Acura RL

bartalk2 · October 2004

Car & Driver has an extensive road test of the RL in the December issue. Very positive except for a few minor quibbles.

shotgun · October 2004

Seems to me that the author was so overwhelmed with the overall excellence of the RL that he simply couldn't accept the notion that the RL is the superior vehicle...as most major automotive magazines have already reported

satire · October 2004

So where's my loyalty bonus Acura???? In the fall of 1984 I went to Toyota to buy my first new car. The salesman (brother to my best friend at the time) refused to remove his $500 markup on a stripped Tercel that I could barely afford. Next day I went to Honda. Got myself an Accord hatchback at a great price because the salesman took pity on my financial situation.

Eight years later I purchased a 1993 Accord. Then a 1997 Acura CL. Next up was a 1999 TL. I now have a 2002 RL. My next car will be another RL but probably a 2006 (I want me those air cooled seats that Acura will have to eventually offer).

So again, Acura/Honda, where's my loyalty bonus????

satire · October 2004

By the way, if it wasn't for that $500 markup I'd probably be driving a Lexus today. But alas, that bad experience turned me off on Toyotas for life.
Do you think dealers ever consider such issues or is it "make money now" d*** the consequences?

prophet2 · October 2004

It's part of the "bird in the hand" theory and a bit short-sighted. The secret is developing clients, not just making a sale.

As far as "loyalty bonuses" go, you have to get in line behind me: 1986 Legend; 1987 Integra LS; 1987 Legend L coupe (2); 1988 Integra LS; 1991 Legend LS; 1993 Integra LS Special Edition; 1996 RL; 2001 Honda Odyssey EX; 2002 Honda Accord EX-L V6; 2003 RSX.

With all the referrals from me (over 100), they should give me a free 2005 RL!

larry6 · October 2004

Bodble2 is perceptive, sharp -- and absolutely correct; the left foot is not used for the brake (or shouldn't be). I suspect I became confused because our second auto has standard transmission. Please forgive my mindlessness...and let's hope that my left foot will remain at rest in the '05RL. Thanks Bodble2 for the heads up!

undecided3 · October 2004

As a BMW 530 driver for the last 3 years, and 2 other 5 series before that, I felt exactly the same on all these points.

RL has more technology choices so new cockpit is a lot "busier" than last generation 5 series.

Interior sound is less in BMW.

Tough call...

jjacura · October 2004

I suspect there may be a few of us out there that drove straight stick for years and may even carry forward the tendency to cheat, and use the left foot on the brake once in a while. I do. and usually its in a situation making one of those "California" stops as we called them or "rabbit' stops and you want to move quickly through an intersection that is clear.

jjacura · October 2004

Very inciteful Shotgun.

markcincinnati · October 2004

Frustrating: Audi dealer is owned by several brothers -- they own geographically separate Acura, Audi, Cadillac, Chevrolet and Toyota stores.

I test drove an Acura TL -- and got to look at but not keep an RL brochure (reason: salesperson only had one). No RL's to test, all presold. I get in a leftover last gen (but new) RL. I decide I like the TL a lot (but didn't care for the torque steer); but the TL's sound system is the best I have ever heard in any car, period.

I test drove an A6 4.2 -- but as much as I liked it, it was $56K and I am really only interested in a 3.2; I did get a brochure to take with me however (woo woo!). I asked about a 3.2 test drive -- they have 1, presold 3.2, about 6 4.2's, 5 of them presold. I'll wait to test the 3.2.

Note: I ask my sales rep (at Audi) are these cars selling at MSRP, less or more. I've known this guy for 20 years -- he says, "we've been taking off $1,200 on the presold ones (4.2's that HE knew of), so far." He didn't know about the 3.2, since the car had been presold by another sales person.

Note2: The Acura rep said MSRP, period (I though, well at least there was no MARK-UP!)

Drove to Chrysler dealer -- asked for 300C brochure with AWD version described, no brochure period on this model was available. Gave sales manager my card and asked to be called when there was a 300C w/AWD that I could test drive. He claimed 11/15/2004 (was that production or availability? I don't think he really knew so he said it both ways once each).

