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Half-ton Pickups - The full field

tundrahqtundrahq Posts: 5
edited March 10 in Toyota
tundraheadquarters just completed it's comparison of the Dodge Ram to the Toyota Tundra, and it was interesting to read that the Dodge Ram was safer, the frame better, and the Ram looked better.

However, it also said that the Ram got 8mpg...so I guess it wasn't pro-Dodge.

In any case, anyone had a chance to compare the two trucks themselves?

Here's the link:

http://www.tundraheadquarters.com/blog/2007/04/13/tundra-v-ram-part-i-mechanical- s/
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Comments

  • dustykdustyk Posts: 2,931
    In case you weren't aware, the 545RFE automatic transmission that's used behind the 4.7 and 5.7 Hemi engines have six forward speeds. Five are used in sequential shifting, but for kick down has an alternate second gear which improves acceleration.

    As far as towing capability, many will tell you that the truck manufacturers are playing the numbers game. Many wouldn't even attempt to pull 10,000 pounds in a half-ton pickup despite the rating.

    As to the comments about the Hemi fuel consumption, come on guys! The only thing gross about the Hemis fuel consumption was your exaggeration. You know as well as anybody that the EPA test is the only fair comparison between vehicles. I know many RAM owners that typically get 14-15 MPG around town. It's how the vehicle is driven. I had one of our company's maintenance trucks for better than a week and that Hemi delivered just over 16.

    The new Tundra sounds like a nice truck, and I guess it would be a little too much to expect you guys to be completely objective. But you could at least try.
  • chris206chris206 Posts: 1
    I have a 2005 Dodge Ram with the 5.7 hemi, I love the truck, I bought it new and have 20,000 miles on it now. I have pulled some very very heavy loads and it did great, BUT the gas mileage it BBBAAAAAAAAAADDDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!! the EPA ratings are not right on this vehicle. I have drove it everyway in the book and it still does not get over 11 mpg in the city and 14 on the hwy. Usually my numbers are more like 9 mpg.
  • tundrahqtundrahq Posts: 5
    Ya...that's what we've heard (and seen).

    Not that gas mileage is a huge consideration when buying a truck, but 9mpg is rough. Here's to hoping it gets better!
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,652
    Edmunds had a long-term Jeep Commander test vehicle with the Hemi engine, and it too got really lousy mileage.

    http://blogs.edmunds.com/roadtests/193

    Bob
  • tent2tttent2tt Posts: 46
    I am trying to find a reliable truck with as good gas mielage as possible that can tow a maximum 5,500 lbs hard sided (not fold-down) travel trailer (that's the GVWR fully loaded up + 2 passengers)without overtaxing the engine going up hill and while still getting decent gas mileage towing and around town (particularly around town). Decent gas mielage to me is at least 20 mpg when not towing. I noticed that several versions of the Tacoma have a GVWR tow rating of 6,500 lbs, but no one seems to be using them for towing trailers--why is that, if the tow rating is that high? Would it overtax the Tacoma? I have seen one posting about using a Tundra for towing loads, but the gas mileage on the Tundra looks awful. Does anyone out there use have a Tundra for towing a travel trailer? If so, how much do you tow, how does it do uphill and what's the towing and non-towing real world mpg? Is it true that I should get a Dodge Ram 2500 with Cummins Turbocharged diesel instead? I haev seen numerous posts on travel trailer sites by people saying that they can get 20mpg empty and 11-15 mpg towing (heavier weights than my prospective TT) in their Dodge Ram TCD with the Cummins engine, but the overall reliablility of the Dodge, Ford and Chevys seems very worrisome compared with Toyotas great consumer report ratings and reliability reviews. I need a truck that I can take to travel that will be reliable, strong and get good gas mileage, especially when I drive it when I am not towing. Any suggestions would be appreciated!
  • p51bp51b Posts: 1
    I have a 2003 Toyota Tundra with the 4.7 liter gas engine; 4 wheel drive; automatic transmission; tow package with transmission oil cooler; and 71,000 miles on the truck. I have had zero problems with this truck. I change the oil and filter every 3-4,000 miles and am running Mobil 1 5W-30 fully synthetic oil. I change the transmission fluid, front and rear differential fluids, transfer case fluids, power steering fluid; every 50,000 miles. And coolant every 2 years.
    I am towing a 2005 Prowler 25 foot travel trailer that weighs loaded maximum 5,500 pound; and using an Easy Lift Hitch with anti-sway bars.
    I take it out of overdrive on even the slightest hill or bucking a headwind.
    This 4.7 liter engine has enough power to tow this trailer and am getting about 10-12 miles per gallon while towing.
    I get 16-17 MPG driving the freeway at 65 MPH (not towing).
    I am considering upgrading to the 2007 Tundra with 5.7 liter engine that delivers 100 more horsepower. I also am considering the Dodge RAM 2500 Heavy Duty with cummins turbo diesel engine. I have had such good luck with the 4 toyota cars and trucks that i have owned over the last 20 years; that i am reluctant to switch over to the Dodge.
    I don't think you will find a more reliable and trouble free truck than the Toyota.
    The Dodge is definately more of a towing rig than the Tundra; and the turbo-diesel will get a little better MPG. The 64,000 dollar question is---What will it cost to maintain the Dodge for 200,000 miles??? My Toyotas that i have owned all went over 264,00 miles and were still running with the orginal engines and transmission with no problem (with consistant preventative maintenance/changing lubricants). Lubricants are the lifeblood of moving components and reduce friction and wear and is very inexpensive preventative maintenance.
  • tent2tttent2tt Posts: 46
    Thanks for your response, p51b,

