Saab 9-5 Sedan

jracine · June 2003

Greetings,

I was just wandering if you would have suggestions as to what is the best way to find a buyer for my prisitine 2002 Aero Steel grey w Touring? I only have 13,000 Km on it!

Going to work abroad this fall...

Any help would be appreciated!

jr@laser-registration.com

blockislandguy · June 2003

Wouldn't the best way to sell an Aero now in Montreal be to throw an ad with an email address (but omit location and phone number) in the Sunday Boston Globe? Offer to email some photos once contacted. If you got the price down to around 24K USD or lower (see article in current issue of Forbes on significant drop in luxury resale values, especially Saab and BMW) that AERO would be on its way down I 91 by mid week with a BC or BU type behind the wheel.

Incidentally, there are several high end used dealers in the Boston metro market who bring in trailer loads of both brand new and slightly used luxury cars and SUVs from dealers in Canada. Seems that our stronger economy is a better market.

dski · June 2003

It's not the economy.. it's the exchange rate difference. Bringing in cars from Canada is an attractive exhange right now.

In fact, some new car dealers in Canada are advertising to the U.S. To add to the incentive with new cars, the pricing strategy in Canada is more aggressive from manufacturers. They sell identical cars there for much less. It's a controversy going on that some officials and dealers are fighting.

amyshubby · June 2003

I decided on the 2000 Saab 9-5 SE instead of the 2001 Accord or Maxima. I am picking it up tomorrow.

Thanks for the advice given. After test driving all three cars, I decided the Saab was much nicer and more fun to drive then the other two.

The other big factor was the extended warranty. It's going to be covered by Saab until September 2006, which alleviated some of the reliability fears I had.

Thanks again. I'm really excited about getting the car tomorrow.

kaparrett · June 2003

Have had my 2003 9-5 Linear for approximately one month now. After having had a '98 Audi A4 and '01 Volvo S60, this is - by far - the most fun and "best" car I have had (I say best, because long term quality of the car will have to be proven).

Had been looking at the 3.0 Arc, but decided on the Linear with the 5M transmission. Was, in my opinion, much more fun to drive. With the Premium and Touring packages, there wasn't much difference between the Arc and the Linear, excepting the 15 hp, ventilated seats and heated rear seats. Unlike a lot of people here it seems, I had a good dealership experience and got the full factory to dealer cash.

I like the Saab for the size, the trim level, and little things like the a/c glovebox and the tilt down side mirror while in reverse. Ditto for the rear parking assist and the cool bi-xenon lights. Granted, these options are available on other cars, but not at the price for which I was able to get the Saab. Also, it's nice to finally have a car that's both fun to drive and where the rear seat passengers aren't completely cramped. The Homelink and autodimming mirrors are great ... after two cars with these features, I would not get one in the future w/out them.

The stereo is quite good - although it would have been nice to have a multiple CD changer as standard. The seats are comfortable and again the room in the rear is excellent. I haven't used the OnStar system except to make a couple of calls, but I'm glad that I have it if ever needed.

Ride quality is good and I haven't had any annoying creaks or rattles (something I did have in my Volvo). Although the interior is a bit dated, it's not offensively so, and I like the unique body stying that's very different than many cars in this arena (5 series, A6). I'm glad that I have the manual tranny as it makes the car a lot of fun to navigate around town and on the highway. Pickup is good thanks to the turbo.

Suggestions would be one touch close operation of the sunroof, and the ability to control the windows/sunroof while outside the car. A electric tilt/telescope of the steering wheel would be nice, but not really necessary for me as I'm the only one who drives the car.

Will definately look at Saab in the future if their large car is anything like the current 9-5. For those who care about such things, I'm a 32 year old male, living in Denver, Colorado.

timmerc517 · June 2003

We're looking to replace our 1997 Subaru Outback Limited Wagon with a car within the $30-$36K range... local Infiniti dealers are offering the FX35 for about $36K while we can pick up a 9-5 Arc for about $32K... I know these two are VERY different cars, and we were originally going to just go with the Infiniti, but we have had a long string of Japanese cars and wouldn't mind something new. However, the reliability of the Saab is questionable apparently, and that is not a strong selling point for a family of 4 with 3 drivers... we also own a 2001 Acura TL and love it very dearly, however we're looking for a car with more "character." The Saab, I know, has unmistakable charm, but the Infiniti is "out there" also. Any suggestions? Go for yet ANOTHER Japanese car for reliability or go for the Saab for an equal amount of charm with maybe a few more problems down the road?

bretfraz · June 2003

After reading your post it seems like you are on a certain wavelength when it comes to cars and style/image. Many people consider Subaru the Saab of Japan. And I equate Infiniti with Saab in many ways. So I don't think your thought process is out of whack - it makes perfect sense to me.

