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Honda Civic Hybrid IMA Problems

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  • bosslessbossless Posts: 179
    The tech bulletin that calls for the update states that a punch mark will be added to the VIN that is under the hood. However, this may not be reliable. I had the update but they did not add the punch mark.
  • Suspicious!! Why can't I find it. I got an e-mail update but the original post is not here? Hmmm.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,859
    edited December 2011
    Nothing suspicious at all. The Edmunds forums cannot be used to organize legal actions and posts along those lines are removed. All part of the Member Agreement that we all agreed to when we first became forums members here.

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  • OK. Thanks for the explanation! Yesterday my car practically revved to the red zone just trying to merge into freeway traffic. Today it revved to 5000 just trying to get to 45 mph on the freeway. 55,000k 2007 Honda.
    I personally know about class actions - they do mainly benefit the lawyers. I got a class action check for $18.00 2 weeks ago - some kind of foreign transaction bank fee settlement. I've only been overseas twice in the last 10 years or so. I must have really been ripped off - LOL.
  • I had better luck. When my hybrid electric battery needed replacing at 120,000 miles, they told me the good news was Honda would replace it free! "Why?" I asked. "Because Honda just increased the warrantee to 10 years or 150,000 miles, whichever comes first."

    Hope this helps you and many others.

    Another time, when I was told I might need a new transmission, they called and asked if they could try something different. They tried flushing it out about five times with oil, and that fixed it. The cost of this was around $200, versus over $1000-$1500, so overall, I've been extremely happy with Honda. My only gripe now is the over $100 an hour labor rate that I can no longer afford. All of these car repair places are chasing away their customers--especially us senior citizens in the new Great Depression with rates like this. Many car dealers have already gone out of business before admitting this mistake.
  • bosslessbossless Posts: 179
    I wonder if this extended warranty would apply to 2006 models and if the State of residence matters.
  • Can someone please help me understand if there is a Honda warranty on the HCH IMA battery. I have a 2005 Honda Civic Hybrid purchased in April 2005 with 65K miles?

    Suggest how I communicate with Honda and what I am likely to expect when I bring the vehicle to the dealer.

    Thanks!
  • Check your owner's manual. I know that in mine, there is an 8-year 100000 mile warranty. In some states, that is extended by law to 10 years and 150000 miles; but you should be well within the limit.
  • dowjddowjd Posts: 14
    Hey dontsettle,

    I have a 2009 HCH and have had the same problems as everyone else. In the first year of purchasing the car I already had a battery go bad. Here is a synopsis of my HCH experience:

    Post #937
    1. Purchased Feb 2009
    2. Got 43-52mpg highway & 43mpg highway/city
    3. August 2009 mileage decreased to 43 highway & 39 highway/city
    4. IMA light on Nov 2009, software upgrade
    5. Poor to no assist, battery drops to 1 bar, averages 4-6 bars, Auto Stop is random
    6. Mileage down to 39 highway & 37 highway/city
    7. IMA light on Dec 2009, new battery installed.
    8. Mileage 37-39 highway & 34-36 highway/city.
    9. Dec 2010, IMA light again. Honda software update.
    10. Car maintains 4-6 bars, Mileage 38 highway & 36-38 city/highway, Auto Stop more frequent, Assist more frequent but ceases above 3000RPM.

    Post #952
    My local Honda dealer (Visalia Honda... Thanks to them for ackowledging) today (3/2/11) acknowledged they are experiencing a lot of battery problems/replacements and have advised Honda USA that it is not poor driving habits of its customers. I advised them that I am paying the price of a hybrid, but getting the performance of a regular Civic.

    Additional: Upon vehicle pick up. Battery recal, performance improved. It appeared Honda performed off record software update or downgrade.

    Should HCH owners opt-out now or wait till Jan 2012 case is finalized?
  • You can expect a variety of responses -- all of which have been mentioned here in previous posts -- and none of which might be of real help to your particular vehicle/dealer/service department, etc. As I am reading more and more of these posts it is obvious that there are many options, some work and some don't, but the bottom line is you will either keep your HCH or get rid of it.

    Either way, the evidence points to the fact that the HCH 2000 and up have IMA battery problems, dealers/service depts/Honda know about the problems, and have year by year moved farther away from fixing it with their software upgrades and/or extended mileage warranties to outright denying there is a problem of any kind and just throwing their hands up while they open the cash register and wait for you to write a check.

    To put it bluntly - you're over a barrel and we all know what happens next...
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,859
    The Edmunds forums cannot be used to organize legal actions or to drive traffic to websites. Please do not make posts along these lines as they will have to be removed.

