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Can VW Overtake Toyota and GM To Become #1?

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  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    "Volkswagen’s reign as the world’s biggest automaker has been short-lived, and the company — in the throes of an emissions-cheating scandal — is bringing in a new head of corporate strategy.

    Toyota published figures on Monday that showed it sold more vehicles in the first nine months of 2015 than Volkswagen, retaking the No. 1 position. Only three months earlier, Volkswagen had surpassed Toyota for the first time and, however briefly, realized a long-held dream to become the world’s biggest automaker."

    Even Before Diesel Scandal Bites, VW Loses Its Sales Crown (NY Times)

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  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 7,164
    You know that some "analyst", somewhere, has been surprised by this news. :s

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    I suspect there's a reason Toyota sold 32 million Corollas.

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  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,594
    Some history on stretching the numbers, and the consequences, from today's New York Times...

    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/28/insider/the-times-greeted-hitlers-volkswagen-skeptically.html?_r=0
  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,594

    What do you want to fix? I can help you with that. "Cancel" just cancels the edit in progress from the original post. It won't cancel the original post.

    I tried to cancel my preceding message by clicking on "Cancel" under edit, but the message didn't cancel.


    Thanks for your offer to help, Shifty, but Stever posted the URL to the NY Times article in his message #45,905 that failed to appear on my post.

  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    "VW might actually be closer to daylight than it appears."

    History Points To A Light At The End Of The Tunnel For Volkswagen (Forbes)

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,699
    From NYT article:
    In November 2012, Hyundai and Kia admitted that they overstated the fuel economy of about one million 2011-2013 model year vehicles sold in the U.S. The companies ultimately paid over $300 million in settlements to the federal government.

    How was the Federal government harmed? How about the poor schmucks that bought the cars expecting better Mileage?

    Of course we all know the families of those killed by the GM faulty switches prior to the bankruptcy all got the royal shaft. That to me would be far more reason to never buy a GM than this fiasco with the VW emissions.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955

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  • PF_FlyerPF_Flyer Pennsylvania Furnace, PAPosts: 7,164
    Well, ya... while the ideal would be profits AND volume, they DO need to make money if they want to stick around. Just sayin' ;)

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  • berriberri Posts: 6,521
    edited October 2015
    Yep, profit over sales, but don't forget greater sales volume can yield more profit dollars and cash flow, so profit shouldn't be the sole driver either. And there actually are occasional instances when sales, even at a small loss, can be important such as incremental pricing when you are in a cash jam.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    "VW sales were flat during the best month of auto sales in the 21st century," Kelley Blue Book senior editor Karl Brauer told Business Insider.

    VW failed to grow its business at a time when its competitors, such as Ford, GM, and Toyota, experienced double-digit growth."

    Volkswagen is just barely staying afloat in the US auto market
    (businessinsider.com)

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,699
    edited November 2015
    With 23% of their car sales being diesel, I would say they did far better than I would expect. Tiguan was up 167% over last Oct. Touareg up 45%. Those are money makers. And Audi registered their 57th month of gains in sales. My guess is VW screwed up trying to dumb down the Passat. The Japanese and Koreans provide plenty of cheap dumbed down appliance cars.

    PS
    Prius is down 11.2% YTD
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    "Volkswagen managers are worried about travelling to the United States, a German newspaper reported on Saturday, saying U.S. investigators have confiscated the passport of an employee who is there on a visit.

    Citing company sources, the Suddeutsche Zeitung said Volkswagen believes the investigators want to prevent the manager from evading questioning or criminal prosecution linked to the diesel emissions scandal.

    A spokesman for VW said: "Volkswagen employees are still travelling to the United States. Everything else is speculation."

    VW managers afraid to travel to the U.S. - paper (Reuters)

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  • fintailfintail Posts: 38,472
    edited November 2015
    It'd be funny if some overpaid untouchable overzealous prosecutor types ended up making this a diplomatic confrontation. If only they were a military-industrial sector contractor, they could avoid trouble.

    I saw this on the news last night in Germany - it's a thing for speculation anyway. But guilty or not, the US doesn't usually hunt down people with money or corporate connections.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    This is turning into a really big deal. I think we're going to witness the utter annihilation of the TDI market in America and possibly the the rapid decline of the diesel car market in this country. 

    If this turns out to be true, then most definitely VW bet on the wrong horse, Toyota bet on the right one, and GM spread their bets on win, place and show.

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  • carboy21carboy21 Posts: 760
    edited November 2015
    I would buy a TDI any day over the Nimby lover's hybrid cars. Don't want to drive sitting over a few pounds of highly combustible lithium batteries. I rather have a tank full of diesel under my butt.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    Well that's great, but it's probably going to have to be a used one from now on. To your benefit however you'll probably get a good price on it.

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  • berriberri Posts: 6,521
    If you are buying a full size sedan primarily based on fuel consumption, I'm thinking a hybrid Camry may be hard to beat when you balance overall ownership costs? I think Americans aren't as enamored with the smell and noise of a diesel as Europeans are. We were raised on quiet highway cruisers here. But the nice thing about the US is that the market is open to all players and alternatives.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    That's right. The market says: "if you suck, you die". The automobile business is pretty vicious and big mistakes are often fatal unless you have plenty of cash reserve.

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  • hpmctorquehpmctorque Posts: 4,594
    Used VW 2.0s, and Audi and Porsche 3.0 diesels may be excellent values now. However, I'd rather wait and risk paying a little more to buy after we know what the fix will be to bring them into compliance.
  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    edited November 2015

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  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    "Monday’s carefully worded statement on cost-cutting does not mention layoffs, but nevertheless raises the specter of job reductions at a company with some 614,000 employees, nearly twice as many as Toyota, which produces roughly the same number of vehicles. “In the present difficult situation we must jointly make decisions that factor in economics just as much as employment,” Matthias Müller, the chief executive of Volkswagen, said in the joint statement with the company’s labor leadership."

    Volkswagen to Begin Talks With Labor on Cost Cutting (NY Times)

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    Well considering the large % of VW sales that are diesel here in the states, coupled with lagging sales already of its gas engine cars, this is not surprising.

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  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955

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  • Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright CaliforniaPosts: 53,795
    Well I'm sure he can wipe his tears with stock certificates from his no doubt $50 million pension plan.

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,699
    stever said:
    That was sneaky. Resign in shame and just move to another obscene paying job. It is hard to shed tears for the guy.

    Ex-Volkswagen CEO Martin Winterkorn could get a severance package worth more than $65 million, according to the Wall Street Journal.
  • steverstever Viva Las CrucesPosts: 51,955
    Surprised me, wonder what the rest of the story is. He may be spending a million or two on his legal defense - doesn't sound like the Germans can prosecute individuals but I suppose the US could try to indict and extradite.

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  • gagricegagrice San DiegoPosts: 30,699
    The US government has hard evidence on 100s of banksters and have done nothing. Not likely they would be able to win a case against Winterkorn, that basically fell on the fake sword as a show. Dieselgate happened on his watch, so he has to go. I would really be surprised if he knew. It may have been his pushing the engineers to do better that resulted in the fiasco.
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