Honda Accord VCM

houdini1

I thought the v6 accord coupe did not have vcm.

bug4

I think your concerns are right on the money! Personally, I'm not convinced the VCM system is good for people who drive their cars well past 100k. Perhaps I'm naive, but the words "active engine mounts" scared me right away from a v6 the first time I looked at these cars.

[Of course, you might want to read some of my comments about my 08 I4 in the 6 vs. 4 thread before going out and buying a 4 cyl. Accord. IMHO, the I4 is underpowered for such a large vehicle. I would not buy the I4 with automatic transmission again.]

imidazol97

There is humor to the Kentucky fen-phen case and $200 million settlement. The attorneys tried to take $130 million instead of $67 million. They had even brought in Stan Chesley, king of class action, and paid him $20 million then there's some dispute about that. He's testifying against the other attorneys, and had claimed he didn't know what "the fifth" was when asked by someone if he planned to invoke it. One of the attorneys said they deserved $170 of the $200 million because the injured parties didn't really have much damage! That's a real interest in your clients' well-being. :confuse:

Somehow there's humor to Chesley who holds fundraisers for Clintons, along with his judge wife, having to testify against other class action money-suckers. He is the King--look him up.

Marsh7 obviously shows show realism in the amounts he would accept in a rich class action settlement. AFter all it is meant to reimburse the victims.

As for VCM, forget it. I believe in one class action suit against a technical company, computer-related, my settlement was like under $8 and I had to send in proof!!!

cstiles

The automatic V6 coupe has VCM, the 6speed does not.

marsha7

"One of the attorneys said they deserved $170 of the $200 million because the injured parties didn't really have much damage!", then why were they awarded anything over $1.00 (that's One Dollar) in damages...

$170 out of 200 is an 85% fee...kinda high, I would think, altho all expenses should be reimbursed and not part of the fee...

dmer

Thanks for that info. My 95 Legend has a 200HP V6 and it's close to being underpowered for the car and it's weight. That is what has been driving my interest in a V6 Accord. A virtue of older American V8's was effortless driving without a high revving engine. I had a 1971 Vovlvo 144 with an automatic and it got worse mileage than my dad's '71 Impala with a 350 V8.

As much as I like the car overall, it strikes me that the VCM could be a detriment to long term ownership.

ljgbjg

Regrettably, if your measuring standard is the Legend, you have a VERY high bar for the competition to match. IMHO the 1st generation came close to perfection in a 4 door sedan - such a low roofline (could never find it in a parking lot - always hidden by other cars) low cowl, almost perfect power/weight ratio (161 HP V6 - Right - not even close - that car would fly ( 80 -100 acceleration was very impressive) double wishbone rear suspension, the only car that our 6'4" and 6'5" sons could put the driver's seat back far enough that they could drive comfortably, a steering wheel with 4 horn buttons - 2 conveniently right where your thumbs fell in the 10 -2 driving position - never at a loss where the horn was. Generation II built on that with its Type II 230 HP engine in the GS Sedan and the Coupes, with added luxury. 200K + is not at all out of the ordinary on these cars. We had 168,000 and 171,000 on our two Gen I Legends when sold with not one engine or transmission problem ever.

The '08 Accord V6 - well, 268 HP but the auto is down on mid range torque versus the 6 MT, and check the power/weight ratio - 3600 pounds/268 is not a lot, if at all, any better than the 2007 V6 with 3200/240. And I too am concerned about the long term reliability of such a complex engine management system comprised of computers, cylinder shut down, Active Engine Mounts, etc. The Acuras were pictures of simplicity by comparison.

Good luck finding a modern day equivalent of the Legend in a current sports sedan.
The TL is nice but IMHO, the ones I have driven, lack the solid feel of a Legend.

thegraduate

A 4-cylinder, low-end model without moonroof, power seats, etc. 2007 Accord was 3200 lbs (LX-SE with Automatic was 3,188lbs); an EX-V6 weighed more, closer to 3,400 lbs.

Technically, the 2008 has a better power to weight rating than the outgoing model.

