2008 Minivans

mfletou1

8 passenger Sienna is that its only available in LE trim. Enjoy those el cheapo blacked out mirrors and old school knob climate control, among quite a few other more subtle differences.

I'm personally not paying north of $25k for a vehicle that doesn't have auto climate control and looks a little cheap. If I had gotten a Sienna, it would have been XLE or bust.

If you want an 8 passenger vehicle with luxury features, Ody's the only game in town. I would obviously admit that the extra seat in the Sienna is larger and therefore more comfortable, but the middle row on the Ody is fine for kids.

mfletou1

Did you catch what Motor Trend send about the Grand Caravan's interior in its COY of the issue?

They said that the interior looks like it was made from regenerated toothbruth plastic.

Ouch.

And before people yap about bias, in the very sane issue, they give a far less than glowing review of the Accord, an excellent review of the Malibu, and give the COY to the Cadillac CTS.

hansienna

Who reads the juvenile Motor Trend? :confuse:

COY? Didn't Motor Trend give that distinction to some pieces of junk over the years? :sick:

bobw3

Are there any car magazines you read or find credible?

dennisctc

They said that the interior looks like it was made from regenerated toothbruth plastic.

That's what bugs me most about Chrysler and Ford - their interiors!! On Friday I had to pick up a coworker up at a Chrysler dealership as he was dropping off his 2003 Caravan - back to leasing company. He had 117k trouble free miles on it. I got to dealer row early. First I stopped at a GMC dealer and looked at a new Acadia......it was stunning - interior/exterior and even under the hood. You could just see the attention o detail. Much nicer than an MDX I looked at months ago. Then I stopped at the Ford dealer and looked at an Edge, Focus and Taurus X........Styling was ok, but the interiors were pathetic - cheap!!! Then I got to the Chrysler dealership and waited for my coworker, checking out a Nitro, Liberty and T&C.....as bad if not worst than Ford!!!

Don't get me wrong, the Chrysler T&C is acceptable for a family automobile at the right price et.... But GM's interiors are really starting to put everyone's to shame except for VW, Audi, maybe Volvo and BMW, and the interior is where everyone spends their time right?

Anyone needing 8 passenger seating, AWD etc......I don't think you can touch GM's CUVs. By summer i'm thinking new Acadia or Enclave!

carcom2

"Anyone needing 8 passenger seating, AWD etc......I don't think you can touch GM's CUVs. By summer i'm thinking new Acadia or Enclave!"

I like those too, but the 2nd row seats, much narrower than the fronts & narrower than the minivans, do not recline and from what I remember last time I checked them out, when sitting in the 2nd row & 3rd- your knees are up high with little if any thigh support. Also it's been noted before, the tracks for the 2nd row seats to slide through, are wide and seems like a lot of dirt & debris could accumulate there.

mfletou1

I liked the Mazda CX-9 better as a more liveable vehicle. No doubt GM did a nice job with those new vehicles, but they're just rather bulky and could use more power. The biggest strike is that they are expensive...the CX-9 is quite a bit cheaper. They technically start at $28, but good luck finding one of those and its really stripped.

We looked hard at several crossover type vehicles before buying our Odyssey. We liked the image and styling better, but...the Ody was better in almost every other respect--value, gas mileage, driving dynamics, safety...oh, and space!

bobw3

Although the Acadia/Enclave/Outlook can seat 8, they don't have nearly the legroom as an Odyssey or Sienna minivan (7" less in the 3rd row and 4" less in the 2nd) and have about 1/2 the cargo space behind the 3rd row. They may have AWD and higher ground clearance, but if you don't need those there's no reason to consider them.

thegraduate

Some just can't bear the thought of what the neighbors might think if they saw them driving a *gasp* minivan!

Whatever. :P

ateixeira

An LE with the right package isn't nearly as stripped as you make it sound.

Yes, you give up dual zone auto climate control.

But mine has a Trip Computer, power doors on both sides, heated mirrors, wiper de-icers, outside temp gauge, 6CD changer that plays MP3s, power seat, alloy wheels, etc.

