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Midsize Sedans 2.0



  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,624
    Please re-read my post--that's not what I said, or implied, at all.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,624
    So with the 6-speed automatic available in the I4 Aura and also, early next year, in the I4 Malibu, does that make automakers like Honda "idiots" for only offering 5 speeds?
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    While driving back to Dallas from Houston over the weekend, I noticed three 1990-1993 generation Accords over a short distance and that got me into thinking about longevity of cars. I can’t recall the last time I saw a Camry from that era, and in fact, 1993-1996 Camry has become a rare thing too despite of being a high volume seller in its day. OTOH, 1990+ Accords are very easy to find on the roads, and mid-90s Taurus is too, as are mid-late 90s Maximas. I don’t expect to see many Sonatas either but they can get the benefit of doubt for being low volume sellers.

    I would like to see the percentage of cars still on road that have been sold since 1990. Anybody knows a credible source?
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Yes. That is one area I have been complaining about from Honda. They have been selling 6AT in European Civic which has the same engine as American version, just haven't considered it yet for American market in any of its cars.

    But at the same time, I don't want Honda to put a 6AT for namesake (that would be simply to appeal to less than informed buyers). When they do, it needs to be the real thing. The best candidates for it are 190 HP Accord I-4, and to some extent, the Accord V6.

    Interestingly enough, I feel Honda could stick better 5AT ratios in Accord than they have, and have it even better than some 6ATs being sold in front drivers.

    With powerful front drivers, it is more difficult to extract the full potential of 6AT.
  • OTOH, 1990+ Accords are very easy to find on the roads, and mid-90s Taurus is too, as are mid-late 90s Maximas.

    I think this is very regional. I see a lot of 90-93 Accords on the road but they are starting to lack rear quarter panels. I actually did well selling mine because being from California, it had no rot.
    The Taurus with the Vulcan V6 will run forever, even the A4OD was somewhat under-stressed by that application. The later 3.8L was a motor that had a lot of longevity as well.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,624
    I see lots of Camrys from the '92-'96 generation, probably more than any other mid-sized car from that era, and lots of Buicks--many even from the '80s. Lots of Taurii from '95-on. I also see some '90-93 Accords, but like you I see a lot of rust on those. Lots of '94-97 Accords out there, they don't seem to have been hit by the rust bug as much.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Maybe you guys remember me posting pictures from being clipped on the interstate over the summer. Did a nice sum of damage, and I got my car back not too long ago (maybe 1,000 miles?). Well, I got rear-ended today, once again, in my 1996 Accord. That brings the total number of incidents (none of which I caused or was found at fault for) to FIVE in that car. None in my new one thank-the-lord.

    I'm beginning to think my beloved 12 year old Honda has a curse. Either that, or a magnet, which draws other cars to me! Luckily, I'm ok, and the damage is minor, but once again I get to play the "deal with their insurance company" game. UGH!
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Glad you're fine. It sucks to be in that situation.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    :cry: Yep, just lucky to have my 2006 while that one is in the shop. I'm actually thinking of selling old faithful (she needs some work that will be expensive - timing belt at $650 plus struts which would cost $800+ I've been told). Maybe when I get 'er fixed I'll put the sign in the window. I can't promise I won't cry though :cry: :cry:
  • andres3andres3 CAPosts: 5,282
    I think guys driving domestics are jealous of the "last and run forever" Honda's and try to play target practice on them with the "won't run for long" domestics they have. :P So you better crash um while you still can! :P

    They try to run the Honda's into the junkyard due to collisions.

    My GF got rearended by a Taurus and a Jetta in her Civics.

    I got rear ended by a Mustang in my Accord.

    I've never hit anyone else's vehicle excluding hits under 3 MPH.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    My experiences belie yours. I got hit by a Honda Pilot this time. The time before, I was clipped by a man in a 1988 Chevrolet S-10 Pickup - proving they can run for an awful long time too. He was going 75-80MPH, so he wasn't pushing it in the slow-lane.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    yeah right - just a few weeks back one Mazda dealer (Houston) was offering all 6s in stock at $6000.00 off MSRP. On a %20k sticker that would only be about $4k UNDER invoice! (including the rebate/financing that naturally went along with it.)
    The day that Camcords (even on model year changeovers sell for that kind of price - the same day that the sun rises in the west! Toyota and Honda would literally disinfranchise any of their dealers caught doing such thing - perserving the brand's value now and later is THAT important, to both them and to those that invested in one of those particular cars.
  • My Accord was about 4.5-5k under MSRP. I cannot imagine anyone paying sticker price for that car, ever.
  • robertsmxrobertsmx Posts: 5,525
    Which Accord was that? When did you buy it? I can see dealers going a few hundred dollars below invoice during year end clearance, but thousands? Well...
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    FYI - and I would hope that everybody knows this - 'invoice is about MSRP * .9 on about all cars made. Factory options tend to work on or about a .85 muliplier, dealer options - is 'Katy bar the door' Once saw a new Camry SE on a lot with 19" tire and wheels - looked horrible and drove even worse. Dealer price for the tires/wheels? How about $8000.00, for maybe 1500 or 2000 'worth' of stuff. Wonder how much 'discount' I could have gotten on that one? Paying sticker for a car - you only do that when the car you want is in very high demand, you haven't done any research, and you probably can't find any in dealer inventories.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    little known to many buyers is that amongst the dealers they can tell you almost precisely what the other guy is likely to do pricewise. A dealer out there cutting prices significantly will likely incur the wrath (and non-cooperation) of those neighboring dealers and also might just receive a 'nasty' letter from the distributor/mfgr.
  • 2007 Honda Accord EX Purchased end of July, 2007 MSRP 23,145 (invoice is right around 21k) Purchase Price 19,000+ mask, "mud guards,"and trunk mat. I still think I overpaid, and I think I could've found a better vehicle for me for 19k, but alas, I can learn about the great resale value in 18-24 months.
  • benjaminhbenjaminh Posts: 1,623
    What better car could you have found than an 07 EX Accord for 19k? What a great deal!
  • Thanks, I appreciate that. :) Did my parents put you up tio that? :P And I think it is a great car for most people. It gets good mileage, does a great job with an infant seat, and has a good sized usable trunk. It should also hold its value pretty well.

    I think a Mazda6 Touring with the V6 and a 5 speed manual would have been more my cup of tea and in the same price range more/less. Or a Legacy turbo sedan (but we already have a wagon and don't know if I can't deal with having 2 similar cars).

    I guess what I really should've done is looked harder for an '06 Mazda6 or Legacy GT in the 10-15k range, or a certified E46 3-series.
  • bhmr59bhmr59 Posts: 1,598
    Or, perhaps an optioned-out Sonata Limited.

    Our Sonata SE (V6, like the Limited) 8 months ago was $16,651 plus doc fee, reg & taxes was $18,189. The Limited was about $2K MSRP higher (car price would have been about $18,500 before doc & TTL).

    Nothing wrong with your choice, just that there are alternatives which could give one more for one's money.
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