2008 EXL-V6 Sedan: 3600lbs/268hp, 248lb-ft = 13.43 lbs per hp, 14.51 lbs per lb-ft

2007 EXL-V6 Sedan: 3400lbs/244hp, 212lb-ft = 13.94 lbs per hp, 16.04 lbs per lb-ft

Acceleration reports indicate that the new Accord is no faster than the old smaller model, however, as ljg said. Hope you don't mind, I had a technical itch to scratch, so I put it here.

The Acura Legend the previous poster mentions has a power to weight ratio very similar to the current I4 Accord.

Legend LS: 3516lbs/200hp**, 210lb-ft = 17.58 lbs per hp**, 16.74 lbs per lb-ft
Accord EX: 3408lbs/190hp, 162lb-ft = 17.93 lbs per hp, 21.04 lbs per lb-ft

**These numbers are derived from the old SAE test procedures; new numbers would likely be between 5-10hp lower.

The Legend had a 4-speed automatic, so the 5-speed automatic in the Accord would help compensate somewhat for the difference.

Interestingly, my old 1996 Accord has a better torque/weight ratio than the 2008 EX Accord. After driving them both back to back, I believe it. My old Accord only has 130hp and 139 lb-ft, so it runs out of steam at high speeds where the new Accord doesn't, but it feels just as quick off the line, and that includes the difference in a 4-speed transmission and a 5-speed transmission.

ljgbjg

Good post graduate. My son's 2007 V6 actually weights 3276 on his registration.

As for the Acura - I would have to say based on my experiences driving both Generation 1 with 161 HP and a Gen II Coupe with 230 HP that those engines were WAY under rated. Gen I had GREAT mid range torque and acceleration in the 75-100 range amazing. It would do 135 - and you don't pull that box of a sedan 135 without more serious power than 161HP unless they are Clydesdales - you would be HP limited.

The Gen II 6 speed Type II engine Coupe would do 0-60 in 6.5 seconds and would top out at 155 governed. 3rd gear acceleration on the 6 speed was fantastic.

Rumor was for years that Honda engines were underrated. I know the dyno tests on the S2000 have proven that for that engine. Trying to duplicate the 1995 Legend "experience" is going to be difficult for him.

pat

thegraduate

Good post graduate. My son's 2007 V6 actually weights 3276 on his registration.

Hmm. Maybe that doesn't include full capacities of fluids (oil, coolant, fuel). I dunno. Now I want to look on mine and see if it has it.

Neat info about the Legend (ya know, the 1995-1997 Accords used a version of the 2.7L from the Legend, but was rated 170hp).

Back to VCM.

ljgbjg

Sorry Pat - guess discussion of the VCM invariably gets us off to comparing the new V6 to those with which we have all had previous experience.

graduate - yes, interestingly I had both and, in all honesty, preferred the performance in the Legend. For some intangible reason the Legend seemed peppier. When I sold the '97 V6 a prospective purchaser commented when driving it - "This is a V6? I thought it would have more power." Got me. :confuse:

Back to VCM

thegraduate

If we disregard the Legend, that makes sense. The old 2.7L V6 Accord has essentially the same power as my 2.4L I4 Accord (2006 model), yet is saddled with a 4-speed automatic versus my 5-speed automatic.

I'm not sure where this specific conversation should go! Suggestions, pat?

dmer

I bought an 86 Legend new and for the first 12 years I had it, I lived in Chicago where eventually, it took on a lot of rust. I took the car with me to California and bought a used 90 Legend as a "back-up". Unfortunately, on a return trip to Chicago in my 86, the trans failed at 180K and because of the body condition, I decided to get rid of it. Besides, I had my 1990. The 1990 was an original California car with a flawless body. Unfortunately, that car got rear-ended and the threshold for declaring a complete loss was met very easily. Presently, I have the 1995.

Those 3 cars have amazed me with their performance and durability. I prefer the way the 1st gen looks to the 2nd, but that's a matter of taste. The 95 is like the other 2 on the highway, a superb high speed cruiser.

When I bought the 1986 in Orland Park, the sticker was about $22K. The sticker on the 95 was $39K, both a lot in today's $'s. Looking at the price of the Accord V6 along with equipment, it's an inflation adjusted bargain, but it may well be unrealistic to compare it to any of the Legend sedans.

Perhaps I'll look at a later model RL, but they don't excel in the fuel economy department.