    You are the first Tundra owner I have heard from. I have heard from 4 Tacoma owners who've been able to tow around 5K lbs., though one out of the 4 said he "white-knuckled" it every time (then got a Dodge Ram 2500).

    Reading the Dodge forums gets me all freaked out that I will be dealing with one headache after another, bad warranty coverage issues and the fact that I don't know squat about diesels. But then I hear from Dodge owner like that one who loves his rig and I start thinking about the power and relatively good mpg (however, the '05 and newer models do not seem to be getting as good as the older models. The 2002- 2003 models seem to be the best). I am so confused right now.

    The city and hiway mileage on the Tundra seems really low, though the towing mileage seems reasonable. Part of me feels that if I am going to get that huge of a truck, seems like it ought to be a diesel, but then it's the reliability issue... so I am back to looking at Toyota...Geez, can someone please get me off this see-saw? I want a truck with the Dodge Ram's power and at least 21-24 mpg hiway and at least 14-17 mpg towing and I want it to be as reliable as Toyota! Is that just too much to ask for my hard-earned money?
  • adamb1adamb1 Posts: 8
    The only time I have seen single-digit fuel economy with my '03 QC HEMI has been towing a trailer.

    That said, I've never come close to the in-town figure on the windon sticker. I routinely averag 11.5-12.5 mpg in town. On the interstate, I have seen 16-17 mpg.
  • dustykdustyk Posts: 2,931
    A look in to the Ford and GM diesel forums seems to indicate a fair amount of issues as well. In fact, it looks to me like there are more angry Powerstroke owners out there than disgruntled Cummins' owners.

    Most of the Dodge diesels owners I know or have spoken to have had little problems. Yes, I have noted a couple that had problems. But the majority have been please with the Cummins' motor and the truck.

    I have an acquaintance that thought his Dodge diesel experience was going to be bad because so many GM and Ford owners told him he would. I spoke to him a while back and he remarked that after four years he was convinced that even the Dodge platform was far superior in his opinion (He owned GMs before).

    In my experience as a former fleet manager, I believe the Cummins' is the best you can get in a light duty pickup.

    Best regards,
    Dusty
  • Like tent2tt I want a pickup that can safely tow 5000-7000 pounds when needed (which is a few times per year), that will get good gas mileage both city and highway, and that will be a reliable vehicle that will last for years.

