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Mitsubishi Outlander vs. Subaru Forester

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  • Instead of percentages I would like to know how many Foresters Subie sold this month last year compare to this month. Reality is that Mitsu and Subaru are small players. Marketing/PR teams suck big time for both companies here in USA, reality is that they offer the same quality products such as Honda or Toyota but because of bad marketing no one notices them. If Outlander had a Honda badge on it and FOrester a Toyota you can be more than sure that the sales would have been in a lot of thousands per month.
  • psychogunpsychogun Posts: 121
    Wow, you have to wait 6-8 weeks... Sorry to hear that.
    Depending on how high gas prices go over the next month or so, there is a chance demand for the new Forester may soften... But like you said, I wouldn't hold my breath either.
    Demand for the Outlander has softened considerably since the end of '07, unfortunate for Mitsubishi, but good for consumers... Hopefully, with the 4-cylinder Outlander now well represented on dealer lots, sales may rebound...
  • biscuit_xlsbiscuit_xls Posts: 194
    Mitsubishi Motors has announced its production, sales and export figures for February 2008, with record-breaking growth fuelled by sales of the new Outlander and new Lancer, according to a report on carpages.co.uk.

    The report states that total global production came in at 128,606 units, an increase of 12.1 per cent over the same month last year, and marking the 12th consecutive monthly increase since March last year. Production volume in Japan at 86,909 units was up 17.7 per cent, the 17th consecutive month of year-on-year growth and marking a new record since Mitsubishi Motors spun off its truck and bus operations in 2003.

    This growth, carpages.co.uk reports, was driven by a 37.6 per-cent increase in output (29,444 units) of the new Lancer for the Russian, North American, Middle East and African markets and by a 36.1 per cent increase in output (17,243 units) for export shipment of the new Outlander, which continues to sell briskly in European and Chinese markets.
  • rcpaxrcpax Posts: 580
    And that's exactly the reason why Outlanders for Europe are already being built in the NedCar plant in Europe itself because of the great demand for the Outlander and its variants, the Peugeot 4007 and Citroen C-Crosser. Exports from Japan just can't satisfy the great worldwide demand.

    If Outlander is a "boring" SUV, I don't think Peugeot and Citroen will want to rebadge it under their own brand.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    36.1 per cent increase in output (17,243 units) for export shipment of the new Outlander

    Back here on earth, what does this have to with anything? For all I know, the compeition increased 50% in output, leaving the Outlander in the dust. You're better off sticking to discussing AWD nuances.
  • biscuit_xlsbiscuit_xls Posts: 194
    It was a reply to this statement: Demand for the Outlander has softened considerably since the end of '07
  • If Outlander is a "boring" SUV, I don't think Peugeot and Citroen will want to rebadge it under their own brand.

    Right... because Peugeot and Citroen don't have any boring econoboxes at all... ;)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Blitz wrote:

    If Outlander had a Honda badge on it and Forester a Toyota you can be more than sure that the sales would have been in a lot of thousands per month

    I don't think anyone will argue with that.

    But...the fact is, Honda and Toyota earned that rep.

    gun wrote:

    there is a chance demand for the new Forester may soften

    Yes and no - fewer people will move up from compact sedans, but more people may downsize from an SUV. With 20/26 mpg stamped on the Monroney, that won't scare people away.

    It could hurt turbo sales but most of the volume is the base engine.

    How's the sales split with the Outlander, V6 vs. I4, I wonder? I bet the diesel represents a lot of those overseas sales.

    In the US, I think sales are softer. I found 7 left over 2007 models when I went on my test drive. That's not good.

    I'm sure the incentive will clear them out soon, but incentives erode residuals, which were already not as good as the Forester's per ALG.

    For someone who keeps their cars forever, that may not matter. You may be upside down on a loan for a while if you took one, but unless it's totalled or you have to sell it early for unforeseen reaons, no biggie.
  • rcpaxrcpax Posts: 580
    But...the fact is, Honda and Toyota earned that rep.

    And also true, a lot of people buy the brand rather than value for money, but as we know, these trusted brand vehicles are not without problems. So they are not superior by default.
  • rcpaxrcpax Posts: 580
    In the US, I think sales are softer. I found 7 left over 2007 models when I went on my test drive. That's not good.

    Can you remember the trims on those vehicles? The Outlander sells well on a particular trim than others. Back in 06, XLS was in hot demand, leaving the ES and LS on the lot.
  • You throw a temper tantrum over someone making a crack at French brands and call me childish? Thats some fuzzy logic.

    I think the Pigeon and the :lemon: are French econoboxes, so if thats how Mitubishi can reflect their brand, you go ahead and proudly wave that flag.

    Don't take it personally.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    So they are not superior by default

    What these brands have earned is a reputation for reliability, good cars and good customer service (and yes, before we go there, there are always a bunch of complainers who can never be satisified). No brand is without issues, and Mitsubishi convering up issues for 22 years is the head of the pack. People who want to buy any car, know it's a crapshoot as to whether the car *you* get is going to be a good experience. However, with a Honda or Toyotota the odds are in your favor.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I think most were XLS actually.

    You can check on fitzmall.com, they list the current inventory on-line.

    They probably sold a few by now with the incentives.

