Chrysler's New Lifetime Drivetrain Warranty

dtownfb

How did Honda and Toyota get into this discussion??? But to answer your question, yes they would (or at least I would). Of course they are increasing sales.

joel0622

No then there would have been a parade down 5th ave touting there great customer service and a bunch of babble about this being just one more reason why they are so great blah, blah, blah, blah.

Then some one here would have said that it does not matter because Hondas never break, blah blah blah

nortsr1

Thank you, joel0622. I wholeheartedly agree with your statement.

Mr_Shiftright

I understand your sentiment but are you looking at the facts here? How can you compare Chrysler to Toyota in terms of success around the world? One company is on its knees and the other is riding high. Why would they both do the same thing anyway?

I swear to you I wouldn't change a word of what I said if Toyota announced a lifetime warranty (not that they ever will)---it's an ill-founded idea in principle, in my opinion, and I don't see it doing any automaker any good in the long run.

What's next? Warranty after death?

hansienna

I bought a NEW 2006 Toyota Sienna LE after owning a 2002 Chrysler T&C LX.

The Toyota Sienna is a BIG, overpriced disappointment. The Sienna is NO better than the less expensive T&C...contrary to the hype touted by too many "self appointed experts". :sick:

The Sienna advantages are overshadowed by the Sienna disadvantages when compared to the T&C.

joel0622

I guess the biggest surprise to me on this is the amount of money they paid out in Global Warranty Claims last year.
Are you ready for this figure

In 2006 Chrysler paid $6.1 Billion in global warranty claims. Now keep in mind that also cover Mercedes and DC's commercial truck unit. But that is still quite a chunk of change. That is also right at $2 billion more then GM or FLM. That is definitely a category you do not want to be #1 in

british_rover

Wonder how much of that was Mercedes. Late model Mercs have been hammered with reliability problems.

Oh and where do you get that data is it in a industry trade paper or something?

jlawrence01

The Sienna is NO better than the less expensive T&C...contrary to the hype touted by too many "self appointed experts".

And one of the executives that I work with is in negotiations with Chrysler on a buy-back of his 2006 T&C that has been in the dealership a minimum of a dozen times on various issues. And the T&C isn't exactly inexpensive - what close to $30k with all the gadgets.

joel0622

It came from Automotive News. That is the best trade publication we get.

The story went on to say:

GM $4.46 Billion

FMC $4.10 Billion

TMC $2.37 Billion

They quote Warranty Weekly as the source

millspd

this is anecdotal, but I have been disappointed with the interior build quality of our two 2005 Sienna CEs in our fleet at work. Interior trims pieces seem to come loose awfully easy.

We also have a 2001 Odyssey in our fleet with over 130K that feels much more solid than the two Toyotas.

Mr_Shiftright

The warranty conditions also state:

""The inspection must be made within 60 days of each 5-year anniversary of the warranty start date of the vehicle. "

So you'd better mark your calendar for October 20th, 2012. Don't be busy that day.

lemonhater

“Perception. They can now say they have the best warranty of any one. Up until this happend that was Hyundai's calling card.”

Not quite. Hyundai has a longer bumper to bumper warranty. Which is more important than power train. Hyundai’s warranty is transferable, which can help resale value. Hyundai is known for being very generous in accepting warranty claims. In fact no other automaker has that rep. Finally Hyundai bills itself as being the best value and being inexpensive. Chrysler does not.

A new car owner that does his or her research is not going to be attracted to this warranty at all. And once they start rejecting claims because someone was 1 day late on getting his power train inspected it will damage their reputation.

As for perception, well Toyota and Honda have the shortest warranty of them all and it does not seem to be affecting them much because they are perceived as the most likely to be trouble free in the first place.

im_brentwood

I think that the Warranty wars are a step in the right direction. Incentives have gotten to the point of insanity, and ultimately don't help to do anything but to devalue the product. A Warranty will serve to build value in the product.. that's a better incentive than a $500 rebate. It also shows confidence in the product, which is a good thing.

hansienna

WHY do the Chrysler bashers come out of the woodwork whenever a new forum discussing Chrysler is started? :shades:

Kirstie_H

Huh, didn't realize they were IN the woodwork in the first place. Look at every manufacturer-focused discussion and you'll find at least one "basher," hombre

1racefan

to get 15 minutes of fame in the media. A longer bumper to bumper warranty (100,000 miles?) would be way more impressive than a "lifetime" powertrane warranty, in my opinion.