Conclusion: frustration at the process, but "patience is a virtue."

Conclusion2: not knowing anything other than what I have read about SH-AWD, it would seem that the Acura TL w/SH-AWD would be sold at a pace equal to or greater than its production -- what a great car, and a great sound system (yea, I know I already said that).

The A6 4.2 had 18" wheels with Ultra High perfomance seasonal tires -- the XM radio was slightly less good than the Acura, but the power and responsiveness of the car belied its size.

Can't wait to try these three cars back to back to back (the Hemi engine may be sweet, but power alone will not seduce me).

Oh, post script: A6 dealer rep, said "money factor is 'artificially high' right now, I would expect it to decrease in November or December."

He who goes first, apparently, pays the most.

I wonder if Acura and Audi will begin some "normal" discounts first quarter 2005?

The current 300C, BTW, is now being "normally" discounted plus $1,000 off from Chryco.

shotgun · October 2004

Yeh...I know. Please forgive me, I just couldn't help myself.

kyfdx · October 2004

I know you have been dealing with them for years.. but, I just haven't had much luck dealing with the Joseph dealerships.. While the Acura guys are pleasant enough, frustration would define my interactions with every one of their dealerships...

On another note.. how is the new Audi dealership? I haven't been by there since they opened.

regards,
kyfdx

bartalk2 · October 2004

Outstanding handling. Impressive skidpad: 0.87g and that without the need for low-profile, high performance tires. O-60: 6.7; 0-100: 17.1; 1/4 mile: 15.2 @94mph. One editor claims RL more than held its own against recently tested 5 Series & E-class.

Minor quibbles: conservative styling (naturally), no more interior room than the Accord, faster cars available for less money.

On balance, however, a rave.

jrock65 · October 2004

0 to 60: 6.7s

So high 6's, just as we've been thinking all along.

Not as high as you hope for when you hear 300 hp, but still best in class. 530i auto and E320 are about 7 secs I think.

The only car that may better it is the M35.

We know that the 245 hp GS300 isn't gonna get there.

"Minor quibbles: conservative styling (naturally), no more interior room than the Accord, faster cars available for less money"

The only real quibble is conservative styling then. No car in this class has more room than the Accord, and the cheaper, faster cars quibble applies to every other car in the luxury performance category.

blessed · October 2004

I was watching MotorWeek on PBS about 3 weeks ago and they clocked a 0-60 time in 6.5 secs.

shotgun · October 2004

Yes, I've read several conflicting "takes" on the RL's 0-60 times. We'll just have to wait until some official road tests/reviews/comparos are published. I dove in an took delivery on 14 Oct 04 and have, thus far, concluded that the RL has substantially exceeded my expectations! It will only be icing on the cake if the magazines, collectively and consistently, come up with 0-60 times under 6.8 seconds and the top speed numbers were to hover around 150 mph...That being the case, and given all the other goodies - SH-AWD, tech-stuff, ergonomics, superb interior design, quality materials, and overall conservative/elegant appearance - I can rest easy with the knowledge that my $50k will have been, indeed, very well spent!

markcincinnati · October 2004

I actually deal, now that the it is part of the Joseph group with the same salesrep I have been doing biz with for about 15 years. The brothers, per se, seem OK as far as I can tell.

The new Audi dealership is a palace (for $7MM it should be). The Acura dealership is dated and is dualed with Hyundai -- isn't that ODD?

We have several Acura dealerships and two Audi dealerships in our area -- the new Audi dealership reminds me of the factory in Germany it is so pristine and perfect. What counts is the treatment and the cars. Both the Acura and the Audi seem to be fine cars, the last time I owned a Chrysler it was a Cordoba with fine Corinthian Leather (that was, hmmm, the 70's?) Anyway, I sit patiently waiting -- I can "go" anytime in the next few months and I'm fine. My 2003 allroad has 37K miles on it and a new set of tires.

