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Mitsubishi Outlander vs. Subaru Forester

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Comments

  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Pretty neat. Have you tried playing Pandora tunes via Bluetooth a2dp? If so how was sound quality?

    Ford's demo even let them say names of songs for Pandora to play. The appeal here being you get music on-demand, plus it's totally free.

    Ford just swept the North American Car/Truck of the year awards, so they're on somewhat of a roll lately.
  • comem47comem47 Posts: 390
    Evidently I'm not the only one who feels their move to "bigger" was a wise one in doubling their popularity (moving from 18th to 9th on the survey). I'm not sure about the price thing though unless it means they've held the price fairly constant vs inflating.

    “In the last 12 months, they’ve made some dramatic improvements to their product line, sales have been relatively strong and the products deserve them,” said Jeff Bartlett, Consumer Reports’ deputy online editor, who was an author of the survey.

    “The cars are good,” he said. “They’ve improved the fuel economy while making the cars bigger, and they’re not more expensive. They’re really hitting on a lot of the magic hot buttons.”
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    What they did was lower the MSRP, but then they eliminated the rebates.

    Example: the base model was about $1200 cheaper, but the 2008 model had a $2000 rebate. That amounts to an $800 price increase for the super-sized 2009 model.

    It's a strategy that has worked. They can advertise low prices that draw people in to showrooms. The lack of rebates has helped boost residual values for new cars (meaning good lease deals) as well as used Subaru prices.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Forester will offer HIDs on 2010 models. They just held a press conference this morning.

    Mitsubishi has a display on Electric Avenue. I wonder if the i-Miev is there?

    http://www.naias.com/the-2010-show/exhibitor-list.aspx

    Last year Mitsu didn't show up.
  • >> Nice try but it's still PLASTIC. It may look and feel better than a molded plastic dash but regardless of whether you call it plastic, vinyl or double-stitched synthetic leather , it's still made from petroleum distillates

    Mitsu, Porsche and Infinity call it “Synthetic Leather”
    BMW – “Leatherette”
    Mercedes – “MB-Tex Leather”.
    Ateixteira – said “leather”

    They all use the word “leather”, so it is leather, but if you want to call it PLASTIC, be my guest!

    I guess it was too expensive, Frank, so you did not purchase LEATHER seating package for your Mercedes GLK, and based on your logic you seat on PLASTIC. Did you ever tell anyone that you have PLASTIC seats in your Mercedes? I didn’t think so, but please be consistent.

    It’s odd that you drive “luxury” Mercedes which has PLASTIC seats and PLASTIC dash, while Fushigi is driving some Mitsubishi which has double-stitch LEATHER dash and genuine LEATHER seats.
  • >> And remember mine was covered in plastic, and had not been PDI'd yet. I even thought it was a pre-production model.

    All I “remember” is that you did not say that it was covered in plastic. After inspecting the car you said "The leather dash is a nice upgrade, and it runs across the dash an into the tops of the door panels." So are you saying you made it up?


    >> You should have written it this way: synthetic leather, it is still a double-stitch vinyl which is a plastic. Vinyl is a type of plastic

    What a discovery! You making it up again using your “deduction method”. Polyethylene is also type of plastic. So what? Not every type of synthetic leather contains vinyl. Many synthetic leathers instead of vinyl use one of these: acrylic, polyurethane, polyamide felt fiber, cork, microfiber, kelp, etc.
  • >> By the way, you never apologized for being wrong about the forged pistons and the different turbo engine block.

    HUH? “forged pistons and the different turbo engine block”? I’ve never said that. I don’t even use this type of vocabulary. You however inspected the car and said twice that Outlander dash is leather, then you turn around and blame it on me saying
    “he was really rubbing that in our faces, turns out he was wrong all along.”
    That’s personal attack and you must apologize.

    >> I am sorry that the Outlander GT turns out to have its dash wrapped in a type of plastic.

    Not a proper way to apologize, but there is different grade plastic used on dashboard.

