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Saab 9-5 Sedan

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Comments

  • jwolljwoll Member Posts: 2
    Just went out to admire my brand new Aero in freezing temps and noticed condensation in both headlights. Any reason for concern?
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    Ya may want to read the contract or call SFSC just to make sure they won't balk when the car is returned with mismatching tires. Some leasing companies don't like that.

    A number of 9-5 owners have had good luck with the Yokohama Avid V4 as they're good quality and affordable.
  • buysaabbuysaab Member Posts: 3
    In reading "
    #1194 of 1203 How's the reliability in '99 9-5 SE V6s? by bszeto", where in Canada, or the USA, does one find a clean used 9-5? I'm looking for the V6 Turbo and there seems to be few of them as mentioned in the message shown above. I'm looking west of the Rockies on either side of the border.
  • white951white951 Member Posts: 18
    There is an independant local dealer with 2 1999 9-5's. One is an SE with 35k miles and the other is the base with the 2.3T with 28k miles and both are listed on the internet for $18k. I drove by after hours and the SE is nice, nice, nice. I have been trying to educate myself here and at saabnet. Is a TSB a recall in which the Saab dealer is required to fix. I looked at the TSB guide here on Edmunds and am wondering what these mean. I have heard about the ECU TSB, but i don't understand how and what I should do regarding it.
  • dskidski Member Posts: 414
    You mentioned that 2 of the tires are in almost new condition. If this is the case, just purchase 2 mxv4's. If all 4 tires are a brand and model match, you shouldnt have any problems returning to the lease company.

    You could also look into replacing all 4 with something like Bridgstone 950's. I did that with my last 9-5 and loved the tires. I'm not sure if 4 950's would be cheaper than 2 mxv4's but worth a look I'd say.

    Good Luck
    Drew
  • wishnhigh1wishnhigh1 Member Posts: 363
    does the 99 9-5 model come with a limited slip differential?
  • aggie76aggie76 Member Posts: 266
    Anyone out there, besides me, wondering if its worth the extra cash to move "up" to 9-5 vs 9-3? Space, options, etc. seem very similar; at least when other two 9-3 models arrive in '03.

    I haven't made final car decision to replace my current one but this lack of contrast seems apparent to me.
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    If the cars are not at a Saab dealer, get the VIN's and take to a Saab service department. They should be able to look up all the service history for the car. Especially important on the 1999 models, as this had a number of electronics recalls.
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    There's some very significant discounts on the 9-5 right now, so the difference in price may not be that significant.

    The 9-5 will be slightly bigger, the ride is more refined and if you go with the Aero you'll have way more POWER!

    I've been driving a 9-5 Linear for about a year and totally enjoy the car. I went to look at the new 9-3s. I would still go with the 9-5.
  • white951white951 Member Posts: 18
    Does the ignition problem only exist on the 4 cyclinder? I am looking at a low mileage SE. Also is the blue smoke issue only on the 4 cylinder. What happens if you don't replace the turbo when there is a blue smoke issue at startup?
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    My sister drives a 2000 SE w/ V6 and one of her DI cassettes failed, too. If you read thru the posts on saabnet.com, you'll see more references to failures in the 4 cyl models, but that could very well be due to the fact that the 4 cyl engines are much more common.
  • hintzhintz Member Posts: 71
    What type of discounts are being offered on the 9-5 besides the low apr? I was able to find that information about 2weeks ago but cant remember where it was posted the dealer cash? thanks in advance
  • tomekktomekk Member Posts: 310
    Yeah, I was looking at it on Edmunds, and then it disappeared.
    Dealer cash ranged from 3500 on Aero wagon to 5200 on Linear sedan.
    If you go to www.carsdirect.com, you'll see that their price references rebates that expire on 12/2 - but are not quantified in $$$... that's all I know. I wonder why Edmunds would pull that rebate info... GM was unhappy? Same thing on '02 Mazda Millenia - there was first $4K rebate going on, then 5K. They never showed it, and their TMV for Millenia is completely off-base (as in way too high). I think it is the same in 9-5 case.
    Talking about misinformation!

