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2009 Honda Civic

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Comments

  • rv65rv65 Posts: 1,074
    Should see some modest changes exterior wise. Nothing too major. No diesel though.
  • diane20diane20 Posts: 4
    How do you know the will add Stability control on all trims? Do you think they will add power driver seats anytime soon?
  • diane20diane20 Posts: 4
    Hi Shipo,

    On the 2008 EX coupe, what is the effect of exchanging the 16" tires for 17" tires? Will it affect ride comfort/noise and/or fuel economy?
  • sparklandsparkland Posts: 108
    Stability control is mandated by the Feds I believe in the model year 2010, so Honda is just jumping the gun a little to get all the bases covered.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Will it affect the ride? Yes, a little, the ride will be a tad bumpier.

    Will it affect the noise? That should depend more on the tires and the tread pattern than the wheel diameter.

    Will it affect the comfort? That depends on whether you call a smooth ride comfortable or a ride where you can feel more of the road comfortable.

    Will it affect the fuel economy? Ummm, probably not, errr, unless you move to a much wider tire.

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Will it affect the fuel economy? Ummm, probably not, errr, unless you move to a much wider tire.

    A larger diameter wheel/tire will always use more fuel, I believe. They require more power to get moving (think of a bicycle in low gear vs. high gear). It'll also slow you down slightly. Just moving up one size shouldn't be too big of a deal, but I'd never go past 18" on any car, since I don't want the rough ride and expensive replacement costs.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Uhhh, are you serious? :confuse:

    Changing the size of the rim should have an extremely nominal effect on mileage or speed or distance traveled per revolution. Consider the following wheel/tire combinations that come from the factory on various Civics:

    Wheel ---- OEM Tire ---- Diameter
    15x6.5 -- 195/65 R15 -- 24.98031"
    16x7.0 -- 205/55 R16 -- 24.87795"
    17x7.5 -- 215/45 R17 -- 24.61811"

    Okay, so maybe my math is hosed up, but I'm only seeing about 0.37" difference on the overall diameter between the largest diameter tire (interestingly enough on the smallest wheel) and the smallest diameter tire (mounted on the largest wheel).

    Thoughts?

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    I wasn't talking about changing the tire profile, just the diameter of the wheel and tire as a whole. As you lower the sidewall profile, you correct the difference in this case. A tire with the same sidewall and a larger wheel would be obviously much more different than the numbers you provided.

    When the poster said moving up to 17", they didn't say what sidewall profile size (55, 50, 45, 40, etc).

    Your math is probably right (I'm not checkin' behind ya) ;).

    I hope you see the point of my post now. :) Notice I said "A larger diameter wheel/tire will always use more fuel, I believe" and didn't just say bigger rim.
    My point was to simply state that larger diamter tire = increased fuel use.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Ummm, nope, not buying. First off, nothing in what the OP asked implied that they were intending on changing the diameter of the tire, and unless otherwise stated, I believe that the OP should be given the benefit of doubt.

    As for your assertion that a larger diameter tire will always use more fuel, nope, not buying that one either. In fact, an argument could be made for such a change causing fuel consumption to go down. How?

    1) Your argument suggesting that it take more power to launch the vehicle doesn't wash because torque converters and clutches take up the slack, and as such, the engine really won't know the difference.
    2) Once rolling, and once the clutch(es) is/are engaged the vehicle travels further per revolution of the engine regardless of which gear the transmission is in. To a certain extent, the lower the final drive ratio, the better the fuel economy, and by putting larger diameter tires on any given car you are effectively shortening the final drive ratio.

    In the end, even if the OP was to have moved from say the OEM 205/55 R16 tires to say a 205/55 R17 (of which I can only find six tires in this size on the market), the revolutions per mile would have only dropped from 832 with the 16" set to 805 with the 17" set (roughly a 3.5% change).

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Your argument suggesting that it take more power to launch the vehicle doesn't wash because torque converters and clutches take up the slack, and as such, the engine really won't know the difference.

    It takes more energy to get a larger diameter wheel rolling. I'm not sure where the engine will get the extra energy except from fuel.