For once, time is on my side lease wise. Let's hope that both the Fed pauses and that the build up of inventory (of cars) causes some "liquidation" incentives to, once again, kick in -- for all cars.

Stimulus anyone?

proe · October 2004

My biggest disappointment is the 70-0 brake distance, 180 ft. that is at least 13 ft longer than bmw 530i. However, audi s4, the m3 beater, takes about 177 ft, so in that perspective, it is not that bad. I wonder if 18" wheel will help that.

In terms of the handling, .87 g is same as s4 and m3. I do not think rl's new chassis is stiffer than neither s4 nor m3, so I think that tells a lot about shawd. I think with better tires, rl will achieve .90 g or better.

I will wait until m35 comes out to see if rl is the winner.

ceric · October 2004

Well, C&D's 0-60 time of RL is not surprising to me based on my own test-drive. I put it at 6.5-7.0sec in my report. Top speed is more or less a function of horse power and drag coefficient (and top gear). BMW E39 540iA with 290hp and 0.32 Cd can reach about 155mph. RL with 300hp and 0.28Cd would reach beyond that.

BMW's brake performance comes with a cost. You need to replace pads and rotors simultaneously as they are designed to wear out together. Therefore, a lot of brake dust from pads and rotors.

bartalk2 · October 2004

Honda/Acura brakes usually require longer stopping distances than many others, but nonethless, testers, from Consumer Reports to the car mags, have always rated their brakes as good. Brake feel in the RL I test drove was excellent.

jjacura · October 2004

"the last time I owned a Chrysler it was a Cordoba with fine Corinthian Leather (that was, hmmm, the 70's?"

The TV commercials were great. Ricardo Montalban "A luxury name and luxury feel, with fine Corinthian leather interior, along with a normal car price" 1975- 1983

sjohnson11 · October 2004

"No car in this class has more room than the Accord"

Check out the Nissan Altima

jrock65 · October 2004

I'm talking about the RL's class: luxury performance sedans.

Maybe the STS has more room, but not the A6, 5, or E. Not sure what the specs will be on the new GS and M, but I'd imagine their similar to the RL, but with bigger trunks.

bartalk2 · October 2004

Slight correction: I think the ad line was "Rich Corinthian Leather." No? After that Chrysler sank into the deep.

jjacura · October 2004

You may have it right .."Rich"...but Ricardo did many comercials and for some reason I remembered it as FINE Corinthian leathers..maybe Mark can remember.
HEY DOES EVERYBODY HAVE ACURA RL (FORUM) BOOKMARKED?

Kirstie_H · October 2004

Grab the children and follow the new bookmark! See the top of this page.

Last few hours at this URL.

1violinist · October 2004

I test drove the RL yesterday. Fantastic car! Very smooth, and power is more than enough for luxury driving. Handling and cornering is pretty stable and steady. Breaking is firm and assuring. The cabin is well insulated and quiet. Visibility is excellent! I told the salesman that the only problem is that they don't have a "buy one get one free" offer!

boomsama · October 2004

"We know that the 245 hp GS300 isn't gonna get there."

On the contrary, the GS is a smaller car, coupled with what might be a better transmission. It also has DI so...we should at least wait until specs are released before we make assumptions

bartalk2 · October 2004

Honda/Acura does have a kind of buy-one-get-one-free offer. You can buy two Honda Accord EX V-6s for the price of one RL. Thus, for the price of one RL, you get two cars. Buy one get one free.

1violinist · October 2004

If we take it a step further, for the price of the RL I can get THREE Honda Civic EX's! So it's more like "buy-one-get-two-free"! :-)

jrock65 · October 2004

I will be shocked if the GS300 AWD breaks 7 seconds.

ceric · November 2004

I second that opinion.

legendman · November 2004

I just came back from the California Auto Show in Anaheim California. There I had the opportunity to sit in several of the RLs on the floor.

