Acura RL

satire · February 2005

Hey folks, I hate to point out the obvious here but it's really rather simple. Acura is stuck with this car for four to five years. Much like Honda does, Acura will dole out additional options each year to keep the car "fresh". They can't very well give us everything the first year and be done with it. So expect the vented seats next year and adaptive cruise control shortly thereafter.

By the time this version of the RL fades away, it will be better equiped, higher powered(?) and far more expensive. It's up to you to decide at what point you're fully satisfied. Me? I'm going to save $20K and get an Accord EX. Love the RL but not willing to pay for it. Sorry but my car needs are such that I don't need to spend $50K to be happy.

jjacura · February 2005

I like your decision...We've enjoyed Accords and Preludes for many years. I chuckle over my wife's Honda Civic...she has had it for 2 and 1/2 years and has 7,000 miles on it. It's like new with 2 oil changes. My cars however... I've been with Acura since '93 Vigor... The new RL is A reward after a career and a few years of retirement. My wife says "JJ, you've earned it." Can't blame you though for buying Accord. That's all the car a person needs. Did you check out the new Hybrid with the Satellite-Linked Navi System, a 255 HP V-6 that delivers 37 MPG? $31,990.

kennyg5 · February 2005

Using your logic, why spend the extra dough on an Accord EX when you can have a Civic for thousands less. Better yet, take mass transit (because investing in a car is never a smart move as it will depreciate no matter what) and help save the environment :-)

prophet2 · February 2005

A fine reward. Go for it and don't worry what the bean-counter type of mentality out there say. The RL is not for everybody. The same as the Accord EX is "too much" for others - the Civic would suffice.

We RL-types don't need the "satisfaction" that owning a BMW, Mercedes, or Jaguar brings. From my perspective and experience, those cars end up "owning" you .........

tayl0rd · February 2005

You know, I really hate it when the "buzz kill" crowd says it's crazy to spend such-and-such money for a car, and that such-and-such is all you need. Blah, blah, blah. If people only bought "what they need" for a car, there would be literally tens of millions of people who wouldn't own a car at all and tens of millions more who would only be driving Geo Metros, Subaru Justies, and the ilk. Having a new car would be like high treason!

There are an extreme few cars in this world that will actually give you a return on your investment. I'm sure any consumer with a quarter of a brain will realize that. Buying a car is a bad financial decision right off the bat if you're an investor type. Buying a NEW car is even more dumb, and the dumbness grows exponentially as the price of the car goes up! SO WHAT??? It's somebody else's money so why should the el-cheapos care what they spent on it?

Granted, I still maintain that the RL is overpriced for what you get, but that is my opinion, based solely on my own criteria of what I expect/want from a car costing that much. Some will agree with me, some will disagree. That's the beauty (and agony) of having a free will. You don't have to agree with what others think.

We all work hard for our money and deserve to pamper ourselves from time to time. For folks whose idea of luxury is being inundated with electronic gadgetry, the RL is a jewel for them. For others whose idea of luxury is comfort and pampering for driver and all his passengers, the RL might not make a whole lot of sense. I'm a member of the latter group. I feel you get more for less in the TL rather than the RL.

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE gadgets, but not at the expense of comfort for me and my companions.

Anyway, if someone opts for an Accord EX V6 over an RL, that's cool. Congratulations. But also try to remember that the guy across the street in the Kia Amante also feels that you paid too much for that Accord. (And when that new Hyundai Sonata hits the streets, it's REALLY gonna look like you paid too much for that Accord. But there's always the trusty, standby justification of "reputation for quality.")

jjacura · February 2005

Interesting how we are different. I loved my 2000 TL and was chomping at the bits when the 2004 TL was coming. When it arrived I really balked at the idea of buying one. The design changes came up short for me. Money had nothing to do with it.

