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Why NOT to buy a 2007 Mitsubishi Outlander XLS

245

Comments

  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Hi well your right about that visual showing how the 4 wheel drive works at speed. What it does not show is how with the skid control on it takes over to straighten the car out and over rides the throttle whether one wants it to or not. I have mentioned higway speeds and the neat "hand of God" at those speeds and think it is great value for the every day. The guyu behind you better be awake when your throttle control is taken over and the car abruptly slows and nothing you can do about it!
    I have just returned from another 2300 km run in snow country and took some time abot three hours, to play on side roads both up and down hill to try and figure what works best. With out a doubt one MUST turn of the skid control OFF when on very tight twisty slippery roads at sane low speeds - leave it on at your peril. When one needs to power out of a forward slide the lateral motion of trying to get the rear end out causes the over ride and sends the car into the snow bank albeit at a slower speed. This is not an issue with the real awd in Subaru or Audi that I am used to or Volvo or the wonderful new system in the Saabs. But then they are just a tad more $$ eh? That's my update as promised
  • So like I said, switch it to 4WD lock and ASC *OFF* if you want to slide the vehicle. Sounds like you went into a corner too hot, got into a slide, and then wanted to use power to kick the rear end out. That's not possible with ASC on.

    What you will find is that these other vehicles that you think are so great are very similar these days. The old days of 4WD like the Quattro Coupe are gone. Computers and traction control drastically limit what you can do in terms of sliding.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Yes you were correct - I wasn't hot though - very surprised at less than 30kmh so there was no damage when I touched the bank. And yes this system over ride is a very necessary item even in the current Q's. Another small item I had to adjust to was the high mass shift - high as in off the ground. I still pine for my old Audi CS with electronically locking difs front an rear. Terrific to play with in the snow - like its driver - no brain control. :) I'm just going drive it from now on - like a truck albeit one that has very chipped paint ;)
  • Audi has great AWD system, but Subaru’s AWD is overrated. In this NY Times article you can see which AWD system can transfer up to 100% of touque to either axele. Audi Quattro, Volkswagen 4mothion, Mitsubishi Super Select II, and Volvo TRACS: all four can deliver the extreme 100 to 0/0 to 100 torque split. Best AWD systems can even drive a car on a single wheel, but Subaru can’t do that!

    The article is from 2002 or 2003, but Subaru’s still use the same AWD systems.

    Subaru with manual transmission can deliver up to 100% only to the rear axel, but not to the front axel. But majority of Subarus sold with 4-speed auto tranny which you can barely call full-time: It is front axel biased and has power split 90/10.

    So if we apply the NY Times classification the comparo looks like this:
    Outlander 6-speed auto: normal split 60/40; extreme split 100 to 0/40 to 60
    Subaru 4-speed auto: normal split 90/10; extreme split 50/50

    It appears the Outlander numbers look better in both normal and extreme conditions.

    In addition to paper specs, Outlander looks great in real life offroad condition. Here are more videos of the Outlander in snow:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3arUMr2PsI
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJt0j38JJBA&feature=related
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Not quite - Subaru the awd can shift torque right to left and corner to corner as well as front to rear. Outlander cant do anything but go to rear and then with the lock turned off and simple awd engaged the wheels can spin their little hearts out until the stability control kicks in and applies a brake to the offending wheel or wheels and the car crawls to a halt. (first hand experience). That is the main dif between Subaru, Audi and Outlander. I don't know where you get that comment about the Subaru automatic? that is incorrect as the same torque distribution takes place as the standard. Are you referring to an old model? The last 5 years at least the technology on both Audi and Subaru has changed markedly. I would refer to Road and Track rather than NY times unless it was for Ann Landers. :)
    The latest writeup on awd was in 2006 and the most recent comments about awd in general refer to the hottest being Mitsubishi Evo and Volvos new magic systems that apparently take it all to a new level.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Don't get me wrong "chelentano" the car is fine for what it is sold as - a crossover. But after putting it through some hard paces I found its weak spots and wont push it that hard again. That threshold is however considerably lower than the Audis and Subarus I have owned and driven over the years. But this chipwagon is fine - a bit noisy but fine.
  • >> Subaru the awd can shift torque right to left and corner to corner as well as front to rear. Outlander cant do anything but go to rear and then with the lock turned off and simple awd engaged the wheels can spin their little hearts out until the stability control kicks in and applies a brake to the offending wheel or wheels and the car crawls to a halt.