Nice looking car, but for me one major flaw. I found the seat to be downright uncomfortable because of how it narrows at the base of the seat, and, the very strong and unforgiving bolsters. Try as I might to get comfortable I always got a backache.

Now I know that some women found the seat to be very comfortable, and for some men as well, but for a 200+ guy with a 44 waist I simply didn't fit.

So now I am in quandry. I want a new car but I certainly can't plunk down $50K (sticker at the show was $49,700!!) for a car that gives me a backache.

Is there anyway to have an uphostery shop loosen up the bolsters? Is a special ordered seat a pipe dream?

The Lexus GS I sat in was much more comfortable, but the styling is not great, IMO. The Infiniti Q45 is comfortable but it's a big car and more money. The 2006 M45 was at the show but you couldn't sit in it.

What to do? Any suggestions?

prophet2 · November 2004

Seriously, we have the private showing this evening, so I'll have to check out the back seat, even though I doubt I'll be doing anything but driving it.

I'm 5'10", 207, with a 38" waist. I know, I know, I should get on some serious exercise routine. My doctors want me to get down to 190, which I almost did in the summer of 2003 at 194.

sjohnson11 · November 2004

Email Acura and ask them to super-size it for you!

sjohnson11 · November 2004

"I'm talking about the RL's class: luxury performance sedans."

Then why do you mention the Accord at all..it is certainly not in this class....

bobb1 · November 2004

An addition to seating comments. I too have a bad back and found that the only car that really did my back any good was a Lincoln Town Car, but when I had one look at that 1960's dash I just could not do it!!!! However the solution is at hand, scoot on over to Wallmart and get a chair pad - the type you put on those hard kitchen chairs. I found that works well and it raises my back up enough that the lumbar support is even better.

jrock65 · November 2004

I was responding to Car & Driver's quibble that the RL has "no more interior room than the Accord", and saying that no other car in the luxury performance sedan category has more room than the Accord, except maybe the STS.

acuraphile · November 2004

A while ago, before the introduction of the 2005 RL, I became impatient with the absence of news from Acura and inquired of one of the car mag's writers if anything had come across his desk re a new RL and, possibly, one driven by a V-8. The following was his reply:

"For what it's worth, I think the purist engineering community at Honda believes that
A) A V-6 makes enough power, or at least that Honda can make a V-6 that's powerful enough and,

Counterweighted crankshafts, required to offset an inherent secondary imbalance in a V-8, are inelegant! They'll race with 8s or 10s, but they'd really prefer a nice inherently balanced
12. I recently had a Honda engineer (not the source for our Acura info) explain to me at length why V-8s aren't good for smoothness, and indeed, the V-8 is the only common engine configuration with free forces out of balance, UNLESS you use counterweights. So, I said, continuing to argue that the NSX would quadruple sales overnight with two more cylinders, Honda has made 3s and 5s, which have greater inherent vibrations (though they're not "forces" but "moments" that are out of balance). He just got exasperated with me, in part because the language barrier was significant. It's good to know the exasperation cuts both ways, though."

Interesting? Agree? Disagree?

Nice seeing some familiar faces!

rsmith15 · November 2004

Test drove the RL and liked much about it and especially the Lakeshore silver metallic color. Was concerned about the lack of trunk space and low end torque. Still was interested until the Las Vegas dealer quoted $52,500 out the door (no extended warantee, no mats, no tint, no tax). The price seems very very high especially given my previous concerns and since it is a new model with the expected bugs, especially with all the new gadgets. Even with all these concerns, I like Acuras and would still consider a purchase from out of town if anyone has a suggested dealer who can give me a reasonable price. If not, I will stay with my 99RL with 68K miles. Scoobe

kfhmail · November 2004

HOST...

There had to be a better way to move the comments from the 2005 RL future car discussions.

When I checked in today to see if there were any new messages your site said there were over 1800 messages that I had not read. I guess this is because it was combined with the existing RL thread/discussion.

It seems like a no brainer, but would it not have been better to have made the comments "read only" and left them as a separate discussion.

It takes a lot of time to clear out 1800 messages that I have already read.

