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Why NOT to buy a 2007 Mitsubishi Outlander XLS

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  • Piast

    dude, calm down. Everyone including Disappointed and clutchguy gets they're turn in this forum. Just like you said about voicing your own oppinions, why dont you let Disappointed and clutchguy say what they think about the outlander aswell, they're just trying to help other people and they're just asking for help on what to do. That is what these forums are about is asking for help and giving answers and solutions. "Just be honest and rady to back up your claims. In that you fail too", your wrong. In this topic of why not to buy an outlander, your the one that fails.
  • susieq6susieq6 Posts: 7
    Thank you so much for the information! Since you know so much about the Outlander maybe you could help with something else. Do you know if there is any way to program the doors to lock automatically when the ignition is started. I had this in my last 2 vehicles(CRV & XL7) and have gotten used to it. Even if I have to get used to locking the car manually, I can't complain. Those suvs didn't ride anywhere as beautifully as the Outlander!
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Now have 10,000 km the last two in snow and mountain roads. The vehicle overall is fine - a little to much road noise maybe. The paint chipping issue is ridiculous. The AWD system is NOT no matter what we have discussed and what I agreed to earlier last year NOT up to comparison to Audi or Subaru.It is your grand mothers AWD. Lame is a short descriptions.
    Is it nice to have the stability control ? Yes but the that's a Mercedes designed system used by almost all vehicle on the road today. And it does play into the AWD system.
    But this is not an electro or electro mechanical type AWD system as used in it two main competitors and also Volvo, BMW, Audi, Acura. It can be very frustrating.

    Try traveling on a packed snow covered road with tight corners and hills - as the front end starts to slip the "AWD" system applies the brakes to the offending wheel to attempt to increase tracktion - not by using a toresen system electro transfer of torque but by forcing a slower rotation.
    So when that happens and one is driving an Audi or Subaru one hits the throttle and allows the system to find traction. It does so by shifting the torque between the four wheels to find the best mix. The driver simply turns the wheel and powers out of the slide - -Not Outlander - it applies the brakes and reduces throttle response until you crawl around the corner or come to a halt - no kidding! My friend in a A4 passed on the inside of me as did a following Toyota Rav.
    Later we took the time at the end of a days skiing to replicate the occurrence 6 times with the same result.
    When hauling down a slush covered highway it is nice to feel "hand of god" stabilize the swaying attitude and slow the vehicle down (thank you Mercedes) - but is sure would be nice if the brake lights came on to let the following traffic know what the computer is doing because the driver sure as heck can't.
    This system needs a rethink in total - will I keep this truckette? It's on a lease so probably not past next fall - I couldn't be more frustrated with a vehicle that in many ways I like. :mad: :cry:
  • If you want to race around tight/slow corners in the snow you can turn off the ASC and set it to 4WD Lock.

    See this video:

    http://outlander.jp/drivers_feeling/dri_03.html#start

    I can't imagine anyone needing to go faster in the snow than the last 2 runs in that video (in a production CUV).
  • toomanyfumestoomanyfumes S.E. Wisconsin Posts: 892
    I'm no expert on 4WD systems but my Outlander got me through 14 inches of snow Wednesday. The Traction Control seems to let the wheels spin a little before kicking in, which is a good thing. The stability control does take a little fun out of cornering, but is a great safety feature: I tried some corners with it on and off, and it really makes a difference.

    I also used it to pull my stuck T-Bird out of where the snowplow had plowed it in on the street, and it yanked it out no problem in 4WD lock.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Please don't think I am being argumentative - but that "good thing" is the last thing one wants to happen on ice. True the pause or spin of the front wheels is on good days nothing to concern the average driver but in the circumstances I found myself it was dangerous (if one was relying on traction to get out of a sticky situation at more than parking speeds). Having driven Audi Q's and Subarus for 25 years I was disappointed, that's all. As a mini tractor like you describe I'm sure it will be fine - just stay under the posted speed limits in the white stuff - well under. That pause will prove dangerous to the uninitiated. Price, space and disposability were the reasons I chose this rig and I pretty much got what I paid for. Take away that extra space and the Subaru would have won.
    I am heading off into snow country again tomorrow morning to drive 2000 miles between several ski areas next week (instuctor). I'll see and report how it works out. We can all learn more by trial and error eh? :)
  • dodo2dodo2 Posts: 496
    "... - just stay under the posted speed limits in the white stuff - well under."

    Aren't you supposed to do just that regardless of the car you drive?

    I second Toomanyfumes - two days ago the Outlander got me through about a foot of heavy snow without any effort. I didn't even have to do anything special like deactivate the ASC or switch to the "4WD Lock". The ASC didn't even kick in. Totally seamless. True, I wasn't racing or anything, just normal drive. At one point I went around a U-shape alley with some deep ruts and the car did not have any problem to get me through (I also had 4 adults in the car while doing it). Again, I was going nice and slow according to the conditions.
    The 4WD system in the Outlander may not be as good as Subaru's (I truly think that Subaru's are great 4WD vehicles), but I think it was designed more for safety than for racing or off-road for that matter. However, I don't think too may owners would ever reach its limits.