My previous Infiniti, a QX4, was great in many ways. But my current 9-5 SE (same as an Arc) has cost me about the same $$ in service costs. My Saab has not been perfect. The Infiniti wasn't perfect. But both were excellent vehicles that offered a personality different from what everyone else is driving.

If you live in an area with good local service, any reliability worries can be taken care of. You might want to search around for local Saab specialists and try to find out if the local dealer is any good. I'm sure you well know your local Infiniti dealer.

FWIW, I helped my mother buy a new car recently. Based on what she wanted, a 9-5 would have been perfect. Yet I recommended she pass on a Saab because where she lives there is no Saab dealer for almost 100 miles. What did she get? An Infiniti I35.

Hope this helps.

alfaber · June 2003

I just had an experience that may be relevant. I drive an I35, and was helping a friend buy a new car. We drove the FX35, and she ended up with a 9-5 Linear Wagon. BTW: The dealer's opening price was $6500 below MSRP. One other car you might consider is the Nissan Murano. I felt it drove a bit better than the FX35, possibly due to the accelerator calibration when mated with the CVT transmission, and the styling isn't quite as imposing as the FX35's. Plus, it's cheaper.
--Andy

hilstroy1 · July 2003

4 months ago I finally got a Saab. I have always wanted one and with the great discounts being offered my husband agreed that now was the time to get one. I love how sporty the car is, how well it handles and its speed (I traded in a Lincoln Navigator for it - big change!!)

Unfortunately I am having several problems that I am hoping are not indicative of how the ownership of this car will be in the future. The first "problem" was that the passenger side visor broke within the 1st 2 weeks I had it. Not a big deal - just a minor annoyance. But then about a month ago I got in the car and the ESP light came on on the dashboard and never went off. I stopped the car, turned it off and then back on. The light went out. I thought maybe I had accidently hit the button or something. A week later I started the car and left my house. I noticed as I was driving down the road that none of the odometers were working - no speed, no fuel, no tac, nothing, although the car was working fine. Again, I stopped the car, turned it off and restarted. Everything was fine. I haven't had any issues since, but my fear is that it is a symptom of a larger or persistent problem. To make matters worse, my dealer is 60 miles away (I have been told that they are trying to get one in my home town). But I certainly don't want to have to drive out to the dealer on an ongoing basis to resolve issues like these.

Has anyone else had any issues with the 2003 Linear 9-5?

Thanks!

rob999 · July 2003

The issues you're describing don't sound like common problems for a late model 9-5. Did you already take it to the Saab dealer for the 1,000-mile checkup?

Perhaps take it to a local GM dealer or AutoZone to see if the diagnostic computer is showing any codes.

dski · July 2003

We have our second 9-5 and have never had reliability problems and VERY few annoyance problems.

I do have a thought as to what may have happened with your Gauges going out: If this happened during day light hours, it could be that somehow you had inadvertantly hit the "Night Panel" button on the dash and you didn't notice. This would cause all the gauges to shut down as well as turning off their lighting. The only gauge that would function would be the speedometer. If you didn't activate the feature somehow by mistake, your computer could have a malfunction that activated it. If that's the case, don't fret. I simple change out under warranty will fix the trouble and you'll be good to go with an explaination and fix for all your problems. You can expect years of reliable service based on my two previous 9-5's

FWIW.. I think the Night Panel is a wonderful feature. I use this alot when I have to drive long distances at night. I activate it and then Dim the panel lights remaining and it creates a much more comfortable environment for late night drives on Dark Highways.

Drew

buddhabman · July 2003

Tough Choice. I am a Saab fan (Aero Owner) but I love the FX35/45 (AWD, Good engine, Cool Styling). If you can get a good price on the FX35 take it. If sportiness + gas mileage is high on your list then Saab Aero is the way to go. The reliability should be even or to Saab if you have good local dealers.

ffb13 · July 2003

well ,took my saab for the 60000 mile service at a dealer in vermont.....
the price list said $448. for 60,000 mile service

i asked 3 times if it included all of the items that had to be replaced........
to make story short.........when i picked up car i noticed that the serpentine belt was not done, the auto transm. fluid was not done,and they failed to reset the check engine lite.

when i asked why i was told that they inspected it and it was in good shape......no need to replace........even thou i had paid for it in the $448 charge ,as listed on the board in the service dept.
when i suggested i would talk to a lawyer they walked away..........saying that i had used the word lawyer......