I think it finds a comfortable middle between too basic and too expensive. "North of $25k" is not expensive for a minivan. North of $35k is expensive. $25k is still pretty cheap, IMO. I spent well below the NADA average price for a new vehicle, and got 8 seats and 268hp. Can't beat that value anywhere.

As a bonus, for whatever reason, LE owner report better gas mileage than XLE and XLE Limited. I'm not sure if it's due to the extra weight, or perhaps the run-flat tires, but I felt I'd mention it.

mfletou1

Leather, heated seats, sunroof?

Not there. Also, fewer speakers, old school antenna...

I paid $25k too, remember...

And I don't care if the car cost $15k, a blacked out mirror is cheap. And it looks cheap. Maybe its just a quirk, but it would bother me every time I saw it.

hansienna

The "old school antenna" provides MUCH better radio reception than the wire antenna build into the right rear side window of the Odyssey but our 06 Sienna radio reception is about half as good as was the reception with the 02 T&C LX.

Black mirrors look VERY NICE on my Natural White Sienna...just as nice as matching color would look and we did NOT like the ugly light tan carpet and cloth of the Taffeta White Odyssey.

The Ody EX dual zone temp for driver and front passenger is VERY nice but the Sienna LE has much more attractive door panels, padded front door armrests, compass, outside temp, and trip computer that are NOT on the Ody EX.

We would have purchased an Ody EX-L instead of our Sienna LE if we had been offered the remarkably low price you paid. :shades:

My niece got her 2005 Ody EX (cloth) in November 2004 for $ 25,510 which was THE lowest price we had seen for an Ody EX. The best price I was quote was $ 26,788 for a 2007 Ody EX (cloth) in January 2007. Honda dealers in this area do NOT discount very much.

maryh3

Anyone needing 8 passenger seating, AWD etc......I don't think you can touch GM's CUVs. By summer i'm thinking new Acadia or Enclave!

I saw a friend's Acadia with the brick colored interior -- that was NICE. I wonder when they will bring this vehicle out in a hybrid version. I think my next vehicle will be a hybrid and I liked the Acadia too. It doesn't substitute for a minivan though. For me a minivan is a substitute for a conversion van, and a CUV is a substitute for a minivan, but the functionality of a CUV is too far from that of a van.

maryh3

Although the Acadia/Enclave/Outlook can seat 8, they don't have nearly the legroom as an Odyssey or Sienna minivan (7" less in the 3rd row and 4" less in the 2nd) and have about 1/2 the cargo space behind the 3rd row. They may have AWD and higher ground clearance, but if you don't need those there's no reason to consider them.

I beleive Dennis has 2 dogs and no kids. For him the AWD and ground clearance is more important than legroom or cargo space.

maryh3

to me (and just my opinion), the stowNgo and swivelNgo are 2 big gimmicks.

I think about 98% of all extras you can add to all autos are gimmicks. Its a question of what gimmicks are important to each person. Are you using the van for hauling? Running car pool daily? Long hauls with lots of kids? Retired folk seeing the country?

dennisctc

I beleive Dennis has 2 dogs and no kids. For him the AWD and ground clearance is more important than legroom or cargo space.

Actually, I have 2 OLD dogs that have trouble jumping into my minivan, so if I get an Acadia, I'm making a "step" for them. I don't need AWD so would just get FWD. The big selling point for me is tow capacity - 4500lbs, about 1000 lbs more than your typical minivan. Also, the interior is fantastic.....anyone into bashing domestic interiors, don't have a leg to stand on.

From what I could see, legroom is as generous as any minivan, you lose only the space behind the 3rd row. There aren't too many vehicles offering AWD and 8 passenger seating....just Sienna I think or a fullsize monster?

dennisctc

I think about 98% of all extras you can add to all autos are gimmicks.

Someone's gimmick is another person's necessity. I never needed a power rear hatch, til I bought my 2005 DCX and it was on it. Who can't open and close their own doors right? Well when you have months of Michigan grime on it, and don't want to touch it, or your hands are full - I DO NOW!!!

thegraduate

So true.

