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Mitsubishi Outlander vs. Subaru Forester

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  • >> iPod and Sirius are indeed available factory installed in the USA. Verify at kbb.com. These arrive at the dealer pre-installed.

    Kbb.com does not say that satellite radio is factory installed. Subaru.com shows that it’s optional accessory. I called local Subaru dealer and out of 31 Foresters they have - none have factory installed satellite radio. Salesman says that they don’t get them factory installed, but they can install it for me for $600 with labor! Thanks much, sounds "exciting"! On my Outlander it came with my factory installed stereo and free 6-month subscription.


    >> On a 3 year lease you get 62% residual, so the cost you quoted (over 400?) was a gross exaggeration. And unlike you said, there is also no labor charge to order those. Actual cost? $129.

    Right, you would be a better salesman at that dealership :)
  • >> It's 0-60? 7.9 seconds. YAWN! My minivan suddenly seems fast.
    7.9 seconds is not exciting, now I know why you didn't buy the 2010 GT.
    We recorded a 0-60-mph sprint of 6.8 seconds en route to a quarter-mile time of 15.1 seconds at 90.4 mph — excellent numbers for a compact SUV
    Braking? XT wins again, 125 ft vs. 130 ft. Skid pad? Forester on top, .76g to .75.
    So Forester wins 3 out of 4 performance measure, Outlander takes only the slalom.


    The braking/skid pad difference is small. Skid pad tested with stability control on, that’s why Edmunds says that if you turn it off on GT, you get EVO. As for acceleration the GT’s 0-60 7.9 sec (I’ve also seen 7.4 sec in the other test) is good, better then Land Rover LR2 (9.1 sec). The Forester 6.8 sec number is very good but I would not call it exciting: Forester would not even pass Toyota RAV4, not to mention BMW X5M 4.5 sec (which is exciting). And the turbo engine is not a good choice for the utility vehicle: the payload and towing specs are poor, premium gas.
    There is nothing exciting about Forester: no exciting specs, older non-exciting technology, styling borrowed from Outlander. It’s a good basic dependable car with nice Mitsubishi turbocharger. Expensive for what you get.

    On the other hand there are quite a few exciting things about Outlander GT. The slalom handling beats almost anything, including X5M, Q5, ML63 AMG, Cayenne, RDX, MDX, and even Mercedes sedan. And this is with regular tires!
    The AWD system is the most advanced in class. The entertainment package is exciting too: 710 watt, 10” sub, streaming wireless audio, 40 GB music server, Sirius, 9” rear LCD, hard drive based Nav, backup camera etc. Xenons. LEDs, Fastkey. The wireless audio streaming is exciting too. The GT is exciting for its value alone.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I supplied the codes for the options, obviously they exist. Even if you cannot find one at your local dealer, it can be factory ordered. How am I so sure? Because mine was. 5 weeks later we got exactly what we wanted.

    I doubt your Subaru local dealer took your inquiry seriously since you're not really shopping for a Forester.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Actually they said: "Turn it off and there's a little Evo in this Outlander".

    The Forester 6.8 sec number is very good but I would not call it exciting

    You said you buy exciting cars, and that's quicker than what you spent your money on. Not to mention you have not driven a turbo.

    premium gas

    Recommended, same for the 230hp Outlander GT, per EPA.gov.

    The slalom handling beats almost anything

    Yeah, but it's a one-trick pony. That is the only thing it did well. All the other performance measures were ho-hum. Forester wins 3/4 performance tests.

    The AWD system is the most advanced in class

    Borg Warner supplies the same system for the Jeep Caliber and it's not Trail Rated. Edmunds noted how it felt like FWD saying "Some front wheel slip at launch". Fact is it's not sending enough power to the rear axle for them to feel like it wasn't FWD. Results speak louder than claims in a brochure.

    They also noted pedal fade after hard braking, You sure you want to tow a trailer when the brakes can barely handle the weight of the vehicle itself?

    Plus, you're only looking at the raw data, in their video, Inside Line said "Forester weaves through the slalom as quickly as you could expect from a compact utility." So clearly they thought it felt just fine.

    Yes, Outlander's time was 9% quicker in the slalom, but the Forester arrives to 60mph more than 16% sooner.

    You accelerate on merge ramps every day, probably. How often do you slalom around cones? Never.

    Acceleration is something you can and do use daily. Braking is vital when you need it. Skidpad grip makes it fun to take those highway ramps as well. These are things you can enjoy every day.
  • >> Lock mode the default is 78/22. And that's for slippery surfaces only, what happens if you forget to turn it off on dry pavement? Subaru's split varies constantly according to needs, no buttons to worry about.