The new 2005 RL came out in October and I new it was the right car for me. The electronic gadgetry didn't "Sell me" on the car. The overall design and refinement of this car outside and inside was perfect for me. Simply put.

driftracer · February 2005

Perfect example - in 1988, I was stationed at Dyess AFB, TX, and I bought a new Mustang GT - talking to one of my buddies at work, talking about how fun the car was at the autocross track that last weekend, an older master sergeant fronted me with the question "why do you need a car that screams around corners and goes 140 mph if the national speed limit is 55?"....

This guy had a horrible looking combover, and drove a 1974 GREEN (yes, THAT green) 4 dr Dodge Dart with a slant 6.

I told him if he had to ask, he certainly couldn't understand.

bodble2 · February 2005

"By the time this version of the RL fades away, it will be better equiped, higher powered(?) and far more expensive."

I agree it will be significantly upgraded, but I don't think it will be far more expensive. If you look at Honda's pattern of mid-model upgrades, they hold cost increase to a minimum. That's how they maintain sales momentum as a model ages.

bodble2 · February 2005

Hey, to each his own. Everyone's got different priorities. It's not for me, or you, to hate it or embrace it. Can't label it as "cheap mentality". Most people only has a finite amount of resources, and different people apportion it differently. A guy who drives a Kia instead of an BMW may be living in a million dollar house, or putting 3 kids thru college. Just different priorities. I wouldn't say it's cheap mentality.

acuraphile · February 2005

It appears reasonable to assume that income/net worth determine just how much one needs to consider "value" when purchasing a car. JJ, your wife said that you had earned it - your RL. However, as much as you may deserve it, you, too, had the means to buy it. Consider having worked fifty years and having accumulated a reasonable amount of money. Depending upon the price of the car in consideration, if you're in a very strong financial position, the "value" of the car becomes academic - if you really want it!

If $5,000 is meaningless and you've fallen for an RL that's deemed by many to be overpriced, then so what? Generally, when one feels "taken," it's the result of an absence of options - of not having a choice. I never feel "used" if I buy something whose price seems excessive to someone else....even if their assessment is correct.

I do feel used when I receive my monthly phone bill and find that taxes and surcharges comprise almost 40% of the total. There, I have no choice but to pony up.

kyfdx · February 2005

Don't get me started on the phone bill.. At least the internet access is still tax-free..

bodble2 · February 2005

I'm trying to start a flame war, but in Canada the 280 hp M35 AWD starts at $58K, I believe. Even with a couple of options, its price should undercut the RL by a healthy margin. It probably doesn't have all the high-tech toys that the RL has, but it won't be that far behind. Styling is a toss-up, IMO. I think it looks more macho, in keeping with recent Nissan trend, whereas the RL looks more sleek. Neither one is a styling home-run. But I think Acura may face stiff competition from the M35 in Canada.

jjacura · February 2005

You are so right "Value" of that car becomes academic. Also there are so many other factors that play into the picture that don't include whether or not one can "Afford" to buy something. One of my retired former associates has done extremely well financially and could afford to buy anything he wants. He comes from a mindset of penny-pinching however and it still reflects how he lives his life. He deliberates over an auto purchase for not weeks, or months, but years. When we discussed the RL he said..."You go ahead, I could not buy one because I would be scared to death of seeing it get that first scratch, I could not leave it in a public parking lot....I would be afraid to get it into heavy traffic." So there you are...it takes all kinds.

The phone bill issue...I am with you all the way on that one followed closely by the way we have been pummeled in recent years by gas and energy rate hikes. Regardless of our financial positions we have a right to our beefs...that's the beauty of living in the good old USA.

bodble2 · February 2005

"He comes from a mindset of penny-pinching however and it still reflects how he lives his life. He deliberates over an auto purchase for not weeks, or months, but years."

OK, jj, how did you meet my father? We always tease him about his car purchase process. He'd think and think, then waits for the annual auto show to "check out all alternative", then think some more, and wait because the new models are "just around the corner". Repeat same cycle when new model year starts, and it goes on and on. Usually when you walk into a dealer the sales guys and gals pounce on you like locusts. Well, when my father walks in, unless they've never seen him there before, no one makes a move for him 'cause they know he's a thinker, not a buyer.