    Tomek
  • grumbgrumb Member Posts: 21
    Check: http://www.gmsupplierdiscount.com/incentives.html
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    Thanks for the link, grumb. Do the Linear discounts carry over to the Aero? I've heard (on various other BB postings) there are similar discounts for the Aero but have never seen an 'official' document or reference.
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    Do the Linear discounts carry over to the Aero?

    No. Don't know why anyone would think that. GM documents don't say that.

    That's not to say it's never been offered or won't be. Just that it isn't now.
  • hintzhintz Member Posts: 71
    2002 aero w/ auto/metallic/visibility pkg msrp of 41600.00 the offered 35k. I offered them 32K. They declined, I walked. Was this a good deal or better that I walked? Help!
  • tomekktomekk Member Posts: 310
    It seemed fair. Carsdirect .com shows $35,828 for this configuration (with a rebate until 12/2).
    Oh, but it is 2002 - just noticed. Yeah, I'd try 33 - 33.5. Good luck.
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    By my calculations you had maybe another $1000 to play with from $35K. $32K was too low and I would have let you walk too.

    If you want the car try $34K but don't expect to buy it much lower than that.

    If you are a current SAAB owner there's also a $500 loyalty cash bonus too.

    $35K is a reasonable price for everyone involved.
  • firephoenix777firephoenix777 Member Posts: 59
    I just got the 9-5 brochure and under the Turbocharged Engines section for the Aero, it said with the manual transmission, you get an additional overboost function with no less than 272lb.ft. available for up to 20 seconds. Anybody know what it means? Is it like a button that you push or you just keep flooring the car for the power?
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    Is computer controlled. No manual intervention. It ain't the Mach V or anything ;)

    Only found on manual tranny models as the auto tranny cannot handle the added torque.
    http://www.saabnet.com/tsn/models/2002/pr6.html
  • firephoenix777firephoenix777 Member Posts: 59
    I'm new to SAAB. Do you know when the next model change for the 9-5 will be? I sat in the new 9-3 and 9-5 yesterday. The interior of 9-3 impresses me. I think it's better than the Audi/VW interior. Definitely better than 3-series. It's hard to decide if I should go for the extra power in the Aeros or the interior of the 9-3.
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    Hard to say right now. It really depends on what global platform a new 9-5 will be built on. There's some speculation out there but no commitment, AFAIK. Market forces will dictate some of these decisions (a new 9-5 will need an AWD version and I've even heard a new V8 could be developed for it). I spoke to some SAAB officials at SEMA and they weren't too informative; prolly cuz they didn't know either.

    The current 9-5 went thru a massive overhaul in 2002 so don't expect too many changes until an all new car comes out.

    One big thing to consider is interior and trunk room. I like the new 9-3 but it is a smaller car than the 9-5. The 9-5 may look & feel small but it is very roomy, even for big folks (I'm 6' 4"). The hatchback is no more in the 9-3 and there is no wagon version like there is on a 9-5. Two rather different cars, the 9-5 & 9-3.

    Hope this helps.
  • wishnhigh1wishnhigh1 Member Posts: 363
    I recall someone made an offer to buy an Aero for 32,000, but the salesman refused. Here is one I just saw on ebay for 32.9k


    Better hurry


    http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=1873170349&category=31867

  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    I've had good experience with the dealership (BRI Saab - OkC, OK) that's offering that Aero at $32.9k. They've been around for a while. I buy all my parts/accessories from them for my 9-5 wagon. They offer a standard 20% off list on Saab parts. (800) 749-1806

    I have no affiliation with them whatsoever, I am just a satisfied customer.
  • lazuralazura Member Posts: 43
    Based on my calculations, you should be able to get an Aero for around $32K.

    Invoice - $37157
    Dealer Cash Discount - less $4000
    Lease Discount - less $1000
    New invoice - $32157

    Based on the above, I don't see why a Saab dealer would not take about $32500 for an Aero, especially since Saab is in such bad trouble financially. Also, Saab has a 2% holdback which contributes more profit for them. I'm thinking of offering $32500 for a 2003 Aero to my dealer and leasing, considering the money factor is .00046 and the residual is 49%. Has anyone else had any luck with this tactic?
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    The only dealer cash I am aware of is on the Linear models only. Where do you find info about dealer cash on the Aero?

