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Midsize Sedans 2.0

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  • jayriderjayrider Member Posts: 3,602
    So my 09 murano has a kbb trade in value of 26k and a retail value of 33k. Think I'll try for a split on the numbers. Car is perfect-- dealers should be falling all over themselves to trade, right ? ;)
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Problem is....when have you not got them? You may get a little bit more now but it's still the old come on.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    Hey everyone,

    Here is some information for the upcoming 2011 Mazda6. What I find the most impressive, is the increased fuel economy, even though it is not huge, it is still significant. Enjoy!

    New or enhanced for 2011:

    ■Improved fuel economy (i models with M/T: 21/30; i models with A/T: 22/31 ( i models with A/T to be confirmed by EPA in mid-August); s models: 18/27 (city/highway (mpg))
    ■New 17-inch alloy wheel design
    ■New headlight design
    ■New fog light design
    ■New folding mirrors with turn signal lamps (Touring Plus & Grand Touring models)
    ■New silver and pearl white paint
    ■New cloth seat materials
    ■New steering wheel design
    ■New instrument panel premium trim accents
    ■New stitched vinyl door armrests
    ■Bluetooth added to Touring model
    ■Multi-Information Display with Rearview Camera added to Grand Touring models
    ■Rearview camera, with 7-inch touch screen, added to optional Navigation System
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    Thanks for the info. Pretty decent improvements. Now the V6 is competitive mpg with others in class as well as i4. Bout time they got a nice sized nav screen. Looking forward to seeing it.
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    edited August 2010
    Found some pics from another forum. It does look like this is indeed an '11 model:

    I'm assuming these are the new 17" wheels:
    image

    Headlight detail:
    image

    Fog light detail:
    image

    New mirror:
    image

    Tie it all together:
    image

    Other than the mirror, the other detail changes don't amount to much IMO. Of what's listed, I'd like to get a set of the mirrors, but it's not nearly enough to make me wish that I waited for a '11 model...
  • m6userm6user Member Posts: 3,181
    edited August 2010
    Just returned from San Diego where I rented a 2010 Malibu for 5 days. Never been a big fan of the styling so had not driven one before. Here are some of my likes and dislikes.

    Likes
    1. Very quiet at cruising speeds on freeways.
    2. Decent interior material quality.
    3. IMO got pretty good mpg. Drove 202 miles in mostly city type driving and up and down lots of hills. Got avg of 22.44mpg based on the fill up but it could have been a little short when I picked it up so it may have been better than I'm reporting.
    4. Seats were comfortable and gave decent support both for cruising and cornering.
    5. Sound system was good but the RDS display only showed one word at a time which I didn't care for. Liked the constantly visible presets.

    Dislikes
    1. Narrow windows limited visibility.
    2. Large A pillars further limited visibility.
    3. Large B pillars further limited visibility.
    4. Seemingly huge turning radius as it seemed I was constantly having to jockey back and forth in parking lots. Absolutely hated parking the thing between the visibility and turning radius.
    5. Didn't really like the feel of the electric steering but could get used to it.
    6. Rear visibility wasn't the best either.
    7. Speedo/tach seemed a little on the cheap side but then I think most of Ford's speedos/tachs are kind of chincy looking too. Just a personal preference probably.

    All in all, I would never buy one because of the turning radius and visiblity problems. I even commented to the DW that "I hate parking this thing". There was also a very distinct lag in pushing on gas and transmission taking hold, like a discernable clunk. I assume this was a problem in this particular car as I've never heard any reviews where the problem was noted. Not a bad rental car.
  • kaliforniakkaliforniak Member Posts: 51
    Thanks a bunch! Just the information I was looking for just got a couple of questions :

    -Are the folding mirrors are powered?
    -Any news about a piano black trim?
    -On a GT model with nav, where would the rear view camera be if it is added to both the MID and 7 inch touch screen

    I went to a local dealer to see a 6s GT and the sales person told me that the navigation would require the dvd in the slot to work, but then were do I put my CD? He said that when using the nav I would need to either stream music via blue tooth or use an external MP3 player with the aux jack. It just makes no sense to me that Mazda would make a system this dumb. Music and nav would be 2 of the 3 most commonly used features while driving (the AC being the other).
  • netranger4netranger4 Member Posts: 149
    Thanks for your input. Like any question, there are many possible answers. Yours was of great help.
  • netranger4netranger4 Member Posts: 149
    He buys all the domestic makes. His comments about 'junk' are not targeted at any specific brand. Since used car markets are regional, some markets can move more used than new and vice versa. What sells in Peoria may not sell in Poughkeepsie.

