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Houses cost too much!

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    My guess is they bought that place with an idea to split the 40 acres. Subdividing in OR may be tougher than in CA. It is about 5 miles to the ocean. The house needs maintenance. Looks like the borrowed more than it is actually worth. I would not get my wife out there without an ocean view. They can be had for a fraction of what you pay here for good ocean views.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1220-Queen-Anne-Ct-Bandon-OR-97411/2106320297_zpid/
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,857
    It looks like the owner was trying to sell it at $1.9 and then the bank foreclosed. The bank is probably just trying to get out of it what they are owed,

    Besides, the jump in value from $350K to $1.7 million over six months in early 2012 makes no sense. There has to be a mistake somewhere there or whatever bank loaned the money thought there were 4 houses like that on the 40 acre lot.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    I look for those sorts of anomolies. My guess is wishful thinking on the part of the owner. Wanting to catching someone from out of state that may think it is a real buy for that much land. It is a very pretty area of Oregon. Mild climate rarely freezes. Income and real estate taxes are high. No sales tax is nice. This place would be more to my liking for a get away from the city.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/86895-N-Bank-Ln-Bandon-OR-97411/2104535471_zpid/

    Or even this one:

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/52566-Knoll-Rd-Bandon-OR-97411/2106170869_zpid/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    Subdividing in an area with little job growth - I don't know if the lucky retiree market is that big. Also, the PNW coast is lovely in summer, painfully dreary in winter. My dad had a place in Ocean Shores for a few years, eventually he couldn't stand it.

    That other place does have nice views, as it should for the money.
    gagrice said:

    My guess is they bought that place with an idea to split the 40 acres. Subdividing in OR may be tougher than in CA. It is about 5 miles to the ocean. The house needs maintenance. Looks like the borrowed more than it is actually worth. I would not get my wife out there without an ocean view. They can be had for a fraction of what you pay here for good ocean views.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1220-Queen-Anne-Ct-Bandon-OR-97411/2106320297_zpid/

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    Just reading about the building boom in Miami Beach. Most buyer of the condos are just investments like buying stock. And safer than where they live. Even with the potential of rising oceans.

    Simon Mass, a Canadian real estate investor (and longtime friend of Tansey), plans to buy a $23 million slice of land of North Beach and, as soon as the city grants permission, build a 230-unit condo tower. Many buyers, he predicts, will never visit the properties. They might as well be buying stocks on a computer. “Sea level rise,” he said, “is simply not a concern in those cases. That’s why people have insurance.”

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/storyline/wp/2014/12/22/miamis-climate-catch-22-building-luxury-condos-to-pay-for-protection-against-the-rising-sea/
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 50,525
    edited July 2015
    Re @Micheall's house buying comments posted elsewhere"

    >You know, it probably wouldn't hurt to contact the bank where I keep my money .. I'm sure they'd love the >opportunity to make some of it back by loaning me a boatload of it.

    I was surprised; my ultimate "bank" fee was going to be $250 and they waived that when I opened an account with a minimum $1,000 deposit (which was fine since I needed a local bank). The other mortgage company said there was only one place they couldn't compete with in Las Cruces and it's my guy. He's doing the deal for our houseguest and got her qualified the same day we called him and he's come to the house a couple of times to get signatures and paperwork from her. And his kids cat sit for us - what a banker. :D

    Moderator - Buying questions? Please include city or zip code and trim you are shopping, FWD or AWD, etc.

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    This one is for Fintail. Is this going to impact your city at all?

    One suggestion would help followers of Sharia law buy houses. That's virtually impossible now because Sharia law prohibits payment of interest on loans. The 28-member committee recommended the city convene lenders and community leaders to explore options for increasing access to Sharia-compliant loan products.

    http://www.bizjournals.com/seattle/blog/2015/07/seattle-mayor-offers-plan-to-help-followers-of.html
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    edited August 2015
    Luckily, I don't live in the city of Seattle. It's what I call "both pedestrian and vehicle unfriendly", and I find getting around to be annoying. Instead, I live in an eastern suburb with better parking and mildly better roads, where in my zipcode, a third or more of all sales are to offshore cash buyers - just don't ask where the (dirty, embezzled, laundered - I mean earned and bootstrapped, of course) money comes from.

    For that article, I won't comment much. Seattle has chosen some iffy mayors in general, this is more bleeding heart nonsense - all on someone else's dime of course, as is typical for that demographic. The same one that got very lucky in the crazy local housing market.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    As crazy as Seattle is San Francisco always seems to top the nut job cities. Today in San Diego building permits are about $50,000 on new residential. I cannot imagine adding another $24,000 to build a home like my modest ranch.

    The cost of housing in San Francisco and Silicon Valley has been a national news story throughout 2015. On Wednesday, for example, USA Today reported that teachers could no longer afford to live in San Francisco.