i then spoke to one of the owners and explained that he and i had entered into a contractual agreement .....and that he failed to live up to it...............

after 20 minutes of pointing out the merits of my position he agreed to and did all of the work....

to add ,i had asked them to mount 4 new michelin mxm tires ( i got from tire rack ) to replace my oe tires with 60,000 miles on them .they agreed.........they did not tell me that they sent the tires out to an outside contractor..........
the wheels came back damaged......all chewed up.......one needs replacement...........again i reminded them that my agreement was with them and not the outside contractor..........i got a new wheel.........

but,as i drove home ,i blew a new tire.........it happens that they did not replace the valve stem....with a new one.......and it developed a leak due to damage from the installation.......
i did not noticed it until the tire blew up......

so,i had to get a new tire............

and of course,the balance was off so i had to re-do it........all 4 again.

so people,when you bring your saab in for service,ask and inspect......over and over again......

by the way,i bought a new di casette as suggested somewhere here......i now carry this in my car because i drive to fla. quite often and would hate to have this fail somewhere and have to visit a saab dealer .......

..and i have now learned that a number of 9.5 2001 have experienced failure of the turbo at about 19 to 21,000 miles......under warranty.....

dski · July 2003

That doesn't sound like the Typical Saab dealer to me.. Lets hope your experience is more unusual than common. I have always been extremely happy with my dealer. I've been dealing with them for over 8 years now.

Okay... so.. what is a di cassette and why do I need to keep a spare with me?

Drew

blockislandguy · July 2003

Ffb13, I was as unimpressed by your post and its ee cummings punctuation as probably you were impressed by your performance at the dealership. IMHO you strike me as a person just spoiling for a fight with a member of a lower social order. Were you really surprised that the hourly employees (that means they punch a time clock every morning for probably $9-14 per hour, live in a modest home-or trailer in VT-, and don't share your world view) walked away from a "customer" who started talking contract law and lawyers? Did you really have twenty minutes to debate the dealer? Maybe you should ask for a credit, tell them why you should get it and then move on to third party resolution if absolutely necessary. In other words, get a life.

Please clarify though a couple of nagging details.

1) you didn't realize you had a tire going soft from a slow leak "until the tire blew up"? Man, I wouldn't want to see you coming up behind me in the outside lane on I 91 South some night. I could wind up bunted down to Greenfield, MA.

2) Did you not choose to buy new valve stems from the Tire Rack with your tires? Were new valve stems on your repair order? Or did you expect the Saab dealer to mount the Tire Rack tires and throw in for free four new valve stems?

3) Wouldn't you agree that as long as a primary vendor stands behind the work, it doesn't really matter if they have located someone else who can do something faster, better, and/or cheaper? Afterall, isn't this just the law of comparative advantage of nations taken down to the level of the firm?

rob999 · July 2003

Direct Ignition (DI) Cassette replaces conventional distributor and coil. Consists of 4 ignition coils mounted in a single 'cassette' plus other electronic controls. Sits on top of the engine between the banks of the valve cover and has the words "Direct Ignition" printed on the top.

Probably as reliable as any other ignition system on the market, but if it fails the car will die instantly.

I've had mine out when changing plugs and it's a snap to replace. 4 Torx screws (use the Torx driver in the trunk) and disconnect the electrical plug by sliding the locking clip toward the rear of the car, then pull the plug off.

skisummo · July 2003

Hi gang ,
I am new to the group and need some info ASAP.
I am trying to decide on the 2003 9-5 Linear with the 2.3 auto or the 2003 9-5 ARC with the 3.0 auto.
Has anyone heard good or bad reviews,or major differences about the two motors.
Repairs/Etc?
Is invoice minus 5k a good deal?
Any help or info will be greatly appreciated.
Thanks.........JK

ffb13 · July 2003

blockisland guy,

you could not be more wrong.
and ,why the class warfare stament ? are you from the peoples republic of vermont or are you an employee of the dealer.

i will adrress your silly comments as follows.

in conn. the price for the 60,000 mile service is $699.
in vt, it is $448.
...........so, i chose vermont..... i do have a house there and are there quite often.