    I agree that CFC took out a lot of used cars, trucks and suv's. Most of those would have ended up on tertiary lots where the junk yard tow truck was their next best friend.

    Thanks for your comments.
  • netranger4netranger4 Member Posts: 149
    You are spot on, m6user. He was an independent dealer (late model used) for a long time before buying for a major dealer who moves huge volumes of new and used each month.

    He went to one auction recently looking for about six cars and came back with one.

    That says a lot.

    Thanks for your reply.
  • netranger4netranger4 Member Posts: 149
    Makes sense to me. With the manufacturers keeping numerous plants off line, the operating plants are loaded with orders. Living in the middle of the automobile producing region the comments I hear go like this:

    We ordered 100 new brand X's. The factory rep said 'Good luck in getting them any time soon, the plants' booked solid for that model/equipment."

    "Jason went to the auctions this week, came back with zero cars."

    That seems to be the norm for this area.

    Thanks
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I doubt that is accurate. I'm sure you load the DVD once and leave it there, either through the CD slot or in a separate slot in the glovebox or trunk.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    I went to a local dealer to see a 6s GT and the sales person told me that the navigation would require the dvd in the slot to work, but then were do I put my CD? He said that when using the nav I would need to either stream music via blue tooth or use an external MP3 player with the aux jack

    The salesperson was wrong.

    When the nav screen folds down, there is a CD slot and map DVD slot below that.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    greyghost-

    I have seen those pic's too. Mazda6club I believe?

    While the changes are not significant, Mazda has dedicated themselves to constant refreshing since they broke away from Ford. They don't want a stale product line. Something can be said for that, IMO.

    As I mentioned, the fuel economy is the biggest improvement for me.
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    While the changes are not significant, Mazda has dedicated themselves to constant refreshing since they broke away from Ford.

    What? Exactly how is this any different from Mazda when under Ford's "control"? They refreshed the 6 and the 3 after a couple of years in their last gen too. This is suddenly fresher now? You don't think slow sales might be a significant factor in this slight refresh?

    You may have noticed that Ford has been refreshing its vehicles nearly every year too and the two companies still collaborate. You make it sound like Ford was holding them back when in fact Mazda would be 6 feet under if not for FMC.
  • berriberri Member Posts: 10,165
    "You make it sound like Ford was holding them back when in fact Mazda would be 6 feet under if not for FMC."

    That is very true. When Ford bought a third of Mazda it was useful to both parties. Mazda was in deep financial straits and Ford needed product help. The partnership has been successful which allowed Ford to unwind to about a 13% stake today.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    You make it sound like Ford was holding them back when in fact Mazda would be 6 feet under if not for FMC.

    By Mazda's own admission back in October 2008, the significant amount of Ford hierarchy in Mazda prevented Mazda from doing what they wanted to do. Mazda Japan and Ford America often bumped heads on product planning. Remember, not too long ago, Ford was slower then molasses when it came to product change....

    The Mazda6 went 3 years before a refresh, and another 3 years before a new model came out. The Mazda3 went 3 years before a refresh and another 3 years before the new model. That is too long in Mazda's eyes.

    Each company has helped each other tremendously. Please don't sit there and say Ford did everything. Ford would not have a Fusion if it were not for Mazda's engineering and development.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Member Posts: 3,855
    The one change Mazda most needed to make was to wipe the smile off the face of the 3, they didn't. :sick:
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    Please don't sit there and say Ford did everything. Ford would not have a Fusion if it were not for Mazda's engineering and development.

    I didn't say Ford did everything, you did! You said they ruled over Mazda completely when in truth, they didn't. They were partners and shared just about everything which is why Ford bought their controlling share. They needed one another as someone else put it.

