here, plus the hosts are very nice.

    M-TIPS REPAIR INFORMATION
    Category F FUEL AND EMISSION
    Symptom(s): 000 All Symptom Codes
    REPAIR INFORMATION: REFERENCE#: 3694 TYPE DESC:
    BULLETIN
    SVC BULLETIN#:1-014/02
    SUBJECT: 3.0L INTERMITTENT ENGINE QUIT OR IDLE DIP
    MODEL YEAR AFFECTED IN VIN RANGE MODEL SPECS
    TRIBUTE '01-'02 3.0L ONLY
    NAVAJO/
    TRIBUTE '01-'02
    TRIBUTE '01-'02
    TRIBUTE '01-'02

    Some vehicles equipped with a 3.0L Duratec engine may exhibit an intermittent engine quite condition. This is usually a one time event during closed throttle deceleration with no Diagnostic Trouble Codes (DTCs)and no Malfunction Indicator Lamp (MIL). The engine will restart immediately.

    When normal diagnostics cannot pinpoint the root cause, refer to the following Driveability Checklist for details.

    1. Verify customer concern.
    2. Inspection of Idle Air Control Valve
    a) With the transmission in Park, the engine should idle at approximately 750 RPM, and the engine temperature should be at least 88 C (190F). All accessories and the engine cooling fan should be off.
    b) Using WDS version B17.2 or later, verify that Idle Air Control (IAC) duty cycle is within specification (between 32-40%) with no purge flow), then proceed to Step 3.
    c) If IAC duty cycle is out of specification, replace IAC with part number AJ03-20-660A. If IAC duty cycle is within specification after replacing with a new IAC, then proceed to Step 3 now.
    d) If IAC duty cycle is still out of specification, replace throttle body with part number AJ03-13-640A.
    e) Verify corrective action, then proceed to Step 3.

    NOTE
    ENGINE RPM WILL SLOWLY RAMP UP. IT IS EXTREMELY IMPROTANT TO CHECK THE IAC DUTY CYCLE WHEN THE RPM IS AT 750 RPM. EVEN 800 RPM IS TOO HIGH FOR CHECKING IAC DUTY CYCLE UNDER THESE CONDITIONS.

    3. PCM Reflashing
    a) Perform the following: IF the vehicle was built on or after 1/16/2002, then proceed to Step 4 now. If not, reprogram the PCM with WDS version B17.2 or later. Only use WDS version B17.2 or later during this reprogramming.
    b) Some 2001 model year PCMs cannot be reprogrammed and must be replaced. Replacement is determiend by the MPC # located in the upper left corner of the barcode on the PCM. If the PCM is an MPC 160, then replace with part number AJ08-18-881F and reprogram with WDS version B17.2 or later. If the PCM is MPC 161, then just reprogram with WDS version B17.2 or later.
    c) Verify the latest calibration was successfully reprogrammed. WDS should show latest calibration level 1U7A-12A650-AYB if PCM tear tag # SJC0, SJC1, or SJC2. For PCM tear tag HQP1 or HQP2, the latest calibration level is 2L8A-12A650-CD.

    Note: For additional details on PCM reflashing, refer to the attached PCM Reflash Procedure Supplement. Proceed to Step 4.

    4. Inspection of Evaporative Vapor Management Valve
    a) With the transmission in Park, the engine should idle at approximately 750 RPM, and the engine temperature should be at least 88C (190 F). All accessories and the engine cooling fan should be off.
    b) With WDS version B17.2 (U.S.) or later, determine if the Evaporative Vapor Management (EVAPVM) duty cycle stops increasing and remains at 95-100% while Fuel Tank Pressure (FTP) holds at approximately 2.6 volts. Monitor these parameters using PIDs--EVAPVM # (in percent) and FTP (in vols). If this occurs, replace the EVAPVM valve with part number AJ03-18-741A.
    c) If EVAPVM is funcitoning correctly, the duty cycle should increase to 84-100% with the FTP decreasing to approximately 2.2 volts and then recycle back to 0% duty cycle while FTP hold at approximately 2.6 volts. Do not replace the EVAPVM valve.
    d) Verify corrective action, then proceed to Step 5.
    5. Inspection of Evaporative System Vent Line
    a) With the transmission in Park, the engine should idle at approximately 750 RPM, and the engine temperature should be at least 88C (190 F). All accessories and the engine cooling fan should be off.
    b) With WDS version B17.2 (U.S.) or later, if EVAPVM drops to 0% from 60-80% (premature purge shutoff), check for an obstructed vent line. This condition may be accompanied by a sudden RPM drop while idling. The premature purge shutoff is caused by the tank not reaching a pre-specified vacuum state.
    c) To clear the possible obstructed vent line, disconnect the vent line in the evaporative emissions system from the check valve side (check valve part number is AJ03-42-910). This connection is located just forward of the evaporative emissions canister assembly, underneath the vehicle in the area of the driver side rear seat.
    d) Using shop air, blow the vent line from teh check valve side forward (towards the brake booster). In the past, spiders have been known to construct webs in the vent lines, so handle with caution. Possible obstructions in the vent line can prevent the evaporative emissions system from purging properly, and in some cases, stalling occurs.
    e) Verify corrective action, then proceed to Step 6.
    6. Inspection of EEC Relay
    a) If the Electronic Engine Control (EEC) relay has stamped lettering, proceed to Step 7. If the EEC relay has white lettering printed on the top surface, replace with a new Hella service relay part number BTDA-67-740 that is all black and has stamped lettering on the top surface. Make sure the relay you are installing has stamped lettering.
    b) Confirm EEC relay female terminal tightness on the Battery Junction Box side using tester P/N 49-L088-0A2=020 from the Mazda terminal repair kit. If loose, adjust terminals as needed. If okay, proceed to Step. 7.

