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Midsize Sedans 2.0

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Comments

  • jd10013jd10013 Posts: 779
    True, the guy that bought my 50 month old 65K mile '03 Accord Coupe V6 from me told his wife "the car drives like it is brand new."

    so will most cars if you take care of them. I have a 9 yr old nissan that looks and runs as well as the day I bought it. and it has 145k on it.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Posts: 4,116
    True... CR's priorities are not all out performance and track speed. CR's priorities lie in ease of use, overall design quality, build quality, reliability, safety, and fuel economy. Fuel Economy could carry over to show they do look at "value" and pricing to determine a "good" deal.

    I have no problem with their product evaluations on particular vehicles where they do a full report. I like that they measure leg room and cargo and towing capacity, although that information is on the manufacturer's website :confuse: And I like how they run them into things at 5 mph to see how the bumpers hold up and what not; although that information is available from the IIHS :confuse:

    I like that they mention how requirements to install an infant or child seat. I like the subjective commentary on ease of use, although I like to evaluate on my own as well.

    I think the only thing I pretty much ignore is the survey responses for reliability and what not.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    Maybe CR also understands that 'value' may not have a whole lot to do with initial price.
    Think that you'll have a difficult time finding any of these cars these days in the shop every 2 months! Things have improved substantially in that regard in recent years, so much so that reliability over even the first 100k is assumed. It's the 2nd (or 3rd) 100k that separates the men from the boys, a number that very few of us that buy new cars will ever see.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    I think the only thing I pretty much ignore is the survey responses for reliability and what not.
    that curious, being about the only thing (other than measured performance figures) that is NOT subjective.
  • zzzoom6zzzoom6 Posts: 425
    actually, go back an read what I have written...when referring to something that does not exist yet, there will always be qualifiers. why? because I don't know, and I won't pretend to know more than I don't.
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    Car and Driver were not as impressed with the Aura's interior as some. I guess it depends on what you compare the interior to.

    "As we said, almost right, until the sponges in GM’s Cheapness Department got to the project. Although styled well, the interior is executed with hard plastic, glaring panel gaps, ragged mold lines, and the scrape-scraping of a gear selector that slides through its range like a screwdriver through sand. Have GM’s cheapness freaks ever sat in an Accord?"

    When you compare it to a real nice car, it comes up shy.
  • w9cww9cw Posts: 888
    I agree totally with jd10013. Timely preventive maintenance, attention to detail, and lots of TLC will do wonders for extending life of a car. I have a 22 year old SAAB 900 that drives, and runs, the same as it did when I drove it off the SAAB dealer's lot in April 1985. No squeaks, no clunks, and the car handles just as well as it did on Day 1.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    until the sponges in GM’s Cheapness Department got to the project
    the enthusiast mags do have a way with words don't they? CR would say something like 'ill fitting parts and pieces, and generally 'subpar' fit and finish and probably wouldn't mention the Accord at all. Have read the same thing about the Fusion interior referencing its use of 80's vintage LED displays, an interior that I personally found agreeable and 'un-Ford-like'. Regard this kind of thing in the same way as exterior styling - beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    OT, a co-worker, after driving Camrys for the past 10 years or so, just bought a Saturn Aura XR, and hasn't stopped raving about how much BETTER it is than her previous '05 Camry

    I hope so! The Aura is new for 2006. That Camry debuted more than five years ago.
  • captain2captain2 Posts: 3,971
    a co-worker, after driving Camrys for the past 10 years or so, just bought a Saturn Aura XR, and hasn't stopped raving about how much BETTER it is than her previous '05 Camry
    60 hp or so will do that won't it? Also a part of human nature - your coworker WANTS to rave about something she just paid all that money for, for her own gratifications (and ego) as well as those reassurances that might come from you when you nod approvingly. This would be why those 'initial' satisfaction surveys need to be taken with a grain of salt...
  • jd10013jd10013 Posts: 779
    I have a 22 year old SAAB 900 that drives, and runs, the same as it did when I drove it off the SAAB dealer's lot in April 1985. No squeaks, no clunks, and the car handles just as well as it did on Day 1.

