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Midsize Sedans 2.0

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Comments

  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    I wish Honda made bluetooth and XM standard on every Accord above the LX.

    I wish every midsize car has standard bluetooth. It really shouldn't cost that much to install at assembly especially if done in huge quantity--maybe a $100. I could care less about XM though. I think if you did a survey of 100 people you'd probably get 80% for bluetooth and maybe 40-50% for XM. Out of my circle(it's not a huge circle but big enough) of friends and relatives I only know one person that has XM and I'm not sure if that is what he has or if it is Sirrius.
  • maxamillion1maxamillion1 Posts: 1,467
    I personally prefer Sirius myself...but since they seem to be combining soon...I can deal with XM. I like how Chevy is doing the bluetooth option for 09...allowing all but the base model to at least have it...so I'm happy about that. But my younger brother works for a Saturn retailer in the Carolinas and he told me that Saturn had a big dealer meeting and explained that the BT system used on the Aura and Malibu would not be compatible with many of today's phones. Not sure what that means...but we'll find out soon enough when the 09s get here.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    I have a bluetooth speaker made by Blueant that clips on the visor. Researched quite a few and this one was high rated and I really like it. No it isn't nearly as cool as having bluetooth built in and coordinated with radio etc. But it does work very well and has outstanding battery life. I mainly use it on longer drives and in areas where handsfree is required. My ultimate test of the device was my father(84yrs old) in Texas couldn't tell I wasn't on my cell when I called him. It only cost about $70.

    I would still rather have built in bluetooth for a reasonalble price though. The system that Hyundai is putting in is nothing more than what I have pretty much. It doesn't sync with the radio to my knowledge. It costs a lot more than mine but then again you don't have to charge it.
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    I have a Blueant now and it works pretty well. The only problem is if you forget to turn if off while the car is in the garage. If you leave it on and don't walk far enough away from the car, the bluetooth connection will not disconnect. The battery can last for weeks between charges, so leaving it on overnight isn't a big deal otherwise.
    Since the Blueant gets the job done, I wouldn't sell my car just to buy a car with built-in bluetooth, but if I'm going to buy a new car anyway, I'd rather get one with that feature.

    There is a new, better version of the Blueant Supertooth coming out that has text to speech Caller-ID and a vibration sensor that will turn itself on based when it senses the vibration of your car door slamming shut. You can also answer calls by voice and not even have to take your hand off the wheel to press any buttons.

    http://www.mycellphoneblog.com/blueant-supertooth-3-bluetooth-speaker/

    image
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    I totally agree and thanks for link. I'm going to look into the new Blueant. I wonder if the new unit will turn off when it feels the door close as well? My wife just got a bluetooth phone so I may give her my current Blueant and get the new one. I'll probably wait until I get a new car within the next few months and see if I can get the installed system for a reasonable price.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Posts: 4,116
    I personally prefer Sirius myself...but since they seem to be combining soon...I can deal with XM.

    I can't get myself to pay for the content they have on satellite radio. I don't understand the allure or the value there. I like local news and traffic in the morning, and I like the local classic rock or 80s stations during the rest of the commute. I just can't see paying $120/yr for something that is already free. HD radio has better sound quality than most satellite radio systems, and its free as well.

    I am glad someone has a revenue stream though, the XM revenue stream might help offset the OnStar stuff.

    But my younger brother works for a Saturn retailer in the Carolinas and he told me that Saturn had a big dealer meeting and explained that the BT system used on the Aura and Malibu would not be compatible with many of today's phones.

    Different phone manufacturers (and service providers) define the bluetooth vehicle interface protocol differently. Some phones offer more features and connectivity than others based on that interface. Most of the newer systems (SYNC, MyGig) have someway to update the firmware in the HU as more phones come out, and most phones are being tested with these devices. It should keep getting better as they hammer out a specification for the bluetooth vehicle interface.
  • busirisbusiris Posts: 3,490
    I personally prefer Sirius myself...but since they seem to be combining soon...I can deal with XM.

