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Cadillac DeVille

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  • richm4richm4 Member Posts: 169
    Rdesman, yeah I'm kinda hesitant to buy a new caddy, even with all the discounts, due to the depreciation.

    I'm also considering a Lexus ES300 which I'll probably have to pay close to sticker for. But at least when I trade it in 5 years, I can get 40-50% of my money back.
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    Elsewhere in Edwards is a useful tool called "total cost of ownership" or something like that. You can compare all aspects of the five year costs for the Cadillac and other competitive vehicles. Even though raw depreciation for the Cadillac may be greater, the total five year costs are, in my opinion, close enough so that you can make a rational decision based on merely which car you like the most without any sleepless nights. Note though when you use the tool that the interest expenses calculated will not be valid particularly if you can get the 2002 Cadillac with zero % interest. But whatever, do not overdose on the Advil.
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    When you trade in ANY 5-6 yo car Mr. dealer
    will HOSE you on the trade anyway. The market
    on 300s are pretty soft now too ! Check over
    at real world trade in values in the smart
    shopper thread. Those guys can tell ya !
  • oldsman01oldsman01 Member Posts: 1,203
    I'd skip the Lexus(or at least go with an LS) and get the DTS. The ES300 is a fancy Camry, the Deville is a luxury car from design up. As for the $6K discount, is this taken off MSRP or off a negotiated price? If the price is already below MSRP and then you take the 6K, it is a pretty good deal. Deville DTSs are VERY nice cars. I sat in one at an auto show this past weekend and while my tastes and driving style lean toward a CTS or even an STS, I'd easily pick a DTS over an Escalade(or ES300) any day. If your keeping the car 5 years, then the resale problem won't be as bad. The first year or so is when they drop the most. And DTSs are not as common as base Devilles so if you keep your mileage at a reasonable level and keep the car in good shape, it should be worth something when you go to trade or sell.
  • richm4richm4 Member Posts: 169
    Oldsman01, the $6K is cashback from the factory, ON TOP of another $6K discount for being a relative of a GM employee, PLUS another $2300 rebate I have on my GM card.

    So basically, I can get a loaded $52,000 sticker price 2002 DTS "out the door" for around $41,500, or I can get a 2003 ES300 that stickers for $35,500 out the door for around $35,500 (no Mark Levinson stereo).

    Based on the discount from sticker price, the caddy is the big winner, but taking into account depreciation and reliablity makes the Lexus deal not so bad.
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    You could buy the 2002DTS with all the discounts,"flip" it to one of your very close friends on this message board, and with the profit go buy your ES300 at a now lower net price. What state do you live in just out of curiosity?
  • oldsman01oldsman01 Member Posts: 1,203
    A new car with an MSRP of 51K for 41K? My mind would be made up already. That is an excellent deal. This is a Cadillac your talking about, not a Kia. And getting the car that cheap to begin with should help you with resale down the road. Like I said before, if you want a Lexus, buy a real Lexus(GS or LS) otherwise save yourself another 10K and just buy a loaded Camry V6.
  • richm4richm4 Member Posts: 169
    I live in Chicago. Unfortunately, one of the provisions of the GM employee discount is that one must keep the car at least 6 months before selling it, otherwise I (and my father-in-law who is the actual employee) could be disqualified from the program in the future.

    I'm really starting to think the DTS is my best deal, even though I really would prefer to spend in the mid 30's for a new car. I realize I can get a CTS for that price, but the CTS interior seems really downmarket to me.
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    Checking the GM family first site today.
    $6000 rebate or 0% int. on 2002 Devilles.
    Bummer when I got mine it was 3k. 3 weeks
    later 4k, NOW 6k....................geo

    BTW my base deville with roof, bun warmers,
    chromies, special paint, etc was 33k OTD
    minus trade
  • richm4richm4 Member Posts: 169
    Sonjaab, the DTS rebate has been 6K since at least Sept. Have they just made the 6K rebate on ALL Devilles?