    By the way, the Mazda3 is a Euro Ford Focus if you want to go down that path and the Mazda6 wouldn't have a V6 without Ford. You also solidified my argument in saying what I quoted above. If Ford ruled with such an iron fist then why was Mazda given free reign on the 6 platform and the I4 that went in it and the 3? Seems to me it would have been more important for both manufacturers to spend the time and money on solid new platforms and motors than to spend time and money, that they didn't really have, on more frequent refreshes.

    I'm still not sure how you see this refresh as anything new either. I had a 2004 6s and several updates were made inside and out by 2005 on the 6 line including new transmissions. This is a 2-year refresh just like the old one had give or take a few months. So what has changed now that Mazda is free of their supposed oppression?

    If Mazda wants to complain they need to do it elsewhere because FMC saved them from the brink. End of story.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    edited August 2010
    You said they ruled over Mazda completely when in truth, they didn't.

    First off, I never said they ruled them completely. For their North American Operations, Ford had a HUGE say in how they conducted business. Second, Ford had a lot of their brass in Mazda North American Operations. That is a FACT. Coming from someone who is associated with Mazda, I would know more then you.

    By the way, the Mazda3 is a Euro Ford Focus if you want to go down that path and the Mazda6 wouldn't have a V6 without Ford.

    No, it is not. Common misconception. They only share a platform and basic engine design in which Mazda developed. The Mazda MZR and Ford 2.0-2.5 Duratec motors are Mazda designs. In todays form, they have become more like distant cousins.

    If Ford ruled with such an iron fist then why was Mazda given free reign on the 6 platform and the I4 that went in it and the 3?

    Mazda had "free reign"to develop the Mazda6 because Ford at the time did not have a mid-sized vehicle. They had a corporate fleet Ford Taurus. Ford used the Mazda6 platform, electronic design, suspension architecture, I4 engine to build the Fusion. They even have the same ECU! Ford saved $10 billion in development costs when building the 1st gen Fusion. When I toured the Mazda6 factory in Flat Rock, MI, the chief engineer of development on the Mazda6 disclosed this information to us. Would you like his name and contact information? I have him in my Blackberry....

    Mazda6 wouldn't have a V6 without Ford

    As part of their partnership, Ford provided the V6 engines and Mazda provided the I4 engines. This is nothing new.

    I had a 2004 6s and several updates were made inside and out by 2005 on the 6 line including new transmissions

    03-05 was the first gen Mazda6 and 06-08 was the refresh. 05 was not considered a "re-fresh". There were no body changes, no interior changes and virtually no mechanical changes, other then the 6-speed tranny for V6 models. 06 showed us a new body and several other changes.

    So what has changed now that Mazda is free of their supposed oppression?

    You are taking what I said out of context. Mazda has decided to constantly re-fresh and up date their product line starting form their break from Ford. There is a better line of communication between Mazda America and Mazda Japan now that Ford is gone. Oppressed? Mazda was not a slave...lets be real here...

    If Mazda wants to complain they need to do it elsewhere because FMC saved them from the brink. End of story.

    What are you talking about?? Who is complaining?? Why are you making thing up??Ford did a lot for Mazda, and visa versa. I will never deny that, nor will Mazda or Ford.I am not disputing what Ford has done for Mazda and I never will. Ford gave then the financial stability to grow into the company they have today.

    Fact of the matter is, Ford had much more say in the daily operations of Mazda then you think they did. Even tough they were "business partners", Ford had a little leverage. This was always something that bugged Mazda. For the first time since the early 90's, Mazda can do what they want, when they want, without Ford having to approve. That is the point of my message. It is the truth Being associated with Mazda for many years, I have first hand knowledge of their relationship. Just because you can "google" Mazda and Ford or you own a Mazda6 does not mean you know how they are intertwined. Working for the company and having interactions with Mazda and Ford brass gives me access to info you can't find on Google.
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    Mazda had the original MPV back in the late '80's and I believe it had a 6 cyl. Was that a Ford engine?
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    Mazda had the original MPV back in the late '80's and I believe it had a 6 cyl. Was that a Ford engine?