I figure that a properly serviced tranny and engine "should" last for a longer time period than I really want to keep a car anyways. At least a really long bumper to bumper warranty would show that the manufacturer was really sure of their product, and willing to put their money where their mouth is, and keep the consumer from getting nickle and dimed.

jlawrence01

WHY do the Chrysler bashers come out of the woodwork whenever a new forum discussing Chrysler is started?

For the record, I have purchased 15-20 Chrysler products over the past five years. During that period, I have discussed the good, teh bad, and the ugly.

joel0622

For the record, I have purchased 15-20 Chrysler products over the past five years. During that period, I have discussed the good, teh bad, and the ugly.

Wow it is true, they don't last very long

Mr_Shiftright

I think only Chrysler itself can hurt Chrysler. I can't recall any car company being brought down by unfounded rumors. Even Audi survived the most vicious media campaign against it without credible evidence presented. Where there is smoke, there's a fire in the auto industry, you can be sure.

As for Hyundai, not only did they offer a better warranty, they went ahead and offered a much better car along with it.

m6vx

I think only Chrysler itself can hurt Chrysler.

I disagree.

I think only Nardelli (or Cerberus) can hurt Chrysler.

Mr_Shiftright

Well okay, only the new Chrysler "family" can hurt Chrysler.

dtownfb

Agreed. but Chrysler is only offering this limited Lifetime Warranty until Sept. 3rd (as stated on their radio commercials) which validates that they are simply trying to move cars. If they wanted to show confidence, make it retroactive for all 2007 vehicles and continue through 2008. Right now it is simply a marketing trick.

british_rover

Ahh I didn't know that fact. It does make it sound like just another version of the Employee pricing sale with that time limit thrown in.

dtownfb

I caught this last week and forgot to include it in my original post. I'm assuming that like all "incentives" this can be extended....if they continue to feel confident about their cars or don't reach their sales numbers.

hansienna

How many of the 15-20 Chryslers were purchased using your own money for your personal use. :shades:

im_brentwood

Oh, I agree that it's a marketing ploy, but IMO, it's better than throwing another $2k at the inventory. Will most people need it or use it? Of course not, but it's a hell of a marketing tool.

I am ALL for incentives, but throwing money at the problem does not help.

Here's an example, if you want to retrofit Navigation in a Chrysler or Jeep, it takes about 30 minutes to install it (Lucky.. I just retrofitted it to my 740iL.. big job!) and the parts list around $1600.

Why not throw in free Navigation and 3 years free maintinence instead of throwing a $2,500 rebate at the cars... this way, you're increasing the value of the product instead of decreasing the value of the product.

joel0622

Not saying they will, but if they do it like Ford did when we went to the 5yr/60 PT last summer it will start out as an incentive on the reamining 2007's and just be standard on the 2008 models, then when the incentive ends they will extend it on the 2007's to the end of the model year.

dtownfb

I completely agree. The entire rebate/incentives have also helped in the negative perception of the domestics. It's like they are admitting that their cars are not worth the price tag so we'll reduce it by $xxxx.

Like I said, this Lifetime Warranty is not a bad thing, just not as great as Chrysler wants us to believe. Plus I still have to pick a car out of their lousy lineup.

hansienna

Has your opinion of Honda gone down after their annoying Mr Opportunity and "Honda Days" commercials started? Has your opinion of Toyota gone down with the BIG cash incentives to buy a Toyota? :confuse:

british_rover

Why not throw in free Navigation and 3 years free maintinence instead of throwing a $2,500 rebate at the cars... this way, you're increasing the value of the product instead of decreasing the value of the product.

and the dealers like that because it brings people back to the dealership for service work where they are fleeing in droves. Just don't include brakes in the 3 year maintenance package so the dealers can up sell that during the last free service.