    There's not that much left in 2002 DTS inventory now. I may need to take a long ride to other dealerships to see what's there. I'm sorry I didn't jump at a loaded black on black DTS a few weeks ago...now it's gone.

    By the way, what's the address of the GM family first site?
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    Does anyone know the details of how to program individual names into the information display instead of "driver 1" and "driver 2". I know it can be done by the dealer but I'm bored and want to do it myself if possible.
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    www.gmfamilyfirst.com
    I think the 6k rebate is a GM family
    special only. Not sure.........
    When I bought it was 3k then a month
    later it went to 4k....Remember ya need
    your sponsors SS# to access site. The
    new site is SLOW and a PIA to get going.
    .............geo

    BTW: Use GM Buypower..let your finger do
    the walkin'
  • sonjaabsonjaab Member Posts: 1,057
    From what i understand a GM dealer must
    do it ! Others say different tho....
    I have scoured the manual and
    it sez nowhere how to do it on my 02.
    They can put any message ya want for
    #1 and #2 keys.........geo
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    I have found Cadillac depreciation to be very high. It's just the way it is ......
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    Back in the day, Cadillacs held their value quite well.
  • flamingoflamingo Member Posts: 5
    I drove my 2001 DHS from Florida to Illinois
    last week and I averaged 27 miles per gallon.
    I think that's very good for a big car.
  • houndoghoundog Member Posts: 21
    Re: Flamingo trip - 27mpg is not just good, it's phenomenal!! I remember when Caddy's were lucky to get 12mpg. They have come a long way over the last 20 years. And the best is yet to come. When they get back to the rear wheel drive platform, look out. They will run with the very best (lets see that new V-12 soon!!)
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    Like a 59 Eldorado or Sedan Deville :-)
  • fjk57702fjk57702 Member Posts: 539
    The 59 Cadillacs should have gotten about 15 MPG on the highway assuming that you were not exceeding the speed limit. City/local driving would have been about 10-12 MPG.
  • abc246abc246 Member Posts: 305
    I had to add that 20 years ago would be 1983. That year my grandfather bought a new Deville with the 4.1 V-8. That car consistently got 26-28 mpg on the highway, so I don't think that Cadillac has done much in the last 20 years for gas mileage. We also had a 82 Fleetwood, 85 Fleetwood, 91 Deville that returned similar highway mileage too.
  • fjk57702fjk57702 Member Posts: 539
    has made fuel efficiency much better. Fuel injection on Cadillacs became available in the late 70's as an option and standard on most cadillacs in 1980. However, the RWD Fleetwood shifted back to a Chevy 350 at some point, which was then upgraded to fuel injection later. The worst fuel consumption was probably the 73 and 74 models with the 500 cubic inch V8 with exhaust recirculation and no cat.
  • abc246abc246 Member Posts: 305
    I had to add that 20 years ago would be 1983. That year my grandfather bought a new Deville with the 4.1 V-8. That car consistently got 26-28 mpg on the highway, so I don't think that Cadillac has done much in the last 20 years for gas mileage. We also had a 82 Fleetwood, 85 Fleetwood, 91 Deville that returned similar highway mileage too.
  • fjk57702fjk57702 Member Posts: 539
    I have an 02 Seville with a 4.6 liter V8 that is getting 19-20 running around town. Highway mileage I don't know as yet. The car was either a trick or a treat from the dealer on Halloween.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...a 2002 Seville STS. It delivers about 25 MPG highway on the average.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    my 95 Eldorado ETC always averages 19.5 mpg
  • plrodplrod Member Posts: 13
    Recently purchased this car w/49K; I've about 1K miles to purchase the factory extended warranty or pass (risk it); everything checks out ok at this time but I don't know which way to go as this is my first Cadi - and I've heard that they tend to require a bit of attn maint wise, but then again everthing I've read about this car indicates that it's pretty reliable. I've had a few Chryslers and I wouldn't own one w/o an extended warranty - does Cadillac fall into this category or not. Of course the dealer's service adviser suggests it's a must. What do you think?