Then, after finally getting a new car, he doesn't want to drive it, so he ends up with something like 5,000 km in 2 years!

And he's not penniless. He can probably afford any car this side of an Enzo.

prophet2 · February 2005

"Paralysis by analysis" - too much time thinking, not enough living. They probably fear that a "better" deal will show up AFTER they finally buy. And, they won't buy a first-year model because the "bugs" need to be worked out. After a few years gave passed and the model has been "de-bugged," a new model is "right around the corner." And, it goes round and round, again A pity, indeed.

When I worked part-time at a UnoCal station during high school (mid-'60s), my classmate's father had his car serviced there. 30,000 miles on the odometer after 13 years .......

A client of mine drives her 2000 Protege LX a bit more. Bought it in early 2002 with 6500 miles on the clock. Now has 16K miles.

pat · February 2005

You might be interested in joining the Luxury Performance Sedans discussion. The RL and M35 are actively being discussed along with several other interesting vehicles.

jrozes · February 2005

As of about a week ago, every morning when I turn on my RL, I have one or more messages that are part of a Feature Guide, each message telling me about some feature of the car that I already know about. Is there a way to make it stop? Thanks.

jjacura · February 2005

Don't think you can stop them from coming to you. (Up to 32 messages I believe) but I have missed most of them by going to XM radio as soon as I enter the car. Now I listen to them at my leasure but have found that like you, I already know pretty much most of the features covered by these messages and once heard you can delete them.

kacurat · February 2005

I purchased my RL in nighthawk black pearl with ebony black interior. It is gorgeous!!! I also purchased the wood steering wheel. When I went to pick it up they kindly decided to inform me that the wood steering wheel is on national back order. I called Acura and they are putting some type of a rush on it for me, but I am quite frustrated as I have already paid for a feature that I don't have and one in which they have no delivery date. Does anyone have any suggestions, and has anyone else encountered this senario??

reallegend · February 2005

Congratulations on your new RL. You're going to enjoy it. I also have the wood steering wheel along with the wood shift knob. It really trims out the front interior and for my taupe interior, it only makes it that much better. I was concerned about only having a partial leather grip, but was pleasently surpised that I still had the same feel. Even the wood section has the finger ridges on the window side which enhances your grip. You'll like the look and feel.

Now to the bad news. In my case, the taupe wood wheel took 12 weeks for delivery. Longer than delivery of the car (5 weeks). I was originally told that taupe was in short supply. But I later found out that it had more to do with a safety check-out of how the wood interior reacted in safety crash tests. It appears that because all the wood in the '05 RL is cut in a vertical, front to back fashion versus horizontal, it could present a safety issue when the wood splinters in a accident. I was told that all original cars were grandfathered, but that newly manufactured cars were being held up until the wood passed safety tests. This included the wood steering wheel.

Is this the reason? Possibly. But Acura also may not have anticipated so many requests for wood steering wheels, especially in the taupe version.

Hopefully you will have yours much sooner than I experienced. It didn't bother me so much as my accessories were thrown into the deal.

In either case, you will enjoy the final look and feel of your RL. By the way, I insisted that the dealership give me the old leather steering wheel when they installed the new one. You may find yourself selling it in the future as a part offering. It's yours, so take it.

rbenton · February 2005

I saw the new RL, it reminds of bloated and dolled up accord. I believe if Acura wants to be taken seroiusly in the market above $40K it needs to develop a VTEC V8.

jmatthe · February 2005

Your comment was worth 2 cents.

acuraphile · February 2005

The latest issue of AutoWeek lauds the RL;a great review!!