    Note: For location of the EEC relay, use 2001 Wiring Diagram Sections Z-52/Connector X1016 and Z-154/Battery
  • I see the first post cut off, so here's the rest (hopefully). Also, the formatting on the small table at the very start of the document didn't hold so the models and years affected look all jumbled.

    Wiring Diagram Sections Z-52/Connector X1016 and Z-154/Battery Junction Box.

    7. Inspection of Key Ring Weight
    a) Ask the customer if they have significant weight (approximately 9 oz or more ) hanging from teh key ring while the keys are in the ignition. If they do, and the engine quits while traveling over bumps, the key ring may move the ignition out of the Run position and stop the engine. When this occurs, all guages immediately shut off (fuel reads "E", tachometer goes to zero, speedometer goes to zero immediately).
    b) It is recommended tha the customer attach fewer keys to the key ring that retains the vehicle ignition key.
    c) Proceed to Step 8.

    8. Road Test
    a) Road test the vehcle long enough to experience 3 closed throttle decelerations from approximately 40 mph down to 10 mph. Ensure overdrive is ON. Use scan tool to examine engine RPM during test.
    b) Ensure that there are no engine RPM dips below 680 RPM.
    9. Obtain an Authorized PCM Modification Label through M-Net (part number 9999-95-AMDC-97) and list the date, dealer number, and summary of modifications performed. Select a prominent place adjacent to the Vehicle Emission COntrol Information Decal suitable for installing the Authorized Modifications Label. Clean the area, install the decal, and cover it with a clear plastic decal shield.

    PARTS INFORMAITON
    Mazda Part Number Ford P/N
    AJ03-20-660A Valve Idle air YF1Z-9F715-AA
    AJ03-13-640A Throttle Body YL8Z-9E926-DA
    AJ03-18-741A Valve, solenoid YL8Z-9C915-AA
    BTDA-67-740 Relay, Coolant FOAZ-14N089-A
    fan
    AJ08-18-881F Reman, control 1U7Z-12A650-AXA
    unit, EGI
    ----------
    Back to me. This document goes on for another 5 pages, but all of those remaining pages are devoted to the PCM Reflash Procedure Supplement. Please let me know if you feel you need this information and we can make some kind of arragement to get it to you, either by fax, or I could type the rest into a Word document and e-mail it to you. I wouldn't mind at all typing it up for the message board--I just don't know if that would be an okay thing to do because it's so long.
    Furthermore, in my opinion, the dealer should not only have this information, he should be willing to share it with you. The head of the repair department at the dealership which serviced my Tribute for stalling (not the same place I bought it from) gave me a copy of the TSB and was also very honest in saying there was absolutely no guarantee that this would fix the problem. You might want to try to find a dealer that's more in touch than the first one you went to--though if you're in a rural area as I am, I know that's easier said than done! Good luck.
    P.S. I didn't proof this, so apologies for any typos--but I was very careful when typing in part numbers, so they should be correct.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 40,866
    8 pages would be a bit much and you are probably already pushing the "fair use" provisions of the copyright law. We'll wait a bit and see if Mazda's lawyers complain :-)

    Interesting note about the key ring weight - that's been an issue with MB ML320 SUVs and other cars (different results though).