    Same question on "lease discounts". What is that exactly?

    And finally, exactly which Aero has an invoice of $37157?

    Oh BTW, just because SAAB Corporate is hurting financially, do not expect the dealers to just rool over and hand you a $5000 under invoice deal. If you can make it work, great. But at least post all pertinent details of your negotiations so we all can figure out how to do this.
  • beer47beer47 Member Posts: 185
    In Sunday's NY Times @ North Jersy Dealer. Nicely equipped, 3000 demo miles, $26,500 or so was the price. Sounds like a great deal for someone. The timing is wrong for me. 4 cyl motor.
  • lazuralazura Member Posts: 43
    bretfraz,
    CarsDirect has the Aero invoice at $37157, without any options. Also, this same site has the Aero purchase price LESS than invoice at $35405. It looks like CarsDirect took $4000 off MSRP ($39275), which leads me to believe that Saab is offering dealer incentives of $4000. Also, the $1000 lease discount comes directly off the cap. cost only if you lease. This amount came from the leasing board. I am considering a Saab for my next purchase, but only if I can get all these discounts. The Saab 9-5 Aero is a nice vehicle, but it is in no way comparable to a BMW, MB or Lexus in the 40K range. A 9-5 Aero for around 34K to 35K is a much better price point for this vehicle.
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    Based on what I've found at places like GM Family Savings the only 9-5 incentive is on the Linear model. I rarely hear of any factory incentives on the Aero and there does not appear to be one on now. So my sources tell me CarsDirect is wrong.

    I've never heard of $1000 off the top for a lease until I read your post. I'll keep digging but so far no official or semi-official confirmation is available.

    A "no options" Aero might be tough to find. There aren't too many options to begin with but a 5 speed Aero with nothing on it is a rare bird from what I can tell. Finding that will take a nationwide search.

    Lastly, Road & Track did a comparo of 11 sport sedans over the summer. The 9-5 Aero finished fourth but I don't know why. The editors did not have one bad thing to say about the car. Well, I think they criticized it for not offering a CD changer. The IS300 finished in 3rd but received several adverse comments. The C280 finished towards the back of the pack.

    All three of those cars you mentioned will offer buyers the pleasure of near MSRP purchases along with the enjoyment of full market price interest rates. Happy full-price paying!!
  • nevcoolnevcool Member Posts: 22
    What type of deals are out there on '02, '03 Aero's. I understand that 9-5's dont hold their resale value. What can you expect for a used '02 Aero, Thanks.
  • cdndrivercdndriver Member Posts: 86
    Hi,
    I'm thinking of getting a Saab. It's the only car my wife likes. I'm also considering VW passat 4mo, and Subaru. I like the look of the 9-5, too, but I'm concerned with reliability, because I would hold onto it for awhile. I know that these depreciate like a stone. One dealer told me a guy had a 9-3 for 9months, and wanted to get a WRX. The value of the car was 50% less. Now, I don't know if that's realistic, but the red book values (I'm in Canada) are way lower than what dealers list them for used. Significantly lower. I don't want to invest in one if it's not reliable and I take a bath on resale. If it's reliable and I can enjoy it for 5+ years, great, I could probably find some deals, but not if they don't hold up. They cost as much as bimmers, even more in some cases, but they don't seem to be the same level of car.
    REgarding the car magazines. I've always felt that they b---ch about the "quirkiness" of the center ignition, and something with the seatbelts. Then they give them a low rating. I think they just can't get over that, and feel they need to knock it because of that. Why should "Quirky" design mean it's not as good a car? They are very biased IMO.
    regards,
    cdndriver
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    With rare exception, anytime someone buys a car and trades it in a few months later they will take a bath. Especially at a dealership where they pay 'wholesale' at best, and even less in a situation where they may have sensed they had a customer who was willing to do a trade for the WRX at any cost. If you intend to keep a car 5+ years, then short-term trade-in values are almost irrelevant compared to reliability. Almost all the consumer organizations have given the 9-5 excellent reviews for both initial quality and long-term reliability.