.little did i know that even thou in their price list they say one thing ,they mean something else. but i could have easily prevailed in court. i have all in writing. and so ,they did what was correct.

i mentioned the lawyer because i was getting nowhere with them ,and i dealt all the way up the line to the co-owner.........

no,i am not full of myself.....nor satisfied with having what was correct ,done....as you suggest.......
i paid for something and i expect to get what i paid for...........
if you are willing to get less for your money than you are told that you will get ,and you do not fight for what is rigth and correct,then ,that is your way.........not mine.

all i wanted was to get my car back with the full work that was promised..............but,i check and i inspect ..........and when i found not all was correct ,i then went up the ladder to get it done right.

it would have been easy and fun for me had they fulfilled their agreement in full .....instead it turned into a bad experience.......

regarding tires.........
any tire dealer or saab dealer knows that when they install a new tire ,a new valve has to go in..........period.

as far as the blowout........i suggest that you talk to any tire dealer and you will find out that it extremely difficult to feel low presure when driving on low profile tires......
i did check the tire before my trip and all was o.k. but once rolling i guess the valve just started to leak and so after a while heat build up took care of blowing it up. no warning of low pressure,nothing.just a blow out.

i did the tire in vermont because they charged me $72 to mount the new tires including balance and all.

the dealer in connecticut wanted $248.00 for the same service .and the local goodyear store wanted $100.00

the michelin dealer would not do it because i got the tires from tire rack..........

so ,i ended up in the hands of an incompetent tire guy who did the work for the saab dealer in vt. because this dealer does not have the equipment to align a car, nor to balance/mount 17 inch tires..........something that i was not told until after i got the car back............

incidentally ,the 60,000 mile service calls for an alignment check and execution....this dealer cannot do it.

by the way when i picked up the car ,they never told me that the tires had been damaged.......i had to inspect them and bring it to their attention.....and only one wheel was replaced even thou all have damage from the impoper tire mounting equipment or technique used by this so called tire dealer.

so, blockisland guy ,if you think that this experience is something that i want ,you are very misguided....i like things to go easy ....i have a very simple mind and like things to be as i am told ...........
byt the way,how did you know that i was on i91 ????

drew,
the di casette ............there are explanations above.......
the reason i got a spare one to carry with me is because i spoke to 6 mechanics at saab dealers all over and they all told me that this is an item that fails more often than other items in the car.

one of the service advisers ,not a mechanic told me that it is more common to have this fail than to have a tire blow out.
and they go usually after 60,000 miles.......and at times they go at at about 30,000 miles but many go on to 120,000 miles..........

while i was at the dealer in vt. they changed one in a car with only 23,000 miles.
i do not want to risk being stranded anywhere so i got one..
the saab dealer in conn. wanted $423.00

the vt. dealer wanted the same ,plus a $235.00 core charge because i did not have an exchange.

i called europarts on the telephone and got it for $338.00...........
on tuesday i drove the saab down to fla. and i towed a motorcycle on a trailer....all was o.k.
the only downside is that i usually average between 32 and 36 mpg.....at approx. 75 to 85 mph.

with the trailer ,i got 20.2 mpg.
i mounted 15 inch tires on the trailer and it was great.

bretfraz · July 2003

Both engines are quite reliable. The V6 has a GM-sourced engine block and components but has been heavily massaged by Saab. About the only real concern with it is the fact that it has a timing belt instead of a chain which needs replacing every 60K (Saab does the first one free). Overall its a smooth, torquey engine that is well suited for most types of driving.

The 4 cyl is the traditional Saab motor. Been around for ages. Almost overengineered and prolly the last Saab motor of its kind. A decent amount of upgrades and mods available. Seems to be a little more troubleprone than the V6 but not troublesome. For the Saab purist the 4 cyl is the only way to go.

Both motors have their quirks and trouble spots but are very good as long as they're maintained well. Since the V6 is heavier the feel of the 9-5 changes a bit. The best thing to do is drive them each for a good bit in all kinds of traffic and get the one you like best.

Invoice minus $5K sounds like an excellent price. Try to get that on a BMW or Mercedes!

bostnwhalr · July 2003

I was at the Saab dealer getting the DI Cassette replaced off my 99' 9-3 with 75k miles. The nice service manager acted like it was a typical wear item. When I asked why they fail, he said that because they are placed on top of the engine, the engine heat (and temperature changes) causes them to need replacement. Also, my second SID has failed, $380 for a new one installed. Overall, I still like the car, but for those of you coming from Japanese cars, you'll be shocked by stuff like this. I hate to say this, but its possibly another reason why Saab hasn't gained significant market share. In this day, where people expect at least 100k without significant problems, that's pretty stupid on Saab's part. However, I believe that Volvo, Audi, VW, Mercedes Benz and even BMW are facing worsening reliability problems. If you want a European car, you could do far worse than a 9-5. Ask my friend with his 1999 A4 with rear main seal leak and bearing failures at 55k - 60k miles.