The only complaint, but a minor one: low end torque. The car is described glowingly. Skid pad and cones:impressive. Interior and exterior refined. Hints that BMW checks its rearview mirror.....RL coming up fast!

nate · February 2005

I have had my RL since Oct. 04, and was wondering if anyone else has experienced the same problem I have. On multiple occasions while going downhill after I release the brake, a second or two later suddenly the car begins to decelerate again as if I was applying the brakes or if the brakes were stuck. Pressing the gas resolves the problem. It is really odd, and I am not sure what is going on. I don't think it is downshifting. Any insight would be appreciated.

kyfdx · February 2005

That is your basic Honda automatic transmission at work... On an Accord, they call it "grade logic".. When heading downhill, once you hit the brakes and let off.. the transmission assumes that you don't want the speed of the car to increase and holds the lower gear.. It will do this until it gets input from the throttle.. Once you step on the gas, it will then upshift and allow the car to coast... I'm not sure of the exact mechanics of it, but the result is the same.

That is an over-simplification, but is more or less what you are feeling.. If you drive Honda automatics for a long time, you get used to it, and once you've adjusted, it actually makes sense.... and you learn to use it to your advantage.. It does save you from riding the brake going down hills in a low speed limit zone...

regards,

kyfdx

nate · February 2005

Thanks for the info. I must say that it doesn't do it all the time going downhill. If your explanation is the reason, then if I change into manual shift mode before entering downhill, it should not decelerate the car and maintain the same gear. I will try that next time I think of it.

bob k. · February 2005

The HFL phonebook is totally seperate from the addressbook. What I do is anything of significance that I put in my address book, I store in my phonebook. Otherwise you do have to read the number from the addressbook into the HFL voice call command.

Bob K.

bob k. · February 2005

Anybody have any problem like this? Periodically, without warning or apparant cause, my varios settings such as when the doors lock, seat memory, how doors unlock,etc., revert back to default settings. If I do nothing(sometimes), hours later, everything returns to my settings. One time the system identified me as driver 2 instead of driver 1, but again later, self corrected. By the way, my Acura service is at a lose and Acura has given me an actural case number as they are trying to figure out what is going on. Except for this annoyance, I love my car. It drives and rides like a dream. Also, Cingular Motorola V515 Bluetooth pairs easily and works flawlessly with HFL.

Bob K.

kacurat · February 2005

Thank you so much for your detailed reply! I too was told that it has to do with safety reasons. I am just afraid that I will get lost in the shuffle and will not have my steering wheel for months. Do you suggest that I ask for my money back, or hold tight with my "we owe you a steering wheel form"?

I absolutely love the car. It is like driving a luxery hotel. And for that person that said it looks like an Accord has obviously not sat in the car nor driven it. The car's a dream!

jjacura · February 2005

Received my first copy of Auto Week and it was coincidently this issue. I also thought the article was well done. An interesting thing was the cross shopping comparisons made with the higher end 745i,S430, and A8L. I can't remember seeing this before. In another forum there were negative feedbacks from the MB and Lexus folk but I really denoted a form of insecurity in their remarks. The people that put down the RL are usually the ones that have never driven the car much less owned one. By the way ACURAPHILE...I have a tip for you on a relatively new trumpet player out there that will absolutely amaze you with his talent. Chris Botti... Been playing his CDs on the RL sound system and I have to say...I would go out on a limb and give him the nod over Miles Davis. I hope you are well. JJ

kfhmail · February 2005

Hey guys how about listing things we would like for ACURA to add/change about the RL for the next model year "06" or even earlier.

I am not talking about major changes that usually occur when a model is redesigned...but more along the lines of minor modifications or tweaking to make the car even better...

Suggestion:

Color changes (interior and exterior)

XM or Sirius

heated back seats

ventilated/cooled seats

more or less cup holders/storage

better speakers

changes in the brakes

changes in tires

keyless system

Just examples...I am sure you will have other ideas

Thanks.

kfhmail · February 2005

1. I would love to see Acura add ventilated seats to the RL as soon as possible. (front and rear if possible).

2. Heated rear seats

bodble2 · February 2005

I would like to see Acura reduce the price of the RL for the Canadian market by about 10%.

adam_kelley · February 2005

I've read some previous posts mentioning problems with the transmission or SH-AWD mechanism, and not sure if what I've experienced is the same or my car is starting to develop a more serious problem.