    The thing for me was, for the first 10 years or so I was driving, I was always in one POS after another. couldn't afford 2 new cars, and the newest was always driven by my wife. As I got older, and more affluent, I was able to pay off my wifes car early and get another new one while her's was in good shape, with low milage. Well, after 10yrs of driving crap, (and boy did I have some crappy cars) I realy appreciated having a new one, and took very good care of it. did all the required stuff right on time, washed every week or two, waxed 2-3 times a year, treated all the interior every couple months, and never allowed my kids to bring food or drinks in it. As a result, the car was in such good shape that when I bought my alti in feb, just couldn't bear to trade my old one in. the car just ran and looked too good to sell.
  • zzzoom6zzzoom6 Posts: 425
    personally, I like reading CR just like I like reading the opinions on this forum... much of it I disagree with, but I like getting the perspective of others, especially from those who know what they are talking about. it seems to me though when I read car and driver, motortrend, or autoweek (among others), I find that those articles have more detail and depth than CR. CR's reviews seem to cover cars for non auto enthusiasts... all about practicality and how "appliance" like a car is. of course these things are important, but I find that car reviews in edmunds, for example (shameless plug :blush: ) much more well rounded and I get a better feel of where the car fits in it's segment. if CR were to review a ferrari, I bet they would say that there wasn't enough trunk space, the car was too loud, and the mpg weren't as good as other "sports" cars.

    and the idea that just because CR does not take ads does not mean they are unbiased. everyone has their bias, and reputation will always play a role in developing opinions.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    I actually saw my first 08 Taurus on my way home from work today in red. The new styling is an improvement and no-way can reviewers complain anylonger for vanilla styling.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    Actually I agree 100% with what you posted. CR does have a bias and their bias is different than C&D bias, edmunds' bias etc.

    To me a most of supposed studies, statistics and reviews have no relevance when I buy a car. I don't care how many awards JD Powers gives the manufacturer, if the car is COTY, how many black marks CR gives it or if CR says the trunk is too small. You never really know about the ownership experience until years after you buy the car and it's a fact of life for lemons occur in every manufacturer. In general, I believe you get what you pay for. One mans no-frills stripper is another mans golden carriage.

    The only exception to the above comment is end of year clearance sales, where manufacturers provide incentives to move the cars. If one shops judiciously a good value can be had.
  • scape2scape2 Posts: 4,119
    heard of a new 2.5 4cyl engine producing 170-180HP and about the same torque for the 09 Fusion? I am reading in other forums about this and noone has yet linked me to an article or review about this. More speculation? can anyone link me?
  • elroy5elroy5 Posts: 3,741
    and the idea that just because CR does not take ads does not mean they are unbiased. everyone has their bias, and reputation will always play a role in developing opinions.

    At least CR's biases are personal (like yours and mine), and not bought and paid for. CR treats car evaluation like Joe Friday, "Just the facts maam". The advertising mags seem to only get critical (less bias) when doing a comparison test. When they do an individual car review, it sounds like an endorsement, that's been paid for.
  • poncho167poncho167 Posts: 1,178
    "I actually saw my first 08 Taurus on my way home from work today in red. The new styling is an improvement and no-way can reviewers complain anylonger for vanilla styling."

    Did you mean new name? This car has been out for what, three years.

    I wish them luck especially since I recently bought a lot of Ford stock at a real cheap rate. The Five Hundred, Taurus, or whatever they call it still looks odd to me. It's bubble top needs to be chopped 1 or 2 inches to look nicer. I don't think I could live with the looks as it is.
  • imidazol97imidazol97 Crossroads of America: I70 & I75Posts: 18,475
    >At least CR's biases are personal.. and not bought and paid for.

    I've always wondered about that because of their past reluctance to change as cars changed.
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Posts: 1,230
    I hope so! The Aura is new for 2006. That Camry debuted more than five years ago.

    Not according to some people around here, that blindly think that a 8-year-old CamCord is still better than the brand-new "American" cars built today, without even stepping foot in any of them, or taking them out for test-drives.

    No grad, you're not one of them... :)
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Posts: 1,230
    60 hp or so will do that won't it? Also a part of human nature - your coworker WANTS to rave about something she just paid all that money for, for her own gratifications (and ego) as well as those reassurances that might come from you when you nod approvingly.