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  • It is fascinating. American Honda, in the words of their customer support: "We do not do business by mail, only by telephone. If you have a question that you do not want answered by telephone, refer to our manual!" Now, is that Customer Service?!?!?! I sincerely hope that someone from Honda America upper management is monitoring these, cause this is not the type of response I would expect from a company doing business in America!
    OH, in case you were wondering what this about: Quick reprise; on 3d IMA battery for '05 Civic, and wanting to just have the question answered; why original battery is good for 8 yr/80K miles, but replacement batteries are only good until the car reaches 8 yr/80K.
    Doesn't seem reasonable to me.
  • bosslessbossless Posts: 179
    why original battery is good for 8 yr/80K miles, but replacement batteries are only good until the car reaches 8 yr/80K.

    Because they do not start your warranty over at replacement. If you pay for a new part, then they will give you warranty on that part.
  • You might want to share your experience with Honda's spokesperson Chris Martin - chris_martin@ahm.honda.com
  • 12.28.2011

    I am taking my 2009 Civic Hybrid into to John Eagle Honda in Dallas, TX today. Same IMA issue as others have noted, except my mileage is only 42,000. I will let everyone know the dealer's response as it unfolds.

    My Owner's Manual warranty says Honda pays for only 60% of the new battery cost after 36 months and that I must pay the cost of installation. I bought the car on 9.30.2008 so I am over 2 months out of full warranty. We will see how John Eagle Honda and the manufacturer responds. Stay tuned.
  • I own a 2008 Civic Hybrid with 73,000 miles and just had my battery replaced at no charge at Jim McNatt Honda. I was told that the battery is fully warrantied up to 80,000 miles.
  • Purchased new in 2009 March,
    December 2011 IMA & CEL check engine light come on
    Highway mileage drops from 47-45 highway down to 33 mpg
    AutoStop randomly works! IMA & CEL RANDOMLY OFF & on
    Software update completed during warranty work in 2010
    Called Honda dealership ASM AUTO SERVICE MANAGER STATES PARTS/LABOR COVERED UNDER 8 yr /80,000 mile warranty IMA HYBRID BATTERIES

    Deliver to Colorado Springs Dealership - confirm my findings hybrid/IMA BATTERIES DEAD
    TSB TECHNICAL SERVICE BULLETIN ON LEAKING FILLER PIPE ON GAS TANK AND VISOR ISSUE WERE TO BE CHECKED OUT AND REPAIRED IF NEEDED
    SO FAR FRONT RANGE HAS BEEN AN EXEMPLARY DEALERSHIP
    POST LATER AFTER PICK UP OF CAR EITHER ON 12-29 or 30th

    REQUESTED ALL COMMUNICATION IN WRITING
    ALL PRINTOUTS DIAGNOSES IN WRITING
    INFORMED THEM I WAS AWARE OF CLASS ACTION IN PROGRESS
    REQUESTED A LOANER VEHICLE - Enterprise rental was provided
    So far no major issues handling this
  • Front Range Honda Dealership of Colorado Springs has made my experience quite remarkable! Went in on Monday 12-26-2011, today 12-30-2011 received my Honda Civic Hybrid (HCH) back new batteries installed, they provided me with a rental car during my wait! So overall I have to give Scott the ASM Auto service Manage and Clayton Davis (the auto representative in shop) two thumbs up! They discovered my claim to be true (the IMA Integrated Motor Assist Batteries were dead) and they checked the fuel neck and visor from other TSB recalls. Here is what I did :
    A. Called the Service Dept. and asked to talk to the Manager of the Auto Service Dept.
    1. Asked for all communication be in writing (stipulated it on the work order in long hand)
    2. Asked for the loaner vehicle, made note of the fact that problem is all over the Internet
    3. Made mention of the fact that a class action lawsuit is in progress (www.hchsettlement.com)
    4. Asked over the phone to elaborate on the warranty of the IMA batteries - which was parts and labor.
    5. Indicated other symptoms, drop in gas mileage 10-12 miles, autostop randomly operable, informed them that batteries were designed to assist gasoline engine obtain higher mpg, IMA and CEL check engine light were on and off, this is typical of any electronic device! Code that was sent to scanner, I had a buddy check it before going in.
    6. Ask that all communication pertaining to problem or diagnostic be provided in hardcopy which included monitor printouts of screen if hardcopy not available due to software limitation.
    7. Checked 12 Volt battery to determine that it was not the culprit, faulty or bad battery will send false positives to the system.(12 volt battery was not at fault)
    8. Made sure that the Hybrid SYSTEM was checked FIRST! to keep it under warranty.
    Indicated that a telephone call to me indicating problem(s) would not be accepted. When asked why I calmly stated in case we need to go to court. (others mentioned having to go to small claims court to get reimbursed for a diagnostic check charge)
    Above all else staying calm, being objective, and working with rather than against the representatives goes a long way, after all they are people who constantly are berated for issues they have no control over. I am very impressed with the final outcome. I am hoping that this posting brings a more optimistic outlook for everyone ! I do recall from my statistics course in college that batteries do die at a rate of 3% for whatever reason. For those of us in that 3% window I wish you as much success with your dealership as I had with mine! I read somewhere that 70% of Honda owners would not purchase another vehicle from Honda. As dealerships go this one is excellent. Furthermore, I am a retired computer teacher and in no way am I affiliated with Honda. I hope by providing some insight others will gain the knowledge and the patience to come toward a positive outcome! Kudos to Front Range Honda for standing behind their product!! Thank You Scott and Clayton!
  • dowjddowjd Posts: 14
    Great to hear your dealer did an excellent job. My only question is did they install the new Lithium battery pack or is it the nickel-metal?