Who needs variable speed intermittent windshield wipers? Who needs automatic headlights? Who needs power pedals? A DVD player? Remote start?

I think I could be truly happy with a car if it had power steering and brakes, a radio, and A/C. Having all the extras is nice, but wasn't a necessity until I actually had them. Now, I have a hard time thinking about stepping into a car without it being at least as nice as the one I have.

hansienna

NOT in my opinion.

ABSOLUTE necessities for us are: A Minivan with Front and Rear Heating and Air Conditioning, tachometer, separately controlled temperature for driver and front passenger, power steering and power brakes, power front windows and power rear side vents, 60/40 split fold into the floor 3rd row seat, fold down armrests in 2nd row seats, and deep tinted windows (sliding doors, rear side windows, rear window). :shades:

Gimmicks for us: Power sliding doors and power rear hatch, roll down windows in sliding doors, leather interior, NAV, RES, Stow 'N Go, Swivel 'N Go, power moon/sun roof, MY Gig, satellite radio and or TV, rear back up camera, tire pressure monitoring system, remote start, roof rack, leather wrapped shift knob, auto-dimming mirrors, cast wheels, leather seats, heated seats, power seats with memory, PAX or run flat tires, center floor console (s), fog lamps, daytime driving lights, wood grain style trim on dash and or doors, fold flat front passenger seat, dynamic laser cruise control, optitron gauges, blue tooth controls, auto dimming headlights, HID headlights, MP3 auxilliary input, 360 watt stereo with sub woofer, and VCM.

Nice to have but NOT necessary: AT with more than 4 forward speeds, outside temperature/compass and trip computer. (An AT with more than 6 forward speeds is a gimmick in my opinion).

bobw3

I agree with you!

maryh3

What is one persons gimmick is anothers "requirement". They all are nonessentials only necessary for comfort and convenience. Why one persons "essentials" are better than anothers is beyond me. Who is to determine whether something is worth it or not? The biggest gimmick stated here - "swivel seats", I hope benefits us with more essential family time that can be obtained by sitting around a table and playing cards, or perhaps even eating. Better yet maybe they will do homework on it which will give us more quality family time after the homework is done. Better than taking a trip with 4 kids isolated from eachother with i-pods in their ears and game boys in their faces. I'd rather a closer knit family than having that absolute perfect temperature blowing right on me alone.

dennisctc

I remember a conversation once with a Visteon engineer who worked on rear seat entertainment systems. He told me whenever he has his children with him in the minivan, that the DVD player is off unless it's a really long roadtrip/vacation. He wanted to be with them, talking, laughing etc...not just having the children watching the screen. I like his reasoning alot!!

dennisctc

The 2008 Odyssey is a refresh, new VCM for the engine, minor face-lift. That's probably why the 2007s are a bargain.

Wow!!! was looking at the Prices Paid for Odys recently....looks like the 07s are going for $4000-$5000+ off MSRP, and they've still got plenty on the lots it seems!! Honda's really trying for bragging rights as the #1 minivan for 07 even if they have to overbuild and give em away. Just have to wonder what this does to resale values longer term? People trying to sell used Hondas etc....

colloquor

Rear HVAC in a minivan is great, until you start having problems with the heater core, evap, or the hoses running back to all of this. It adds complexity, and eventual repair costs, but it sure is nice when it works!