Thanks again!

auld_dawg

**Thanks for the feedback. Do you know if Honda plans to continue with the present system, or drop it? Also, what's the supposed mileage advantage of VCM over standard operation?**

I'm not sure there is an advantage in mpg. I think there's supposed to be, but the "real world" mpg's posted here and on the other midsize sedan forums has me kind of thinking that the engineering effort, and money spent on it, could have been better spent........

Looking over the "Real World" mileage stuff here, it looks like the earlier, 2003 to 2007 Honda Accords {the V6 ones} get better mileage on average than the 2008s. In fact, I think the case could be made that the 2003 to 2007 model years could be considered the peak in Accord design.......

Looking over the Camry and Sonata "Real World MPG" threads, it looks like a case could be made, that on average, the Camry is at least as good {V6 vs V6}, and the Sonata noticeably better. Neither Camry or Sonata use any "tricks" like VCM to get the job done. Neither car is an exception light weigh in the class either, I think Camry is pretty close to the weight of the Accord, and the Sonata, which is about 4 inches shorter {total length}, still weighs 3540lbs.

In the "good old days", neither Camry or Sonata would be able to outshine the Accord in any performance category.........

I think that Honda would be miles ahead to drop VCM, and spend the r&d money where it'll do more good. Where they've gone with this, sure reminds me where GM and Ford went in the mid 90s.........

pat

The general Accord 08 discussion would be better than here.

ljgbjg

You have to figure that if you consider those cars in today's dollars, they would not be in the same class as the Accord - and they are not. Is the Accord a relative bargain in today's market? Yes, I think so, and the VCM is working for me now - at first I was among those with problems. But is it of the same caliber as your Legend. I would say no - let's face it the Legend was built and sold as a luxury car with high end quality and materials.

Don't discouraged about the Accord - it is a great car for the money and as an every day middle America family car. No matter how much leather etc. you put on it, it is not a luxury class car. In this case you cannot make a silk purse out of a sow's ear..

ljgbjg

"has me kind of thinking that the engineering effort, and money spent on it, could have been better spent....."

I agree - a simple 6 speed automotic transmission with a taller overdrive would have given as much of an increase in mileage if not more without complicating the engine and the need for AEMs.

ljgbjg

Last comment on the 2.7 V6 in the legend vs the Accord - Gen I Legends had a dual range transmission - you could shift into "Sport" that changed the gearing to more aggressive gearing for acceleration and harsher shifting. This too I believe lent to the 2.7 being peppier in the Legend than the Accord.

cstiles

Only indirectly related to VCM, but an interesting quick take on Honda and its fundamental corporate culture that focuses on fuel economy.

http://money.cnn.com/2008/06/10/news/companies/taylor_honda.fortune/index.htm

Although the company has yet to even offer a V8 in the general marketplace, it's also interesting to see Honda's leadership and niche within Indy Car racing.

And the next NSX will have a V10 and all wheel drive. But probably no VCM.

thegraduate

I'm going to reply to this in the 2008 Honda Accord general forum. Follow me there!

My reply is posted here.

cstiles

Honda recently announced that it will introduce VCM with its motorcycles starting in 2010.

http://www.autobloggreen.com/2008/05/28/honda-motorcycles-to-get-variable-cylind- - er-management-and-more/

jusvisitn

In motorcycles around 2 to 4 cylinders and maybe not as complicated as 6 cylinder vehicle VCMs?
Honda Motorcycle cylinder deactivation 2006 prototype

Honda Accord VCM seems to be a somewhat complex technology in which all components must be working flawlessly & must be accurately tuned so everything works perfectly in unison. If something is just slightly off, then symptoms start appearing? To me, it's perhaps too 'high maintenance'. As other's have commented, it could have been accomplished some other way. Other car makers have taken a less complex approach, even though they also depend on technology but not to the degree Honda has with their VCM. Perhaps, once they committed to this 3 mode cylinder de-actvation scheme, there was no turning back. Maybe a transitional technology until Honda figures out something else?

Also, I am not sure, but I believe the VCM makes some contribution to it's 'Partial Zero Emissions (PZEV1) rating':
"AT-PZEV (Advanced Technology-Partial Zero Emissions Vehicle) is an emissions standard created by the California Air Resources Board"
It's stated in their VCM engine specs/description. So, VCM maybe not that beneficial with contributing to mileage savings, but more an impact on emissions output.