    3. Hard plastic: Subaru, Toyota, Kia
    2. Soft touch plastic: Benz GLK, BMW X3
    1. Double-stitch synthetic leather: Outlander GT, Infinity, Lincoln MKS, Porsche 911

    0. Genuine leather: Jaguar XF, Ferrari,

    Synthetic leather used on cars is not equal to your Subaru molded hard plastic dash. Usually it is a nicely stitched composite of natural fabric covered with ‘breathable’ soft synthetic layer. My impression was actually that “leather dash” is just a shortcut or figure of speech. You have to be naive expecting stitched genuine leather dash from $30Kcar, while $60K Mercedes has molded plastic. In order to get genuine leather dash you have to get closer to $100K price level and above.
  • >> Well, a quick search reveals psychogun was actually the first to bring it up

    Psychogun didn’t see the GT live and he was actually smart enough to use implicitly subjective “it appears”: “it appears Mitsubishi … added some stitched leather surfaces on the doors and the dash”. You however inspected the car in person and you explicitly said that Outlander has dash leather. Psychogun also did not blame anyone for his notion and he did not make any personal attacks.
  • >>Forester will offer HIDs on 2010 models. They just held a press conference this morning. Mitsubishi has a display on Electric Avenue. I wonder if the i-Miev is there?

    Interesting contrast in magnitude of announcements:
    Subaru: HIDs
    Mitsu: i-Mev.
  • rshollandrsholland Posts: 19,661
    Forester will offer HIDs on 2010 models.

    Well, on one model at least. :)

    Bob
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Here is what you said about the XT's engine:

    Subaru did not provide an engine appropriate to function with high performance turbocharger. They simply attached turbocharger to a stock "boxer" engine. Irresponsible and cheap approach

    Link to the full post:

    http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.f185114/950#MSG950
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    you did not say that it was covered in plastic

    I don't even think the GT I sat in was a production model. I made that part very clear.

    As I wrote:

    "Seats were wrapped in plastic"

    It's hard to compare the materials (dash vs. seats) when you can't even touch them.

    It looked sort of like this, but even more protective plastic covering the seats and other interior bits:

    http://www.liam27.com/audi/S3-pre-delivery-04.jpg

    The dealer told me it was a press car, and that was why I could not test drive it. I'm not sure what was changed for production.

    fushigi thought they just hadn't done the PDI yet, but this was unique in that all other 2010s were available to test drive, and this GT (their only one) was not.
  • kdshapirokdshapiro Posts: 5,751
    Sorry, fail. Petroleum distillates are petroleum distillates. A rose by any other name.

    Every car has plastic,well maybe not a Bentley or Rolls, but I'm sure there is some to be found within the car.

    The difference and I'll use BMW as an example, I/you/we can order the 335 with leatherette, er plastic, without HIDs, without power seats etc. It's the difference in the way the car manufacturers allow the car orders to be places a la carte vs prix fix.

    The fact the ordering philosphy is different has nothing to do with anything.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Interesting contrast in magnitude of announcements

    Enough so that Mitsubishi didn't even schedule a press conference:

    http://www.naias.com/the-2010-show/press-preview/2010-press-conference-schedule.- aspx

    Subaru showed a gull wing concept, besides the couple of new options packages for the Forester.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Point taken, but it was peaceful in here until the guy who has yet to apologize for saying that Subaru 'simply attached turbocharger to a stock "boxer" engine' came back.

    I was wrong about the fake leather, but can you blame me? Two people (psychogun and jwaters943) said it first and I believed them.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Video coverage of NAIAS:

    http://www.autonews.com/article/20100112/VIDEO/301129962/1219

    Subaru's press conference was standing-room only. :shades:
  • comem47comem47 Posts: 390
    Now that was informative (vs apology wars)

    I see that Subaru intends more options in Forester next year and Hyundai was talking about the next Santa Fe. I think the economy CUV niche is why they are both doing even better these days. (defectors from gas hogs, but people still need room)
  • fushigifushigi Posts: 1,234
    Have you tried playing Pandora tunes via Bluetooth a2dp? If so how was sound quality?

    I did it on my initial test drive just to see if it would work. And it was really easy to setup. We only listened for a minute, though, so I can't comment on sound quality other than it was fine during that test. I've spent most of my in-car hours ripping discs to the hard drive.

    I don't think the voice integration goes nearly as far as Sync does. Which is fine, as some of the CDs I ripped are Japanese and the title info is in Kanji.

    1100 miles on the Outlander as of last night, BTW.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The option package on the base models (alloys and roof rails for next to nothing) is one of those bargains that will have dealers ordering every one equipped that way.

    A similar package on the base Impreza sells well. You'd be crazy to get one without it because the residuals are higher, meaning the package ends up costing next to nothing.

    The Santa Fe got a refresh, I guess?

    I did go check out the new Tucson. They definitely took some risks with the styling. It's a tad smaller than our Forester inside, with a few blind spots. Reminds me of the Rogue, but sharper, with more creases. Their new 4 banger makes more HP than the outgoing V6.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    The option package on the base models (alloys and roof rails for next to nothing) is one of those bargains that will have dealers ordering every one equipped that way.