    This has prompted hand-wringing from San Franciscans who worry that their city is well on its way to being a global symbol of income inequality. With the average home selling for more than $950,000 and average monthly apartment rent hitting $3,458 this year, with further increases expected in coming months, this fear seems well-founded.

    Residential builders will pay $7.74 a square foot on new projects, with those already approved by the Planning Commission grandfathered in. Non-residential projects will pay $18.04 a square foot, and production, distribution and repair (PDR) buildings will pay $7.61.


    http://calwatchdog.com/2015/08/07/new-fee-push-s-f-housing-costs-even-higher/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    edited August 2015
    I don't know if building permits are the real issue. Something more makes a stapled together house cost 750K++ than 25K in paperwork. Artificially low rates, sketchy outside influences, lucky parental help, lack of land, etc.

    I am educated and have a decent job, yet the idea of owning a detached house near where I work is laughable. I can rent, buy a money pit condo, or have an hour + commute to an old tract house. Nice. I have a friend my age who has scraped together a down payment and wants to buy - 300-350K range. He's losing on bidding wars on 1950s bungalows in areas that can be more than an hour from where he works. I've heard that supply in the once-distant area where my grandmother lives is at 30 days. It's crazy here, surpassing the 2006 bubble.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    fintail said:

    I don't know if building permits are the real issue. Something more makes a stapled together house cost 750K++ than 25K in paperwork. Artificially low rates, sketchy outside influences, lucky parental help, lack of land, etc.

    I am educated and have a decent job, yet the idea of owning a detached house near where I work is laughable. I can rent, buy a money pit condo, or have an hour + commute to an old tract house. Nice. I have a friend my age who has scraped together a down payment and wants to buy - 300-350K range. He's losing on bidding wars on 1950s bungalows in areas that can be more than an hour from where he works. I've heard that supply in the once-distant area where my grandmother lives is at 30 days. It's crazy here, surpassing the 2006 bubble.


    It has passed the 06 bubble here as well. Difference is financing is a lot tougher. A lot more cash buyers. My guess is fear of the stock market bubble has got people pulling cash out and looking for something to invest in. A place close to me just sold to the Iraqi Chaldeans for $800k. It has 3 old houses that were all built before 1940. They are rented, but I would not have paid $500k for the property. I was happy for the lady that sold it as she now lives in NM and was wanting to liquidate. If my place hits $900k I am out of here. Probably just rent somewhere. Keep a little place in Hilo as my primary and spend time in Oregon with the kids.
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    Or even more likely, pulling out of unstable foreign markets and putting it in US property, as this is still one of the best places on the planet, even with all of its faults. And of course, few questions are asked about the origins of money.

    If I was of similar age and had a similar windfall appreciation, I would do the same. Late last year I talked to an older woman, early run boomer, who along with her husband bought a house in 1987 for under 250K. They sold for 2MM. She was more than happy to exclaim she'd be renting for the rest of her life, and not minding it. Lottery jackpot, and this won't last forever.
    gagrice said:



    It has passed the 06 bubble here as well. Difference is financing is a lot tougher. A lot more cash buyers. My guess is fear of the stock market bubble has got people pulling cash out and looking for something to invest in. A place close to me just sold to the Iraqi Chaldeans for $800k. It has 3 old houses that were all built before 1940. They are rented, but I would not have paid $500k for the property. I was happy for the lady that sold it as she now lives in NM and was wanting to liquidate. If my place hits $900k I am out of here. Probably just rent somewhere. Keep a little place in Hilo as my primary and spend time in Oregon with the kids.

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    For Fintail, Interesting article on Seattle and their plans for the future.

    Amidst all the noise over the city’s recently adopted Housing Affordability and Livability Agenda (HALA), scarcely a word has been spared for the 4.35 million Seattleites who have the most to lose in the push to create more housing.

    These are Seattle’s trees, and they’re squarely in development’s sights, whatever lip service developers may pay to them. To take a particularly poetic example: At the corner of South Willow Street and Seward Park Avenue, an enormous cottonwood and a thicket of other broadleafs – nothing fancy, but a lot of green – lined the oversized front yard of a modest older home on a double lot. A developer bought that yard and, through some deft shortplatting magic, turned it into three lots. The trees were replaced with three looming gray and white boxes that look like all the other contemporary lot-busters going up around town. One scraggly, much-thinned ash and a few sidewalk saplings still cling to the remaining dirt perimeter.

    http://crosscut.com/2015/10/saving-seattles-trees-may-mean-saving-their-yards/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    Seattle property development is a mess. It seems you can build pretty much anything if you pay the city enough. Add to that a booming economy and a market filled with offshore investors and mysteriously wealthy newbies (don't ask where the money comes from). putting lots of pressure on new starts, and it's a recipe for chaos. Seattle isn't going to be what it once was, and I can't say that is entirely a good thing. The city becomes addicted to tax and permit proceeds, so the golden rule applies.