I for one like to keep it simple, similar to my old '90 Honda Civic . . . roll up windows, no power steering (didn't need it), stick, and only a few minor options. The more esoteric stuff they put on vehicles, the more there is to go wrong, and even more importantly, when they do fail, it costs big money for the repair. On the other hand, I think it's impossible to buy a minivan today with roll up windows - or, practically any other vehicle for that matter.

radar1

I remember when I was younger and read car ads that had the abbreviation "R&H". That meant it had a radio and heater, which I assume many would have considered "gimmicks" at one time.
Several "gimmicks" that became new to me during my driving years but I would not want to do without are air conditioning, cruise control, power steering, seat belts and the list goes on.
The "stow and go" seats on the Caravan/T&C vans are a strong selling point to me since there are times that I need to carry large loads one way and carry lots of people after I get there.

bobw3

perhaps even eating. Better yet maybe they will do homework on it which will give us more quality family time after the homework is done

just don't stop too fast!!

maryh3

Rear HVAC in a minivan is great, until you start having problems with the heater core, evap, or the hoses running back to all of this. It adds complexity, and eventual repair costs, but it sure is nice when it works!

I for one like to keep it simple, similar to my old '90 Honda Civic . . . roll up windows, no power steering (didn't need it), stick, and only a few minor options. The more esoteric stuff they put on vehicles, the more there is to go wrong, and even more importantly, when they do fail, it costs big money for the repair. On the other hand, I think it's impossible to buy a minivan today with roll up windows - or, practically any other vehicle for that matter.

Excellent point. When I talk to mechanics they typically say that they get only the basics on their own cars. They say "The less that can go wrong". And they also say that all the add ons often make repairs more expensive because the extras can get in the way of the essentials. You have to pull the revolving ash tray motor to get to the spark plugs etc. And again when they go wrong, there usually is no manual override so you can't just "live without it". Many of us questioned the necessity of our automatic windows the day after the bridge collapsed in Minneapolis wondering how we would be able to exit our vehicle under those circumstances!!

dennisctc

just don't stop too fast!!

Kinda think that goes for anyone, or if a Chrysler owner is concerned, only swivel seats when stopped. It's called personal responsibility

bobw3

"only swivel seats when stopped"

I agree...but that's not how Chrysler advertises it.

maryh3

"only swivel seats when stopped"

And what is the problem with stopping fast while buckled in a swiveled seat doing homework? Not much different than stopping quickly with forward facing seats while holding a book is it? Better than balancing that text book on the lap and haunching over it, for that would exasperate any whiplash that might occur should one need to stop fast too. Perhaps they will be playing cards and get a jack of diamonds in the eye? No worse than a coke can in the face resulting from the cans flying out of their cup holders during a fast stop either. I find the idea of it being any more dangerous because of swiveled seats and a table compared to its counterparts as unlikely.

According to the Honda salesman, a minivan is more likely to be rear ended. He told me to check out the rear end crash test results based upon this info and chose an Odyssey because it fared better than its counterparts for rear-end crash test results. Perhaps he was just trying to make a sale but, my 2 accidents that I have had in my current minivan were both being rear ended so I consider what he said as having some merit. If this be the case - having a rear facing swivel seat would be better - instead of 6 cases of whiplash, it might result in only 4 cases.

ateixeira

Kudos for getting that price, and as I mentioned above, the timing right now is ideal to pick up a leftover 2007 Odyssey.

When I was shopping an EX-L was exactly $29,052.

THANK GOD I did not buy one because I would have been absolutely slammed on resale value. Scary thought! :surprise:

At $25k, I'd probably be driving an Ody now, too. Actually, probably an EX for $23k.

We did not like the leather, which we found a bit hard. 3 out of 4 of us in the family said "No" to leather. I realize this is personal preference. That meant we would lose VCM, too.

Obviously, you will place the priority on the leather and moonroof because you wanted those things, and the dual zone climate control as well. That is precisely the reason you picked the Honda. Naturally! :shades:

I did notice the 07 Siennas had some stuff missing from the EX-L that we test drove, though:

* better 8th seat
* tow prep package was standard (gone for 2008 Sienna)
* 2nd row seats tumble (Ody can be joined, though)
* 3rd row can be placed for tailgate seating
* plays MP3s (2008 Ody does that, not 2007)
* more powerful engine
* roof rack with cross bars
* puddle lamps
* trip computer

We seat 5 often so that 8th seat was the key issue for us.