    Next time when you are having fun try what biscuit_xls suggested - turn off the ACS and set it 4WD Lock and see how it goes and let us know. I'm really interested in your experience as I don't get too many opportunities to try fun things myself.

    BTW: The new Forester might be a good fit for you - it grew in size and I guess it will have at least as much cargo as the Outlander. It also has a bit more ground clearance than the Outlander (8.9" vs. 8.5"). No V6 though, so the power may be in short supply, at least on the naturally aspired version.
  • toomanyfumestoomanyfumes S.E. Wisconsin Posts: 892
    My brother drives nothing but Subaru's and swears by them. I read a review of the new Legacy and they gave positive comments and mentioned the reasonable price. I stopped at the Subie dealer to check one out to replace my T-Bird when it finally dies. All the ones there had dealer added spoilers and paintsripes to pad the sticker.

    Oh well, maybe in a year or so there will be deals to be had. Kinda like the situation with the Outlander, I wish I had waited for the rebates and discounts. Of course my trade would have depreciated that much more, so I guess it kind of works out.
  • As someone who once worked in customer service, it's a known fact that satisfied customers will rarely share their experiences with others while those who have a reason to complain will tell 50 people they know. It's human nature.

    My point? djbderwood, the ex-Honda owner, isn't representing the majority of us who are quite happy with our Outlanders.

    As an previous owner of Toyota, Infiniti, Nissan, and Honda vehicles, I've yet to own a car that didn't have a problem. The Toyota had a failed head gasket and transmission by 60k miles. The Infiniti had an issue with the brake pads wearing out prematurely and the passenger side window motor had to be replaced. The Nissan required a catalytic converter replacement at 4k miles, the a/c doesn't always work correctly, and the engine has an unusual vibration to it. The Honda had numerous prominent interior rattles, the front suspension would creak (had to TSB it twice), and the fuel gauge was inaccurate by 3 to 4 gallons.

    Am I jumping around to different forums telling everyone "DON'T BY A HONDA!" "DON'T BY A TOYOTA!" "DON'T BY AN INFINITI!" No, because learned through previous experiences that no car is perfect at ANY price point so why go crying over split milk.
  • comem47comem47 Posts: 389
    And the good news in all this is the Outlander 's warranty period to fix the problems.
    (10 yrs/100k drive line and 5 yrs/ 60K bumper to bumper) Toyota/Honda feel they don't have to compete. I'll take the written guarantee over a perception of quality. (like the head gasket problem that the Toyota had would be covered if occurring on an Outlander)

    Were all gambling that Mitsubishi is around long enough to honor it, but
    I'll take my chances that I will be covered and Mitsubishi has got the honest intent to
    re-establish a presence in the US.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Hi well your right about that visual showing how the 4 wheel drive works at speed. What it does not show is how with the skid control on it takes over to straighten the car out and over rides the throttle whether one wants it to or not. I have mentioned higway speeds and the neat "hand of God" at those speeds and think it is great value for the every day. The guyu behind you better be awake when your throttle control is taken over and the car abruptly slows and nothing you can do about it!
    I have just returned from another 2300 km run in snow country and took some time abot three hours, to play on side roads both up and down hill to try and figure what works best. With out a doubt one MUST turn of the skid control OFF when on very tight twisty slippery roads at sane low speeds - leave it on at your peril. When one needs to power out of a forward slide the lateral motion of trying to get the rear end out causes the over ride and sends the car into the snow bank albeit at a slower speed. This is not an issue with the real awd in Subaru or Audi that I am used to or Volvo or the wonderful new system in the Saabs. But then they are just a tad more $$ eh? That's my update as promised
  • So like I said, switch it to 4WD lock and ASC *OFF* if you want to slide the vehicle. Sounds like you went into a corner too hot, got into a slide, and then wanted to use power to kick the rear end out. That's not possible with ASC on.

    What you will find is that these other vehicles that you think are so great are very similar these days. The old days of 4WD like the Quattro Coupe are gone. Computers and traction control drastically limit what you can do in terms of sliding.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Yes you were correct - I wasn't hot though - very surprised at less than 30kmh so there was no damage when I touched the bank. And yes this system over ride is a very necessary item even in the current Q's. Another small item I had to adjust to was the high mass shift - high as in off the ground. I still pine for my old Audi CS with electronically locking difs front an rear. Terrific to play with in the snow - like its driver - no brain control. :) I'm just going drive it from now on - like a truck albeit one that has very chipped paint ;)
  • Audi has great AWD system, but Subaru’s AWD is overrated. In this NY Times article you can see which AWD system can transfer up to 100% of touque to either axele. Audi Quattro, Volkswagen 4mothion, Mitsubishi Super Select II, and Volvo TRACS: all four can deliver the extreme 100 to 0/0 to 100 torque split. Best AWD systems can even drive a car on a single wheel, but Subaru can’t do that!

    The article is from 2002 or 2003, but Subaru’s still use the same AWD systems.