    I would hate to see you have a repeat like I am having.

    I bought my HCH in Feb 09 and battery had to be replaced in Dec 09. Dec 2010 battery problem again. Software after software updates, still get poor mpg's. When I first got the car it averaged 46-47mpg, now 38-37mpg. Honda says won't replace until IMA light comes on again. Here it is Dec 2011 still at 38-37 mpg.

    I'm paying for a hybrid, but getting the performance of a Civic Sedan LX.

    Thanks Honda.
  • Fantastic! That is the first good outcome I have heard of so far. Anyone in your area who wants a Honda should buy from this dealership because they should be rewarded for being responsive to their customers. I think you hit the nail on the head when you urge people to stay calm and treat the dealership employees with respect. It is not their fault - Honda built a lousy car. Unhappy Civic Hybrid owners should visit dont settle with honda dot org for more information.
  • I am happy for you and your successful experience. It seems as if you not only reported your success, but admonished others to stay calm, remain objective, and work with not against the Honda representatives...I don't recall any of us that have had troubles with the IMA battery stating we approached the Honda representatives in any way but as one would who expects someone trained and employed by a company to provide service to the company's products. In fact, your post seems to report you taking a rather intimidating, manipulative, and threatening stance right from the get go. I am happy that our reporting of our experiences - the positive and the negative - provided you with the leverage and knowledge that may have tipped the scales in your favor. If you care to re-read my post, you will note that up to the ride back to the dealer after receiving a quote over the phone, I sang the praises loud and long of my HCH. We are not talking about a bunch of troublemakers who have got it out for Honda dealers because we've got nothing better to do with our time and brain power. In fact, we are HCH owners/consumers who would likely be even more justified than you are, my kind sir, to have threatened lawsuits, demanded everything in writing, etc. given our previous experience with our particular vehicle problems. None of us reported berating the service manager, etc. In my particular case, the service manager was the one doing the berating and it wasn't one of his staff he was berating, it was me. Please count your blessings and keep your fingers crossed. My hope is that all is well for you. My wish is that your case was the norm and mine the exception; sadly, quite the opposite is true. Happy new year to you.
  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 5,859
    edited January 2012
    While it can be frustrating dealing with an automotive issue, the Edmunds forums cannot be used to organize legal actions. This includes linking to sites that are organizing such actions. Those posts will be removed. This is a non-negotiable rule of the road in the forums. Thanks in advance for your cooperation on this.

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  • THIS IS PURE INSANITY. THE SETTLEMENT CLEARLY ADMITS DEFECTIVE PARTS, PROBLEMS WITH HONORING WARRANTIES, OUTRAGEOUS EXPENSES INCURRED BY OWNERS, POOR VEHICLE PERFORMANCE AND FUEL ECONOMY, AND A BLATANT DISREGARD BY AMH TOWARDS RECTIFYING THE SITUATION SATISFACTORILY FOR HCH OWNERS FOR 2003 - 2009. tHE SOLUTION IS A $100-$300 REBATE TOWARDS THE PURCHASE OF A NEW HONDA AND A VIDEO TO TEACH US HOW TO DRIVE THE DEFECTIVE VEHICLE!