Today, at these prices, it would be harder, because the Ody EX is $23k, so that's a much lower price. I'm cheap so I'd probably pick the Honda and force the nanny in to the 3rd row.

You can see, though, that depending upon your priorities, choosing either way can be justified, even now.

mfletou1

Yes, I can...

I'm not worried about resale value because 07 Ody pricing is such a quirk. This is sort of a one shot deal---essentially, 07 Ody production lasted much longer than usual for Honda because all their efforts were on the Accord launch. They wanted to try to make a little bit of a splash with the minor 08 refresh, but they knew that if they did it at the same time as the Accord intro, it would get completely ignored.

So they decided to continue 07 production around 3 months longer than normal, and dealers sort of had to play along if they wanted Accord inventory. As a result, you had a lot more 07s than normal---I actually drove a 2007 Ody with a 10/07 build date--and that was in the last week of October! (Car had arrived on the lot a few days earlier...though I didn't end up buying from that dealer).

Anyway, that situation hasn't happened before, and isn't likely to. 2008 prices are much higher--Honda raised the price an average of a $1000 or so for each trim line to begin withm, and vans are selling at invoice or a little above, which points an '08 EX-L without res and nav at around $29.500/$30500 range.

So I think resale will remain very strong for the Ody---I just got lucky with this little quirk.

If you really need a full size 8th seat, than regardless of price, you made the right decision in going with the Sienna. I've only got one kid right now, so I'm in a little different spot.

I wish that our Ody had a power liftgate and a trip computer. (Though it does at least have an outside temp gauge and oil life monitor. And...I've yet to have a trip computer that actually works, even in my Camry Hybrid--its always off on MPG by a fair amount). MP3 woudl be nice, but that's an easy add-on aftermarket.

The other clear advantage for the Sienna is the engine. The Ody is no slouch, but the Sienna's is the best. From a driving dynamic standpoint, I really prefer the Ody handling though, so...kind of mitigates the powertrain.

The Sienna's a nice van. It was my solid second choice, and if it had been much cheaper than the Ody, than I might have gotten one.

jpf

You can still buy a plain Jane 2007 Dodge Caravan (SE model). Some may still be available on dealers' lots. 2007 is the last year for this model. I bought a 2006 model brand new last year. Roll up windows, no power door locks, and no other fancy electrical stuff that I would never use and typically breaks down in the vehicle's third or fourth year.

dennisctc

So I think resale will remain very strong for the Ody---I just got lucky with this little quirk.

I don't think this is will be the case. This discounting ripples thru all previous MYs....that's just common sense. People hear about discounting thousands of dollars on brand new ones, why buy a used 2005 or 2006?, so their value will drop. If Honda is set on "Number One Selling Minivan" bragging rights, like they compete with Toyota on for mid size car, this price cutting will continue on the 08. I think it was WSJ article talking about incentives on Odys recently - I think its $2500 on the 08s even now. On the Honda site, they're advertising a $10 difference in lease rates between 07 and 08 Odys!!!

mfletou1

I get frustrated when people assert factual things that aren't true, so I'm sorry to be snippy, but Honda is not offering any incentive on the 2008. There might be a financing deal on most Honda's right now, but that's it.

The discounting occured for about 3 months on a very small number of Odyssey's. CarMax was selling a used '07 EXL, no RES or NAV, with 11k miles for $28998. It sold in a week. Once the '07s are gone, the incentives end.

The only way for it to really affect used prices is if Honda was discounting at the time you were trying to sell your vehicle. I already explained the quirk in scheduling that caused a glut of 2007s. It was a one shot deal.

And as you currently pointed out, the situation is similar on the Accord and Camry, both of which still have excellent resale.

If you REALLY want to believe that resale on an Odyssey is still going to plummet, go ahead, but compared to the other vans in its class, I think that's a very tough sell.

dennisctc

I get frustrated when people assert factual things that aren't true, so I'm sorry to be snippy, but Honda is not offering any incentive on the 2008. There might be a financing deal on most Honda's right now, but that's it.