    A similar package on the base Impreza sells well. You'd be crazy to get one without it because the residuals are higher, meaning the package ends up costing next to nothing.

    The Santa Fe got a refresh, I guess?

    I did go check out the new Tucson. They definitely took some risks with the styling. It's a tad smaller than our Forester inside, with a few blind spots. Reminds me of the Rogue, but sharper, with more creases. Their new 4 banger makes more HP than the outgoing V6.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    I'm finding that Pandora works well for me on a wi-fi network, so-so when I have a 3G signal, and not at all with an EDGE signal.

    This is with a BlackBerry 9700 Bold and T-Mobile, BTW.

    Maybe if T-Mobile beefs up their 3G service then I could rely on it.

    My Miata has an aux in so I could listen for free, plus when I receive a phone call it pauses the music, and picks up where it left off when I hang up. That's neat.

    Bluetooth to the Garmin also works well, even the voice dial feature (not with the top down - too noisy), and the Pandora audio mutes automatically when a call comes in.

    I just wish Pandora worked better on T-Mobile's 3G network. I can deal with no music in tunnels and such, but it doesn't work well even driving down the road.
  • comem47comem47 Posts: 390
    The Santa Fe got a refresh, I guess?

    I know as much as you do by the quick reference on the auto show video clip. Have to chase that one down for more details (not that I'm buying for several years!! ) ;) .
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Could be a powertrain update? The Tucson's 4 banger was a huge upgrade, maybe that's the new base engine in the SF?

    Info is scarce, I'm sure they're busy putting stuff up on-line right now, so we'll start to see stuff over the next couple of days.
  • piastpiast Posts: 269
    "The 2010 edition of the Hyundai Santa Fe isn't getting a full redesign, but a visual refresh does provide a few hints of the "fluidic sculpture" design language that debuted last month on the new Tucson and Sonata. The lower front fascia also gets some new forms that evoke a similar look to the Tucson.
    The old 2.7-liter and 3.3-liter V6 engines have been sent off to the scrap heap in favor a pair of engines that provide better performance and efficiency. The base setup is the same 175 horsepower 2.4-liter inline-four found in the new Tucson while the optional engine is a re-vamped 3.5-liter Lambda V6 now with 276 horsepower and 248 pound-feet of torque. Both engines are mated up exclusively with six-speed transmissions but only the four gets a manual option."
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Bingo, thanks.

    No surprise, same engine upgrade from the Tucson in base models. Should be adequate now, too.

    V6 output is impressive, wow.
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    Just in case you've never seen something like this...

    imageSee more Car Pictures at CarSpace.com
  • fushigifushigi Posts: 1,234
    I guess that would be one advantage to Sprint's network. You can get full EVDO data speed even with just 1 bar of signal strength.

    Oh, Mitsu Fuse does do some music voice control but from what I've read so far (haven't had the seat time to try it yet) it's mostly for USB-connected players. From the Fuse description on the Mitsu site:

    With the USB connection, you can also select music using voice recognition, using commands such as:

    * play artist
    * play album
    * play genre
    * play playlist


    More detailed info about Fuse and actually using it is at http://mitsubishicars.com/MMNA/jsp/owners/fuse.do
  • ateixeiraateixeira Posts: 72,587
    USB also charges devices like iPhones, right? That'd be useful. On a road trip your battery would die otherwise.

    Back to T-Mo...it might have been my phone. I pulled the battery to reset Pandora, and it worked for my whole drive home yesterday (3G signal).

    I get a slight delay if I request a song, probably for it to buffer part of the song?

    Toyota is working with Denso on a response to Sync, so I guess we'll see if they pass that along to Subaru.

    Ford's a step ahead, though. While Toyota is looking at Sync, they have MyFord Touch and MyLincoln Touch on display at NAIAS. I bet it sends the Denso designers back to the drawing board:

    http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010/01/video-mylincoln-touch-in-2011-l- incoln-mkx.html

    Looking past the flashy mood lights it's pretty darn cool. Lincoln already won the JDP award in the category, and that was before these improvements. It's smart for them to make it an extension of your smart phone, because then as smart phones evolve, the technology doesn't become outdated.

    I wonder for how long Pandora will continue to be free. I guess they make money off pay-per-click if you download songs they suggest? They may just put XM/Sirius out of business.
This discussion has been closed.