    The first Mazda MPV was 1990 I believe, or 89, I can't remember. Mazda used a 2.5L V6, which was a Mazda engine. Mazda used a Ford 2.5L in 1999 when they made the body change, and upgraded to the 3.0L in 2002 or 2003
  • tlongtlong Member Posts: 5,194
    So if Mazda had their own v6, what ever happened to it? Was it just not competitive? And so does the current Mazda 6 have a Ford engine?
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    edited August 2010
    So if Mazda had their own v6, what ever happened to it? Was it just not competitive? And so does the current Mazda 6 have a Ford engine?

    I was not with Mazda back in the late 90's. I do believe this is the time that Ford took controlling interest in Mazda to 33%. It had previously been 25%, I believe.

    I honestly do not know why the Ford sourced V6 was introduced into the Mazda. Again, I was not with the company back then.

    The current Mazda6 and CX-9 use a Ford designed 3.7L V6. Mazda does build this unit themselves in Japan and they tune it differently then Ford does.
  • lehrer1lehrer1 Member Posts: 54
    Dear aviboy97,
    I bought Fusion 2010 SE with V6 3.0 engine and am happy with it. I wander if V6 3.5 is any better or more modern? Does it have any advantage apart from slightly higher torque and HP?
    Best regards, Lehrer1
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    The original MPV used a 3.0L Mazda V6, also for awhile a 2.5L I4.
  • kaliforniakkaliforniak Member Posts: 51
    edited August 2010
    Thanks aviboy97! I knew that did not make any sense at all.

    I found this on Automotive.com

    New for 2011, a 4.3-inch Multi-Information Display for audio and Bluetooth controls and a rearview camera are now standard on Grand Touring models. A rearview camera is also added to the optional Navigation System on Grand Touring models which features an upgraded 7-inch display touch screen display.

    From what I understand, the GT models will get a standard 4.3 inch screen with rear view camera where the optional GPS would be. If the optional GPS is selected, the 4.3 inch would be deleted in favor of the 7 inch. Speaking of the the 7 inch, how is it different than the 7 inch on the 2010's?

    I also want to ask about the 6's aux jack, does it allow me to control music via the screen or does it just play whatever my device is setup to play?

    Oh, say I want to custom order a 6 to the exact color and equipment that I want, how would I go about it ?

    Thanks !
  • mlmcgaheemlmcgahee Member Posts: 102
    Hey... I thought this was the Nissan Altima forum....
    :)
  • jimbresjimbres Member Posts: 2,025
    Why do you say that?

    Look at the list of cars following "What is this discussion about?", toward the top of the page. You'll see a bunch of names, among them the Altima & the Mazda6. Discussion of any of these cars, or of any car that competes with these, is considered to be on-topic.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    I wander if V6 3.5 is any better or more modern?

    From what I have read, the current 3.5L is no more modern then the 3.0L The 3.0L was heavily revised for 2010 from what I understand, putting out 240hp or so.

    I have read some reviews that say there is not that big of a difference between a 3.0L Fusion and the 3.5L in the Fusion Sport. I have never driven a Fusion Sport, so, I can;t give you a personal opinion. You would be better off asking someone more familiar with that car.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    Hey... I thought this was the Nissan Altima forum....

    LOL.....we discuss every mid-sizer here!
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Member Posts: 1,230
    I have read some reviews that say there is not that big of a difference between a 3.0L Fusion and the 3.5L in the Fusion Sport. I have never driven a Fusion Sport, so, I can;t give you a personal opinion. You would be better off asking someone more familiar with that car.

    I've test-driven both a SEL (with 3.0) and the Sport, and I noticed the difference almost immediately, especially when I turned the first corner. The suspension tuning of the Sport is VERY evident, with a stiffer, more controlled ride and tighter handling. The better ride goes to the SEL, but IMO the overall ride/handling combination was better in the Sport. The steering is also hydraulic (unlike the electric assist in the SEL), and IMO there was more feedback and was nicely weighted (the SEL was too light, with little feedback).