    Steve
    Host
    SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

    Moderator
    Need help navigating? stever@edmunds.com - or send a private message by clicking on my name.

  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    I do not work for a car company, and I do not think this is a huge problem. I have driven a few cars in the past that did not have power assisted steering or braking. If you've never driven a vehicle without power, I can imagine you would be very frightened by the sudden lack thereof. The first one I drove (early eighties Chevette) almost ended up in the trunk of a much larger car because I was not applying enough pressure to the brake pedal. That scared the crap out of me.

    I am in no way trying to push this problem off to the side. I want it fixed as much as you do. I've done a lot of research on this which is evidenced by my previous postings in this thread (posted the entire Ford stalling TSB and it's updated info).

    Just remember that you still have total control of the vehicle if it stalls again. You just have to apply more force to the wheel and brakes. If you just try drifting it to a stop, that's when the real problems begin.
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    The brake system should have enough residual vacuum to get to to a complete stop anyway with power assist gradually decreasing. It would be the power steering that provides abrupt loss of power.
  • Oops--I certainly don't want to stir the copyright pot! I was thinking that this info was okay to post, as a good portion of Ford's was already up. Also, I thought this was info Mazda would want people to have, to show they are doing something to fix this problem, and that its ultimate destination was the public domaine anyway through NHTSA. If that's not the case, then by all means remove it, and I can try to get it to wintergreen9 another way.

    And to baggs32--believe me, I've driven vehicles with power nothing Remember the Ford Pinto? My first car. Volkswagon squareback? My second car. Yup, I'm real old, and I've owned some real winners... So I know well the difference between harder-to-steer and can't steer. But in any case, the postings I've found so troubling (not yours) are from people who are inexplicably hostile and berate people for complaining about this problem. Those are the ones that leave me drop-jawed and make me wonder what is going on. But I really have vowed not to write another word about whether or not stalling is a problem or a safety issue. So I'm going to be still now.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    TSB 02-11-06 was performed on our Escape yesterday to fix the stalling problem. (History: Ours only stalled once when it was about three weeks old back in February, 2002 XLT 4X4) The only thing that they did was flash the PCM because everything else on the list checked out. The vehicle is a lot smoother now, and I could not get the tach to drop below 600 whereas I could almost get it to hit the zero pin before. The transmission is far less "bumpy", and it seems to time the shifts better.

    I'll post any other issues if they arise. Good or bad.
  • drew1070drew1070 Posts: 1
    just curious, scape2. Do you work for ford? Everybody elses problems are 'spun out of control', but since yours is fine, as you've pointed out so many times the rest of us are just making problems up?

    Also, are you married, with a family? I'm guessing NO, or else you would be a little worried that your wife and children could be injured. I happen to have a wife who is expecting our second child, and she doesn't have the brute strength you must have to keep the same turning angle after losing power.

    So on behalf of everyone else out there who fears for the safety of their families, I'd like to tell you that these problems are not at all 'blown out of proportion'!
  • bessbess Posts: 972
    I have a wife and 2 kids (3 & 6) and I am not worried at all about the Escape. The Escape is no more or less dangerous to its occupants than any other vehicle out there.. The occurances of stalling is extremely rare (although some seem to live on certain roads where the condition is just right).. But, then some will claim that it's a common problem that thousands and thousands of folks are experiencing.. Still there are others that say, when a stall does occur, it's a drastic problem that is likely to cause injuries.. But, if the problem is so pervasive, and dangerous, do you think its just 'luck' that there aren't any associated injuries?

    My opinion, (with some facts thrown in).
    -First, the stalling problem is 'blown out of proportion' to some extent..
    - Second, I don't deny that some vehicles (a very small number) do stall. Ford seems to have a handle on the problem and knows the fix. I don't think folks are making up the problems where the vehicle stalls. But what is often blown out of proportion is the consequences that some folks are thinking up that would result from a stall.
    - Third, in the case of the stall, control is not lost. There is still steering and braking control, and there is the ability to restart while the vehicle is still moving if you desire. The speed the stalls occur also appear to be relatively low.. (around 40mph).
    -Fourth: if you not confident with the vehicle your driving, you should relieve your self of that vehicle and get a different one with which you are confident in.

    My wife has driven alot of beater vehicles (that were truly un-reliable), and I'm confident in her ability to 'not panic' and maintain control. I'm confident in the Escape and my driving ability as well.