It there a "trick or secret" to get those message to no longer show as new/not read. Some of them go back to 2003.

There had to be a BETTER WAY.

prophet2 · November 2004

I just jumped ahead to the latest messages. Now, when last I logged on, the Acura RL line indicated just "1" new message and none of the thousands of old ones I "skipped."

pat · November 2004

Yeah, I hear ya ... I had the same problem. Do you use subscriptions? If so, read all of your subscriptions but this one, then go to your Message Center and use the Catch Up button. That'll do it. If you don't use subscriptions, go ahead and subscribe to this for the specific purpose of using that Catch Up button.

Prophet2, there's something screwy about using the Recent Msgs link to catch up. If it actually worked for you (i.e., caught you up completely), that's a new thing. Usually it just takes you to the last page, but doesn't update your "last read" mark ... which is ridiculous, yes.

Kirstie and I talked about this earlier today. We agree that this could have been handled better and will be handled better in future situations.

Sorry 'bout that. FWIW, this was my fault, not Kirstie's. We didn't want you to lose your very active conversation and thought this would be a good way to keep that from happening, rather than close the new model discussion altogether. Live and learn, eh?

If anyone needs any specific help on how to straighten this out, feel free to email me.

shotgun · November 2004

I love you Legendman, and I don't wish to sound trite - But this would be an excellent opportunity for you to pursue a diet. Think of the possibilities...not only would your health improve, you'd look better, and be in a brand new ride to boot (smile).

courtney11 · November 2004

Just a Question:
I have been looking at both of these and have some questions. I really like the C55 and feel that some of the toys on the RL are a bit of overkill or things I probably would not really appreciate. The SH-AWD to me is not that important nor is the real time traffic info. nor the the navigation. For the price of the RL I can add a few dollars and get a car that can fly. It has all the things I need. As far as handling, engine performance, braking and styling I feel the C55 has the advantage.
Any thoughts on the comparison would br greatly appreciated.

shotgun · November 2004

Simply put...Satisfy your need Courtney11 and go with the C55. It's what you want that's important...nothing else really matters!

prophet2 · November 2004

Yeah, I know. In the old days, jumping ahead like I did only changed the first unread page (25 messages) to the "read" category.

This time, I just jumped ahead and the next time I logged in, the rest of them were disregarded. As an analog dinosaur in the digital world, have no idea what happened.

The other thing is that I had previously read all the Acura RL messages in the SEDANS board. So, I was surprised at the change-over that I was supposedly "thousands" of posts in arrears.

jjacura · November 2004

It's good to have you 2 guys in here along with a few others from the 2005 RL forum. I mentioned in a past post that I am doing the in-person color check now and am still waiting to see Celestial Silver and Premium White Pearl before finalizing a decision and placing the order. (Note: The Acura web site allows one to build the car and make color selections and shows the 9 different color options which is pretty good but there is nothing like seeing this car in person!)

shotgun · November 2004

Good to have you here too Jjacura! You're right, theres nothing like seeing the real thing in person. I took a huge risk by selecting the Opulent Blue Pearl sight unseen! Fortunately the color was everything I expected - I was lucky! I almost went with the Lakeshore Silver but I could never get a decent fix on what it actually looked like - even the brochure didn't give me real good idea on what it actually looked like. Now most people who've actually seen the Lakeshore Silver color really like it and something tells me when I see it I'll probably like it too.
The reason I went with OBP is because the grille is highlighted so nicely. On the other, lighter colors, the grille outline gets, for a lack of a better word, "lost". Acura did a very poor job with their brochure lets hope they'll revise it soon.

jjacura · November 2004

My Demo drive was with your blue pearl and I have not ruled it out as a color selection. As I recall one of the regular contributors to "2005 RL" ordered the car in Lakeshore Silver. (Acuraphile maybe) Yes, the brochure seemed to lack the quality you would expect for the introduction of this NEWLY DESIGNED LUXURY automoble. but the bottom line is....you know the quality is in that car!

Acura RL

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