    As far as engines are concerned, there really wasn't a HUGE difference. The 3.5 felt slightly more refined, and I felt it had more mid-range punch, but the power difference between them (from the driver's seat) is minimal.
  • lehrer1lehrer1 Member Posts: 54
    Thank you.
    Lehrer1
  • lehrer1lehrer1 Member Posts: 54
    Hello mz6greyghost,
    thank you for your response.
    I had 97 Taurus V6. The hydraulic assist steering in Taurus 97 was much better than in Fusion SE 2010 V6. It is a pity because otherwise SE 2010 V6 is a very good car.
    Does anybody know how electrical assist steering works?
    Just in case, I am mechanical engineer with some knowledge in electromechanical dives.
    Lehrer1
  • explorerx4explorerx4 Member Posts: 19,204
    what was the front tire pressure on the Fusion you the drove?
    2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
  • baggs32baggs32 Member Posts: 3,229
    First off, I never said they ruled them completely. For their North American Operations, Ford had a HUGE say in how they conducted business. Second, Ford had a lot of their brass in Mazda North American Operations. That is a FACT. Coming from someone who is associated with Mazda, I would know more then you.

    Right. That's why I told you Ford did not control them completely. Yeah, I Googled it and learned all of it from other forums. It's public knowledge and I don't need to work for Mazda to know that.

    I'm pretty sure you're wrong about the 3 too. The last gen 3 was a joint effort between Ford, Mazda and Volvo where each contributed their own expertise. IIRC Ford provided the chassis engineering and balance, Mazda developed the platform and provided the powertrain, and Volvo obviously worked on the safety. Maybe the new one has morphed away from that formula but that's how I remember the original being born. So in a nutshell, the last gen 3 was very much a Euro Focus and Volvo S40 too.

    Mazda had "free reign"to develop the Mazda6 because Ford at the time did not have a mid-sized vehicle. They had a corporate fleet Ford Taurus. Ford used the Mazda6 platform, electronic design, suspension architecture, I4 engine to build the Fusion. They even have the same ECU! Ford saved $10 billion in development costs when building the 1st gen Fusion.

    Right answer. That's why Ford bought the controlling interest. Another example is with Volvo where Ford bought them simply because they were so impressed with the S80 platform which now underpins several Ford and Lincoln models. Aside from some trucks there really are very few Ford cars that who's platforms were actually developed by Ford.

    Fact of the matter is, Ford had much more say in the daily operations of Mazda then you think they did. Even tough they were "business partners", Ford had a little leverage.

    No, I'm well aware of how the arrangement worked. Google is more powerful than you are giving it credit for. I probably read your statement differently than you intended it to read so I understand your point more now. lf nothing else it looks like others have learned something from this conversation because there seems to be a lot of questions about Mazda and Ford cars/motors all of a sudden!

    This was always something that bugged Mazda. For the first time since the early 90's, Mazda can do what they want, when they want, without Ford having to approve.

    Well, let's wait and see how that goes before saying it's good or bad for Mazda. I took my two boys out to the lots yesterday morning to check out the new models. We first stopped at one of the top 3 Ford dealers (in sales) in the area and there were zero new Fusions on their lot, which is what I really went there to see, and not much more there other than F-150s and Focii. I'm guessing they are waiting to sell off the '10 models before they build up the '11 MY inventory so that could explain the emptiness of that lot over how it usually is. Higher sales than normal could explain it too though.

    Next we drove a few miles up the road to the VW/Mazda dealer. The Mazda dealer's lot was packed to the gills with '10 models most sporting bright neon colored paint on the windshields advertising 0% interest + cash back. Sure it's only one dealer in a medium sized city but when the Ford lot up the road, and the Honda lot we drove past, are nearly empty at model year end time, you have to wonder.

    I also had the unfortunate opportunity to see a Mazda2 in person there. After seeing a Fiesta down the road I have to say that Mazda really messed that one up. The Fiesta looked sporty and sleek whereas the 2 looked like a cheap little blob. Maybe it was the white color or the base wheel/tire package. Either way I did not like it at all.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Member Posts: 3,159
    I also had the unfortunate opportunity to see a Mazda2 in person there. After seeing a Fiesta down the road I have to say that Mazda really messed that one up.

    Ford definitely put a little more effort into the Fiesta, no doubt. The Mazda2 we see is virtually the same as it has been for the past couple years, outside of a few different styling cues. I will say, when sitting inside the Mazda2, it is not as cheap as it seems. It is put together very well. It could be better, though, especially with the quality of all their other vehicles.