  • fjk57702fjk57702 Member Posts: 539
    Can you extend the warranty coverage for 3 full years? If the price is ~$500 per year (depending on additional miles) then I think that is a good price. Engine failure is very expensive although unlikly, but the transmission is a 2-3000 repair. Water pumps and A/C problems are also potential problems.
  • bolivarbolivar Member Posts: 2,316
    Get the warranty if it is the Cadillac 'Certified' warranty. This is a bumper-to-bumper warranty. The price was $600 about 4 years ago.
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    I for one am not interested in making car payments and having repair bills at the same time. Since I plan to keep my 2002 Deville for a long time I have looked into this plan (I'm not interested in aftermarket plans, just the GM product) and alternative ways to purchase it. I got a quote directly from GM after sending in the form in the new vehicle warranty book and then searched the Web for alternative sources after I got the direct pricing. I found one Cad dealer in Pennsylvania selling the GM plan at a substantial discount and with no sales tax since I was out of state. They are at www.gmoutlet.com. Please note that this is just a lead for you to explore, and not a recommendation as I have not purchased yet. What was odd about my car purchase was that I wanted to buy the extended warranty from the dealer and have it financed along with the car but the dealer had NO interest in selling it, even at full retail---very strange as I am sure they had an additional profit opportunity.
  • flamingoflamingo Member Posts: 5
    I'm getting an intermittent "service stability
    system" message on my 2001 DHS. Does anyone
    know what this is all about? I would like to
    know what I'm talking about before I take the
    car to my dealer.
  • wwhite2wwhite2 Member Posts: 535
    The system has set a trouble code.The dealer has to read the code and repair the problem
  • mlm4mlm4 Member Posts: 401
    Question was posted a couple of times, and I didn't see a response. In the Bonneville and some other vehicles with the DIC, the text that says "Driver 1" or "Driver 2" can be replaced with a customized phrase. This requires a Tech 2 scan tool, so unless you have one or know someone with one, you'll have to get the dealership to do it. You may also have to explain all this to them if they look at you funny when you ask for this to be done.
  • mlm4mlm4 Member Posts: 401
    I'm a loyal GM owner, although I've always fretted about the build and material quality of their products compared with the Japanese or Germans. I sat in a 2003 Deville DHS at the auto show this weekend, and was appalled. The rear vanity visors were falling out of the headliner, and when I pressed them back in place, they barely stayed put with flimsy clips. Same for the overhead console up front. It seems to me that the interior fit and finish of the Deville is no better than a Chevrolet. I expect more from Cadillac (and Chevrolet as well) and just don't get why GM can't get their act together.
  • lemkolemko Member Posts: 15,261
    ...are not always the best place to judge a car's quality. Thousands of people and their children pass through these cars and break and steal things. I've seen plenty of Mercedes and Lexi with knobs and such missing or broken off. One S-Class I sat in had the entire driver's power seat switch broken off. I wouldn't be surprised if some kid didn't hang onto that vanity mirror and yanked it from the headliner.
  • mlm4mlm4 Member Posts: 401
    After I wrote my post it occurred to me that someone would suggest that auto show cars are abused -- and I agree. But not in this case. I chose the example of the vanity mirrors because they were exceptionally flimsy (and would be in a new, unabused car as well). I have friends with Toyotas and Hondas and the difference in the quality of the interior trim between those cars and the Caddy is striking. In those other cars, sunshades don't feel like they are twisting the attachment points, switches click with a satisfying and precise feel, and I can't flex the console or door panels with my fingers. All I'm saying is that I'm disappointed that GM can't replicate that level of solidity in their cars. The $52,000 Caddy just seemed like a glaring example to me.
  • fjk57702fjk57702 Member Posts: 539
    I don't think the sun shades in my 2002 Seville are as nice as the ones that were in my 98 Aurora. The vanity mirrors in them are not particularly "heavy duty" either, although I'm not sure I would want them built to with stand excessive abuse either. Yes, I think Cadillac has a ways to go to justify $50000+ price tags. I got mine for $10,000 off though, so I am happy.