    You seem to be very anti-Mitsu biased and until you post a link to a legitimate source, you can only speculate what Subaru or Outlander can or can not do.
    .

    >> That is the main dif between Subaru, Audi and Outlander. I don't know where you get that comment about the Subaru automatic?

    Did not you see the chart in NY Times? I guess I have to post it here. As you can see 4-speed auto Subaru’s normal split is only 90/10:

    image

    >> Are you referring to an old model? The last 5 years at least the technology on both Audi and Subaru has changed markedly.

    Oh, yea? Sure, Subaru’s technology changed so much, that even on the latest 2009 Forester they use same-old-same-old 4-speed auto tranny which will be sold at least trough the year 2014, while the rest of the world has been using 6-speed and even 7-speed tranny for a while. 2008 Forester sold today at dealerships is the same generation as 2003 Forester: the same AWD. And the new 2009 Forester is not known to have any major AWD changes in terms of a torque split. So Subaru’s 4-speed auto AWD system has only a 90/10 split and it could barely be called full-time. The same AWD 90/10 split number is given in Wikipedia about the 4-speed auto Outback. It is your grand mothers AWD.

    The NY Times expert in his other article “Introduction to All Wheel Drive systems” actually calls this auto transmission based Subaru’s AWD system a “part time”:
    “Subaru has for many years been quietly offering radically different AWD systems in the same car, depending on the transmission choice. The manual transmission Legacies and Imprezas use a full time system that is split 50-50 with viscous couplings for limiting slip. In the automatic transmission versions, however, the system is a part time”.

    On the other hand, the Outlander in 4WD Lock mode has 60/40 split under normal conditions and 40/60 in extreme conditions. The Outlander's snow videos are the real life evidence.
    .

    >> I would refer to Road and Track rather than NY times unless it was for Ann Landers.

    NY Times is a little more independent source, while Road and Track gets all its money from car manufacturers. Road and Track is car marketing mag. But even the Road and Track (nor any other mag) did not ever say that a Subaru can transfer up to 100% of torque to either axle nor it can drive on a single wheel. Subaru’s AWD system is greatly overrated, it’s marketing myth. The AWD is decent only on manual transmission Subaru’s.
  • >> The AWD is decent only on manual transmission Subaru’s.

