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Chevy Tahoe/GMC Yukon Hybrid

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,847
    After months on Craigslist I have found a buyer for my GMC Hybrid. I may miss it, then again I may not. I found a beater Ford Ranger for my truck duties and I can now buy the Diesel SUV that will be more what I need in a vehicle.

    Oh, and I got my price. $7000 more than I was offered in trade. Car Dealers are so greedy. Still has less than 13k miles after 25 months. The guy has looked all over CA for the GM hybrid. Dealers told him they were sent to help out after Katrina. Probably why I have not seen any others. His wife's car, 2002 Prius....
  • chadxchadx Posts: 153
    >>>larsb - Good information, but what I said was "IN PART" they chose that engine for towing. And that's true.

    I'm still not sure why you claim the tow capacity had anything to do with the using the 6.0 liter engine. I've found no supporting documentation or articles where GM claims this. The ONLY reason ever stated was it was a lighter engine block.

    And my point was that the standard 5.3 liter will tow 7,000 - 9,000 in various GM vehicles, so a larger engine is absolutely not needed to help this vehicle with tow capacity. Even their old 4.8 liter would tow that much, so this in one case where engine size does not correspond with tow capacity. Acceleration or acceleration with load perhaps, but not capacity. That is vehicle set-up.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    From the USA Today review of the Tahoe hybrid:

    The 6-liter has nearly 4% more horsepower and 8% more torque than the 5.3-liter in gasoline-only Tahoes.

    AND:

    Key exception: Hybrids tow less. Rear-drive hybrid is rated to tow 6,000 pounds, vs. 7,500 pounds for gasoline version. Four-wheel-drive hybrid is rated to tow 6,200 pounds vs. 8,200 for gasoline.

    My educated guess is that using the smaller 5.3 liter engine would have made for an even LARGER disparity between the hybrid and the non-hybrid in regard to tow ratings.

    Do you think GM wanted a GREATER disparity, or a LESSER disparity?
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,847
    I think it is further evidence that hybrids do not belong in any vehicle you plan to tow with. The compromise is too great to make the slight gain in mileage worth the extra complexity. I guess GM will just join Toyota trying to look green when they are not.

    You notice that Toyota did not follow through with the Tundra hybrid they promised.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    I can revise your statement to fit reality:

    "Hybrids for towing substantial weight is a new phenomenon, first introduced by GM in the 2008 Tahoe/Yukon hybrids. Later hybrid generations will get better at it."

    And Toyota is green - the number two behind Honda in most "green rating" studies.

    And Toyota never "promised" a Tundra hybrid. They talked some about it, but never said, "we ARE DOING IT."
  • tpetpe Posts: 2,342
    My understanding is that this 2008 GMC hybrid will use Li-ion batteries. That's interesting when you consider that Toyota states this type of battery is still a couple years away from being mature enough for use in hybrids. I think what they're really saying is that the particular Li-ion chemistry they're developing (LiNiCoAlO2) still has major obstacles to overcome. This is the type found in laptops and is the most susceptible to thermal runaway. GM has specifically stated that they don't want any of their battery developers to pursue this chemistry because they don't feel it's suitable for an EV or hybrid application.
  • larsblarsb Posts: 8,204
    Where did you see that the GMC Yukon hybrid is using lithium batteries?

    All the info I can find say GM's system uses NIMH.
  • tpetpe Posts: 2,342
    Where did you see that the GMC Yukon hybrid is using lithium batteries?


    Here's my source (slide 3). In doing more research I think this might be incorrect and the Yukon does in fact use NiMH batteries.

    yukon
  • stevedebistevedebi LAPosts: 3,786
    "I found a beater Ford Ranger for my truck duties and I can now buy the Diesel SUV that will be more what I need in a vehicle. "

    What kind of diesel SUV? I haven't heard of any for sale in CA (New) since the Excursion was canceled in 2005. You could get one used, of course.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 28,847
    I am looking mainly at the ML320 CDI or maybe the GL320 CDI with 7500 miles. If I find a new one that is the right color I will buy and register to our home in Hawaii. That is an advantage to having more than one home.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    ...and I have no indication that they aren't, then the T2M and Y2M should accomplish the same as the TCH and HH vs their ICE-only siblings.

    All of them should save 30-40% of the fuel normally used if the hybrid system wasn't present. This is what we want as a nation. Whether it's done by diesels or hybrids or new gasser technology or the eventual conversion to alternate fuels every step helps.