    Considering how she drives, HP has nothing to do with it. She WANTS to brag because she test-drove everything else out there, including the new Camry, and feels she made the right choice because SHE loved it more than the Camry.

    She doesn't care about my approval (or anyone else, for that matter). In fact, when she started her search a few months ago, I recommended the Camry and Altima to her. Apparently, her husband was pulling for the Camry as well, but she did her own thing, and bought what SHE liked. And after having sat and rode in one, I agree that she made the right decision, and I too like the Aura very much as well.

    Egos have nothing to do with it, unless one's not very confident in their own.
  • mz6greyghostmz6greyghost Posts: 1,230
    Did you mean new name? This car has been out for what, three years.

    Check his post again. I don't see anything else mentioned but the new styling, which indeed is new for '08, as well as the 3.5L and a new name.

    I wish them luck especially since I recently bought a lot of Ford stock at a real cheap rate. The Five Hundred, Taurus, or whatever they call it still looks odd to me. It's bubble top needs to be chopped 1 or 2 inches to look nicer. I don't think I could live with the looks as it is.

    And who's fault is it that you bought stock in a company in which you find the styling of it's products "odd"? I'm sure I can speak for everyone else here when I say that that last thing I'd do is invest in a company who's in dire straits and whose product I'm not particularly fond of.
  • urnewsurnews Posts: 668
    I hope so! The Aura is new for 2006.

    Grad, is that a typo? I thought the Aura was new this year, 2007.
  • poncho167poncho167 Posts: 1,178
    "Egos have nothing to do with it, unless one's not very confident in their own."

    I would also drive the Saturn over the Camry any day. The Camry is an old peoples car.
  • poncho167poncho167 Posts: 1,178
    "Check his post again. I don't see anything else mentioned but the new styling, which indeed is new for '08, as well as the 3.5L and a new name."

    That new styling, looks like the same car from 3-years-ago other than new headlights and a grill on it, big deal. The rest of the car is the same. What about the bubble top roof?

    "And who's fault is it that you bought stock in a company in which you find the styling of it's products "odd"?"

    I don't see a fault in supporting a company with a funny looking car when there are other vehicles in their line-up that show some promise including the upcoming F series trucks. My hopes an aspirations are not banked on that silly looking Five Hundred/err Tuarus. The stock was cheap because of the poor direction of the company and products. They can only get better but I don't think this car Taurus/500 is the answer, but maybe they will find buyers? That will be a bonus to me and my bottom line. People who buy stock and have a diversified portfolio don't necessarily have to believe or like everything about company they invest in as long as it shows profit/potential. If you have a diversified portfolio (15 + different companies) do you really know all the products they produce and use them?
  • w9cww9cw Posts: 888
    The designer of the previous generation VW Passat designed the Five Hundred, now Taurus. You should see a distinct family resemblance. Not everyone wants vertically-challenged side windows like the Chrysler 300, and many new cars, including the Aura.
  • benderofbowsbenderofbows Posts: 544
    Does anyone know:

    Who was the first to put five blades on their Fusion, Gillette or Ford?

    The Fusion was out first... or was it the Fusion? I can't remember, anyways besides having the same name, they do kinda look alike to me.

    image

    image
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Posts: 4,116
    Thank you for that; things were too serious. I wonder if there was patent infringement there. :D
  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    AFAIK, you are correct, 2007 it is.
  • maxamillion1maxamillion1 Posts: 1,467
    According to Nissannews.com All 08 Altima sedans add the following over 2007 models.

    Standard ABS on 2.5 models

    Standard splash guards
    Available Xm radio on all trim levels.

    I am happy that the once hard to find ABS will now be standard...took Nissan long enough.
  • lilengineerboylilengineerboy Posts: 4,116

    Standard ABS on 2.5 models
    Standard splash guards
    Available Xm radio on all trim levels.

    I am happy that the once hard to find ABS will now be standard...took Nissan long enough.


    Yeah I agree, that makes it go back on the shopping list. And splash guards make my heart go pitter patter.
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