    What are my best bets?
  • I've been a loyal Dodge fan for years, but the issues I had with my '02 Ram were nearly intolerable, so that is why I switched to the '07 Tundra. It can do nearly as much as most 3/4 ton trucks, with a gas engine, and so far I'm getting nearly 19mpg on the highway and about 14mpg city. Not too bad for a big truck. Now my father just recently traded in an '04 Ram Quad Cab 2500 that had the Hemi. He used it to tow a 34' travel trailer that weighed nearly 10,000lbs. His best mpg came after he installed a cold air induction kit and a free flowing exhaust system, but that still only netted him just under 8mpg. He got an '07 Ram MegaCab with the new 6.7L Cummins turbodiesel. It tows that tt without a problem. He hasn't gotten to take it on a long enough trip yet to get the real world mpg when towing but he's guessing around 12-14mpg. But he doesn't expect it to get much higher than that when he isn't towing. His is a 2WD and I would highly recommend that set up for any heavy, long term towing. The only downside to the diesel seems to be more preventive maintenance like 12qts of oil and a water filter of some kind that needs checked every month. His is very nice and would easily tow 5,500lbs. I can tow his tt with my Tundra. The mpg are not great, about 10.5mpg, but it can do it. My suggestion...get the new Tundra. It will easily tow the weight and is likely to have fewer problems. The Tacoma is strong enough to pull it, but the mpg will be bad when towing and they are not that much better than the full size Tundra when not towing mpg wise. My friend's Tacoma only gets 21mpg hwy. Hope this helped.
  • :shades: I just bought a new 2007 Dodge Ram 1500 5.7L and it does great gas wise. I stomp it off the line all the time after stop signs and stop lights and not only do I love the power but gas mileage isn't all that bad. I get around 12-16 in town and 20-27 on highway. I love power behind the engine. I've towed a couple good loads of brick and cement and it drives like nothing was behind it. I took my truck to the Toyota dealership right after buying it and asked a couple guys there if they could tell me how there truck was better than mine. They had nothing to say but "IT HOLDS IT VALUE BETTER". I got a Laramie with Nav. and everything and made them sell it to me for $31,000. The Toyota's price with everything I had in my truck was so exaggerating! I'm glad I went to dodge.
  • bugchuckerbugchucker Posts: 118
    Tundra does hold its value better than any truck. Ram is not in the same class as a Tundra. They were probably laughing at you for stopping at the Toyota dealership with your new Ram. Why waste time with you? Damage is done.
  • I give you maybe two years before you get rid of that Dodge and buy a new Tundra. After taking that Dodge in for repairs many times you will change your whole attitude about these fine Tundra's. :)
  • deodudedeodude Posts: 1
    I just bought a 2007 Dodge Ram 1500 5.7L Lonestar Edition and currently have 658 miles on it. In Texas we love to gun it on every light and every sign. When I do gun it, I only get 10.6 mpg around town. But I am currently averaging 12.7 miles around town and that is driving the speed limit and gradually accelerating from a dead stop. On the highway I average between 18-21 hwy. I also have Flowmaster 40 dual exhaust and plan to purchase CAI (True Flow). I would like to know what you have under the hood that makes your gas mileage better then mine. When you gun it all the time. :confuse:
  • Well the 12MPG around town I can buy, but 27MPG on the highway? Were you coasting down the side of a mountain? And is that real world or are you letting that little computer tell you? Even with the Hemi shutting down 4 cylinders at highway speeds, I can't imagine getting much over 20MPG. And I agree with bugchucker...wait until you have to take your truck into the shop every month because something else is wrong! Trust me, I lived it.
  • What do you mean "Not in the same class"?
    Tundra Ram
    5.7 5.7
    300 something HP 300 something HP
    1/2 ton 1/2 ton
    I can get the same exact features on both.
    what's the difference? :confuse:
  • obyoneobyone Posts: 8,065
    The difference is that you don't have camshaft or trans failures. Can you imagine having either of those within the first 1000 miles of ownership? I can't but that's what happened with the new and improved 2007 Tundra. And if you want to see frame flex well I can link to a video that will blow your mind.

    Here are a few links on the previous reliable Tundra:

    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007/01/toyota_ball_joints.html

    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2006/07/toyota_tundra_airbag.html

    http://www.consumeraffairs.com/recalls04/2006/toyota_trucks.html

    Based on a history like that one wonders what's in store for the new 2007 Tundra. Hopefully it will have a better history than the previous model.
  • So are you with me and the Ram or against me and with the Toyota?
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