    Congrats to GM for bringing these to market.

    $10000 'extra cost'? I believe this is marketing posturing. 'Don't beat us over the head. We've got lots of development costs to recoup.' What isn't disclosed in this figure is how much of it is development cost ( already spent money ) and how much of it is variable manufacturing cost for the 2-Mode system? Additionally over how many vehicles are they calculating this cost? 1000? 5000? 50,000? 200,000?

    Whatever the figure most of it is money already spent on development, now they just have to recoup their costs by amortizing the expense.

    One problem in foreseeing this being successful is that these BOF SUVs are a dying breed that fewer and fewer buyers have any interest in supporting. The lambdas are the natural next step and these should be a raging success. Immediately the Outlook, Acadia and Enclave could jump up to 28-30 mpg on average similar to the Highlander hybrid ( HH ). Now that gets attention in a segment that's growing, not dying.
  • JBaumgartJBaumgart Posts: 890
    Did GM/Chevy actually quote $10,000 extra cost? If it's that much extra, count me out. It would never pay for itself over the life of the vehicle.

    I'm seriously considering the Tahoe/Yukon as I need a good towing vehicle with a higher hitch height/better towing capability than most crossovers provide. But I don't tow that often so good mileage would be a major plus too. I would pay $3,000 - $4,000 extra and MAYBE recoup most of the premium over a long ownership period. A reasonable shortfall would be my contribution toward conservation. Will do the math once prices are set and "real world" prices are determined by the marketplace.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    Chevy did quote that figure but again what does that figure mean? If they try to get $10000 extra per vehicle then that's dumb. If they recognize that foregoing some profit for a couple of years, say 200,000 vehicles, while only charging a $4000 premium will put them in position to sell 200,000 units per year in the future then it's a good investment.

    This is what Toyota did with the Prius. Now from 5000 units in 2001 it should sell 250,000 units this year alone worldwide....all profitable.

    I posted this here back in May. Y2M 'payback' what think the GM faithful?
  • JBaumgartJBaumgart Posts: 890
    "Chevy did quote that figure but again what does that figure mean? If they try to get $10000 extra per vehicle then that's dumb. If they recognize that foregoing some profit for a couple of years, say 200,000 vehicles, while only charging a $4000 premium will put them in position to sell 200,000 units per year in the future then it's a good investment.

    This is what Toyota did with the Prius. Now from 5000 units in 2001 it should sell 250,000 units this year alone worldwide....all profitable.

    I posted this here back in May. Y2M 'payback' what think the GM faithful?"

    Great points, let's hope GM/Chevy sees the light.
  • nedzelnedzel Posts: 787
    "Did GM/Chevy actually quote $10,000 extra cost? If it's that much extra, count me out. It would never pay for itself over the life of the vehicle."

    They quoted it as the manufacturing cost and went on to say that they were undecided as to how much of that will passed along to the consumer.
  • kdhspyderkdhspyder Posts: 7,160
    It can't be the manufacturing cost itself ( variable cost ). It's just a normal vehicle with a ~$3000 battery pack ( retail price ) and two small motors in the transmission..
  • nedzelnedzel Posts: 787
    "It's just a normal vehicle with a ~$3000 battery pack ( retail price ) and two small motors in the transmission.."

    The battery pack for a 5000+ lb Tahoe hybrid has got to be much larger (and thus more expensive) than the one for a ~2500 lb Prius. How much more? Unclear.
  • Karen_CMKaren_CM Posts: 5,020
    A freelancer aims to talk with owners of the following hybrid models: Accord, Altima, Camry, all Lexus hybrids and all pick-up truck hybrids.

    Please respond to Chintan Talati at ctalati@edmunds.com no later than Wednesday, September 12, 2007 with your daytime contact information and the hybrid model you own.

    Community Manager If you have any questions or concerns about the Forums, send me an email, karen@edmunds.com, or click on my screen name to send a personal message.

  • galvanggalvang Posts: 156
    Based on what the buyer would get on a hybid you are getting quite a bit of extra standard accessories such as NAV, rear camera and othe goodies. So the 10k adder is probaly in comparison to a stripped down Yukon with no extras. So you need to look at the number closely.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,854
    With the mileage numbers some of the new hybrid coming out are offering, you have to look real close at the numbers!

    A Forbes.com article on the least efficient hybrids and the dreaded "hybrid premium" are the subject of today's Alternate Route entry, Boon or Bane?

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