Another thing not mentioned too much is, Honda's advertisement/promotion that I see here in Calif.. All very strong Eco-green spin. So when you go to a Honda dealer, part of the sales campaign is that you are buying the car for a 'Cause' and therefore, any noticeable non-seamless symptoms, one can overlook because it's for the 'big picture' of World Green. IMO, I believe the on & off green light is part of it, sort of like a placebo effect. Sounds far fetched? I'm seeing a number of consumer products doing the 'green' spin thing.

All that being said, in spite of the rough ride or other symptoms that could be caused by Honda's VCM technology, it may be 'reliable' but like I said before, possibly require 'high maintenance' or more servicing to minimize those erratic symptoms.

cstiles

I don't think there's any question that a "green" philosophy helps a company sell it's products. Many of the early adopters who purchased Toyota Priuses and hybrid models were doing it to make a statement about the environment, since the savings at the gas pump rarely paid for the extra MSRP cost of the car.

Today, with fuel prices blasting past $4.00, with little prospect of prices coming down to levels seen just 6-12 months ago, explosive sales of fuel efficient cars are being dictated by pure and simple economics.

Honda obviously believes in VCM, based on the expanding numbers of cars, trucksters, and motorcycles that are receiving the technology. For those contemplating a class action, the odds may improve for proving your case, since Honda is pushing the technology to a larger part of their product offerings. It's no longer just a niche offering for Honda, especially with potentially hundreds of thousands of motorcycles getting it in the years ahead.

Is the system too complex? Is the technology flawed? We'll find out sooner or later. At least the system saves from the cost and weight of installing both an electric and gasoline motor, plus a huge battery pack, to one automobile.

Honda is obviously trying to expand its market share among V6-equipped cars. Their bread and butter for years has been the I4 engine. VCM allows them to differentiate its offerings with the more upper-scale, near-luxury, V6 customer. (Just curious, is the technology feasible or practical with a 4 cylinder engine? Shutting down 25% or 50% of the cylinders on a Civic or I4 Accord while cruising at higher speeds?)

The benefits of VCM are also skewed toward highway driving. With most hybrids, MPG is better in town than it is on the highway. The stronger business case for the traditional hybrid car is that it excels in urban driving settings. The benefits of VCM come to light while cruising on the highway, where shutting down a bank of cylinders can improve mileage by 10-20%. For much of the USA, where there are open roads, VCM makes a lot of sense on paper.

Provided the technology is not flawed.

Finally, for those still considering class action against Honda as an option, last Friday, Richard Scruggs, the king of class actions with huge victories over big tobacco, asbestos, and recent shots at the insurance industry post-Hurricane Katrina, was sentenced to 5 years in prison for attempting to bribe a judge. I suppose there is a seamy side to class action litigation also....

pat

Well... it sounds like there is a seamy side to that particular individual, but I'm not sure how that can be applied across the board to class action litigation in general.

In any case, let's not get off on the class action litigation tangent again. We already did that.

auld_dawg

**Provided the technology is not flawed**

Kind of my thought on this...... Since the question of whether VCM actually has any mileage benefit at all came up on the MPG thread, it would appear that it doesn't. It almost appears to me that it hurts fuel economy, at least on the six.

Someone mentioned that maybe it helps the emission case. Maybe that's the key to this...........

cstiles

Lower fuel consumption based on cylinder shutoff should logically result in improved MPG and reduced emissions. But granted, the question is how much improvement? Especially when it has been established that the 2008 Accord gets slightly worse fuel economy compared to the previous generation (smaller and lighter) Accord.

How do people conclude that VCM *hurts* fuel economy, assuming all else being equal and the same driving style?

elroy5

I don't think it's fair to compare the 08 VCM Accord's mileage to the previous generation V6, and expect it to be better. The 08 is bigger, heavier, and has a larger engine. So if the 08 can achieve close to the same mileage as the 07 V6, VCM must be doing something.

auld_dawg

On the other hand, the Mazda 6 has grown about as much {if not more} for 09, had the engine grow from 3L to 3.7L, and the 09 has better fuel economy than the 08. No VCM..........