    You'd be hard pressed to get a BMW for the same price as a similarly equipped 9-5. With the current incentives, a 9-5 is a great value and you'll pay far less than MSRP.

    Yes, the 'quirky' adjective seems to pop up in every Saab review ever written. OK, so the ignition key is in the center console. Big deal, it's been there 20+ years in different models. It would be nice if writers would just get over that. From a functional viewpoint, I've come to really appreciate having the ignition and the window regulators in the center console. It's nice to keep your left hand on the wheel at all times and use your right for ignition, shift, windows, heat/acc, and stereo.

    I drive both a Subaru Outback and a 9-5 wagon, and I must say that though the Outback is endearing in its own right, it doesn't come close to the comfort and performance of the 9-5 on a road trip.
  • cdndrivercdndriver Member Posts: 86
    Hi,
    I test drove a Subaru Outback sedan/vdc-H6. It was a 2002. It was fun, and I was impressed. I took it in a big parking lot and did some tight turns. Fair bit of roll to it, but otherwise, very nice and smooth engine. Man the heater fan is noisey, though. My problem is I don't fit. Even with the seats all the way down, my hair and left side of my head kept brushing the liner and roof. That gets annoying after awhile. I couldn't sit in the back seat without bending my head. So I think they'll have to get taken off my list. They are very nice.
    Lasat night I test drove a Passat with 4mo. I am interested in the vr6, but they only had the W8. WOW. That is peppy and puts you back in the seat! I loved it, but now I must get realistic.

    I stopped by the Saab/Saturn etc. dealer on the way home. I loved the look of the Linear wagon, and the aero sedan. The wagon had the touring package and premium package and was 44,999.00 but I overheard the saleman telling another guy that there was no dickering on price, that was it. He didn't mention anything about incentives. A woman who works near me says she and her husband have a 9-3 and 9-5 wagon. Even though they bought two from the save dealer, they didn't get any break on the price. That knocks them out unless I go used and then I'm concerned about care and repair of that turbo. Very pricey I'm sure. Though they depreciate fast enough that I might find a deal there. Especially in a wagon. So they hold up in the long run? I've found two 99 wagons to look at.
    I must say that I think they are one of the sleekest looking wagons out there, and the cockpit is gorgeous; it looks like a jet!
    regards,
    cdndriver
  • tomekktomekk Member Posts: 310
    1. No discounts on 9-5 wagon... hm, that's unheard of.

    2. Passat doesn't have a VR6 anymore, it has the old 2.8 V6 (190hp) used earlier in Audi A4. VR6 is now used in Jettas and Golfs GTI (2.8 liter with 201hp, there is also VR6 3.2L coming soon in Phaeton and Toureg, also used in Europ in Golft R32). Yummy!

    Tomek
  • rob999rob999 Member Posts: 233
    That non-negotiable price of $44,999 CDN translates into $28,900 USD, which is a pretty decent price if it includes an auto and premium package. Much less than what I paid last March, even with GM employee discount and that month's incentive. I don't dwell on what I paid vs the most current incentives - I just enjoy the car. Historically, 9-5 wagons usually get less of an incentive compared to sedans due to more limited availability.

    If you can swing it, go for it!
  • dskidski Member Posts: 414
    Wow..I didn't even consider what 44K was in US dollars. If $28,900 is correct in US dollars.. that's unheard of. It's no wonder they won't offer any additional discounts. You say that's with a Premium Pkg and Touring Pkg? Ours was equipped with Premium and the Sticker was around $37K US if i recall correctly. Go for it cdn. You won't regret it.

    Drew
  • tomekktomekk Member Posts: 310
    Is that before or after GST?
  • dlbensondlbenson Member Posts: 13
    I need to replace 2 of the original Michelin MXV4+'s and I'd prefer a cheaper alternative as I only have 7 months left on my lease. I am
    considering mixing 2 Yokohama Avid V4's with the 2 remaining original Michelin MXV4+'s.

    Any opinions on whether this makes sense?

    Don
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    How many miles is that for you, typically? I'd understand your logic a bit more if your lease was up in 2 weeks, but it's not.