There was a point to the post. I'm in the market for a 9-5 wagon, circa 2000. Close to the service desk was a used 99' 9-5 wagon SE (with the V-6). As I looked at the car, I was thinking, you know, I should go ask the service writer what he things about the V-6 vs. the 4cyl. Ironically, before I could go over to see him, he looks up and waves me over to come talk to him.

"I didn't tell you this, but go for the 4 cyl. model." He mentioned something about the V-6 having a timing belt while the 4 cyl. having a timing chain. He had no vested interest in selling me a car. I truly appreciated his unsolicited candor.

Anyway, the dealer had a 2000 9-5 2.3t, 41k miles, no leather, but sunroof. $23,900 with 100k bumper-to-bumper warranty. Seeing that another Saab dealer has 2003 Service Loaner wagons with leather and other options for $27k, I'll take a pass on the offer. I could find the same 2000 9-5 on Ebay for $12k. The lower reasonable prices are why I'm considering another Saab. I'll take my chances on replacing a SID and DI once in a while.....

petquality · July 2003

Hi all,

A little bit of background (for context), then a question for anyone who cares to listen.

A few years back, I owned an Audi 200 quattro. It was by any measure a very enjoyable car to drive, but frequent, high maintenance and repair costs eventually lead me to sell it, in favor of a more "practical" Honda Prelude. I knew that someday I wanted to own a well made sporty sedan again.

The Honda is "okay" to drive, but it's not exactly inspiring. However, it has served me better than I could have ever imagined.. I purchased it with about 45k miles, and in 5 years of daily driving and occasional abuse, it's never once broken down. Literally -nothing- has failed on the car until very recently, when I needed to replace the master cylinder. Other than that it's run like a charm every single day.

But the time has come to replace the venerable Honda. I need more room for cargo, and although I imagine the Prelude could continue to serve me well, I'm not sure that I want to be driving a car with its best years behind it.

In researching what's available, it seems to me that the 2001 9-5 Aero fits the bill almost perfectly. It's got plenty of space, power, good mileage, etc. etc. and is reasonably priced (in the 25k range). And as it turns out there's a low mileage specimen at a dealership not far from me.

So I'm looking for some advice from recent owners/ex-owners, enthusiasts, and/or pundits. Is the '01 9-5 going to be the ideal car? Or is it going to be another Audi-like experience, where in one loves the car but hates having to deal with an endless stream of repairs? By way of comparison, Honda Accords don't excite me in the least as a car enthusiast, but I know if I buy one the chances are good that I won't know the service manager on a first-name basis.

This is sort of the classic "fun versus reliable/practical" issue, but I'm wondering if/hoping that the 9-5 Aero might be both.

Any thoughts, feedback would be greatly appreciated!

ffb13 · July 2003

if you read my post and the above post you will get an idea of what you are in for.
so far my 2000 aero which is rated by consumers report as very reliable has had 3 or 4 computers replaced ,an electric fan,an oil leak,and disc brakes.

60,000 miles .so far.

a much fun to drive car and good range...about 525 miles or more i get 600 on long trips at about 80 mph.

if you want reliability stick to honda.
if you want reliability and fun check out infinity g35.

also most saab owners are kind of fanatics.........see posts above.....because the cars used to be unique and charming.......currently they are german opels with a saab name..........if you ever drive an ipel in europe you will understand.

so,

if you want fun fun go saab but you will pay........

if you want the reliability of honda,lexus and infinity....stick to those.

bretfraz · July 2003

One thing (of many) to keep in mind is the 9-5 is much more practical than most of the cars it competes with. The interior is huge with plenty of room front and rear. If you carry people frequently or want/need a roomy car, the 9-5 is terrific.

The 9-5 has a huge trunk and offers flip & fold rear seats which turns it into a fantastic hauler. I know for a fact the G35 doesn't offer this and its trunk is tiny by comparison.

So the 9-5 is equal parts fun and practical. Just depends on what's more important to you.

And while I've never driven an Opel or Vauxhall, I am somewhat familiar with their product lines. I can't think of a single model from those companies that have any tangible similarities to the 9-5. Yeah, there's some parts sharing and some platform sharing but that's a million miles from making Opels and Vauxhalls the same as Saabs.

buddhabman · July 2003

Consumer Reports noted that the quality of the 2001 and later models is much improved over the earlier models. Believe it or not I think GM money has helped with this. We have a 2003(7800 miles) with no problems at all. The only wish I had for the car is a little stiffer springs.

dski · July 2003

Too bad you don't have a dealer like mine. Sounds like yours is clueless. If mine wanted to charge me the cost of a scheduled repair without doing all the work.. explaining it didn't need it.. but we're charging you for it anyway.. I'd be completely done with him! That's insane!