This is just my opinion, but if the Camry, which also has a 3.5L V6, and whose weight is close to the Accord, can equal or better the mileage of the Accord VCM, then maybe the VCM isn't helping the Accord. If the real world mileage of the 08 and 09 Sonata V6 is equal to or better than the 08 V6 Accord, then how can VCM be doing its job as far as mileage goes?

I remember in the mid-90s when cylinder deactivation was discussed, the mileage improvement gains were apparently going to be about 30% when used {as in highway mileage}.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if the VCM was doing that, wouldn't the real world freeway mileage be closer to 40mpg, than what we're seeing today? How many of the 08 folks claim more than 30 mpg with their V6 Accords? How many 03 thru 07 V6 Accord owners claimed more than 30mpg? {like most of them maybe?}

As I stated in the Accord MPG thread over the weekend, maybe the fairest comparison would be the Acura TL, which uses pretty much the same 3.5L Honda, without VCM. If you check the "Real World MPG" thread on the Acura TL forum, you'll see quite a number of folks claiming over 30mpg. A heavier car, same motor without VCM, for all intents and purposes the same manufacturer using a similar platform......... and yet the car without the VCM seems to get better real world mileage........ Makes a lot of sense, right?

cstiles

auld dawg---

The base TL has a 3.2 liter V6, w/258HP. It's rated 18/26.

The TL Type S has a 3.5 liter V6, w/286HP. It's rated 17/26.

The VCM Accord has a 3.5 liter V6, w/268HP. It's rated 19/29.

The 09 Mazda6 will have a 3.7 liter V6, w/272HP. It will be rated 17/25.

The 09 Maxima will have a 3.5 liter V6, w/290HP. It will be rated 19/26.

The 09 Hyundai Genesis will have a 3.8 liter V6, w/290HP. It will be rated 19/27
OR....a 4.6 liter V8, w/375HP, to be rated 17/25! Hyundai has to have the Germans and Japanese a bit concerned....

auld_dawg

Ok......... but I'm not concerned about EPA ratings, as they're not as accurate as the "Real World MPG" comments, once you have enough of a sample to get a decent picture........

When you look at the "Real World MPG" threads, suddenly the Acura TL, S, looks really good in mileage....... If you look at the Acura TL period, a case could be made that highway mileage comes pretty close to 35mpg, or absolutely blowing away the EPA estimates. If you look at just the "S", you'll note that the mileage isn't quite as great, but still over 30mpg.

If you look at the "Real World MPG" thread here, and go back to 03 and 07 V6 models, you'll find several people well over 30mpg, or blowing away the EPA estimates, even the higher way the estimated then. The current VCM V6 matches the EPA estimate pretty much, seemingly about 28 to 30 mpg.

I could mention the Camry and Sonata real world mpg stuff, but my point should be pretty much made. VCM makes good sales material, but in my opinion {just my opinion if you will}, the VCM doesn't live up to its hype.

Honda's not the only one {unless my memory is a bit off}, the 06 Impala SS was EPA rated at 31 mpg highway. Needless to say, it didn't live up to the cylinder deactivation stuff either, and today is EPA rated at 24mpg highway.........

In my honest opinion, the 03 thru 07 Accord was easily the best of the mainstream midsize cars. Maybe not the best in every category, but as a whole, the best total car. Close to the top, always in handling, performance, and mileage {both I4 and V6}.

I think the 08 I4 may still be near the top of the pack {Motor Trend recently put it in the top 5 of 10}, but I think the V6 misses a bit. Particularly in mileage, but maybe also a bit in some of the VCM cars {or have you missed some of the complaints in this very thread}.