    Oh, and some Subaru's with H6 engine have a decent AWD, but hardly the best.
  • Had the Outlander XLS now for four months and 5500 miles. We live at high altitude north of the Mason-Dixon line in PA -snow and ice are a regular part of our driving experience. There is no such thing as an effective "all season tire" here. The first thing we did was get a set of real winter tires mounted on their own rims. The winter rubber keeps the ASC from intervening only until we are in extreme circumstances. With any car, if your traction-control and stability control system are working too much, it is the surest sign that you are running the wrong tires for the kind of driving conditions you frequent. All the fancy electronics and safety devices only work as well as your vehicle is connected to the road.
  • cooljwcooljw Posts: 47
    Hi rubyred83: Given where you live, I'm curious if you have experienced the notorious paint chipping problem on the sides of the car in front of the rear wheel wells?
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Not a valid assumption here friend. New - 225 70 15 BFG Slalom snow tires WITH studs. If that isn't connected t the road ...? Turning off the stability control is a very necessary action in mountainous situations when tied to this grandmothers type slip stop via brake system. Please don't test your theory on the open road when other cars are around. Not trying to be argumentative here - please read all the previous posts both on this thread and awd discussions for more detail of findings. :)
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    I really can't agree with your opinions on Outlander 4WD/ ASC setup. We have had snow storms every other week here in Chicago area this season, and every single time I have to drive to work early, where plows are nowhere to be seen yet. Every time 4WD lock worked perfectly, and I only saw ASC kicking in maybe twice, when I switched it to 2WD just to try it. I'm constantly driving at 40-50 mph with no sensations you are describing. This system combo is much better and safer than the real 4WD system (with 4 hi and low ranges) I had in my old SUV, with ABS only. I just feel more confident and that's what counts. You of course have the right to your opinion. Just don't try to convince everybody, it is the only right one.
  • Studs are no guarantee for good contact with the road -they stick best to soft ice and packed snow, in all other conditions they actually compromise road contact. Even on black ice they will slide if the ice depth isn't sufficient to allow deep penetration. Some of the worst-performing winter tires I have used were studded (Glacier Grip- a Cooper Weathermaster Clone). They were good for straight line acceleration in the conditions I described but totally sucked in any fast cornering situation.
  • Other Outlander owners have reported it around here, but not all; when my wife decided she wanted one I insisted on putting extra flaps on over the molded factory ones. I extended the front an extra 3'' and an inch out to the side so that the flaps look like the ones on the Endeavor. I have no chipping, so far.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Opinions are great as is yours. Please read my earlier comments to see from where my comments derive. On the highway it is nice - "kinda like the hand of God straightening out the track" - very nice provided you are not being tail gaited. But my main comment was directed at those roads that are like you have been driving in Chicago but now take that same daily trip on a switch back road up a slope or hill with hard compact snow and ice and the intervention of the ASC is a deterent whether we are talking about Outlander or any other vehicle with this amazing technology. I went to great lengths to find the limits of this combination of systems. I perhaps have failed to make myself clear enough for you. Sorry.
  • biscuit_xlsbiscuit_xls Posts: 194
    The reality is that in 99+% of real world conditions the ASC performs perfectly.

    Your *rare* example is of a person trying to hustle the vehicle through a series of very tight switchbacks in the snow with another speedy vehicle right behind you. In that situation the solution is to switch ASC off and use 4WD lock. Doing that will eliminate the ASC from slowing the vehicle down to prevent loss of control and allow you to slide the vehicle using the throttle.

    Your original assessment that the Outlander has a "grandma's" AWD system was because at that time you didn't completely understand how the system works.
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    Yes I've read your comments, and still disagree. The only thing slowing me down is snow not ASC. ASC is only engaging when you back end is sliding the other direction than your front, and that's what it should do. Now, take any car (ASC or not) and turn right at intersection with corner not plowed clear yet, and show me how the car won't slow down. And that's exactly what twisty rod with packed snow is, turn after turn. And how other said, if yours ASC is on way to often, you are driving way to fast. Relax, winter is almost over.
  • growwisegrowwise Posts: 297
    Lets get over the AWD shall we? It is fine.. The real reasons that Mitsu need to worry about, if they care to read this thread to begin with are as follows:

    1. Poor ergonomics: No excuse for lack of telescopic steering wheel (get rid of anything else if in the way). I am 5 10 and its ridiculous I cant find a good seating position without stretching my hands all the way.
    2. Hard seats with no bolstering. I dont know about LS since I have XLS and leather seats are irritating with no cushion and no lumber/thoracic support/contours.
    3. Excessive noise: Its too damn noisy (guess they cant afford to tack on extra weight for noise reduction or they simply dont care)
    4. Cheap dash and door inserts. Plastic that looks terrible and no effort on the inside of doors. Just a sea of plastic everywhere.
    5. Steering wheel hard to turn (dont cut corners in areas where customers can feel the difference)
    6. Suspension too stiff. Understand that this is suv but no excuse in letting us feel every irregularity in the road.