I hope you find better service soon. Good luck.
Drew

ffb13 · August 2003

of course i will never go back to that dealer in vermont.except to get the new wheel he owes me.

i have an excellent dealer in connecticut. he is expensive but i do trust him because i know him for a long time.
and,also have an excellent mechanic here in florida who has a very large operation and works only on saabs'.

dealers do not get it .and ,i do not mean saab only but almost all of them. their prices are 3 to 4 times higher than anyone else out there ( i do undeerstand their overhead ,etc....) but,and at times they fake the work. i think that they rely mostly on warranty work.

most of the people i know ,once the warranty expires they go on to local mechanics,usually after their first non-warranty work to a dealer.

last month my vette broke a tiny piece of plastic in the clutcch pedal. a $1.25 part.-----the clutch became very hard and difficult to engage.

i called my mechanic in fla. and he told me what was wrong,namely the clutch pedal went out of alignement when this plastic piece broke off.

i removed the panel that covers this area and took it to my local dealer in conn.--i told him exactly what was wrong with the car.and went home.................
he called me 2 hours later and told me that i needed a new clutch assembly at $800. and a new clutch pressure plate at $1400.----(not including the clutch ).....
i told him to do nothing and came to pick up the car.
i then explained to him that this was a case of gross incompetence or fraud........no other way around it..........

i then went to the parts dept, and ordered the plastic piece and a week later i had the same mechanic replace it........the car now works fine.

but i got hit with a $125. diagnostic charge and a $ 190 charge for 2o minutes of work the next week.

i can fight it and win ,but ...rather forget it and go on....
so, it is difficult when you keep cars to over 250,000 miles like i do.......mostly because it is hard to find honest people out there to work on it.

dski · August 2003

They may not be dishonest.. It could be that they are just stupid.

In either case.. they should be out of the business.

d.

mdashi · August 2003

My friend at work has a 2000 Saab 9-5 Wagon that had the "bike" package and came with 225/45/17 tires. The originals were Michelins and they wore out in 15K miles. He had them replaced with a set of Kumhos and had an alignment done. They lasted another 15K miles. He bought a third set of tires and had another alignment done. This time he asked to see the alignment results. They said that the front had been out of alignment and they fixed it, and that the back was just a little out of alignment and there wasn't anything they could do about it. Is this type of tire wear (15K for a set) normal for a wagon that is driven in a non-sporting manner around town only??? I drive a M3 with the same size tires on the front, and I'm getting longer life out of the same Kumho tires and I drive extremely fast and hard and even do a little autocross racing. It just doesn't make any sense. Can anyone help??

-- Matt

dski · August 2003

Two things to find out: Does he have an Aero Version and how often is he rotating?

The Performance tires used on the Aero are low profiles that do not last nearly as long as traditional tires do. 15K might be normal if he's not keeping pressures and rotations up.

With either 9-5 version, he should be rotating every 5,000 miles. Ignore what Saab says about 10K or not at all with the newest versions. Thats insane! IMO I followed the 10K recommendation with my first 9-5 and my tire wear was not as good as it should have been. BUT... I got closer to 25K before one tire became unacceptable for wet roads.

Our 2002 9-5 Wagon now has 15K on it and no sign of significant wear. I rotate every 5K now.

Aside from his rotation interval, he needs to make sure he keeps his tire pressure in check. That will kill these tires very fast and MUST be checked when the tires are cold or sitting idle for at least 3 hours.

Drew

bretfraz · August 2003

I've heard plenty of stories from 9-5 owners of rapid tire wear on 17's. Heck, the 16's on my SE wore out at 28K.