    From what I hear in Mazda world, and this is nothing official, it that Mazda released the Mazda2 as-is with the intention of adding their soon to be SKY drivetrains in the next year or so. Since a new model usually generates buzz, they figure to ride the initial wave of success and then come out with the new drivetrains. Kinda like what Ford did with the 2010-2011 Mustang. Again, this is nothing official, but, that is the plan from what I have been hearing.
  • csandstecsandste Member Posts: 1,866
    Moderators-- This has been posted all over Edmunds today. Virus?
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Administrator Posts: 11,142
    Nope, just your run-of-the-mill pesky spammer. :mad:

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  • cobraboy1cobraboy1 Member Posts: 69
    Ford definitely put a little more effort into the Fiesta, no doubt. The Mazda2 we see is virtually the same as it has been for the past couple years, outside of a few different styling cues. I will say, when sitting inside the Mazda2, it is not as cheap as it seems. It is put together very well. It could be better, though, especially with the quality of all their other vehicles.

    Actually even though they both came out at roughly the same time, they really don't share all that much in common with one another. I don't know all of the specifics about what each car shares with the other but I believe its very little if anything at all. The Fiesta is a european car that Ford pretty much brought straight over from europe and only changed what they needed to do to make the car legal for U.S. roads and laws. The Mazda2 is a vehicle brought from Japan.

    That said I've driven both of these vehicles (w/ the manual tranny) and they are very different cars. I drive about 60k per year (I currently have a 2010 fusion sport with 46k miles), looking for a car with better mpg. The Mazda2 is a great city car that is a lot of fun to drive as long as your drive is no longer than an hour or two. And the performance in the straight line is really really really sluggish.

    The ford on the other hand is a lot more solid feeling and seems like a much larger car. It handles very well and in the straight line if feels very eager and fun to go through the gears. The styling is better and not as weird to look at, not to mention that the mazda is a much simpler car than the Fiesta. These two cars are great because they are both designed to do two very different missions in life.

    BTW. FYI, Mazda is still owned in part by Ford, only 13% currently, but hey still part.
  • Sandman6472Sandman6472 Member Posts: 6,948
    edited August 2010
    Personally like the looks of the Fiesta better than the Mazda2...outside looks sportier and a much better dash layout. But out current Mazda 3s has been great up to a month ago, so think the wife would prefer the Mazda. We've had a Ford and a couple of Lincoln Continentals growing up & all 3 were crap compared to our Cadillacs, so not sure if I could ever purchase another Ford. The Fiesta would have to be an exceptional car to even be considered. But if the wife got such a small car, she'd need the one with the most powerful auto tranny. But coming from a 2.3 to a 1.6 will probably not work for her.

    Wish I could find a small car with a 2.0 engine that would make her happy. She won't go any larger than her current M3s and would be happy dropping down a size. We don't need a large car anymore as we already have 4 cars for us and the girls and anticipate having to purchace a fifth for our just graduated boy to start his new job. Not sure what we're gonna do!



    The Sandman :confuse: :sick: :shades:

    2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)

  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    If wife needs a small car about the size of the Mazda3, you should show her the 2011 Elantra when it's out. It will likely continue its heritage of having a mid-sized interior and compact exterior, but will have a new DI I4 (might actually be smaller than the current 2.0 Beta II, but with at least as much power if not more), 6AT, high fuel economy, and the looks of a mini-Sonata (some think it actually looks better than the Sonata). Another nice midsize-inside/compact-outside car is the Sentra. I am leasing one now and I find it's a smooth and comfortable car, with plenty of room and excellent FE with its 2.0L CVT. Best car I could find for $179/mo. with 0 out of pocket.
  • Sandman6472Sandman6472 Member Posts: 6,948
    edited August 2010
    That is one that I've already planned on showing her...we done the Sentra thing and had bad luck... yet, the kids versa is a great vehicle so far. She really likes the other girls Accent, but I think she'll like the Elantra's extra power, which she's used to. Our time frame is for a 2012 model which will work out great. brike my 1st year model with my '06 Civic & don't want to repeat that again!