    Subaru with manual transmission can deliver up to 100% only to the rear axel, but not to the front axel. But majority of Subarus sold with 4-speed auto tranny which you can barely call full-time: It is front axel biased and has power split 90/10.

    So if we apply the NY Times classification the comparo looks like this:
    Outlander 6-speed auto: normal split 60/40; extreme split 100 to 0/40 to 60
    Subaru 4-speed auto: normal split 90/10; extreme split 50/50

    It appears the Outlander numbers look better in both normal and extreme conditions.

    In addition to paper specs, Outlander looks great in real life offroad condition. Here are more videos of the Outlander in snow:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3arUMr2PsI
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJt0j38JJBA&feature=related
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Not quite - Subaru the awd can shift torque right to left and corner to corner as well as front to rear. Outlander cant do anything but go to rear and then with the lock turned off and simple awd engaged the wheels can spin their little hearts out until the stability control kicks in and applies a brake to the offending wheel or wheels and the car crawls to a halt. (first hand experience). That is the main dif between Subaru, Audi and Outlander. I don't know where you get that comment about the Subaru automatic? that is incorrect as the same torque distribution takes place as the standard. Are you referring to an old model? The last 5 years at least the technology on both Audi and Subaru has changed markedly. I would refer to Road and Track rather than NY times unless it was for Ann Landers. :)
    The latest writeup on awd was in 2006 and the most recent comments about awd in general refer to the hottest being Mitsubishi Evo and Volvos new magic systems that apparently take it all to a new level.
  • 20vcq20vcq Posts: 82
    Don't get me wrong "chelentano" the car is fine for what it is sold as - a crossover. But after putting it through some hard paces I found its weak spots and wont push it that hard again. That threshold is however considerably lower than the Audis and Subarus I have owned and driven over the years. But this chipwagon is fine - a bit noisy but fine.
  • >> Subaru the awd can shift torque right to left and corner to corner as well as front to rear. Outlander cant do anything but go to rear and then with the lock turned off and simple awd engaged the wheels can spin their little hearts out until the stability control kicks in and applies a brake to the offending wheel or wheels and the car crawls to a halt.

    You seem to be very anti-Mitsu biased and until you post a link to a legitimate source, you can only speculate what Subaru or Outlander can or can not do.
    .

    >> That is the main dif between Subaru, Audi and Outlander. I don't know where you get that comment about the Subaru automatic?

    Did not you see the chart in NY Times? I guess I have to post it here. As you can see 4-speed auto Subaru’s normal split is only 90/10:

    image

    >> Are you referring to an old model? The last 5 years at least the technology on both Audi and Subaru has changed markedly.

    Oh, yea? Sure, Subaru’s technology changed so much, that even on the latest 2009 Forester they use same-old-same-old 4-speed auto tranny which will be sold at least trough the year 2014, while the rest of the world has been using 6-speed and even 7-speed tranny for a while. 2008 Forester sold today at dealerships is the same generation as 2003 Forester: the same AWD. And the new 2009 Forester is not known to have any major AWD changes in terms of a torque split. So Subaru’s 4-speed auto AWD system has only a 90/10 split and it could barely be called full-time. The same AWD 90/10 split number is given in Wikipedia about the 4-speed auto Outback. It is your grand mothers AWD.

    The NY Times expert in his other article “Introduction to All Wheel Drive systems” actually calls this auto transmission based Subaru’s AWD system a “part time”:
    “Subaru has for many years been quietly offering radically different AWD systems in the same car, depending on the transmission choice. The manual transmission Legacies and Imprezas use a full time system that is split 50-50 with viscous couplings for limiting slip. In the automatic transmission versions, however, the system is a part time”.

    On the other hand, the Outlander in 4WD Lock mode has 60/40 split under normal conditions and 40/60 in extreme conditions. The Outlander's snow videos are the real life evidence.
    .

    >> I would refer to Road and Track rather than NY times unless it was for Ann Landers.

    NY Times is a little more independent source, while Road and Track gets all its money from car manufacturers. Road and Track is car marketing mag. But even the Road and Track (nor any other mag) did not ever say that a Subaru can transfer up to 100% of torque to either axle nor it can drive on a single wheel. Subaru’s AWD system is greatly overrated, it’s marketing myth. The AWD is decent only on manual transmission Subaru’s.
  • >> The AWD is decent only on manual transmission Subaru’s.

    Oh, and some Subaru's with H6 engine have a decent AWD, but hardly the best.
  • Had the Outlander XLS now for four months and 5500 miles. We live at high altitude north of the Mason-Dixon line in PA -snow and ice are a regular part of our driving experience. There is no such thing as an effective "all season tire" here. The first thing we did was get a set of real winter tires mounted on their own rims. The winter rubber keeps the ASC from intervening only until we are in extreme circumstances. With any car, if your traction-control and stability control system are working too much, it is the surest sign that you are running the wrong tires for the kind of driving conditions you frequent. All the fancy electronics and safety devices only work as well as your vehicle is connected to the road.
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