Get snippy all you want, and maybe Honda isn't advertising their "incentives" to dealers, but when you can get "special leases" on 08s that are only $10/month more there's incentives. Just go to Honda.com. Or you can go to the Prices paid section for Odys and see what people are getting across the postings.

And as you currently pointed out, the situation is similar on the Accord and Camry, both of which still have excellent resale.

It's only similar in that they're vying for bragging rights. You're comparing apples and oranges here. It's Ody vs Caravan, and Ody will be playing in the dirt here with Dodge and lowering their prices to do so. You don't maintain resale value by adding incentives, and think people will forget in a few months, especially when incentives are continuing.

I did not say resale was going to "plummet" - you did. It will certainly take a hit. I bet people are rushing to Honda dealers saying "OHhh!! give me the used 06 for same price as the 07!!!!".

Ohh and you can't take one example from CarMax and make some broad assumption. That just proves there's a sucker born every minute, that's all.

ateixeira

That explains it.

Sienna had a short 2007 model year. They took a while to get the 3.5l V6 engine ready for that van, so the 2006 model year was extended. There were big incentives towards the end of 2006.

I decided to wait because I really wanted that new engine. Call me a power junkie.

Any how, I guess we could look back and say the sweet spot for picking up a cheap Sienna was toward the end of 2006.

For Honda, that's now, with leftover 2007 Odys.

2008s are indeed up above the prices I saw back in May, i.e. back to normal.

You did get lucky with the timing.

For me it's too late, I needed a van back in May. I actually had sold my Subaru Forester and was relying on my tiny little Miata for about a week and a half.

Packaging is tricky. With Honda you have to get a Touring to get the power liftgate and trip computer, right? See, now that I'm used to my trip computer, that would be a big minus. I really like seeing the current mileage readout, it helps you maximize your MPG. The Ody does have the ECO light in the dash, though, if you get VCM. That also helps.

We want a Subaru Forester for the wife, and I'm really hoping they put a trip computer in a non-turbo model.

Back in May, the Sienna was cheaper. My LE pkg 3 was about $1600 less than a quote for an Ody EX at the time.

Today, it's $2200 more.

Crazy.

dennisctc

Had some time to kill and the Honda dealer is nearby. Drove an 08 EX-L for about $32,000. Some observations:

1) The salesperson didn't know much, other than here's the key and put tag on back please. He didn't come along.

2) Told me there's no Jack for an iPod. I had to point it out to him in brochure, then find it for him.

3) I love the leather seats and IP mat'l.....very nice

4) I didn't like the tiny back up camera display and fuzzy pic....I guess it's useable, but a larger display in nav is way to go

5) I didn't like that it didnt have buttons on "B" pillars to close sliding doors. So if you're sittig inside in second row, DO you have to start pulling the door to close it or the driver in front has to close it for you? Did I miss something.

6) I would really miss my power rear hatch unless I got the $40k Touring - which won't happen

7) The sales person was very eager to deal.....special financing rates and discounts for the 08s. I asked him about 07 specials and he claimed he could do just as well on an 08 now - maybe they're out of them? I don't want an 07, just wanted to let him know I knew the market.

thegraduate

Interesting observations, dennis. About the power doors;

You don't manually close it, you just pull on the handle (it's just an electric switch, essentially) and it begins to close. It's not necessarily bad, just different.

I'm curious, where is the screen for the backup camera?

dennisctc

You don't manually close it, you just pull on the handle (it's just an electric switch, essentially) and it begins to close. It's not necessarily bad, just different.


That would take getting used to. My Dodge and my dad's Sienna have them on the B Pillar, so you just push a button - no having to start the door moving. When I'm getting dogs out of van at barkpark and they're going crazy to get out and play, and I'm trying to leash em up, and also shut the door, this would be difficult, not impossible.

On EX - L models, if you don't get the Nav, they put the backup camera into the review mirror (but not the entire mirror - just a tiny square portion). I think these were developed my Magna, the Canadian company that almost purchased Chrysler this year. So GM vehicles are using it also.

thegraduate

For people who don't realize the doors are power (my grandmother rides in my great aunt's 05 Odyssey all the time, and she just pulls the handle like she would getting out of a car to open the door).