    The Civic already has a very tall gear ratio (less than 2000 rpm at 60 mph); some would say too tall for a car with such meager torque. Want to go from 60-70 MPH sometime TODAY, well you can count on the RPMs climbing. On the highway, the Civic will be doing more unlocking of the torque converter to maintain speed, if not downshifting altogether. There's a point of maximum fuel economy, and I'd wager to bet the designers of the Civic have done enough research to find it.

    That being said, in theory, you are absolutely right about the larger wheel making the ratio taller. It also makes getting off the line negligibly harder.

    I never said anything about the difference being big, to be fair.

    Anyway, I stand by my comments, and you stand by yours. Since this has nothing to do with the arrival or features of the 2009 Civic, shall we move on?
  • raychuang00raychuang00 Posts: 541
    I do think the 2009 Civic will get these changes:

    1) Minor tweaks to the R18 engine to possibly increase horsepower slightly (maybe to 143 from 140 now) or widen the torque curve. We may see some minor changes to improve fuel economy, too.

    2) Some minor changes to the center front dash, but the main instrument panel design used now will be retained.

    3) An optional new car stereo with the ability to control iPods that use the iPod Data Connector.

    4) A switch to the same headlamps and taillamps used on the JDM Civic sedan.

    It will be very interesting to see what kind of automatic they'll use on the 2009 Civics. Since the 5AT unit is starting to get old in design, we can't dismiss the possibility of a new 6AT unit for improved acceleration and better highway fuel economy.
  • thegraduatethegraduate Posts: 9,731
    Since the 5AT unit is starting to get old in design, we can't dismiss the possibility of a new 6AT unit for improved acceleration and better highway fuel economy.

    Yes, I think we can. I'd bet my house on the fact that Honda will put a 6-speed (or any upgraded transmission) in an Acura, or even the Accord, before the low-priced Civic.
  • backybacky Twin CitiesPosts: 18,682
    Old design? The Civic is one of the few compact cars to offer a 5AT at all. I really don't see Honda putting money into the Civic's transmission until the next generation at the earliest. They're already out in front of the competition there.

    Also, what is the source of your information on the 2009 Civic?
  • raychuang00raychuang00 Posts: 541
    A number of Honda-oriented web sites have said that there will be some changes to the mid-model change (MMC) Civic. The most obvious change will probably be switching to the larger headlights used on the JDM/Asian market Civic models, and another change could be a revised center front dash (just like what Honda did with the 1996-2000 model Civic).

    Tweaking the R18 engine is also possible, though unlikely. And the more I think about it, I do think Honda may not replace the 5AT unit during the MMC until the next full-model change (FMC) in 2010 for the 2011 model year.
  • sandman46sandman46 Posts: 1,798
    Look for the current design to be possibly flipped while keeping the same sized dimensions. Honda has done this numerous times before during their mid cycle freshening. Agree that the headlamps will also be swapped for a slightly different design. Cosmetic changes are usually done with the refresh, as that's really all that's needed. Any major tweaks will come with the next generation Civic.

    The Sandman :)
  • vegan64vegan64 Posts: 1
    how is the civic on snow and ice ? My 02 toyota
    rav-4 2wd slides all over the road. Is the civic
    much better ? i'm thinking of getting the 09 civic
  • jcanaverajcanavera Posts: 11
    I won't drive it if the snow gets high enough that they get the plows out. That front end is so low, and with all the plastic, I can see the chunks of ice that the plows push aside breaking some of that trim. I take out the CRV instead.

    Jack
  • Is there any risk (based on any historical patterns or otherwise) that Honda will stop offering the EX-L 4 door in the Leather with Manual combination? This seems to be a somewhat hard mix to come by. If you throw in Navi, it's been my experiace that it's impossible to find. Maybe it's just too late in the MY.
  • shiposhipo Posts: 9,152
    Interestingly enough, the only EX-L 5-Speed that I've seen at any dealer around here was one with Nav as well. Go figure. ;)

    Best Regards,
    Shipo
  • will26will26 Posts: 62
    Get it! I have an 07 EX and drove it all last winter in Wisconsin. It was the 10th snowiest year on record (so the weatherman said) and the car handled great. I've never had an issue with hitting ice chunks. On a side note I just got 37 mpg!
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