    The "affordable housing" movement is also amusing, as little is being built. It is moving along like Vancouver - I can't call it evolution, as that implies progress.
    gagrice said:

    For Fintail, Interesting article on Seattle and their plans for the future.

    Amidst all the noise over the city’s recently adopted Housing Affordability and Livability Agenda (HALA), scarcely a word has been spared for the 4.35 million Seattleites who have the most to lose in the push to create more housing.

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    All that is being built here are apartment buildings. All are accepting the over abundance of section 8 vouchers. Extreme shortage of single family homes. If mine hits a million I am headed to the Southern Coast of Oregon. Mild climate rarely freezes or snows. Lots of cool places with enough land to play on.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/91547-Highway-42-S-Coquille-OR-97423/2101269437_zpid/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    Cool, a Geodesic dome. I liked those when I was a kid. Very 70s-80s, very PNW. I remember there was one like that in the town where I lived as a kid.

    Section 8 isn't an impact in my area, just values rising at something like 10% per year, outside influences in the market, speculation. I know nobody in my age demographic who owns a detached house and didn't receive family help.
    gagrice said:

    All that is being built here are apartment buildings. All are accepting the over abundance of section 8 vouchers. Extreme shortage of single family homes. If mine hits a million I am headed to the Southern Coast of Oregon. Mild climate rarely freezes or snows. Lots of cool places with enough land to play on.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/91547-Highway-42-S-Coquille-OR-97423/2101269437_zpid/


  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    edited November 2015
    One of the seldom-discussed reasons property in most west coast cities is crazy right now

    Crazy world out there. The gold is flowing from other places, too, just don't ask questions.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    Can't really blame the Chinese that have money. At least they will have clean air to breathe while they are here. Though I question their choosing Los Angeles to invest. That city is becoming a giant catchall. I got an acre+ of paradise I would sell them for a million bucks. Nice neighbors and pristine air. No traffic jams even during rush hour. Great produce store less than 2 miles away. One of my neighbors is selling his mini mcmansion for less than the average price the Chinese are paying.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1031-Khish-Ln-Alpine-CA-91901/16905583_zpid/
  • robr2robr2 BostonPosts: 8,857
    gagrice said:

    Can't really blame the Chinese that have money. At least they will have clean air to breathe while they are here. Though I question their choosing Los Angeles to invest. That city is becoming a giant catchall. I got an acre+ of paradise I would sell them for a million bucks. Nice neighbors and pristine air. No traffic jams even during rush hour. Great produce store less than 2 miles away. One of my neighbors is selling his mini mcmansion for less than the average price the Chinese are paying.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1031-Khish-Ln-Alpine-CA-91901/16905583_zpid/

    They don't want that. They want to live in a vibrant urban environment, not a rural area. That they can get an hour outside Shanghai.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 50,525
    I vetoed a home here that had a curved living room (that wasn't the only issue, but I don't like curved walls). And that dome - ugh. Bet it leaks. :p

    Moderator - Buying questions? Please include city or zip code and trim you are shopping, FWD or AWD, etc.

  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    They and other offshore "investors" also want a place to park often questionably obtained funds, something to gain ROI, and a place to flee if and when the axe falls at home - residency can be purchased for a relatively small amount of money, and our lawmaking class likes to turn a blind eye as to how money is obtained. These aren't real Horatio Alger stories at play.

    Regarding the dome, that might be the downfall - 70s-80s residential construction "workmanship" (sarcastic quotes).
    gagrice said:

    Can't really blame the Chinese that have money. At least they will have clean air to breathe while they are here. Though I question their choosing Los Angeles to invest. That city is becoming a giant catchall. I got an acre+ of paradise I would sell them for a million bucks. Nice neighbors and pristine air. No traffic jams even during rush hour. Great produce store less than 2 miles away. One of my neighbors is selling his mini mcmansion for less than the average price the Chinese are paying.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/1031-Khish-Ln-Alpine-CA-91901/16905583_zpid/

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    Regarding the dome, that might be the downfall - 70s-80s residential construction "workmanship" (sarcastic quotes).

    You are correct on homes built in the 1970-80s. Some very shoddy practices. I remember one contractor that got run out of San Diego county, ended up in Anchorage AK. He built a whole string of concrete slab, CA style houses and sold them cheap around 1971-72. By the 1990s they were all torn down as the slabs cracked. 100s of homes here in San Diego built in the 1960s did not have any steel in the slabs. My brother in law had to tear his entire slab out and replace it.