I don't think either way is really "bad," just different. And, you don't start the door moving at all. You just pull the handle shown on the door in this picture; you don't have to use any force. It's as easy as unlatching the glovebox. You should try it sometime.

dennisctc

You just pull the handle shown on the door in this picture; you don't have to use any force. It's as easy as unlatching the glovebox. You should try it sometime.

I see your point, and that's great if you're inside the vehicle. I'm speaking when you're outside, struggling with two crazy dogs and trying to close the door. Pushing the button to close it is easier.

I noticed on the Chrysler that if your inside and you want to open sliding doors, you have two options:

1) Push the button on the pillar

2) Open it with lever, but then it's all manual? this seems odd -no assist whatsoever?

thegraduate

I see your point, and that's great if you're inside the vehicle. I'm speaking when you're outside, struggling with two crazy dogs and trying to close the door. Pushing the button to close it is easier.

I noticed on the Chrysler that if your inside and you want to open sliding doors, you have two options:

1) Push the button on the pillar

2) Open it with lever, but then it's all manual? this seems odd -no assist whatsoever?

When dealing with the dogs, it may in fact be EASIER to close the doors manually (you can do it faster). I remember the Dodge had that feature; thought it was unique, although not really a bad idea.

If you are outside the Odyssey, you pull the exterior handle, just like you do inside the van, and the door opens right up - no force exerted.

dennisctc

When dealing with the dogs, it may in fact be EASIER to close the doors manually (you can do it faster). I remember the Dodge had that feature; thought it was unique, although not really a bad idea.

The problem comes when the dog are finally OUT of the van dragging me to the park, so to push a button on the pillar or shutting it with keyfob button is the way to do it.

hause7

heres video of a Sienna Limited doing a 0-60 run. That 3.5L is a very powerful engine!
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1225555133734152080

thegraduate

Ah, i gotcha. Just making sure, but you know there are buttons on the fob and the dash for the Honda, right?

I'll report back in a few days. I'm going on a trip to Oklahoma tomorrow into the snow in my aunt's 2005 Ody EX.

artgpo

There are four ways to close the power doors on an Odyssey: The outer door handle; the inner door handle; the switch on the driver's side of the dash; the key fob.

Aren't we splitting hairs? My '03 Silhouette had the "button" on the "B" post but the transition to the Odyssey was seamless.

dennisctc

There are four ways to close the power doors on an Odyssey: The outer door handle; the inner door handle; the switch on the driver's side of the dash; the key fob.

Aren't we splitting hairs? My '03 Silhouette had the "button" on the "B" post but the transition to the Odyssey was seamless.

I was just stating how handy the button is for my specific situation. I thought they were standard on all minivans with power doors - my father's last gen Sienna has em. I found out they're not available from Honda. We weren't counting numbers of ways to open or close the door, but lets see......for my Dodge - outer door handle, inner door handle, driver switch, fob built into actual key (not the dangling one from others), and B pillar button. I think that's 5. Speaking of keys and fobs, the 08 Chryslers don't even have a metal "key", just a fob that plugs into the IP, similar to a BMW or Mercedes, but still not as convenient as a GM/Nissan with push button to start. I also like how Chrysler added button for rear hatch to D pillar (I think Toyota gets credit for this?), along with driver's switch, and the keyfob, not to mention a normal handle. I think that's a total of 4.

hansienna

EACH has distinct advantages as has been discussed here over and over again. After owning a 2002 T&C LX and now a 2006 LE, my next minivan will be an Odyssey EX (cloth).

I will have to give up the Trip Computer that the T&C and Sienna have :shades: but will appreciate the MORE Comfortable seats for all that are on the Odyssey.

hause7

After a Town&Country and a Sienna we know our next will be another Sienna, we love ours. All of the vans have pluses and minuses and we look at them different. I agree with hansienna.