Gotta run higher than normal tire pressures, rotate often, and pay close attention to them. Even still, they're gonna wear faster than a RWD car.

blockislandguy · August 2003

Guys, I'm at 41K and rolling on the OEM Pirelli Scorpion 16" tires on a Volvo XC. We've rotated once in all these miles, drive in ice and snow with the attendant wheel spin (and I presume abnormal wear), and cruise at 75 MPH on I95 with the back full of dogs, bikes, and other weekend must-haves. So, what's up with the short tire life on the 9-5, even the non-Aero?

evantodd · August 2003

the SAAB 95 linear is a car I am seriously considering. However, my friend says the 4 cylinder engine only lasts around 100k while a 6 cylinder engine lasts 150-200K. Is this true? Also he said the turbo will only last 60K before needing replacement. Is this true or not.

evantodd · August 2003

I am looking at the 2003 Saab 95. It is a 4 cylinder turbo charged 185hp. It is recommened in Consumer Reports. I am also looking at BMW 325xi which is 6 cyl and 184 hp. Saab is 7K cheaper. But I was told by a friend that the 4 cylinder engine will not last as long as the 6 cylinder. He also said the turbo will only last 60K miles. Do you agree with this. I often drive my wife's 1999 Saab 93. I enjoy it. It is a 4 cyl turbo and is quick. Also the BMW is AWD while the Saab is FWD. Opionions, comments welcome.

bretfraz · August 2003

This is one of those eternal debates within the Saab 9-5 community. The fact is that both engines are very reliable. Your friend's mileage figures are 100% arbitrary and seem to have little or no basis in reality. I wonder how your friend became such an expert in Saab engine durability.

The current 2.3L 4 cyl is based on an old design which has been upgraded many times over the years. Its almost over-engineered and is very robust. With proper maintenance 200K+++ is easily attained.

The current 3.0L V6 is sourced from Vauxhall (GM England) and is heavily modified by Saab. While its only been in the line since 1999 its proving to be very reliable. About the only beef people have with the V6 is that it uses a timing belt instead of a chain, and the belt needs to be changed every 60K (Saab pays for the first replacement). Comments from dealers show the V6 to be less troublesome than the already reliable 4 cyl but that's prolly due to there being fewer V6 Saab's on the road.

As for 9-5 vs 3 series, both are great cars and either is a fine choice. Obviously if you want/need AWD, the decision is made as the Saab cannot compete. But if that's not an issue you'll find the 9-5 to be roomier, more versatile, more passenger friendly, and probably safer - the 9-5 is simply one of the safest cars on the road. The 9-5 offers a much larger trunk, 82% larger, and the rear seats flip and fold increasing the cargo capacity even more. The 9-5 has a larger fuel tank which means more miles between fill ups. The interior noise and braking performance are about equal.

The BMW is certainly a terrific driving car and the BMW name holds a lot of cache with folks. So it really depends on where your priorities lie. I suggest you drive them both extensively and decide which works better for you, day in day out. Have fun shopping!!

jerrys2 · August 2003

I have a thumping or clunking sound from the front end when I drive over bumps. I also get a feeling in the steering column that something is loose in the front end when the wheel is turned or when I go over bumps.

The dealer replaced the left front sway bar link at 5k, also "checked all suspension components, retorqued front suspension bolts and lubricated bushings". This seemed to help for awhile but the problem resurfaced.

Returned to dealer at 7k, they then"removed and replaced control arm bushings"

This did nothing to alleviate the problem. Before I go back to the dealer I want to be certain that there is in fact something wrong...

My question to my fellow Saab owners is ... is this a characteristic of the Saab? Do you have similar noise?

Thanks,

Jerry

dski · August 2003

Your friends comment about the 6 vs. 4 is bogus. The Saab 4 is a GREAT engine and will probably out last the 6 currently in use. He made a general statment about 4 cylinder engines which is just not correct IMO.

The previous Saab 6 in '94 & '95 was horrible and dropped very quickly. I had one and even though I didn't keep it long enough to experience too much trouble..it was not a very desirable power plant.

One thing to keep in mind is that Saab is DROPPING the V6 for 2004. If I were buying a 2003, I'd go for the 4.

Another thought... You mentioned that your shopping the BMW 3 series.. I would highly recommend taking a serious look at the newest Saab 9-3. The Arch version of this car is Aweseome.. the linear version is a steal. Remember that Saab has about 3K in incentives right now which puts a 9-3 linear down around 26K.

Good Luck
Drew

dski · August 2003

We have 17K on our 2003 and have not noticed the noise your referring to.

Hope you find the problem soon.. good luck.

D.

rob999 · August 2003

Check this link (and its related posts):

http://www.saabnet.com/tsn/bb/9-5/index.html?bID=57039

Does this sound like yours?

stu15 · August 2003

I drove both the 4 and 6 and I preffered the 6 (auto trans). 6 is a much smoother engine....the 4 cyl was a bit buzzy and the torque of the 6 (vs the 4) meant that there was less downshifting. I leased my Arc 3.0t so I don't care about resale value in 2006...Saab's problem.