    I know this post may sound 'more harsh' than I really intend it to, but for you to imply that someone else cares less about their family than you do yours is absurd.. You (nor I) do not speak on behalf of everyone else who looks out for the safety of their families.
  • baggs32baggs32 Posts: 3,213
    I can't believe there are so many people out there who have never driven a vehicle, whether it be a car, truck, tractor, etc., without power assist.

    Here's another tip:

    If a tire blows out on you, don't slam on the brakes. Coast, in a straight line, to a safe speed with your hazard lights on, and then pull over to the side of the road. This happened to me in a pickup truck while I was doing about 75mph downhill on a highway. It was the front left tire and I had three TRANE A/C units in the bed. Thank God I remembered what to do from driver's ed.

    We really need to step up the requirements for a driver's license in this country. In Europe, we'd all still be walking.
  • deserttandeserttan Posts: 2
    Add another Tribute to the stall problems. I sure there are many like me that simply
    take the "flat" roads until they can take the car in to have the stall problem fixed.
    I can make it happen on a particular hill about half the time. Same conditions;
    rolling down a steep hill, speed about 40mph, no accelerator, results in stall.
    It is obviously a design problem from Ford, and not a catastrophic failure like
    a tire blowout. I have learned my lesson about buying any new first run product
    from Ford (Sept. 2001 Tribute ES-V6)
  • oregonboyoregonboy Posts: 1,653
    Yes, you can still steer a power-assisted car with the assist missing in action, but it's not quite the same as the "bad old days" of non-power steering.

    Cars, in general, are heavier for their size than in the "old days". There is a lot more stuff under the hood... AC, emissions equipment, power steering pumps. In addition, steering wheels used to be significantly larger in diameter, giving more leverage. And, probably most importantly, steering ratios are now much faster, again a change in leverage. Let's face it, it's MUCH harder to steer a modern vehicle with no PS than an old one that was designed that way.

    Threehounds - I gotta laugh... a VW squareback with no PS. Come-on that's rear engined. I had a 3/4 ton Dodge van with manual steering that was a real bear until I put on 6.50x15 (skinny) Michelin truck tires that could run at high PSI.

    Anyway, I wouldn't want to suddenly be faced with the loss of PS on a twisty downhill with no shoulders... potentially life threatening. On a straight, wide road... a piece of cake.

    -james
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    I do have a wife and two beautiful children. The fact that I have not experienced any problems with my 2001 Escape with just under 12,000 miles is a surprise to you? The Escape/Trib are not as problem prone as you may have been led to believe. Ford and Mazda have a winner on their hands and are able to deliver a reliable and quality product to the market at a fair price. The fact is with these chat rooms you do get the people who like to bash Ford. They can log on as many times as they want under many names and post what they wish.
    No, I don't work for Ford. I have just owned 4
    of their products over the years and none have given me the problems and unreliable service that some people like to lead other people to believe every Ford will. I work for a Japanese company...
  • varmintvarmint Posts: 6,326
    Just like those people who log on multiple times and praise Ford...
  • I am the owner of a 2002 Mazda Tribute LX. I have 1,500 miles on it and it stalled in traffic going down hill.

    I am thankful for the posts here as I did bring it to the dealer and they appeared to be honest about the situation. Stating that everything checked out on the TSB and they did nothing.

    I guess now there is nothing to do but wait and see if this becomes a regular problem, but I am most dissapointed.

    Has anyone had this only happen once and not return?
  • I am a first time ford buyer. I purchased a 2002 Ford Escape XLT 4x4 on June 7. The car stalled daily on my way to work. I took the car in 4 times for repair. The dealer had my car more than I did. I placed a call to Ford customer service who documented my issues.

    On June 25, I had enough. The dealer allowed me to trade in my car for another escape. June 26, new car stalled. June 28 car stalled again. Tonight I called Ford customer service again and stated that I wanted all the recommended steps to be completed in one feld swoop. I am currently waiting to see if that is going to be possible. I really like this car and its a shame that Ford has such a non-challant attitude towards what is potentially a serious problem.

    The symptoms are exactly like everyone else has expressed here. Speed about 40, deceleration (mine occurs going down hill), RPMs rapidly drop, and then the engine light comes on and the car stalls.

    I ask you, what are the odds of this happening to two vehicles back to back like this?

    Has any one here had all the steps done from the TSB at their dealership? Is the problem corrected? I would really appreciate some feedback from anyone who has completed any/all steps and if the problem was rectified.

    Thank you.
  • maltbmaltb Posts: 3,572
    It seems that you have better luck duplicating it than Ford does. Is this something that happens every time in the same location? I bet their technical folks would be interested in taking a drive with you.
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