    Rockville Mitsu had a 2007 in the showroom and it was also an XLS. I test drove a 4 cylinder base model though.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Nissans ATTESA which is regarded as the best.

    Interestingly, I was reading a C&D article about this phenomenal AWD system, and they say it directs power via an electronically controlled clutch pack. Hmm, sounds familiar.

    Nissan uses the name "Vehicle Dynamics Control" for their brake-based traction and stability control system. Tunerzine wrote "three-stage adjustability is available for the VDC system and transmission shift operation" so it's adjustable. GT-R World has a YouTube video up and that compares VDC On with VDC Off.

    Electronically controlled clutch pack with VDC that you can turn on and off. Cool.

    Where have I heard that before? ;)

    :D
  • jjc335jjc335 Posts: 14
    I have an 07 Outlander and an 09 llbean forester. My wife drives the forester most of the time,but I just dove it about 800 mile trip and have done so with the Outlander.
    I will give a list of likes of one over the other.First let me say I am a fan of both vehicles and companies.This our third subaru and my first outlander.
    This list will be lengthy so I will continue to update it for a while as the differences come to me.
    The outlander wins in the power department it is the v6 the ll bean is the2.5 4 non turbo. Although the forester was not weak in power It cannot compare the the outlander,when passing or climbing hills the outlander does it with ease and plenty of power.the subie takes a while to pass and shifts way down to get some large hills the tach will hit about 5k while the outlander might not have to downshift or if it does it might go to 5th gear maybe 2.8 k I am shure it does not hurt the subie but I dont like It.
    The subie corners much better I don't know how they do it but they always amaze me how flat they stay when hard cornering.
    mpg--the subie does better in city driving but highway they are about the same.
    I think subies have to have about 15 thousand miles on them before they get their best mileage. so I would it expect it to average about 29 highway this trip it got 27.
    Thats about my outlander does now It has 17,000 the subie has 4,500.
    Thats all for now I will try to give more details tommrow. I have many more.
  • dcwestbydcwestby Posts: 29
    Why do I title this by that?

    Its quite simple. I owned a 08 forester not too long ago and then, through some blundering and floundering [which I wont go into, its a long story], I finally got it sorted out to where I got a Nissan Rogue. I went for a 2wd sl [when I should've gotten that blue awd sl that had less options, sunroof was important].

    I disliked the Forester for the roadnoise, I'd like to hear my music not the engine/road thanks, the lack of a tilt function for the sunroof, and the missing 5th gear. While the Forester really was a good rig, there were issues with the center console and my knee.

    Fastforward to the Rogue. Perfect mirror placement, I have larger blindspot mirrors and the mirrors turned outward 10 degrees and takes care of the blindspots. I prefer to think of the larger D pillar as a safety promotion issue for when changing lanes or passing.

    The outlander I havent even test drove yet, but I do like the features they have on their offerings, and at least they have a cvt.

    Speaking of cvts, Nissan has got those down pretty well. Something Subaru US should pay attention to... Really? 4 speed autos in this day and age? cvts are far more efficient and are on demand power instantly.

    I would like to say that first time I had a cvt it was in a ford freestyle, and going from that to the forester was a bit disconcerting. I've test driven the Altima, sentra and Rogue and also the 09 forester twice. I just really enjoy both legroom and headroom with the Nissans. I have far more to say, but I'll end here for now.
  • dcwestbydcwestby Posts: 29
    Thought I did, but apparently I dont.. and considering this is in the forester forum, I'd rather not get too carried away...
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Congrats on your new Rogue.

    CR just rated all 3 of these (Forester XT and X, Mitsu Outlander 2.4l, Rogue) and rated the Subie on top.

    The Rogue did stand out among base 4 cylinder models for its acceleration.
  • >> Hyundai's system is FWD based and on-demand only, rather than always engaged. It's a pretty basic system, AFAIK.

    Majority of Foresters (which are equipped with 4-speed auto transmission) are also a FWD biased with on-demand torque to rear wheals. Only a manual transmission based Forester has real full time AWD.

    Hyundai has a decent Borg Warner based AWD system: it uses Multi-plate clutch coupling - which is also installed on Porsche 911. Borg Warner system can provide up to 95% of the torque to the front wheels, but automatically diverts up to 50% of the torque to the rear wheels when needed. In addition, Hyundai has optional button to lock the clutch providing permanent 50% torque to the rear wheels. 4EAT equipped Forester can't do it.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I kinda doubt the Sante Fe uses the same system as the Porsche 911...maybe the same type of system.

    Not too long ago the 911 Turbo employed a viscous coupling like Subaru's MT system. In fact, with a boxer engine, a Subaru is more or less like a 911 driven backwards. :D

    Automatic Foresters still always send some power to the rear axles (10 or 20%, depending on who you ask), unless you insert a FWD fuse (meant for being towed or for when you get a flat tire). So it is full time, then adjusts constantly as needs change.

    Watch this video below to see just how well it works, too:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2yp1PkXizeQ

    The 09 pretty much owns the 07, despite the 07 being a turbo with much more torque. The 09 has better ground clearance and a better tuned traction control system. Why? You have to look at the whole vehicle - ground clearance, angles of approach and departure, breakover angle, even tires. The 09 Forester does well as a package, incredibly so for a unibody sans low range.

    There were no changes to the AWD system from that 07 to that 09 yet the new model does substantially better.
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