joel0622

Not at all. I dislike them as much today as I did 15 years ago

dweezil

It is not offered only until Sept. 3rd. That may be the cut off to get the discounted Lifetime Coverage for any new 06-07 purchased before the 'Lifetime" warranty coverage was offered. This from the Chrysler site:
"For 60 days this plan will be offered at a great value to you if you own a 2006 and 2007 MY Chrysler Jeep or dodge vehicle with the basic 3/36 warranty coverage"

This, also, from the Chrysler Lifetime Powertrain Warranty Customers Q&A site:

Q13: "How long will this new Chrysler Lifetime Powertrain Warranty be offered on Chrysler vehicles?"
A13: "At this time we plan to continue this warranty program through the 2008 MY."

A little more than a marketing ploy.

But consider: 70% of the new Sebring production has been for the rental fleets [according to a report in The Car Connection].How much of Chrysler's total production is for fleet?

Of those cars sold to retail customers, how long does the average retail new car buyer keep his or her car ? How many keep them for 7-25 years ? On the average, I would suspect that the overall exposure Chrysler will have on this warranty will be very very small.

Rentals aren't covered, 2nd owners aren't covered, diesels, Sprinters, SRT, police, taxi, postal ambulance or government vehicles are not covered. Dodge Ram Cab/Chassis and Dodge Sprinter diesel have a 5 year 100,000 mile warranty. Jeep Liberty Diesel 3/36.

Lots of unnecessary handwringing about this. It is both less and more. Chrysler won't have too much to lose in this, yet they're getting great PR and sort of announcing they don't need daimler to stand on their own. They have very little to lose in this.They may have a problem with those 06s that have been parked for the past year or so and meet the criteria for the warrnty by being sold after the warranty started in late July 07.

Anyone who can't get their car in within 60 days of it's 5 year inspection and misses it by "one day", deserves to be denied any lifetime warranty coverage.

That isn't much to ask other than keeping up with maintenance.If you are that clueless you have probably missed other vital scheduled maintenance anyway and Chrysler shouldn't be held liable in that instance anyway.

If someone doesn't like getting the rebates and think they "devalue" their car, then give it back or don't take it. Or pay list price and stop all the haggling.

Still: I like the idea of it. I've kept my 63 Valiant for the past 25 years.I've had my other cars for a minimum of 5-8 [one was destroyed in a wreck]years and tend to keep them longer that the general public. But again, I am in the minority of those who keep their cars for 5 years or more.

It's moderately appealing, but not a big motivator to buy a Chrysler product.They have too much unproven "new tech" out there to say how reliable they will be in 5 years: ["World Engine", CVT, reworked 2.7 V6].
But if you plan on keeping your Dodge Caliber for 10 years, it would be a good thing to have.

Mr_Shiftright

Don't you see a lot of hedging in Chrysler's wording of the future of this program? I sure do, and it's there for good reason---basically, if it doesn't produce a lot more sales they will kill it pronto because it could end up costing a lot.

I don't think anyone argues that this program won't benefit SOME people. But like so many "incentives" and "rebates" and "special leases", if you sit down and think them through and compare to other strategies, they really aren't the good deals they seem to be.

But, if the program is free and if it makes you feel better about buying a Chrysler, I guess I could say "What's the harm in trying?"

For me personally, I'd wait it out a year or two and see how Chrysler is faring as a company and how their reliability ratings improve/de-prove.

So my question is, I guess: "Does it matter to the consumer if the warranty is for eternity if the product isn't any good?"

hansienna

Apparently Honda and Toyota don't think their products are as good as Kia, Hyundai, Suzuki, GM, and Chrysler because they don't offer warranties as long as these 5 do. :shades:

dtownfb

No, Honda has been running these commercials during the same time each year for a while now. I pretty much ignore most car commercials. I have this rare ability to think for myself and make my own decisions based on research, my needs (not wants) and my budget. Commercials and marketing ploys are wasted on me.

Regarding cash incentives on Toyota...Sorry BIG cash incentives: it will only reduce their resale value. The issue is Toyota resale value is already high and they are not dealing with the same issues as Chrysler. Toyota is offering these incentives on cars that are selling slow pickups and SUVs. All manufacturers are having this problem. When I see $3000 off on a Camry or Corolla then I will change my mind about Toyota (and be in line to buy one).