    I can't get myself to pay for the content they have on satellite radio. I don't understand the allure or the value there.I like local news and traffic in the morning, and I like the local classic rock or 80s stations during the rest of the commute. I just can't see paying $120/yr for something that is already free. HD radio has better sound quality than most satellite radio systems, and its free as well.

    I used to feel the same way, until I bought an 08 Altima with XM radio. Its quite addicting, especially if you spend much time on the road. There are so many choices, from music to talk to comedy, and virtually commercial free. Personally, I see the value, but I understand why others may not view it as worthwhile...

    I am glad someone has a revenue stream though, the XM revenue stream might help offset the OnStar stuff.

    But my younger brother works for a Saturn retailer in the Carolinas and he told me that Saturn had a big dealer meeting and explained that the BT system used on the Aura and Malibu would not be compatible with many of today's phones.


    That's true across the board, but some manufacturers support many more phones than others, and each model may be different within an individual manufacturer.

    For example, my 07 BMW Z4 only supports 4 or 5 phones, all but one Motorola. However, my 08 Altima supports a boatload of Bluetooth phones from many manufacturers.

    I don't know about other manufacturers, but both BMW and Nissan list the compatible phones on their respective web-sites...


    Different phone manufacturers (and service providers) define the bluetooth vehicle interface protocol differently. Some phones offer more features and connectivity than others based on that interface. Most of the newer systems (SYNC, MyGig) have someway to update the firmware in the HU as more phones come out, and most phones are being tested with these devices. It should keep getting better as they hammer out a specification for the bluetooth vehicle interface.

    I absolutely agree with that statement.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    Sync's bluetooth interface is fantastic. They seem to have done a very complete implementation of the latest bluetooth standards. There are many phones that support all features. The ones that don't need to be upgraded by the mfr/service provider. At least with Sync so far it's always been the phone's firmware that was lacking. However, should Sync ever need an update it can be accomplished with a computer download to a USB thumb drive.

    We got an Edge last Saturday - my wife paired her phone in just a few minutes, including downloading the entire address book. She then hit the phone button and said "call Chris" - and it did. I sent her a text message and Sync read the message out loud, including translating "LOL" to "laughing out loud". Not to mention voice control of her iPod. What a great product!
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    Sync's bluetooth interface is fantastic

    Come on Mazda, press Ford to let you put SYNC in the new 6.
  • urnewsurnews Posts: 668

    We got an Edge last Saturday ...

    Congratulations Allen. What did you trade? Did you keep the Fusion or is it an MKZ you have (had)? Tell us more.
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    I still have my Fusion. This was my wife's vehicle which replaced a [gas hogging, premium sipping, problem laden, truck riding] 2003 Aviator.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Posts: 3,855
    I wish every midsize car has standard bluetooth. It really shouldn't cost that much to install at assembly especially if done in huge quantity--maybe a $100. I could care less about XM though.

    Of course, I am no indicator, or maybe I am a contrary indicator. But I could not :) care less about either of those features.
  • frag235frag235 Posts: 81
    Sounds like the Bill Gates Co. got something right :P
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    You must not use your cell phone while driving.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    Did he say he has a cellphone??? ;)
  • akirbyakirby Posts: 7,699
    Did he say he has a cellphone???

    What is he - Amish? ;) ;)
  • drwilscdrwilsc Posts: 140
    I can't get myself to pay for the content they have on satellite radio.

    I agree. It seems smarter to download whatever songs you want on your MP3 player, which plugs into most modern car audio systems. That way, we Generation X'ers can listen to our favorite '80s songs whenever we want!
  • jaxs1jaxs1 Posts: 2,697
    It wouldn't need the vibration sensor to turn off because it goes into standby automatically when it's out of range of the bluetooth connection, but if you don't walk far enough away to lose the connection, it will remain paired (such as if you have an attached garage and don't walk more than 20 or 30 feet away from the car when you go inside. You will have to remember to turn if off manually in that case.