Personally I owe golfski and others a great deal...... When I started this year's research into which midsize sedan I wanted to replace the dying 94 Sable I'd had for years, what has been written here, and in other threads on some of these other forums really helped........

ljgbjg

You have commented several times about the TL and its 3.5L engine and no one has responded. It is 3.2L. The RL has 3.5. The TL also runs on premium - the engines are really quite different, and then too you must take into consideration final drive ratios. Engines alone do not good MPG make.

dpmeersman

Recent entries in the thread your suggesting for the TL don't look that great to me. I've had a personal best of 32.15 mpg with my VCM 08 V6. I don't have any trips planned until August to see if I can match or better that trip. If you look back a couple of years in the TL thread they seemed to have better mileage then recent entries. I think we are all suffering to some degree from the 10% ethanol mix. I'd love to have 3 months, a 1/4 year of just gas, and I think I'd see at least a 10% improvement, but that will never happen. While not a big fan of VCM, I do think we are seeing some benefits in fuel economy, and it would appear it also improves emissions. Given their position in the automotive world, I have to believe that Honda wouldn't have taken chances with tarnishing their reputation, not to mention their bottom line, with a half baked technology that would place millions of vehicles in lines outside their service areas waiting to have major engine overhauls to correct. After their transmission problems earlier this decade, I would hope they emerged as a wiser, more consumer oriented organization.

ljgbjg

There is a website called justanswer.com staffed by trained technicians for a particular vehicle - Honda, Acura, Toyota, etc.

This was my question:
I feel the VCM engaging and disengaging. There is a sickening surging sensation - a hybrid like torque feel that is incessant, particularly at highway speeds with cruise control on. What gives? Honda denies any problem - "operating within normal tolerances" Is there a widespread problem with VCM?

Answer:
I've recently had a few 08's with this problem. If the dealer uses the HDS scan tool and goes into the powertrain side of the computer they can scan for updates and install the lastest software patch and that should fix the problem. Also I would reset and follow the crank sensor calibration procedure to ensure the problem goes away. It's worked so far for me to do those two things to fix it.

The technician is Kyle Northrop, ASE Certified Honda Technician in California with 1427 accepts for his answers and 99% positive feedback.

Hopefully this will be of help to some of you with your experiences with VCM. Not a TSB but close to it! Good luck to all of you - I REALLY can empathize.

cstiles

Thanks for sharing. This is potentially GREAT information and hopefully provides a clue to unlocking the solution to frustrations expressed regarding VCM. Many of the concerns and ideas volunteered on this forum revolved around mechanical flaws with the VCM system itself (faulty engine mounts, for example), but this note suggests that a software fix may be the way to go.

Somehow it shouldn't be this complicated.....and why is the consumer teaching Honda's service depts how to fix their cars? Also, imagine the frustrations expressed by an Accord owner who isn't Internet savvy and can't understand why their car is behaving in this manner and must rely solely on their service depts, or God forbid, an independent mechanic!

roy21

Has anyone taken there 2008 Honda in to a dealer for adjustments on the surging problem that some seem to have ? Mind seems to be the worse when its first driven"cold". I have friend who has the same engine with no problems. Are there adjustments or do we have to have live with the design.

Roy 21

roy21

This is the best post so for ! finally a Honda Tech,admits there is a problem. Im sending this to my local Dealer and challenge them to fix my this junk design engine,cant believe Honda denies there is no problem.

Roy 21

dpmeersman

That's a good question. It will be interesting to see how receptive they are to being told how to address the problem. I've found that it did me little good to leave TSB's with the ticket writer as I would pick my vehicle up and the problem still existed. So I would bring the car back for an oil change or other scheduled maintenance and point out that the problem still existed and again give them a TSB # to look at as a possible solution and upon picking the car up I would usually be told that the problem has been corrected but had nothing to do with the TSB I directed them to. I think it's in our nature to feel we are best suited to do that which we are paid to do and not take direction from from those we are servicing. This is potentially a great piece of information and if it provides a cure for those with VCM issues, will this fix bring with it some increase in fuel economy as well? Time will tell.

ljgbjg

Roy21 - I do hope it helps you out. I was actually asking about another issue regarding Acuras when the thought occurred to me - why not ask about VCM?

Fortunately, my personal situation seemed to resolved itself, as my problem was not a programming issue like he suggests - I suspect mine had to do with AEMs that were not operating properly but have gotten broken in and now are.

My mileage has been as high as 30 on the highway. If the VCM REALLY does help fuel economy I would hate to think what mpg would be without it!! This mileage is not a whole lot different fomr the 2007 regular V6.

elroy5

I think the 08 I4 may still be near the top of the pack {Motor Trend recently put it in the top 5 of 10}, but I think the V6 misses a bit. Particularly in mileage, but maybe also a bit in some of the VCM cars {or have you missed some of the complaints in this very thread}.