Mr_Shiftright

Sad thing is, Honda and Toyota could probably LOWER their warranties and sell the same number of cars.

joel0622

Sad thing is, Honda and Toyota could probably LOWER their warranties and sell the same number of cars.

Oh Puleeze

jipster

Lower their warranties to what?

Bad PR would hurt sales.

dtownfb

You lost me on this one Shifty....

Mr_Shiftright

I'm quite serious. I honestly believe that their reputation is so solid that people wouldn't worry if the warranty dropped to say 2/24.

I'm not saying they SHOULD do that, but they could get away with it.

My point was (aside from being too flakey and obscure for anyone but me to get ) that the length of the warranty will not make or break a car in the public eye.

My opinion is that it has a lot less effect on sales than people think it does, at least "these days". Way back when it might have been dramatic, but now it's oh well 5 years, 7 years, 10 years, forever....whatever....I'm not keeping the damn thing that long anyway.

You know, if Toyota had offered me $1,000 cash back and NO warranty, I think I would have taken it. I never used the warranty even once. OH wait...they fixed a rattle....well I fixed it while waiting for them to fix it...

joel0622

I am pretty sure a large % of America would disagree with you. The risk vs reward to give up your warranty for $1000 weighs heavily to the risk side. There captive would see a spike in slow pay/repo's to due to the fact that allot of people can't afford to fix a car and make payments on it at the same time. If they have to make a choice they will choose fixing it

jipster

I am sure a large % of America would disagree with you.

Sure they would. The "minimally" accepted warranty among the public is 3 years/36 months. Going down to 2/24, while everyone else is going up, would send the message they are losing confidence in their product.

Mr_Shiftright

Oh I think if Honda and Toyota *simultaneously* dropped their warranty to 2/24 (which of course they would never do), that Americans would still buy their cars in equal numbers. What alternatives do consumers have who are already solid in the Japanese brand equity arena? Do you think they'd all switch to Nissan? I don't. And VW doesn't look all that attractive once you've gotten used to Japanese reliability.

Again, my point for this unlikely scenario was to suggest that warranty extensions (and possibly reductions) don't necessarily translate into greater or lesser sales.

It was strictly a hypothetical thought exercise. No company would actually do this. Sometimes you can try to test something by testing the reverse premise.

benderofbows

I had already decided to buy my Accord, and was sitting in the office signing the paperwork when I noticed that it had a standard powertrain warranty out to 5yr / 60k miles. I was pleasantly surprised, as I thought it was just the regular 3/36 bumper-to-bumper, and would have bought it anyway... The poor finance guy, he was having a tough time trying to sell me an extended warranty even before I saw the extended powertrain coverage.

Mr_Shiftright

The "Magic Number" I'd like to get is how much each automaker spends on each model for warranty claims. Lots of luck. I bet that's as secret as the Coca-Cola formula.

grbeck

The problem with that measurement is that an automaker could be penalized for going the extra mile.

If one company agrees to fix a recurring problem even for customers out of warranty, it will spend more than a company that sticks strictly to the terms of the warranty and denies lots of claims.

The first company is doing right by customers, but it will look worse if the measurement is warranty costs per model.

british_rover

We tried to figure that out one time by dividing the number of cars we sold by the amount of money paid by land rover for warranty claims per model.

The numbers were all messy so we kind of gave up.

Mr_Shiftright

Oh, yeah, that's a good point. Still, I've never known an automaker to be what you would call "generous" with warranty claims. Their cost-controls are pretty rigid.

nortsr1

"it has a lot less effect on sales than people think it does"...."that is your opinion"...

My opinion is that most people buy Hyundais and Kias BECAUSE of the "longer warranty"....and of course the "price"!!!!!

Mr_Shiftright

Toyotas and Hondas cost MORE than Hyundais and Kias, have smaller warranties, and still outsell them readily, right?

So I'm not buyin' your argument there. I think it's a combo of warranty + price + (in Hyundai's case) improved product.

I'm not sure why people buy Kias at all...I never really thought about it.