    Here is the website with a demo

    http://www.supertooth.net/HelpService/interactive_voice_demo.html

    Looks like the changed the name to "Supertooth Voice" instead of Supertooth 3.
  • jeffyscottjeffyscott Posts: 3,855
    I generally don't have a cell phone with me. We have one but my wife carries it most of the time, it is used pretty rarely. 200-300 Tracfone minutes covers us for a year or more.

    Neither of us likes to use the telephone much, cellular or otherwise. Our last long distance bill had one call for 2 cents and last local bill shows 19 calls for the month.

    Like I said before, I know I am an out of touch luddite, which is why I don't understand how you-all have so much need to talk on the phone constantly.
  • m6userm6user Posts: 3,006
    I use mine(both the cell and the blueant speaker) mostly on longer drives when I catch up with family. They all live long distance from me. For example, I drive up to Minneapolis occasionally for AF reserves and call my dad in TX while I'm driving. We might talk for an hour or so. It's just nice to drive with both hands on the wheel and looking staight ahead while conversing. It's usually a weekend so minutes are free. Then I might call the sister in Michigan and do the same thing. It breaks up the drive and also helps me keep in touch.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    I generally don't have a cell phone with me. We have one but my wife carries it most of the time, it is used pretty rarely. 200-300 Tracfone minutes covers us for a year or more.

    I thought we (my family) were the only one's who didn't talk on cell phones constantly. ;)

    I think the increasing number of gadgets in today's cars (i-pod connections, navigation, phone accessories, etc.) are only providing more distractions for drivers. Car shopping seems to be less about the car, and more about the toys included. All this would be fine with me, if it were not increasing the prices of the cars too. :( Some of us just want our car to be a car, and not a toy box.
  • urnewsurnews Posts: 668

    Some of us just want our car to be a car, and not a toy box.

    Well stated. I am one of those people, too.
  • bwiabwia Boston Posts: 1,235
    Some of us just want our car to be a car, and not a toy box.

    Well stated. I am one of those people, too.


    I used to feel that way until we bought a Malibu with OnStar navigation and handfree telephone. These toys can be very addictive and not to mention ridiculously expensive.
    Nonetheless, I still don't own a cell phone and probably won't buy one any time soon.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Posts: 4,116
    So I just installed a Britax Boulevard in the back of the '05 Legacy wagon (I know, not a sedan but still midsize) and I can't believe how much space it takes up. Right now it is in the center to protect the lil dude better from side impacts, and there is no way for anyone to sit in the two outboard positions unless they are a contortionist. I am positive they could design a child seat every bit as safe and secure without taking up half of the car.

    The '07 Accord fared better with the infant seat (Graco SnugRide) than the Legacy, which still had a usable back seat, but I think the Britax installed in the Accord would have the same outcome.

    The other issue that most cars I have seen lack the lower tether (it should be on the floor in the back seat) for anchoring a rear-facing child seat, with the Accord and Legacy being no exception. Now that the Accord is losing its main advantage of having a usable back seat with the child seat installed, buyers remorse just grows. Its not that it isn't a great car, its just not the one for me.
  • tedebeartedebear Posts: 832
    Some of us just want our car to be a car, and not a toy box.

    Well stated. I am one of those people, too.


    Like someone else said, I used to be like that myself. I told my wife that I didn't want a cell phone and when I'm out doing things like my favorite pastime bicycling I want to be detached from the rest of the world and not bothered.

    In the car the only time I would ever listen to the radio was for weather updates related to upcoming bike rides or the news.

    Last fall I bought a Sebring with a MyGIG infotainment system. Now I've turned into a gadget junkie. This thing is so cool I call it my playground on wheels. Heck, I even carry a cell phone with me on my bike now.
  • Karen_CMKaren_CM Posts: 5,018
    A reporter is hoping to talk with consumers who had considered purchasing a Hyundai Sonata and ended up purchasing another vehicle. Please respond to ctalati@edmunds.com before Friday, May 16, 2008 with your daytime contact information and what you ended up purchasing.