Some people think it's the other way around. The 08 Accord is too big and heavy for a 4 cylinder engine, IMO.

The base TL has a 3.2 liter V6, w/258HP. It's rated 18/26.

The TL Type S has a 3.5 liter V6, w/286HP. It's rated 17/26.

The VCM Accord has a 3.5 liter V6, w/268HP. It's rated 19/29.

The 09 Mazda6 will have a 3.7 liter V6, w/272HP. It will be rated 17/25.

The 09 Maxima will have a 3.5 liter V6, w/290HP. It will be rated 19/26.

I noticed the VCM Accord has the highest rated mileage on that list. And it is probably one of the largest and heaviest in the group. VCM is helping IMO, but it's not working miracles. Even when the engine is running on 3 or 4 cylinders, it didn't magically become a 3 or 4 cylinder engine. It still weighs the same as a 3.5L engine. You are not going to get 4 cylinder mileage with a V6. If you want 4 cylinder mileage, buy a 4 cylinder car, and live with the lack of power.

golfrski

if this works than this forum was soo worth it to so many of us... I will hit the dealer asap and ask to have this done, I will report back.. I am not convinced this will eliminate the vibration issues, but we'll see.

ljgbjg

I'm feeling a lot of pressure here! :shades: All I can say is that it is straight from a certified Honda Tech. I can promise no more and only hope it can cure some of your VCM ills, if not all..

marsha7

that if a simple firmware fix can make the VCM "seamless" have I just lost millions in fees from my evaporated class-action lawsuit???

Does this mean I have to go to the office tomorrow and work???

:):):):):):)

ljgbjg

Nahhh - stay home and watch Office Space - you'll feel better!

thegraduate

Excuse me... um... you have my stapler.

ljgbjg

:P

sundance2

We had a new 2004 Acura TL for 48,000 miles and this past May traded it for a new 2008 Accord EXL-V6. I can speak from over four year with the Acura, and we got about 25 in town, including freeways, and 30-32 on the road. The Acura was heavier that the Accords of those years and was a very fast car.

Our new 08 Accord gets 23 in town and 27 on the road, and we are conservative drivers. The sticker shows 19 and 29 so we are in the ballpark. But we also wonder why the TL got better mileage.

BTW, we notice the VCM and see that the Accord Coupe with stick does not have VCM. I wonder if our dealer can set the computer to lock out VCM. It seems to always be shifting or surging on the road. While this is noticable, we do not pay much attention to it.

The new Accord is an excellent car, rides and handles great and we love it. Our main reason for trading the TL was its harsh ride, which never softened even after four years and new Michelin tires. The ride in the new Accord is far superior in comfort level to the TL.

sunnfun

As I'm sitting at the Honda dealer (while out of town on my vacation) waiting to have the rear wheel bearing replaced at 9500 miles on my 4DR V6, I asked the service tech at this dealer if they have heard of my VCM problem. Oh yes, I was told. All of the cars do it and Honda is aware of it. (validates the marketing change I suppose). In fact, this dealer had 2 new 4 Dr V6's with MAJOR VCM issues that required a major fix. The details would take to long to type but in summary, it was electrical in nature. This is the first dealer (out of town no less) that acknowledges that Honda does know about the issue. So my next question - How do I fix it or turn it off???? At this point, there is no fix and they were not sure if Honda was working on a fix.
So for me, in less than 10K miles, I have had a new wheel bearing, new windshield (rock cracked it - I also think the glass is not as strong as previous models), new speaker (sub woofer vibrated like crazy) and I still have the VCM issue. I can't wait for the next 10k miles......

ljgbjg

Sorry to hear about your issues - all I could do was relate the answer I got from an ASE certified Honda Tech and share it with everyone here. If it does not do the trick, please let me know. I will take it up with the tech I PAID for the answer.

marsha7

OK, they admit that it is not seamless...I would not be surprised if a simple firmware flash fix to the computer module will eventually fix it, similar to a number of transmission problems posted on other topics where a flash firmware repaired the problem...

Threre goes my class action fee of a billion dollars!!!...:):):):)