  • oldsman01oldsman01 Member Posts: 1,203
    I can somewhat agree that Chevrolets seem to not have very good grade interior parts, but I've always been impressed with Cadillacs. Maybe they are still not up to MB or Lexus standards, but certainly better than your typical Honda or Toyopet. Speaking of Toyos, I've noticed their interiors seem to have much cheaper materials these days. Not long ago I rode with a co-worker who has a 1990 Camry LE. Nothing special about the performance of the car and the retarded motorized shoulder belts reminded me why I never even considered older Japanses cars, but I found the interior trim very nice. The cloth on the seats and door panels was very rich, almost like the plush cloth Buicks and Cadillacs used to offer. What I've seen in modern day Camrys is the typical "mouse fur" type cloth that pretty much everyone is using. Guess thats their way of trying to upsell you to leather.
  • barry45rpmbarry45rpm Member Posts: 98
    ...and you'll see that to get the "same car" from MB or Lexus would cost at least 10 grand more. The Caddys are more feature laden than either of the others, and have room in them for 5 real passengers and 3 bodies in the trunk...and given the economic climate nowadays, arent you glad they run on regular?
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    When was the last time you had to get 3 bodies in the trunk at the SAME time? Time for an Escalade perhaps.
  • oldsman01oldsman01 Member Posts: 1,203
    Okay, 3 or even 4 sets of golf clubs along with some luggage:)
  • barry45rpmbarry45rpm Member Posts: 98
    Maybe a head & torso rolled up in a carpet, 2 bags of clubs, and a baseball bat to press on the steering wheel airbag cover to honk the horn which requires so much effort that there's PROOF that you now have to be younger to drive a Caddy...
    By the way, get the bucket seats. Have you ever tried to sit in the "front middle" seat? Ya have to open the sunroof to sit erect.
  • rdesmanrdesman Member Posts: 43
    Would the traditional Cadillac buyer crowd be joking about the number of bodies that can be carried in the Deville? I doubt it. We are living proof that the new and sarcastic (I hope) crowd has been targeted successfully by the GM marketing group. However, when they start offering a fluid proof liner option for the trunk we will know that their focus groups and research have truly struck paydirt.
  • chevymalibu19chevymalibu19 Member Posts: 49
    We have a deville with about 66,000 miles. The call is stalling from time to time. Mostly when we stop at lights. Has anyone had this problem?
  • gk3gk3 Member Posts: 13
    chevymalibu19, what year/model is your Cadillac?
    I would suggest that you take it to the service department of your friendly Cadillac dealership as soon as possible. Most likely, your car's crank sensors will need to be replaced. Let us know what will be done and if that fixes the problem. Good luck!
  • chevymalibu19chevymalibu19 Member Posts: 49
    thanks alot, we will do that. It is a 2000
  • oldsman01oldsman01 Member Posts: 1,203
    Wow, 66K on a Y2K model. I guess thats further evidence that modern day Cadillacs are still an excellent road car.
  • dickr2dickr2 Member Posts: 1
    I have the Automatic Climate Control System and have no heat. I have flushed out everything and changed the thermostat, but still no heat. Is there a valve that allows heat vs. a/c somewhere.
  • chevymalibu19chevymalibu19 Member Posts: 49
    Yeah, its a good road car actually. It's my parents car. They got it used actually, with about 17,000 miles on it. They both drive it back and forth to work. Total about 70 miles per day. They travel alot back and forth to texas. We live in Oklahoma. So far they are very satisfied.
    I myself drive a 98 malibu 116500 miles on it.
  • seifert1seifert1 Member Posts: 1
    Purchased 2001 Cadillac with 8000 miles after 25,000 miles the engine sounds like a diesel
    for the first 5-10 minutes after start up. Have been back to dealer 3 times with no resolution. Dealer claims it is carbon build up.Now with 48,000 miles getting close to end of wty.
    Any answers or recommendations?
  • barry45rpmbarry45rpm Member Posts: 98
    Have them check for a bad coil pack & be sure u are running the latest engine computer programming available for the car. It shouldn't be "carbon build up" even if the car was used as an ice cream truck doing 10 MPH all day.
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