The last few times I drove my car, I noticed that after accelerating around a turn, after slowing down (releasing the gas) the car makes a "growling" sound in the transmission - it's almost like when you downshift when you're going just a little too fast, but in this case it's not as loud and the car doesn't slow down any. You can feel the car vibrate a little and then it goes away (it lasts no more than a second or two) and it doesn't happen again. I haven't been able to reproduce this.

I recall reading some posts about some "transmission" fluid in the SH-AWD mechanism being low. Could this be what's happening?

I plan to call the dealer, but I'm afraid, like me, they won't be able to reproduce the problem, and so won't be able to do much. But if someone else has had this problem, and can provide some further insight I might be able to use in my discussion with the dealer, it would be most helpful.

I'm beginning to get worried about breaking my rule of "not buying the first model-year of a major redesign"... my car still has less than 5,000 miles.

reallegend · February 2005

Stay with your order. You'll appreciate the look it adds to the interior.

Hopefully you won't have to wait that long. I received mine last week, so they are shipping their backorders.

markcincinnati · February 2005

Many modern premium cars with auto transmissions actually do hold the lower gear (or even downshift) to provide, I can only assume, engine braking.

I would think this is a feature -- not a problem.

adam_kelley · February 2005

Unfortunately I wish it was only the engine downshifting, but I'm pretty sure this is definitely not the case...it's a sound I've never heard before (I only mentioned the downshifting because the sound sort of resembled it, and the feel). I'm quite concerned about this as I've read some posts about the problem with the SH-AWD. No warning lights or any other indication of a problem other than the "grinding/growling" sound after a hard acceleration while turning.

jjacura · February 2005

Most Acura dealers have enough information by now on potential problems with this car. I recommend you take it in to a dealer right away. Fead back in this forum can possibly give you misinformation.

steven9179 · February 2005

I absolutely agree with these two ideas

steve

cove148 · February 2005

Price of car can be reduced by making these options as has Lexus & Infiniti.

AWD & Navigation.

Should help get the car to a competitive price point.

fmcgirt · February 2005

Outside temp moved to rear view mirror OR

outside temp displayed with total odometer mileage NOT trip odometer.

Oil pressure and voltmeter added to Fuel/Temp guage.

Programmable option to use HFC voice and data through OnStar cell phone so that one will not have to depend on Bluetooth quirks and another cell phone. Also would like to be able to dump address book from cell phone, pocket pc, or palm devices to OnStar address book - maybe also Nav system address book. Would save a lot of adding stuff by hand. In other words provide a sync facility for these devices.

bodble2 · February 2005

I forgot about another change to wish for --- how about a low engine oil level indicator, or warning. Actually I think this should be standard fare for all cars. If they have something trivial like low windshield washer warning, why not something for oil? Even the Echo econo-hatch has an oil level indicator.

markcincinnati · February 2005

The car would be dead if AWD was made an option since the car would remain FWD.

The RL is a bargain, relatively speaking -- make that a 300HP V8 and rock on.

Or, make the car RWD, base, and AWD an option.

AWD -- at most -- accounts for $2,000 at the retail level. Still seems like a bargain.

The M's from Infiniti may have the formula you would like. They seem to merit all our attention if we are indeed looking at such cars as the Acura, Audi, Chrysler 300C AWD and perhaps even the new GS from Lexus.

A few years ago I bought an Audi A8 -- the next year, 1998, tiptronic was added, more features were made standard and the price took a few K dive. The following year, more standard features and a lower price yet.

I have noticed that each year the cars seem to cost less when you factor in features and price/performance just seems to get better all the time.

valuebuyer · February 2005

LOL!