    No, the Lock mode locks only the lower default rear axle torque, otherwise rear axle torque varies constantly 22-60% according to needs. No buttons / “fuses” to worry about ( I think early 50/50 split data was misleading in some sources). In addition torque varies side-to-side.
    .

    >> You were name-dropping - Porsche, Dakar. So I did the same thing - Dodge Caliber, Chrysler, Jeep Compass. Outlander shares plenty of DNA with Chrysler.

    Forester uses more parts from Mitsubishi then Outlander from Chrysler (none). And Compass/Caliber don't look as close to Outlander as Forester.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Both Outlander and Caliber/Compass are supplied the same AWD system from Borg Warner. That's the system that isn't Trail Rated. The non-endorsement from Jeep applies.

    Even if Mitsubishi had supplied it to Jeep, the criticism would still apply. Jeep wants to sell cars, yet they have to admit - that system just doesn't cut it. They cannot endorse a vehicle they sell.

    The Mitsu turbo is so-so, a ball bearing turbo is a common upgrade for the EJ257.

    Mitsubishi can build great turbos, too bad the Outlander doesn't get one! :D
  • >> You said you buy exciting cars, and that's quicker than what you spent your money on.

    I did not say quickness alone is enough for a car to be exciting. Exciting car is usually a balanced package. Sorry, but none of Subarus could get even close to the ML350 in terms of excitement.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I like the ML, but you and I have very differing ideas of what exciting is.

    A balanced package will have acceleration, grip, braking, and handling, not just a slalom.
  • >> Both Outlander and Caliber/Compass are supplied the same AWD system from Borg Warner.

    Could you provide a link?
    .
    >> The Mitsu turbo is so-so

    Bad enough to be bought by Subaru :)
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Link was provided above, and look who's talking.

    You say things like "I called my Subaru dealer" and rarely provide links. Where's that dealer's site with an inventory?

    Again, Mitsu should put a turbo on the Outlander, then maybe it would deserve the "GT" nomenclature.
  • >> A balanced package will have acceleration, grip, braking, and handling, not just a slalom.

    Slalom is a combination of handling and quickness. Outlander passes cars in a busy traffic with great confidence and ease: fun to drive.

    Does these add excitement for you: dated tranny, cheap interior, cheap audio, lack of modern tech, borrowed styling?

    For me a balanced package is more then you've mentioned.
  • >> Link was provided above, and look who's talking.

    No, that link does not have any info that "Both Outlander and Caliber/Compass are supplied the same AWD system from Borg Warner", so it appears to be just your specuation.

    This is a link to my local Subaru dealer:
    http://www.evanston.subaru.com/index.htm
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Remember you said the iPod interface was not a factory option?

    Use your own link, the XT priced at $30,116 indeed has the iPod interface.
  • comem47comem47 Posts: 389
    I don't check this group for a few days and WWIII has broken out in the mean time !!! (19 new messages)

    Reminds me of a Star Trek episode "Let this be your last battlefield" where Bele and Lokai who are the last survivors of a race war (both 1/2 black and 1/2 white, but the mirror image of each other) are still keeping up the battle after everyone else is dead on their planets -fighting over who is more superior.

    http://tinyurl.com/belelokai

    I think you two can agree to disagree.

    Now if this much energy went into solving the country's problems we'd have it beat!!!

    :blush:
  • tidestertidester Posts: 10,110
    Reminds me of a Star Trek episode "Let this be your last battlefield" ...

    Certainly this discussion won't end like the story did! :)

    tidester, host
    SUVs and Smart Shopper
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The posts were moved from another thread.

    It all started when the OP asked about the Forester and Santa Fe ... I have no idea why the Outlander even became part of the conversation. It was a major detour.

    Now at least it's in the right thread.
  • Stever@EdmundsStever@Edmunds YooperlandPosts: 38,931
    The Outlander was part of the conversation because it's a direct competitor to the Forester and the rest of them in the Crossover SUV Comparison discussion. It did get a bit two-sided there though.

    It was more like Darmok and Jalad at Tanagra to me, Comem47. :-)
  • Oh no, I did not say that about iPod.

    You however said that "Both Outlander and Caliber/Compass are supplied the same AWD system from Borg Warner", but you still did not provide any info. The link you posted has no mention of Outlander.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    It's a joint venture, and it's not like Chrysler is going to say "we used a Mitsubishi engine" or Hyundai is going to say "we sourced a shared Borg Warner AWD system" or Mitsu will say "we all sourced the CVT from JATCO".

    Instead each will put their own tag on it, trying to brand it as their own, hiding the origin of those components.
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