    Community Manager If you have any questions or concerns about the Forums, send me an email, karen@edmunds.com, or click on my screen name to send a personal message.

  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    Just a little engine comparo here

    Mazda6 2.5L 170hp @ 6000 rpm / 167 lb-ft torque @ 4000 rpm
    Accord LX 177hp @ 6500 rpm / 161 lb-ft torque @ 4300 rpm
    Accord EX 190hp @ 7000 rpm / 162 lb-ft torque @ 4400 rpm

    Mazda6 3.7L 272hp @ 6250 rpm / 269 lb-ft torque @ 4250 rpm
    Accord 3.5L 268hp @ 6200 rpm / 248 lb-ft torque @ 5000 rpm

    I would say that Mazda's 2.5L is on par with Honda's Accord LX. Obviously, the EX has more hp, but, less tq. That's i-VTEC for ya!

    As for the V6's, I would guess that the Mazda will be quicker, especially with the 21 lb-ft torque advantage, however, curb weight and gearing will come into play. Honda is known for great gearing.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I would say that Mazda's 2.5L is on par with Honda's Accord LX. Obviously, the EX has more hp, but, less tq. That's i-VTEC for ya!

    As for the V6's, I would guess that the Mazda will be quicker, especially with the 21 lb-ft torque advantage, however, curb weight and gearing will come into play. Honda is known for great gearing.


    Interesting read, avi. One thing I noticed, that I hadn't before, is that the torque in the Honda 2.4 actually peaks at a higher RPM than my 2006 does (4,000 in my 166hp car). Wrong direction!

    Also, as far as gearing goes, the V6 Accord has relatively short gearing which allows VCM to operate more often. With taller gearing, VCM wouldn't activate as much because the combination of the gearing and the VCM would mean VCM would rarely get used because it didn't provide enough power. So, you may have something there, with gearing, but I suspect Mazda's 6-speed and fatter torque curve will push it to the front if there were a race. The Accord Sedans are noted for having a weaker torque curve than the non-VCM coupes, effectively "missing" some power. There's a reason the Malibu/Aura, with less horses, is faster than the Accord.
  • aviboy97aviboy97 Posts: 3,159
    There's a reason the Malibu/Aura, with less horses, is faster than the Accord.

    I noticed that too.

    Would you say that the VCM Accord is a bit "lost" in terms of what Honda was trying to do? The have gobs of power, but, it's not used to its potential? The Accord should be quicker then it is. I understand the fuel savings with the VCM, however, I have noticed an abundance of VCM Accord owners not getting the fuel savings they were expecting. What do you think? You know Honda better then I do.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Honestly, I read about the economy of the VCMers, and it actually seems pretty good. Probably as good as I was reading last year with the 3.0L models. The only thing is that with no noticeable gain in economy or performance, the 3.5L is now hauling around more weight and girth. The 4-cylinder model seems to have lost a lot of economy, however, based on the MPG forum. I don't hear people beating EPA numbers, the NEW ONES! I average close to 30 MPG and drive in the city plenty (I go to school in Birmingham and work nearby in an office park). These days people are struggling to get their Accord to 30 MPG on the highway, and this is the 2.4L model.

    It does seem that Honda tried to go three different directions with the V6 model(upscale, towards the Avalon; fast, towards the Camry; efficient towards its own 4-cylinder) and ended up getting nowhere but bigger and more expensive, with nothing groundbreaking besides VCM, which has turned out to only be ground-shaking for those with VCM surging and vibration issues.

    I will say this (and its a shame to say it): if something happened to my 2006 Accord that caused me to have to shop for a new car, the 2008 Accord would not be on my list. The Altima 2.5 would likely be close to the top, the Nissan Versa would be there too, actually.
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