If you do the math, even with Mr. Greenspan helping out the Acura Canada thieves with the last rate hike (and lower $CAD), I think Santa Claus needs to cut the MSRP about 13% to put more than a handful of these on urban Canadian roads. By the way - that Infinti M is AMAZING - and all for 20K less - you even get heat/ventilated seats standard. Ironically, Acura aimed for 'BMW cachet' thinking a jacked price would do it. The M reviews are coming out and saying M beats the Bimmer - on .....head to head lux comparo/value. Maybe just jacking a price isn't such a hot 'Automotive Genius in Charge' strategy.

nate · February 2005

Make heated seats like Audi. Heat the whole seat(no cold spots), heat passenger back area and back seats, and more than two settings and not just luke warm and very hot. get rid of the continous chime for seat belt. power plug in the trunk. ski sack. folded back seats. thighter suspension. more cupholders. less idiotic messages on nav screen. put outside temp with heating system display. a tire size that is available from other manufacturers. these are just some suggestions for the next model.

markcincinnati · February 2005

It is my belief and observation that Acura targeted the Audi A6, not the BMW 5 series. Conversely, it would appear that Infiniti targeted the BMW 5 and more or less ignored the A6.

I have read the Car and Driver article on the A6, watched the TV version of C&D review and read several reviews of the Acura RL, one in each of the big three (or is it four) US mags: Car & Driver, Road & Track, Motor Trend and Automobile. Recently and historically the editors opine or state as fact that Acura targeted the A6.

In some respects this makes sense since Acura's RL was always FWD (as was the Audi even though quattro was always a low cost option).

According to these editors, Audi has -- with the new A6 -- become the "most luxurious" of the German brands (of course leading one to the conclusion that BMW remains the most sporting, although somewhat austere).

Then you read the comparo of 6 of the premium class current members and number one and number two (so says Motor Trend) are the Infiniti M35, closely followed by the Acura RL. Poor ol' Audi goes to number 4 of 6 -- but still its interiors are said to be "jewel like" and "puts the others on the truck" (C&D).

Where was I, Oh yea -- Acura's own marketing people not too many years ago said that the RL was meant to be budget luxury (with some performance ability) from Japan, like Audi was budget luxury (with performance abilities [aplenty]) from Germany.

Each company probably targets a competitor, a segment, etc. Infiniti w/RWD seems to be a natural to go after or be compared with BMW; and, Acura with SH-AWD (I wish the Japanese would stop with all the letters of the alphabet when they name something, but that is another subject) based on a FWD platform (just like Audi, currently and historically) seems to be targeting the Audi buyer, perhaps not the Audi loyalist, but someone who has, shall we say, an open mind.

Of course, I could be wrong.

sjohnson11 · February 2005

I am waiting to buy this car - all I want is ventilated seats (like Canada has) and that will close the deal for me (if not, the M35X looks promising)

But if I was starting a wish list I would also add

1. a backup camera

2. laser cruise control

clpurnell · February 2005

Hey guys I started a new comparison topic and wanted to invite you guys over.

clpurnell, "New M35/45 vs Lexus GS vs BMW 5 vs E-class vs A6 vs RL" #, 8 Feb 2005 4:53 pm

jjacura · February 2005

Excuse Me...I am not doing her job....she's great. (Pat the Host) But I just want to say that anyone interested in joining CLPURNELL'S comparison discussion save yourself some time and go to:

http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef26837
INSTEAD!

(LUXURY PERFORMANCE SEDANS)

ferrelli · February 2005

Like you, I would expect it to work since the player is obviously DVD capable, but after several tries, I am convinced DVD+RW discs don't work. (They just spit out without trying to play.) I'm borrowing a DVD-R drive to test that format out this weekend.

FWIW: my local dealer didn't have a clue (he thought I meant video DVDs...) and the Acura help line couldn't answer the question either. Their suggestion? "Try it!"

Acura RL

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