    The Sandman :sick: :shades:

    2023 Hyundai Kona Limited AWD (wife) / 2015 Golf TSI (me) / 2019 Chevrolet Cruze Premier RS (daughter #1) / 2020 Hyundai Accent SE (daughter #2) / 2023 Subaru Impreza Base (son)

  • dash5dash5 Member Posts: 421
    Not sure if this should go someplace else, but at 31k, I think this fits in the standard midsized section now?

    G25 preview

    http://www.autoblog.com/2010/08/13/2011-infiniti-g25-arrives-stateside-priced-at- -30-950/
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    IMO, a car starting at $31k doesn't belong in this discussion. If it did, we'd have to add several other cars to this discussion. All the cars on the right start close to $20k, with the exception of the current Passat. And I've read the new Passat will be priced lower than the current one. $10k+, or 50%, is a huge difference in starting price. Yes, the G25 has a V6, but the cars on the right offer a V6 or a like-powered turbo for much less than $31k.
  • stephen987stephen987 Member Posts: 1,994
    IMO, a car starting at $31k doesn't belong in this discussion.

    Nor do the Mazda2 and Fiesta.
  • backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I agree, they are not mid-sized cars by any stretch of the imagination. Being formally accepted in this discussion vs. a mention in an occasional post are two different things, however.

    Just my 2 cents... since the question was asked.
  • acdiiacdii Member Posts: 753
    Most people who have test driven the Sport vs SEL dont notice a power difference mainly beacuse the engines need to learn, which takes at least 1500 miles or more being driven by the same driver. Also keep in mind the 3.0 and 3.5 use different transmissions. After about 10k on the two cars, the Sport will smoke the SEL. The 3.5 has a different power band and the trans connected to it is designed to maximize that power band. If you drove the Sport AWD, it will feel more like the 3.0 due to the parasitic losses of the AWD transmission and Center differential. My Sport easily smokes the front tire with very little effort, and after 20k miles, looks like I may need to get new front tires soon. :blush: Due soon for its next oil change, so i will get the tires rotated again. I should get a few more miles out of them then.

    Had ford decided to drop the 3.5 DI Ecoboost in the Fusion, it would be one that could blow the doors off most cars out there, including some of those very high priced "luxury" models. I have the Flex with ecoboost and it easily does 0-60 in just under 6 seconds. It is a 4600# box, so imagine that power in a 3600# aerodynamic car like the fusion. It is also tuned down in the Flex, the Taurus has 10 more HP. 360HP 355 Torque in the Sport, LOOK OUT! ;)
  • akirbyakirby Member Posts: 8,062
    I seriously doubt that the front clip in the Fusion could withstand the 3.5L EB torque. When they first put that engine in the Taurus it totally destroyed the front end in just a few minutes, necessitating a totally new front clip for the Taurus and Flex to handle the torque (this is sometimes referred to as the D4 platform since there were also changes made to the rear suspension IIRC from the original D3 platform).

    It could be done but probably costs too much at this point to do that much reengineering on a lame duck platform (scheduled to be replaced by a jointly engineered CD4 Fusion/Mondeo replacement in 2 or 3 years).
  • kaliforniakkaliforniak Member Posts: 51
    I finally got to drive a 6 S GT and really loved the car. It's quite at low RPM and the engine growls to live when I step on it. I gotta say it's many levels above my 2003 6 with the I4 engine. BLIS worked like a charm on local street and I'm sure it'll be even better on the Interstate 5.

    The CC I test drove a couple of months ago had a certain European feel to it. The road noise was much less than the 6 probably because of its 17 inch wheels. I also like how the 2.0T almost snapped my neck when I punched it. Oh, the seats fitted my driving posture more, too.

    My question for you shoppers / owners is which car do you guys think will be the better choice down the road ? I am a little concerned with VW's quality from what I've read while my Mazda has been problem free for 7yrs/65K miles. Repairs on a German car would probably cost more than a Mazda as well. The 6 is fast but gets far worse gas mileage which could add up over a 5-8 yr ownership. Say 300 bucks a year over 8 year is 2400 bucks.

    I'm hoping owners of current 6 and CC/Passat can shed some light on their experience.
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