    Everything else about the vehicle is just fine and dandy!

    On a bright note, there are no rattles in my outlander. Thank god for that. BTW, I have 33000 km on odo and owned it for more than a year now.
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    The vehicle must all good, when you try to copy our wish list from "What do you like to see on next Outlander” tread on this forum. Any of those points above are hardly enough for "Why NOT to buy a 2007 Mitsubishi Outlander” topic. To be honest, you should compare it to other cars in its class, and not to Audi, Lexus or BMW .
    Do you think they can add telescopic steering wheel, soft leather, extra insulation, soft plastics and real wood insert, back up camera, etc, on top of a long list of standard equipment, and still charge low 20K for it. Would you pay 35-40K for it?
    IMO seats, steering, performance and suspension are fine, more like European sedan, than floaty Camry or Buick style. I know, it is not for everybody, there are other choices out there. For me dash design is better than RAV4, equal to CRV or Santa FE, door panels could be more attractive, and they are for 2008. In the end it is all personal.
  • growwisegrowwise Posts: 297
    For the record, my XLS costed me 36 grand CAD out the door with 7k in finance charges on top of it if I dont pay quickly. Besides, I would be glad to trade in the paddle shifter, blue tooth, roof rack and any other useless item for more quality. I guess that would be a bad thing for marketing wouldnt it?
  • busta4busta4 Posts: 35
    IMO, in the final analysis after 11,000 miles and a little over 15 months of ownership it is a poorly designed car that I regret buying brand new. My Interior is FULL of annoying noise. My staring wheel even has a funny click to it when I turn it side to side. The wind around the side windows is way to much I have to push it down a little to muffle the noise. My dashboard and windshield are poorly aligned and have have started to make creaking noises over every single bump in the road. The stereo is a huge letdown, sounds horrible with the volume up. The 2008 Outlander brochure states "stiff inner door panels and precisely designed speaker housing to accentuate the system's sound quality" this is clearly not the case for the 2007 Rockford Fosgate system. It sucks. The whole interior is one giant rattle box and it shouldn't be. I have ranted before on this forum about the quality of the plastic used, so I will give the short version, it sucks.
    My advice is if you want the Outlander, is to buy it used so some of the "used" looks and sounds my brand new Oultnader displays might not bother you as much. and someone else can pay the depreciation.
  • chelentanochelentano Posts: 634
    >> For the record, my XLS costed me 36 grand CAD out the door with 7k in finance charges on top of it if I dont pay quickly.

    Are you saying finance charges are not applicable to other cars, why mention them? ...28 grand in US, 36 grand in Canada or 48K in Russia, so what? It is still the best value on the market. The noise level and interior is adequate to the price, but equipment and features exceed the price by far. The Outlander is equipped as well as Lexus 350.
    .

    >> Besides, I would be glad to trade in the paddle shifter, blue tooth, roof rack and any other useless item for more quality.