    Here is the place for Stever to get that perfect air his wife needs. It is a bargain. Not to mention Kaiser operates a hospital on the Big Island.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/92-8477-Bougainvillaea-Dr-Ocean-View-HI-96704/2108914655_zpid/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    It's the same in the PNW - I see a lot of 70s and 80s era developments that are looking pretty sad today. Kind of a shame, as I like the style of some building from that era. Many older neighborhoods have fared better. My grandmother's early 60s house seems to have better materials than later ones I've looked at.

    Hawaii would be more of a place to visit than live, for me. The humidity would get to me, and I kind of like things cool.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    edited November 2015
    Humidity is not a problem, but it is warm year round. low of 60 at night, low 80s during the days. Hilo has a constant trade winds of 4-5 MPH. It never gets humid like the Midwest, South or Florida. It can seem confining for some people. Very old Hawaii laid back. You don't want to get in a hurry to get anything done. They have perfected the art of "Manana".
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    Don't think I could deal with it. I'd rather retire to small town western WA/OR or maybe even east of the mountains. Cost of living is still OK in many places, and the climate is good.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    I am looking in that same direction. I don't want snow and cold. Which the further North the more you get. SW Oregon is looking better for many reasons. I think WA is a bit better tax wise for us because of the 9.9% income tax in OR. Maybe suburban Vancouver WA, where you can cross over to shop in Oregon with no sales tax. We paid the state of CA about $17k in taxes last year. With a nice home in Coquille Oregon we would cut our taxes and utility expenses by about $5k per year. This looks good to me.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/94022-Covey-Ln-Coquille-OR-97423/2100672676_zpid/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    As long as you are west of the mountains, snow is seldom an issue. Sure it will be colder in Bellingham than Medford, but real snow is uncommon outside of maybe once or twice a year for a short time. East, places like Spokane or Bend can get dumped on, but they are used to it.

    I've heard they just love transplants from California in Oregon ;)
    gagrice said:

    I am looking in that same direction. I don't want snow and cold. Which the further North the more you get. SW Oregon is looking better for many reasons. I think WA is a bit better tax wise for us because of the 9.9% income tax in OR. Maybe suburban Vancouver WA, where you can cross over to shop in Oregon with no sales tax. We paid the state of CA about $17k in taxes last year. With a nice home in Coquille Oregon we would cut our taxes and utility expenses by about $5k per year. This looks good to me.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/94022-Covey-Ln-Coquille-OR-97423/2100672676_zpid/

  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    I don't think Oregonians like transplants from anywhere. I have spent a quite a bit of time in Medford when my folks lived in the area. Way too hot in the Summer. After following the weather this last Summer up to Salem, I am not sure I would like it. Though it is a short drive to the coast from most anywhere I would want to live. We looked at a couple places up near Salem when we were there in April. I would not go any further North than that. Out around Silverton is very nice. I have several towns on my weather map I follow most days. Two or three inches of snow that melts right off I can live with. Not interested in shoveling my way out of the garage, ever again. We looked at this place in Salem. Way over priced, though it is coming down. The snow picture is kind of a turnoff for me. Unless it was on Christmas morning. Big draw was Kaiser and Costco less than 3 miles away.

    http://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5320-State-St-Salem-OR-97317/80483580_zpid/
  • fintailfintail Posts: 37,528
    That's a very cool house, and the outbuilding looks amazing too. Maybe more square footage and acreage than I would want in retirement. Zillow gives a much lower estimate as I am sure you noticed, so no doubt it will keep coming down.

    There are a lot of hills in the Salem area, maybe that has something to do with it, and it is on the border of the cold Columbia River outflow in winter that can make suburban Portland an icy mess. I wouldn't want to live too close to Portland either - it somehow has a greener friendlier image, but it is just as much of a rat race as Seattle, and becoming just as expensive, too.
  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,482
    Talk about high priced homes. The Feds are getting in on the Chinese wealth. You can buy a Visa for a million bucks.

    The community, described by the builder as “a unique development that will be one of a kind in Corinth,” will certainly be a far cry from the wrinkled jeans-and-cowboy-hat society of Canyon Lake Ranch. Long Lake is a gated and guarded Chinese-themed community marketed in China to ultra-rich Chinese nationals interested in contributing a million dollars to a U.S. government-sponsored visa program as an expedited way to obtain American citizenship, secure an advanced education for their children and diversify their investments outside of China.
    The luxury homes are available for anyone to purchase but are being marketed and sold in China as part of the federal government’s EB-5 visa program.
    “The EB-5 investment is completely separate from the purchase,” says Vivian Tsou, Lelege’s president and chief operation officer, explaining that the million-dollar investment does not guarantee or pay for a home in the Long Lake community.


    http://www.dentonrc.com/local-news/local-news-headlines/20150321-lake-draws-dreams.ece

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/29/business/international/chinese-cash-floods-us-real-estate-market.html?_r=0
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