There are some killer deals right now on 2003s..OMG....$6K to $7K off MSRP on window stickers...who knows what you'll get if you negotiate. I would have waited until Aug to buy mine but the 3.0t Wagon was the last one they had so I bit the bullet (still had $5K off sticker). I really don't think I would have bought the 4cyl at all.

My intel says that the 2004 arcs get a 225hp version of the 4 cyl; so they will have more power than the linear to help justify their price.

I drove a 325 wagon and prefered the Saab. Feels much roomier overall and $3K less.

jerrys2 · August 2003

Thanks Robb...it may be the same clunk in steering column. I am back to dealer for drive with tech tomorrow.

As a Subaru owner I automatically go to Edmunds, I forgot about the other Saab cite.

Jerry

rob999 · August 2003

Funny, I have a Subaru, too. I'm a regular at both Edmunds' Subaru topics and the 'other Saab site'

ffb13 · August 2003

guys,
i got 61,000 miles out of my original michelins 17 inch tires on my aero and still had another 2/32 of wear left or about 5 to 8,ooo miles.

i do a lot of hiway tires at 80 mph plus and still got this wear.
heat is what kills these tires ,and low pressure ,below 41 does them no good.

now,when these tires/aero cars first got here a lot of consumers complained about the harshness of the ride,so, saab brought the tire pressure down.........this is what kills these tires.

i think the trick is that i run them at 41 psi and rotate them once a year only.

read the owners manual and you will note that they do recommend higher press. for heavy loads and hi speeds............ but if you read the tire sidewall for press. info . you will note that you can go to 41 plus......

and,by the way ,you will not get the "overinflation " abnormal tire wear at these pressures.the tires ,low profile ,are made for higher press. than normal.

dski · August 2003

Well.. if you say you got over 60K on your 17" Tires... I'll believe you.

I can maybe agree that increasing pressure on these will increase life.

But.. the once a year tire rotation is not a correct statement to make. Time has nothing to do with increasing the life of your tires... It is the MILES.

How many miles are you putting on these tires before you rotate them at the end of a years time?

Drew

caprat · August 2003

I have a 9-5 V6 Wagon. A couple of weeks ago the 'check engine' light came on. I brought it to the dealer who replaced some valve somewhere and sent me on my way. The next day, the light was back on as I drove out my driveway on a long trip. Over the course of the next week, while filling the tank, gas started to drip from the fuel pipe leading to the fuel tank. The drip turned into a gush.

It's back at the dealer's now getting fixed.

Has anyone else heard of a serious fuel leak like this?

dski · August 2003

Ouch! Never heard that one yet. Glad you caught it before it became a real problem. That situation can be dangerous.

There are literlally hundreds of things that can cause the Check Engine lights to come on in all modern cars. The most common and simplest is from not tightening your Gas Cap. Yours is probably the most dangerous. Shame the dealer didn't catch that.

Good luck
Drew

caprat · August 2003

My car is still under warranty. A couple of columns on the LED (for radio/temp controls/etc) are out. It's not a big deal, but has anyone had it replaced under warranty for this simple reason?

rob999 · August 2003

The LED display (commonly known as the SID, or Saab Information Display) is known to lose pixels due to the failure of adhesive on an internal contact strip.

If yours is still under warranty, go for a replacement at the dealer. It should be covered.

For those of you out of warranty and are competent DIY'ers you can remove the SID and repair the defect without having to spring for a new one. Check the following link: http://www.users.waitrose.com/~randmwilliams/

caprat · August 2003

Thanks, Rob. I will get it fixed when I send it in for other work. Nice job on the work-around though. Thanks for posting it.

ffb13 · August 2003

drew,
i rotate only once a year because this is when i install my winter tires.
and because i keep the winter tires on for only 4 weeks--while i am in vermont and conn. i do the rotation then and it has worked for me.
by the way the winter tires have only about 2000 on them and thus the 61,000 miles should be reduced by 2,000 miles or 59,000 miles is more accurate for my actual wear on the 17 inchers.

as to the tires per year.

the car was bought on november 1999.
so 3 years and 4 months before the new tires went on this translates into 18,300 miles per year.
i really do about 50,000 miles per year or more but in my other cars also.

so far i am happy with the tire wear and the 32 mpg i get on the highway at 80 plus mph

dski · August 2003

I understand.. my only point was that a rotation interval is based on miles not on time. I am surprised that you get such long wear on a FWD rotating at 18K though.

I used the 10K interval on my '99 and the tire on the drive wheel went way to early. I'm doing 5K now.. we'll see if it's better.

Drew

Saab 9-5 Sedan

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