    The paddle shifters are free bonus and the Bluetooth is a must feature for me. I love the Fast Key, premium stereo, Nav, handling, styling, seat comfort, warranty, 4WD, transmission. I am really happy with beige interior in white leather. And then talking of quality, according to Consumer reports, the Outlander has the best reliability in its class, unlike the least reliable in its class Mercedes M class, LR3 and BMW X5.
  • biscuit_xlsbiscuit_xls Posts: 194
    IMO, in the final analysis after 12,000 miles and a little over 13 months of ownership it is a well designed car that I am glad that I bought brand new. My interior is quiet and has no squeeks. The stereo is fantastic, sounds great with the volume up, especially with a CD, Sirius, and absolutely thumps on things like James Bond DVDs. It rocks. The whole interior is tight and has modern/technical styling that suits my eye perfectly, so I will give the short version, it is great.
    My advice is if you want the Outlander, buy it new or used, it's a great vehicle.
  • rcpaxrcpax Posts: 580
    1yr 4mos, with 12K miles on the odo, this vehicles is almost still new. I take care of my Outlander, and after washes, I can still smile because it still looks like I've just driven off the dealership. And that's with black paint. after 2 winters, i've manage to keep the car chip free, and no major scratches so far. The interior seems to be holding pretty good in my case, no rattles so far. Had the clunking steering when I bought it, but since been fixed after I mailed MMNA about it, so was the mirror noise. Other than that, I still feel the thrill of driving it everytime, how it hums on bridges and how quickly I pass RAV4s and CR-Vs on the freeways, and yes I try to do that when I can, just for the other driver to look it's an Outlander that overtook them, thanks to the paddle shifters which definitely allows me to demand power from the V6 MIVEC engine when I want to at a split second without reaching for the stick shift (which is not a good idea at 75-80 mph). The navigation software (and the maps also) could use an update, but I'm holding off paying for it until I see a good enough version that's worth the money. I have no regrets with my 4WD XLS, and I would still very much recommend it for those in the market for a sporty SUV. Reliability has been outstanding so far, but I already expected that from a Japan built Mitsubishi, having owned a Lancer before. So, it's been a worthy investment in my case. I feel confident and safe everytime I drive with my family on board. Ample power for towing when the need arises. It's money well spent in my case.
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    You must be frustrated with your job or something. Don't blame your car for all your problems. Most of us are satisfied. Mine is quiet, no rattles at all, panel are tight and even, dashboard looks good. Are you sure you own the same car as rest of us? Highlander, Outlander, Uplander....
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    I paid 22.5K USD for brand new XLS 4wd, with protection and appearance packages.
    Blue tooth, roof rack, selectable 4WD, tinted windows, sliding & reclining 2nd row seats, drop down tail gate, Fast Key, ASC with traction control, V6 engine and 6 speed auto transmission, were important to me.
    I'm not crazy about fabric seats (lint catchers) and useless 3rd row seats. I would like to see more accessories available, and maybe diesel engine option in the future.
  • busta4busta4 Posts: 35
    :confuse: I run a non-profit that specializes in bringing aid and comfort to people who are in need and I can't think of a better way to spend my days, thank you for asking.

    My frustration is the Twenty seven thousand dollar car I purchased has to many minor problems that add up to one big disappointment.

    If i wanted a car that is clunky, and noisy, and scratches easy, and has throttle lag(dangerous) and a stereo system that can't keep an FM signal or rattles the whole car with the volume over 20, or a windshield that literally sounds like it's not lined up properly, I would of stuck with the used cars I have bought in the past.

    I can't figure out why people put up with with the car problems discussed all over this forum with every make and model after spending thousands on these vehicles. where is the accountability in the craftsmanship and promises made by the manufacturing?

    You can't t tell me The folks at Mitsubishi could not hear the wind noise in the cabin of this car during the design phase. Or the rattles the stereo makes inside the doors.

    They could and did. and rather than spend the money to work out the problems they banked on an apathetic consumer. And it looks like that is what they got.

    Piast, I am taking about my experience with my Outlander on this forum not about one of your family members so try not to make this personal, but if you are still interested in my frustrations, or problems or my job I will be glad discuss it with you further in a private email.
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    Have you ever heard of bean counters bringing down to earth many great engineering ideas? Smaller manufactures just can't afford to put all the luxury features on a car , sell it to you at a low price and guarantee it for 5 and 10 years, can they? How is it possible that you see this car so much different than most of us? It is personal, because it sound like all of us happy owners are just idiots, who spend 20-30K on a brand new car, and still not see how crappy it is. Well, we don't.
    Okay, admit, you just need a hug.
  • biscuit_xlsbiscuit_xls Posts: 194
    Hey busta4, what part of the country are you located? I'd like to compare Outies to see and hear your problems, because mine doesn't have what you're describing.
This discussion has been closed.