    You've got all winter ahead of you. I'd install 4 new tires and not worry about the extra $200 or so the additional 2 will cost.
  • dlbensondlbenson Member Posts: 13
    I've already bought 2 new ones several months ago. The MXV4+'s cost me almost $200 each installed! I'd prefer a good cheaper alternative to last the remaining 8,000 miles of my lease.
  • dskidski Member Posts: 414
    Mixing different Tire types is not a good idea. Different tread designs on these types of cars can create poor handling characteristics.

    The other problem you'll encounter is from your Lease Company. When you get your turn-in information, it will be very cleary stated that you WILL be charged for turning in a car with mismatched tires.

    Sometimes they will get very picky and charge for replacing with a Lower Tire Rating as well. However, we did replace our MXV4's with a lower speed rated tire (Bridgestone 950's) before turning in our old 9-5. We loved the tires, they were cheaper and the lease company didn't charge us.

    To others with newer tires, I suggest that you step up your tire rotation schedule. Saab's recommendations are way too long. Rotate every 5-6K and your tires will wear evenly and longer. We used the 10K Saab say on our last one and also experienced 2 tires wearing to fast. Actually, I believe that with the new No Charge Scheduled service, Saab is actually saying that NO rotation is needed. That's insane IMO. The tire manufacturers will Love it though.

    Good Luck
    Drew
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    I rotate mine every 6K and still they'll be gone by 30K. The OE Michelin was not meant to last 100K and be maintenance free.

    The 9-5 tends to wear the outer shoulder and being front wheel drive means the fronts will take most of the punsihment. Check air pressures weekly and run a higher PSI in the fronts than the rears. What's SAAB say you should run, 26PSI or something? Jeez, I run 41PSI in the front and 39PSI in the rear.
  • buysaabbuysaab Member Posts: 3
    I traveled to Canada and bought a used 9-3 through the dealer. I paid the GST and it was refunded plus interest. The B.C. sales tax was waived. It's legal but the cars must have been registered in Canada a minimum of 12 months.
    I've heard that new cars are coming over the border and are being sold to USA buyers. Who knows how this takes place? $44,000.00 CDN$ is $28,106.00 USA$ at today's rate.
  • cdndrivercdndriver Member Posts: 86
    Hi,
    The dealer here says he has a 99 9-5 coming in with the 6 cyl engine. Are these very good engines, and is the 99 a good year or perhaps I should ask, if I go for a Saab 9-5, pre-owned; what would be the best year to look for, assuming it's a clean car? since little has changed to the current one.
    thanks,
    cdndriver
  • dskidski Member Posts: 414
    I like the 4 personally. I've heard that the 6 is very difficult to work on and more expensive to repair. You might check out what people are saying at Saabnet.

    Drew
  • bretfrazbretfraz Member Posts: 2,021
    The V6 is turning out to be more reliable than the 4 and SAAB covers some of the future repair costs with a free timing belt change at 60K. The timing belt issue is about the only negative comment anyone can legitimately make against the V6. And lots of cars have timing belts.

    Both engines are very good and durability is a strong point. Buy the one that gives you the performance you want.
  • firephoenix777firephoenix777 Member Posts: 59
    I am still debating between a new 9-3 or a used (1999-2000) 9-5 or 9-3. I just read a website and it said one of the thing to watch out for when buying a used Saab is rust? Anybody have rust problems with their Saab? I checked out some used Saabs over the weekend and saw some of them have rusts in the brakes? Is that possible? What about the turbo engines? Does the turbo fail easily (my friend's audi has its turbo failed in less than 3 months)?
  • tomekktomekk Member Posts: 310
    Hm, my neighbor had already 3 repairs on the 6 cyl in his 2002 9-5 Arc - all coolant leaks. He is happy he leased and didn't buy used.

    It appears that 9-5 Linear sedan carries about 5K in rebates right now until 1/2 --> carsdirect.com target price is something like USD 30K - pretty close to those $44K Canadian. If I needed a new car, I'd probably go for it (we're talking VW passat $$$ here).

    Happy SAABing -

    Tomek
  • dlbensondlbenson Member Posts: 13
    The turbo on my 2000 95 had to be replaced at ~ 32K. If you're inclined towards a Saab I would put a lot of value on the warranty.
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