    1-THE VEHICLE HAS DEFECTIVE PART.
    2-DEFECTIVE PART IS REPLACEABLE WITH COST BETWEEN $2000-$4000.
    3-DEFECTIVE PART HAS BEEN KNOWN TO BE DEFECTIVE BY MANUFACTURER FROM FIRST YEAR OF MANUFACTURE THROUGH FINAL YEAR VEHICLE WAS BUILT - APPROXIMATELY 10 YEARS!
    4-MANUFACTURER HAS BEEN UNABLE TO CORRECTLY AND COMPLETELY ELIMINATE DEFECTIVE PART AND THE EFFECT THE DEFECTIVE PART OR ITS REPLACEMENT PART HAS ON THE PERFORMANCE OF THE VEHICLE.
    5-CONSUMERS HAVE PAID FOR REPAIRS OF DEFECTIVE PART AND BEEN LEFT UNSATISFIED BUT ALSO WITH A VEHICLE THAT DOES NOT PERFORM AS ADVERTISED AND, IN FACT, LOSES PERFORMANCE QUALITY AFTER REPAIR HAS BEEN COMPLETED AT THEIR EXPENSE.
    6-VEHICLES WERE SOLD WITHOUT NEW OWNERS BEING ADVISED OF PROBLEMS WITH NOR WITHOUT BEING SHOWN 'PROPER' WAY TO OPERATE VEHICLE.
    7-WARRANTIES WERE NOT HONORED. AMH HAS BEEN ALL OVER THE MAP WITH THEIR EXTENSIONS, EXCEPTIONS, ADDITIONAL QUALIFIERS, DEALER ARRANGEMENTS.
    AND THE LIST GOES ON, AD NAUSEUM . . .
  • Kirstie_HKirstie_H Posts: 10,830
    Consumer class-action lawsuits continue to thrive largely due to consumers' misguided notion that the resolution will be of real benefit to their situation and that they will, individually, receive adequate compensation if the manufacturer gets a judgment against them. This is rarely the case, and sadly, the proposed settlement in this particular case is pretty typical.

    In many life situations, working together against a common "enemy" is more effective than working alone, but this has not been my observation with consumer class-action lawsuits, particularly against automotive manufacturers. A few bucks thrown toward the consumer, and a $-off coupon toward the purchase of a vehicle made by the SAME manufacturer with whom the consumer is dissatisfied. That seems to benefit the manufacturer! I've seen more effective resolutions reached by consumers who pursue an individual case on their own, whether through extensive complaining & reporting (and working with a good dealership) or by hiring their own legal counsel.

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  • Bravo! Well said.
  • bosslessbossless Posts: 179
    However, if you paid for a battery replacement and your car had less than 92,000 miles, this settlement is beneficial since you can file a claim for reimbursement.
  • Oh please, Bossless. There is NOTHING good about this proposed class-action settlement, unless you are one of the attorneys making $8.5 million. This proposed settlement is an INSULT to every consumer who was ripped off by Honda when they purchased their Hybrid. Here's what to do: 1) Opt out of settlement. 2) Make a "reasonable" reimbursement request to American Honda Corp on some "reasonable" basis (which will of course go unanswered by Honda). 3) Take them to small claims court for reimbursement plus expenses allowed by the court.

    And to the class-action attorneys, go away. Your greed is only surpassed by Honda Corp itself.
  • bosslessbossless Posts: 179
    If the only problem you have had is paying for a battery replacement, and you are getting reimbursed for that, how is that not good in this particular case?
  • A 12 months(12000 miles) extension of the IMA battery is not bad. Full reimbursement of labor and parts if you have paid for the IMA battery replacement out of your own pocket. .
    My battery has started to fail lately, all I want is a replacement. And I'll take the $100 for being displeased with the mileage and $100 for the trouble with the software update, that should cover the cost of the extra fuel expenses.
    Take the money and run.
    I will be selling the HCH as soon as the new battery is installed. I loved the car but Honda can go to hell.
  • I took my 07 with 36K miles in to have the batteries checked since they would no longer stay charged.. I paid to have the engine battery replaced and without hesitation they told me that they would diagnose and replace the hybrid bats. WOW!, is it going to be this easy... (I called the dealer several times about the Hybrid bats right after the original software update, but, they said there was nothing they could do, and that Honda Corp did not care) They replaced the hybrid batteries and did me the favor of doing another software upgrade.

    I now have good Hybrid batteries that stay charged and a new software update that will not use the batteries on hills, under load or anytime where it could help the little engine. Yes! new batteries and new update is even worse MPG around 26 MPG. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

    Note: Had original warranty software upgrade that trashed mileage from 43 MPG to 28 MPG.

    I was hoping that the class action would provide some justice... the mileage is criminal at 26 MPG, the cars poor road performance in pulling into traffic is criminal, the loss in Kelly Blue Book value is criminal... Honda customer care is criminal...

    See you in small claims court Honda!
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